Would you choose Lillard over Curry?

[Who]

Westbrook is a better defender than Curry or Lillard.

[Vox_Populi]

Is there an argument, this season, for any player over Curry? This might be the greatest offensive season of all time.

I don't think there is. Lebron, Durant and RW are still transcendental players, but Curry makes shots that don't even go in on video game "easy mode".

Yes, Curry is in a perfect system, but that system isn't why he's nailing multiple 30+ foot shots in the clutch. He's easily the best shooter I've ever seen, combining accuracy with volume.

He's broken the game really. He's managed to give an incredible degree of consistency to probably the most variable aspect of basketball. I honestly never thought I'd see a player have a better season than LeBron and Durant when they're still in their relative primes.

[Eddie20]

Is there an argument, this season, for any player over Curry? This might be the greatest offensive season of all time.

I don't think there is. Lebron, Durant and RW are still transcendental players, but Curry makes shots that don't even go in on video game "easy mode".

Yes, Curry is in a perfect system, but that system isn't why he's nailing multiple 30+ foot shots in the clutch. He's easily the best shooter I've ever seen, combining accuracy with volume.

Nice reaction after RW is the one guarding Curry

Watch the games vs grizzlies/Celtics and post your reaction

You know why the Spurs were able to beat Cavs in the finals?  Leonard slowing down/shutting down Lebron

You know why the Bulls were unstoppable bc nobody could slow down Jordan.   

Remedy to slow down Curry is have a solid defender like AB, Allen on him. Play physical D. Glue onto him

This said he is still one of the top players in the league. Let's just calm down to say he is the greatest ever bc he is making beyond the 3 shots being guarded by so so defenders

This thread, which you started, is about you saying Lillard is better than him, not the bolded above. You're changing the argument on the fly.

[Tr1boy]

Westbrook is a better defender than Curry or Lillard.

No he is not. RW is as lazy on the defensive end as Rondo

He does not play honest defense. Does not stay with his man . not not always fight through screens.  Does not raise arms.

[Roy H.]

Is there an argument, this season, for any player over Curry? This might be the greatest offensive season of all time.

I don't think there is. Lebron, Durant and RW are still transcendental players, but Curry makes shots that don't even go in on video game "easy mode".

Yes, Curry is in a perfect system, but that system isn't why he's nailing multiple 30+ foot shots in the clutch. He's easily the best shooter I've ever seen, combining accuracy with volume.

Nice reaction after RW is the one guarding Curry

Watch the games vs grizzlies/Celtics and post your reaction

You know why the Spurs were able to beat Cavs in the finals?  Leonard slowing down/shutting down Lebron

You know why the Bulls were unstoppable bc nobody could slow down Jordan.   

Remedy to slow down Curry is have a solid defender like AB, Allen on him. Play physical D. Glue onto him

This said he is still one of the top players in the league. Let's just calm down to say he is the greatest ever bc he is making beyond the 3 shots being guarded by so so defenders

Name a better shooter -- volume + accuracy + range -- than Curry.

[chambers]

Triboy, do you still feel the same way?

What?

What a poor defender RW is.   Yeah I will say that

Yeah, I can't believe RW left Curry open from 9 feet beyond the 3PT line!

I think he means the whole game (Andre Robinson was on him that last game winner).

He's wrong regardless.
Westbrook is one of the best defenders at PG in the NBA.
Love how he criticizes Westbrook, has the gaul to say Lilliard is better than Curry, but doesn't say anything about Lilliards awful defense.


Damian Lilliard....
Can't stay in front of his man.
Can't read pick and rolls.
Gets lost on screens and is soft coming through screens.
He is targeted by opposing defenses.
He won the 2015 'All No Defense' award.

he is Steph Curry's ball boy if we're being honest.

[mctyson]

Is there an argument, this season, for any player over Curry? This might be the greatest offensive season of all time.

I don't think there is. Lebron, Durant and RW are still transcendental players, but Curry makes shots that don't even go in on video game "easy mode".

Yes, Curry is in a perfect system, but that system isn't why he's nailing multiple 30+ foot shots in the clutch. He's easily the best shooter I've ever seen, combining accuracy with volume.

I don't disagree with any of this, but it is also clear that he practices those shots and shoots them often in games.  That makes it amazing, but it also makes it reasonable that he will take and make the shot.  Everyone has to know this on the court, and you have to make him pass it.

Basketball isn't played in a vacuum or in a video game.  If I recall last night's game correctly, there was a horrendous offensive possession on the play that facilitated Steph even getting the ball to end the game.  Error #1 by OKC.  Then OKC doesn't recognize him as the handler and lets him dribble it up uncontested, over the half court line, and up to 35 feet before a guy even steps at him.  I am sorry but that is not good defense, against anyone, especially him.

