Marcus Smart and KO next contracts?

[flybono]

Trade bait

[Celtics4ever]

That's not an option, it's an extension.

This is a great example of semantics.   It is essentially, the same thing.   Ainge could have signed Kelly for another year, and he chose financial flexibility over this so-called vital asset.

It's on Olynyk's play the rest of the season.

I have always thought this as well.   Ainge wanted to test him.

KO will be getting at least $14 million x 4 years this off season. Perhaps offers of closer to $16-18 mill x 4 years.
This isn't 2010. We are in a golden era for 3 point shooting big men who can facilitate offense and play defense.

You said the same kind of stuff about Sully.   You were wrong then and way off.   I guess you could be wrong on this as well.  So excuse me, if I don't trust your salary prognostications.  This is not Madden.  Guys are getting paid for their potential and how high is Kelly's given the majority of slow twitch fibers in his makeup.   I think we value our assets here more than the rest of the league.

I live outside of Boston, KO is not as well respected as some think.     I heard him called " Flabby Jesus" at a Celtics-Pacers game.  My guess is he will try to go home to Toronto where he is from. 

I think KO is a nifty player who does neat things on the floor.   He has a high basketball IQ and can shoot the three well.   He is also slow and soft at times but he generally tries.   I just wish he was not so wishy-washy in terms of confidence.   I would love to see him put it all together like he did against the Hawks.   It would help us.

Marcus is a heart and soul guy.   I could see us moving on from AB and signing Marcus.   What happens to both these guys depends on if we can sign free agents of merit.   That will take priority over our own.

[BitterJim]

That's not an option, it's an extension.

This is a great example of semantics.   It is essentially, the same thing.   Ainge could have signed Kelly for another year, and he chose financial flexibility over this so-called vital asset.

They are not even close to the same thing. You may as well say that drafting a player and signing them through free agency are the same, because they are about that far apart

[Darío SpanishFan]

An option is sooooo far away than an extension. Basically, the option declined on James Young makes him unrestricted and his future with us doesn't exist.

Kelly is resctricted, we will keep rights on him.

It's not a bad thing to assume a mistake. Everybody commits them and it's natural. But you can't defend that.

[chambers]

That's not an option, it's an extension.

This is a great example of semantics.   It is essentially, the same thing.   Ainge could have signed Kelly for another year, and he chose financial flexibility over this so-called vital asset.

It's on Olynyk's play the rest of the season.

I have always thought this as well.   Ainge wanted to test him.

KO will be getting at least $14 million x 4 years this off season. Perhaps offers of closer to $16-18 mill x 4 years.
This isn't 2010. We are in a golden era for 3 point shooting big men who can facilitate offense and play defense.

You said the same kind of stuff about Sully.   You were wrong then and way off.   I guess you could be wrong on this as well.  So excuse me, if I don't trust your salary prognostications.  This is not Madden.  Guys are getting paid for their potential and how high is Kelly's given the majority of slow twitch fibers in his makeup.   I think we value our assets here more than the rest of the league.

I live outside of Boston, KO is not as well respected as some think.     I heard him called " Flabby Jesus" at a Celtics-Pacers game.  My guess is he will try to go home to Toronto where he is from. 

I think KO is a nifty player who does neat things on the floor.   He has a high basketball IQ and can shoot the three well.   He is also slow and soft at times but he generally tries.   I just wish he was not so wishy-washy in terms of confidence.   I would love to see him put it all together like he did against the Hawks.   It would help us.

Marcus is a heart and soul guy.   I could see us moving on from AB and signing Marcus.   What happens to both these guys depends on if we can sign free agents of merit.   That will take priority over our own.

The jury is still out on Sully. Unfortunately his injury has stopped us from seeing him in Toronto. He was only signed to a one year deal and was looking at some solid playing time there until the injury.

If you think I'm over rating him, then what do you think Olynyk will command on the open market as a free agent?

[footey]

I think Danny will get a long term deal done with Marcus, similar to the way he did with Bradley and Crowder. Marcus has a lot of intrinsic value but not much statistical value. That will suppress his value in the marketplace.

Feels like the opposite for Kelly. Some team will overpay for his services. I think Danny will figure him to be replaceable and let him walk. Unless he gets included in a trade before the deadline.

[Tr1boy]

I think Danny will get a long term deal done with Marcus, similar to the way he did with Bradley and Crowder. Marcus has a lot of intrinsic value but not much statistical value. That will suppress his value in the marketplace.

Feels like the opposite for Kelly. Some team will overpay for his services. I think Danny will figure him to be replaceable and let him walk. Unless he gets included in a trade before the deadline.

lets list some viable replacements before potentially saying bye to KO

There are not many players in the league that can do what KO can (and of course can do that KO can't) .... in an overall package, not many

I thought 2017 prospect Lauri Markakanen was like KO, but he has struggled as of late and is not a willing/good passer

Jon Leurer is tied up long term to the Pistons...

