LeBron vs Jordan

[PaulAllen]

Lebron > Michael B. Jordan

[jambr380]

I've said it before and I'll say it again.  If I'm starting a team from scratch I take Lebron James every single day of the week.  If I need to win a game or series I take Michael Jordan every single day of the week.

So you want a great regular season? Just by the nature of your comment, Jordan is the obvious choice - he will win you series' and important games. Luckily Lebron had Kyrie and Ray Allen to come up big in the most important moments instead of him...and I think Lebron knows in his heart that he didn't want to be the one taking those important shots. You saw how many he clanged off the rim from short distance during the last four minutes of last night.

[jambr380]

Surely you can't be this excited, LarBrd - the whole thread is kind-of ridiculous and you are just trying to p--- people off. I am a few years older than you and hit Jordan's first title season win I was a 11-12. Maybe you are just forgetting Jordan's first three titles and think that they just kind-of happened.

[TwinTower14]

Jordan is the best. 6-0 with 6 finals MVP. Lebron is right there though.

[TwinTower14]

I do think Lebron is the most talented player ever. However Jordan is the best. Jordan drive and competitiveness can't be duplicated.

[Moranis]

I've said it before and I'll say it again.  If I'm starting a team from scratch I take Lebron James every single day of the week.  If I need to win a game or series I take Michael Jordan every single day of the week.

So you want a great regular season? Just by the nature of your comment, Jordan is the obvious choice - he will win you series' and important games. Luckily Lebron had Kyrie and Ray Allen to come up big in the most important moments instead of him...and I think Lebron knows in his heart that he didn't want to be the one taking those important shots. You saw how many he clanged off the rim from short distance during the last four minutes of last night.

Lebron James is a better all around player.  He is easier to build a team around because he can play with anyone and put you in a position to win in the playoffs. 

But your stuff about James is just silly nonsense.

Here are the closeout games James' teams have lost (i.e. win and advance) or elimination games (i.e. lose and go home) since the Dallas series.

Game 4 L 5/6/12 1st round Knicks - 27p, 4r, 4a, 1s, 0b, 5t
Game 6 W 6/7/12 ECF Celtics - 45, 15, 5, 0, 0, 4
Game 7 W 6/9/12 ECF Celtics - 31, 12, 2, 1, 1, 3
Game 6 L 6/1/13 ECF Pacers - 29, 7, 6, 2, 1, 4
Game 7 W 6/3/13 ECF Pacers - 32, 8, 4, 2, 1, 2
Game 6 W 6/18/13 Finals Spurs - 32, 10, 11, 3, 1, 6
Game 7 W 6/20/13 Finals Spurs - 37, 12, 4, 2, 0, 2
Game 5 L 5/28/14 ECF Pacers - 7, 2, 4, 0, 1, 3
Game 5 L 6/15/14 Finals Spurs - 31, 10, 5, 0, 2, 1
Game 6 L 6/16/15 Finals Warriors - 32, 18, 9, 2, 0, 6
Game 5 W 6/13/16 Finals Warriors - 41, 16, 7, 3, 3, 2
Game 6 W 6/16/16 Finals Warriors - 41, 8, 11, 4, 3, 1
Game 7 W 6/19/16 Finals Warriors - 27, 11, 11, 2, 3, 5

So since the Dallas series, James has had one stinker in a closeout game his team lost or when his team was facing elimination, and that stinker was a Game 5 with his team up 3-1 and which they closed them out in Game 6. 

This notion that James isn't a closer has clearly been eliminated and erased with the last 5 playoffs.  James shows up when it counts, but no one is anywhere near Jordan in that regard.  Jordan just has a will to win like no one has ever had in the history of the game, but that will to win is also grating and Jordan didn't have the all around ability that James has.  That is why if I'm starting at team from scratch, I'm taking James, but if I need to win that one game, I'm taking Jordan. 

[chiken Green]

This is really the only thing i hate about Lebron winning..  People get crazy and start comparing him to a man who never loss a Finals.. 
Yes Lebron is the 1st man to come back from 3-1 ... That's a cool thing.. but no man has ever not been beat on the big show.. (the ones who have gone multiple times)

Players say it all the Time, they would throw away all those foolish awards for Just one Chip.. What would they do for Multiple Chips?
And To a man EACH player would tell you that LOSING one Sucks 10times More than Winning one..  Jordan does not know anything about this side of the business. Losing Finals.. someone else defeating him.. This man Was pure Dominate..

So if you want to start your all around team of All stars around Lebron - please go right ahead.. My Guess is that Jordan would not want to be your first choice.. He would want to simply play the best that you have and sing "Giving you the best that I got" to them while he is busting they (Bleeeeeeppppsssss)

You must have forgotten about this man when he got the War Engine.. 
Lebron is a wonderful player, A great guy and he has 3 rings..  When he decides to play He can be a beast especially in this era of basketball that is slanted for scoring..   But he is no MJ.. Those final losses make sure he will never be...

Wins and loses Trumps all.. Jordan up to this point is the most Dominate winner we have ever seen..   But Someone will eventually take his spot... Someone will eventually win 7 Titles - 3 of them in concession - twice and never experience a finals lost.. And when they do we will say oh wow.. now that's special.. until then - you can have your Microwave ESPN created champion.. He's good heck he is even great but he isn't the best, not even close.

[gift]

Through age 31 his achievements look pretty good compared to Jordan. However, look what Jordan did after that. Changed his game, led an all time great team, 3 more championships, unbeaten in Finals etc.