When he played the Cs earlier this year, he hit some of those same shots but he was pressured all night, and did not shoot it all that well (certainly not 12 for 16 from 3).  Maybe he had an off night, maybe not having Klay was the main factor, but I consider the idea of having a bunch of good NBA perimeter defenders constantly in his face to be a simple option for slowing him down.

[Tr1boy]

Is there an argument, this season, for any player over Curry? This might be the greatest offensive season of all time.

I don't think there is. Lebron, Durant and RW are still transcendental players, but Curry makes shots that don't even go in on video game "easy mode".

Yes, Curry is in a perfect system, but that system isn't why he's nailing multiple 30+ foot shots in the clutch. He's easily the best shooter I've ever seen, combining accuracy with volume.

I don't disagree with any of this, but it is also clear that he practices those shots and shoots them often in games.  That makes it amazing, but it also makes it reasonable that he will take and make the shot.  Everyone has to know this on the court, and you have to make him pass it.

Basketball isn't played in a vacuum or in a video game.  If I recall last night's game correctly, there was a horrendous offensive possession on the play that facilitated Steph even getting the ball to end the game.  Error #1 by OKC.  Then OKC doesn't recognize him as the handler and lets him dribble it up uncontested, over the half court line, and up to 35 feet before a guy even steps at him.  I am sorry but that is not good defense, against anyone, especially him.

When he played the Cs earlier this year, he hit some of those same shots but he was pressured all night, and did not shoot it all that well (certainly not 12 for 16 from 3).  Maybe he had an off night, maybe not having Klay was the main factor, but I consider the idea of having a bunch of good NBA perimeter defenders constantly in his face to be a simple option for slowing him down.

Exactly

[Eddie20]

Triboy, do you still feel the same way?

What?

What a poor defender RW is.   Yeah I will say that

Yeah, I can't believe RW left Curry open from 9 feet beyond the 3PT line!

I think he means the whole game (Andre Robinson was on him that last game winner).

He's wrong regardless.
Westbrook is one of the best defenders at PG in the NBA.
Love how he criticizes Westbrook, has the gaul to say Lilliard is better than Curry, but doesn't say anything about Lilliards awful defense.


Damian Lilliard....
Can't stay in front of his man.
Can't read pick and rolls.
Gets lost on screens and is soft coming through screens.
He is targeted by opposing defenses.
He won the 2015 'All No Defense' award.

he is Steph Curry's ball boy if we're being honest.

To add to that...

http://blogs.mercurynews.com/kawakami/2015/06/29/2015-defense/

* 2015 No-Defense PLAYER OF THE YEAR: Damian Lillard, Portland.
 
OK, I believe I’m going to get some criticism for this selection, and maybe some counter-attacking analysis, because Lillard has many fans (statistically-inclined and regular) and that’s fine.
 
Lillard has been a great offensive player since he stepped into the league… and actually the defensive metrics point to an up-tick in Lillard’s play (his -0.37 DRPM this season wasn’t horrible–but still 30th among point guards–and much better than his -1.97 last season) and his steal rate was much higher.
 
However… On this one, I’m just going to go with what I saw in many, many Trail Blazers games. I’m also giving coach Terry Stotts a ton of credit for maneuvering his defensive scheme so deftly to cover up Lillard’s glaring weaknesses.
 
In some ways, it’s very similar to everything Steve Nash’s coaches used to do to cover for his inability to stay in front of quick offensive players or work through screens. Yes, Lillard currently is the primary benefactor of the star-player Courtesy Defensive Assignment strategy.
 
Flat out: Stotts tries to avoid putting Lillard on anybody who is any good.
 
When Portland played (and lost to) Memphis in the first round of the playoffs, who did Lillard cover? Tony Allen, of course. Who almost never does and never should shoot.
 
That was just one of the very frequent times Arron Afflalo and Nic Batum (and of course, before he was hurt, Wesley Matthews) had to lock into the dangerous perimeter scorers and stay locked on them, and from what I saw, even when they were screened by Lillard’s man or even when Lillard should’ve given them some help, they had to keep chasing their dangerous scorer.
 
Because Lillard wasn’t going to. He had the CDA. He wasn’t going to be playing D, nope.
 
Nobody dies easier on screens that Lillard, that’s just a fact.
 
Most of the time, it’s almost as if Lillard just stops playing when he’s screened–he doesn’t work through it, he doesn’t switch hard, he doesn’t rotate. It’s just… in his mind, once somebody makes contact with him, the defensive possession is over, time to play offense now! (Except the opponent still has the ball.)
 