Donatas Motiejunas maybe. Not as good of a 3 pt shooter though

[footey]

I think Danny will get a long term deal done with Marcus, similar to the way he did with Bradley and Crowder. Marcus has a lot of intrinsic value but not much statistical value. That will suppress his value in the marketplace.

Feels like the opposite for Kelly. Some team will overpay for his services. I think Danny will figure him to be replaceable and let him walk. Unless he gets included in a trade before the deadline.

lets list some viable replacements before potentially saying bye to KO

There are not many players in the league that can do what KO can (and of course can do that KO can't) .... in an overall package, not many

I thought 2017 prospect Lauri Markakanen was like KO, but he has struggled as of late and is not a willing/good passer

Jon Leurer is tied up long term to the Pistons...

Donatas Motiejunas maybe. Not as good of a 3 pt shooter though

Check out Isaiah Hartenstein in Draft Express. I started a thread about him a week ago but not much interest then. Seems like there are a few guys like that who will be coming into the league. I really like him though. A little hot headed but very quick first step and developing three pointer. Very long. Check him out.

[CsBanner18]

KO won't be back next year, so no need to think about his next contract...

[Smokeeye123]

I think Danny will get a long term deal done with Marcus, similar to the way he did with Bradley and Crowder. Marcus has a lot of intrinsic value but not much statistical value. That will suppress his value in the marketplace.

Feels like the opposite for Kelly. Some team will overpay for his services. I think Danny will figure him to be replaceable and let him walk. Unless he gets included in a trade before the deadline.

lets list some viable replacements before potentially saying bye to KO

There are not many players in the league that can do what KO can (and of course can do that KO can't) .... in an overall package, not many

I thought 2017 prospect Lauri Markakanen was like KO, but he has struggled as of late and is not a willing/good passer

Jon Leurer is tied up long term to the Pistons...

Donatas Motiejunas maybe. Not as good of a 3 pt shooter though

Check out Isaiah Hartenstein in Draft Express. I started a thread about him a week ago but not much interest then. Seems like there are a few guys like that who will be coming into the league. I really like him though. A little hot headed but very quick first step and developing three pointer. Very long. Check him out.

LOL. KO is easily replaceable. He is underrated nationally but he's one of the guys you let walk. He's a big who can shoot well outside and has a decent mid range. He's also an ok passer. But he's a poor defender, not a great rebounder, and unathletic.

You can draft (Johnathon Issac), trade or sign for someone very comparable.

[Yoki_IsTheName]

...reasonable contract for Kelly Olynyk... ...$8-9 million per year...

Pick one, because $8-9 million for Kelly isn't reasonable, it's insulting

How is it insulting? Market value doesn't mean it's his real value. Just because Bismack Biyombo and Timofey Mozgov get $10 million more doesn't mean we should pay Kelly the same amount. You think Miles Plumlee at $12 million is reasonable?

It is reasonable, for us. Anything more than that is overpaying for an off the bench player at most. He does have range but he doesn't really move the needle as much to make your team a contender. He doesn't offer a big impact on defense.

That should be our offer. If that's insulting to him, then apologize, but stand firm. Would love to keep Kelly, but not for more than that (well, maybe up to $10 million). Let's try and not pay a an off bench player more than that.

KO will be getting at least $14 million x 4 years this off season. Perhaps offers of closer to $16-18 mill x 4 years.
This isn't 2010. We are in a golden era for 3 point shooting big men who can facilitate offense and play defense.

Here is a ranking of our best performing line ups...
you'l notice that with KO at the PF with Horford at C, that is easily our best line up and that's why this lineup usually finishes games with either Bradley or Smart.

Why? Because KO stretches the floor so IT can drive. It gives Al more room inside and it gives us the ability to have a 5 man stretch line up with all 5 guys on the perimeter waiting for IT to penetrate or run pick and pop for IT to penetrate and dish to an open shooter.
Kelly has the footspeed to go and guard a lot of guards in the switch out on the perimeter, whereas no one else on our team other than Jerebko can do this effectively whilst hitting 3's on the other end. Take a look, Kelly is somewhat of a unicorn, and he's still very young and improving...
I'm not saying he's a max player or he's Kevin Love, but to say he's worth 8 or 9 million in today's NBA is actually a bit of an insult ( I know you didn't mean it like that).

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/plus/lineup_finder.cgi?request=1&match=game&lineup_type=5-man&output=total&is_playoffs=N&year_id=2017&team_id=BOS&game_num_min=0&game_num_max=99&order_by=diff_pts

I understand that that is the market value. What I'm saying is that should still be our offer on the table. If it's insulting for him, then so be it, but we shouldn't cave in and pay Kelly $14 million per year, and here's why...

- You're right, this is the age where a big man who can shoot from deep is very valuable. But we just paid one for the max contract. We already have that big.