Lebron has maybe one more year of dominating before he will need to refine his game in order to be the best player in the league for multiple more championships. He needs to get his shooting back.

One of the reasons I was rooting for Lebron in the finals last year and this year was because I see this as maybe his last best chance.

I like it when guys' achievements reflect their dominance. It still bothers me that Steve Nash has two MVPs while Shaq only has one. Not an accurate snapshot of their respective careers at all.

[MBunge]

Lebron James is a better all around player. 

Jordan career averages.

30.1 pts.
6.2 rebs.
5.3 asts.
2.3 stls.
.8 blks.
2.7 tov.
PER 27.9.

LeBron career averages.

27.2 pts.
7.2 rebs.
6.9 asts.
1.7 stls.
.8 blks.
3.4 tovs.
PER 27.2.

Passing is close to a wash when looking at assist-to-turnover ratio.  Jordan's the better scorer.  LeBron's the better rebounder.  Jordan was all-defense 1st team nine times.  LeBron has been all-defense 1st and 2nd team only 6 times and I doubt he'll get three more in the rest of his career.

LeBron is NOT clearly a better all around player than Jordan.  It's certainly close, though.

Mike

[meangreenmachine]

Jordan in the Finals: 6-0 *
LeBron in the Finals: 3-4 **

* - Undefeated, two three-peats, no game sevens, may have possibly won 8 in a row if not for his father's murder, all during an era with better talent than 2003-present (Jordan vanquished the Bad Boys, Late Era Showtime, Drexler, Barkley, Payton, Malone, Stockton, Ewing, Miller, etc.)

** - Without clutch threes from Ray Allen and Kyrie Irving, LBJ would likely be 1-6 in the Finals. If LBJ is the GOAT, why did he not make those clutch threes?

Repeat after me: Jordan did not even come close to losing a Finals series.

For those of you who are (rightfully) baffled by the comparison: Anybody who thinks LBJ is even close to Jordan is likely subconsciously biased by the fact that they are closer in age to LBJ than Jordan (that is, they are experiencing generational bias).

[meangreenmachine]

Jordan and it's not that close at all. Jordan owned the 90's with two three peats and a retirement in between. Perhaps, a more interesting question would be:

Lebron vs. Duncan

Yeah, a more reasonable argument is who is the best player after Jordan. Now that is an interesting debate.

[meangreenmachine]

31 years old... Pick the exact age that comes *before* Jordan's second 3-peat, *after* his year off, and which allows for James to have played 3 more seasons?

James is working on his case, but the cherries are getting picked pretty hard here. If he wins 2 or 3 more championships in the next 3 seasons, then we can talk.

Pretty much. But that would be too reasonable. We need to react to the moment.

This isn't the first time I've made this comparison.  When he finally won his first championship, I made a thread pointing out that he was the same age (27) as Jordan was when Jordan won his first championship.  His resume at age 27 compared favorably with Jordan at 27.  That didn't mean he'd win a couple more. 

I wasn't the only one making that comparison, either:  http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1228796-lebron-james-is-flat-out-better-than-michael-jordan-at-27-years-of-age

Now here we are at the age of 31 ... LeBron is still on pace.

When I compare them at age 35, will LeBron have 6 championships?  Probably not.   But given that Jordan only played for 3 more significant seasons and LeBron will likely play more than just 3 - it's pretty interesting to keep track of.

I would not be certain that LeBron has 3 more significant seasons left. He looks much older than his age. Heck, he looks older than Karl Malone did at 40, and the dude is only 31? Father Time is wearing on him. Like Kobe and Bird, I would bet on LeBron's body giving out much sooner than he would like.

[Big333223]

31 years old... Pick the exact age that comes *before* Jordan's second 3-peat, *after* his year off, and which allows for James to have played 3 more seasons?

James is working on his case, but the cherries are getting picked pretty hard here. If he wins 2 or 3 more championships in the next 3 seasons, then we can talk.

Pretty much. But that would be too reasonable. We need to react to the moment.

This isn't the first time I've made this comparison.  When he finally won his first championship, I made a thread pointing out that he was the same age (27) as Jordan was when Jordan won his first championship.  His resume at age 27 compared favorably with Jordan at 27.  That didn't mean he'd win a couple more. 

I wasn't the only one making that comparison, either:  http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1228796-lebron-james-is-flat-out-better-than-michael-jordan-at-27-years-of-age

Now here we are at the age of 31 ... LeBron is still on pace.

When I compare them at age 35, will LeBron have 6 championships?  Probably not.   But given that Jordan only played for 3 more significant seasons and LeBron will likely play more than just 3 - it's pretty interesting to keep track of.

I would not be certain that LeBron has 3 more significant seasons left. He looks much older than his age. Heck, he looks older than Karl Malone did at 40, and the dude is only 31? Father Time is wearing on him. Like Kobe and Bird, I would bet on LeBron's body giving out much sooner than he would like.

I don't care how he looks, I care how he plays. That block on Iguodala at the end of the game says everything that needs to be said, to me. Even if he's over the hill, he's one of the most athletic players in the league on top of being one of the smartest. Barring injury, he's got at least 3 more all stars years in him.

[LarBrd33]

Looks like someone else had a similar idea:

[Kane3387]

Looks like someone else had a similar idea:

I think minutes and seasons means more than age.

What's it look like after 13 seasons for MJ? That's the better comparison.