Lillard also has a habit of getting back late in transition, trotting to one spot, then staying anchored there and refusing to rush out to defend a shooter at the three-point line even when he actually should be… rushing out to the three-point line.
 
That kind of stuff just kills a defense because so much pressure is heaped on the four guys (if you’re lucky) who ARE playing defense that eventually they have to break down vs. the best offenses.
 
–One thing about watching so many Warriors games this season is that Steve Kerr’s offense put pressure on all 5 defenders and you could always tell when an opponent had a weak defensive link–and the Warriors broke down Portland pretty thoroughly, largely because Lillard couldn’t get a CDA, or if he did (occasionally Harrison Barnes) the Warriors would find a way to force him to switch onto Curry or Klay and… bucket.
 
A peripheral stat that doesn’t look so good for Lillard: Portland gave up 106 points per 100 possessions when Lillard was on the floor; that number dropped to 100.9 points per 100 when he didn’t play.
 
 
 
Last year, I said Lillard probably was the third-worst overall defensive player, behind only Kyrie Irving and James Harden.
 
Irving was maybe a little bit improved on D this season; Harden got a lot better.
 
That leaves Lillard, the Oakland native and favored point guard of many statistical studies. But not this one. He’s a very deserving NDPOY.

[Roy H.]

Is there an argument, this season, for any player over Curry? This might be the greatest offensive season of all time.

I don't think there is. Lebron, Durant and RW are still transcendental players, but Curry makes shots that don't even go in on video game "easy mode".

Yes, Curry is in a perfect system, but that system isn't why he's nailing multiple 30+ foot shots in the clutch. He's easily the best shooter I've ever seen, combining accuracy with volume.

I don't disagree with any of this, but it is also clear that he practices those shots and shoots them often in games.  That makes it amazing, but it also makes it reasonable that he will take and make the shot.  Everyone has to know this on the court, and you have to make him pass it.

Basketball isn't played in a vacuum or in a video game.  If I recall last night's game correctly, there was a horrendous offensive possession on the play that facilitated Steph even getting the ball to end the game.  Error #1 by OKC.  Then OKC doesn't recognize him as the handler and lets him dribble it up uncontested, over the half court line, and up to 35 feet before a guy even steps at him.  I am sorry but that is not good defense, against anyone, especially him.

When he played the Cs earlier this year, he hit some of those same shots but he was pressured all night, and did not shoot it all that well (certainly not 12 for 16 from 3).  Maybe he had an off night, maybe not having Klay was the main factor, but I consider the idea of having a bunch of good NBA perimeter defenders constantly in his face to be a simple option for slowing him down.

If it was a simple solution, though, wouldn't the 29 other coaches be doing it?

His splits are 52% FG% / 47% 3PT% / 91% FT%.  .643 eFG% / .685 TS%.

That's not a result of bad defense. That's being unable to be defended.

[Tr1boy]

Is there an argument, this season, for any player over Curry? This might be the greatest offensive season of all time.

I don't think there is. Lebron, Durant and RW are still transcendental players, but Curry makes shots that don't even go in on video game "easy mode".

Yes, Curry is in a perfect system, but that system isn't why he's nailing multiple 30+ foot shots in the clutch. He's easily the best shooter I've ever seen, combining accuracy with volume.

I don't disagree with any of this, but it is also clear that he practices those shots and shoots them often in games.  That makes it amazing, but it also makes it reasonable that he will take and make the shot.  Everyone has to know this on the court, and you have to make him pass it.

Basketball isn't played in a vacuum or in a video game.  If I recall last night's game correctly, there was a horrendous offensive possession on the play that facilitated Steph even getting the ball to end the game.  Error #1 by OKC.  Then OKC doesn't recognize him as the handler and lets him dribble it up uncontested, over the half court line, and up to 35 feet before a guy even steps at him.  I am sorry but that is not good defense, against anyone, especially him.

When he played the Cs earlier this year, he hit some of those same shots but he was pressured all night, and did not shoot it all that well (certainly not 12 for 16 from 3).  Maybe he had an off night, maybe not having Klay was the main factor, but I consider the idea of having a bunch of good NBA perimeter defenders constantly in his face to be a simple option for slowing him down.

If it was a simple solution, though, wouldn't the 29 other coaches be doing it?

His splits are 52% FG% / 47% 3PT% / 91% FT%.  .643 eFG% / .685 TS%.

That's not a result of bad defense. That's being unable to be defended.

Watch the prior games Curry played against the grizzlies and Celtics (all of them in the last 2 years) and see if you still think he is unguardable

[nickagneta]

Triboy, when backed into a corner you constantly come out with the comment "you need to watch....." or "obviously you don't watch.....".