- We have two first round picks who are coming in next year, both are playing PF and C respectively. One of them (Yabusele) can shoot (or atleast has shown an ability). So why exactly do we need to pay a lot of money for a PF/C when we will have two coming, who combined, can do the things Kelly does, for the rookie scale contract?

- We need to max out Isaiah. And who knows, maybe we're going to acquire a star (Jimmy Butler or Paul George) who will also command a max eventually. We'd also have to pay Marcus Smart and/or Avery Bradley, and they're going to command some dough as well. The Luxury tax could be a killer. Do we really want to carry $14-16 million of Kelly Olynyk as we max out two other guys and pay the more vital ones?

- Yes the game is evolving, and so are the prospects. Every draft class will have big guys who has the ability to shoot now, and we have the assets to be able to acquire one via the draft. Will be cheaper than Kelly's supposed price.

I understand that the money is different now, but we should stand pat and offer nothing less than $10 million per year for Kelly. If he thinks it's too low, let him walk. He's a solid guy to have off the bench, but we can get other options for the cheap, and it helps us save money in case we need it. It might be insulting, but I believe it's the right to do. I'd get it of Kelly can move the needle when it comes to us contending, but he doesn't really move it as much. 

[CsBanner18]

KO "vital?"

Uh, hardly. Too soft, brings nothing but erratic shooting and occasional defense to the table. Zero interest in paying him eight figures. Time to face facts that he was a draft miss.

Personally. I'd love to see him shipped out at the deadline - for anything of value. Dangle him under Orlando's nose for a real rebounder in Ibaka.

At least somebody on this thread is making some sense. No chance we tie up future cap space for KO, given what little he does for the team. His shooting (he shoots like he's 6'9), rebounding, passing, defense, etc can be easily replaced.

Also have Yabusele and Zizic coming over...

[MBunge]

I think Danny will get a long term deal done with Marcus, similar to the way he did with Bradley and Crowder. Marcus has a lot of intrinsic value but not much statistical value. That will suppress his value in the marketplace.

Feels like the opposite for Kelly. Some team will overpay for his services. I think Danny will figure him to be replaceable and let him walk. Unless he gets included in a trade before the deadline.

lets list some viable replacements before potentially saying bye to KO

There are not many players in the league that can do what KO can (and of course can do that KO can't) .... in an overall package, not many

I thought 2017 prospect Lauri Markakanen was like KO, but he has struggled as of late and is not a willing/good passer

Jon Leurer is tied up long term to the Pistons...

Donatas Motiejunas maybe. Not as good of a 3 pt shooter though

Check out Isaiah Hartenstein in Draft Express. I started a thread about him a week ago but not much interest then. Seems like there are a few guys like that who will be coming into the league. I really like him though. A little hot headed but very quick first step and developing three pointer. Very long. Check him out.

LOL. KO is easily replaceable. He is underrated nationally but he's one of the guys you let walk. He's a big who can shoot well outside and has a decent mid range. He's also an ok passer. But he's a poor defender, not a great rebounder, and unathletic.

You can draft (Johnathon Issac), trade or sign for someone very comparable.

KO is definitely not worth breaking the bank over but easily replaceable?  Only if you emphasize his weaknesses while ignoring the flaws in the potential replacements.

Mike

[Celtics4ever]

If you think I'm over rating him, then what do you think Olynyk will command on the open market as a free agent?

Honestly, I have no idea as I do not try to predict future salaries.   You're much braver than I for throwing out a figure.  He will get paid what the market bears.   It could mean what you predicted, less or more.   Much depends on what we do as a team, do we woo Hayward.   I think Kelly is close to his ceiling.   He is already skilled so, and he is limited athletically.  I see confidence as the big area he could improve and it would help him immensely.

I don't know if I am Ainge if I try to lock him for major cash.   Some day we need to resign IT,  and I would rather spend that money on someone with toughness.  He is a decent player but the price has to be right.  KO is better than Mickey by a long shot so letting him go and not signing would be a big drop off.

Ainge wanted flexibilty and we got that.  Time will tell if he was right.

The jury is still out on Sully.

No, it is not really.   He is shooting 31% from the field and 17% from the Down town.   He is still bombing away about  two threes and 4 FGAs  in his ten minutes of play.   Which is absurb given how poor a shooter he is folks.  He played well against us but he had motivation for that game.  But since then he not played as well.

http://www.espn.com/nba/player/_/id/6624/jared-sullinger

[Phantom255x]

I would keep Smart + IT going forward (past 2018 as well - long term).

Ideally you sign a max FA and hope Jerebko or Green comes back on a cheap, exception deal.

Zizic, 2017BKNPick, and Yabu may join next season as well.

But in all this I think KO is gone UNLESS Ainge has zero faith he can sign a max-FA (even Ibaka or Millsap).