I'm starting to think you aren't the one watching anything.

You want Roy to watch a couple games! How about you sit down and watch some of the 100+ games Curry has played this season and last and actually see just how unguardable he is. The man has a 68% TS%. He averages 2 steals a game. He has the best handle in the game of basketball and is a tremendous passer and floor general.

Open your eyes, kid.

The eye test says Curry is the best guard in the league and one of its 2-3 best players. The award test says Curry is the defending MVP, THE man on the defending world champions, and most likely a leader to do it again. The stats test show he is unreal. Better than most anyone since Jordan.

Time for you to watch games, watch Curry play, and study his stats and compare them to other players. When you do, you might get a clue.

[Tr1boy]

Triboy, when backed into a corner you constantly come out with the comment "you need to watch....." or "obviously you don't watch.....".

I'm starting to think you aren't the one watching anything.

You want Roy to watch a couple games! How about you sit down and watch some of the 100+ games Curry has played this season and last and actually see just how unguardable he is. The man has a 68% TS%. He averages 2 steals a game. He has the best handle in the game of basketball and is a tremendous passer and floor general.

Open your eyes, kid.

The eye test says Curry is the best guard in the league and one of its 2-3 best players. The award test says Curry is the defending MVP, THE man on the defending world champions, and most likely a leader to do it again. The stats test show he is unreal. Better than most anyone since Jordan.

Time for you to watch games, watch Curry play, and study his stats and compare them to other players. When you do, you might get a clue.

thanks for the tips, kid

[Roy H.]

Is there an argument, this season, for any player over Curry? This might be the greatest offensive season of all time.

I don't think there is. Lebron, Durant and RW are still transcendental players, but Curry makes shots that don't even go in on video game "easy mode".

Yes, Curry is in a perfect system, but that system isn't why he's nailing multiple 30+ foot shots in the clutch. He's easily the best shooter I've ever seen, combining accuracy with volume.

I don't disagree with any of this, but it is also clear that he practices those shots and shoots them often in games.  That makes it amazing, but it also makes it reasonable that he will take and make the shot.  Everyone has to know this on the court, and you have to make him pass it.

Basketball isn't played in a vacuum or in a video game.  If I recall last night's game correctly, there was a horrendous offensive possession on the play that facilitated Steph even getting the ball to end the game.  Error #1 by OKC.  Then OKC doesn't recognize him as the handler and lets him dribble it up uncontested, over the half court line, and up to 35 feet before a guy even steps at him.  I am sorry but that is not good defense, against anyone, especially him.

When he played the Cs earlier this year, he hit some of those same shots but he was pressured all night, and did not shoot it all that well (certainly not 12 for 16 from 3).  Maybe he had an off night, maybe not having Klay was the main factor, but I consider the idea of having a bunch of good NBA perimeter defenders constantly in his face to be a simple option for slowing him down.

If it was a simple solution, though, wouldn't the 29 other coaches be doing it?

His splits are 52% FG% / 47% 3PT% / 91% FT%.  .643 eFG% / .685 TS%.

That's not a result of bad defense. That's being unable to be defended.

Watch the prior games Curry played against the grizzlies and Celtics (all of them in the last 2 years) and see if you still think he is unguardable

In the last two seasons, in games Bradley has played, Curry has shot 12-for-26 from deep and has averaged 32.3 ppg.

The last three games against Tony Allen, he's 15-for-30 from 3PT, averaging 35.3 points.

The Warriors won all six of those games. So, yeah, basically unguardable..

[Tr1boy]

Is there an argument, this season, for any player over Curry? This might be the greatest offensive season of all time.

I don't think there is. Lebron, Durant and RW are still transcendental players, but Curry makes shots that don't even go in on video game "easy mode".

Yes, Curry is in a perfect system, but that system isn't why he's nailing multiple 30+ foot shots in the clutch. He's easily the best shooter I've ever seen, combining accuracy with volume.

Nice reaction after RW is the one guarding Curry

Watch the games vs grizzlies/Celtics and post your reaction

You know why the Spurs were able to beat Cavs in the finals?  Leonard slowing down/shutting down Lebron

You know why the Bulls were unstoppable bc nobody could slow down Jordan.   

Remedy to slow down Curry is have a solid defender like AB, Allen on him. Play physical D. Glue onto him

This said he is still one of the top players in the league. Let's just calm down to say he is the greatest ever bc he is making beyond the 3 shots being guarded by so so defenders

Name a better shooter -- volume + accuracy + range -- than Curry.

Allen locks down Curry
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KctZoGSBrFU

look at the 4:00 min mark. That is how you need to defend Curry once the ball is inbounded. Not what RW did

look at the clever D at 5:52.