Official 2015-16 Brooklyn Nets Season Watch Thread (21-59, 3rd slot as of 4/12)

[alldaboston]

Larbrd33 jinxed us when he finally started to believe how bad the Nets might be.

Please Larbrd33, go back to thinking the Nets are a playoff team.

Lol we're an unlucky fan base on this forum. Whatever we discuss ends up being jinxed. Let's all praise the Nets!

[esel1000]

My goodness, Simmons had 43-14-7-5-3 on 15/20 shooting....

The lakers better not get this kid. Please, if it's not us, I pray it's not to LA

Lakers won tonight! I can't believe I'm rooting for the Lakers but it's a small price to pay when you think of the possible consequences

[KeepRondo]

Larbrd33 jinxed us when he finally started to believe how bad the Nets might be.

Please Larbrd33, go back to thinking the Nets are a playoff team.

Lol we're an unlucky fan base on this forum. Whatever we discuss ends up being jinxed. Let's all praise the Nets!

We might have to unless Lar picks up the slack again.

[ImShakHeIsShaq]

Larbrd33 jinxed us when he finally started to believe how bad the Nets might be.

Please Larbrd33, go back to thinking the Nets are a playoff team.

Lol we're an unlucky fan base on this forum. Whatever we discuss ends up being jinxed. Let's all praise the Nets!

We might have to unless Lar picks up the slack again.

It's the fault of the fans who cheered "thank you bkn" during that first game.

[LarBrd33]

Larbrd33 jinxed us when he finally started to believe how bad the Nets might be.

Please Larbrd33, go back to thinking the Nets are a playoff team.

Lol we're an unlucky fan base on this forum. Whatever we discuss ends up being jinxed. Let's all praise the Nets!

We might have to unless Lar picks up the slack again.

Assuming they make the playoffs (which they likely will), ya'll probably deserve it for counting your chickens with these "who do we take if the pick ends up 2-4?" and "the Brooklyn pick is our most valuable trade asset" threads.  This is on you, CelticsBlog forum... not me. 

No, but honestly, the blame falls on the Boston fans chanting "Brooklyn Draft Pick" a day before the Nets embarrassed us with a double-digit beatdown.   They've won 3 out of 4 since that game.  The fans angered the basketball karma gods and lit a fire under a sleeping giant.  The fans gave Brooklyn a goal this season:  Spoil Boston's Party.

[celticsclay]

I must be missing something. They have the second worst record in the conference and are currently playing joe johnson 35 minutes a game to get their 5 wins (and brook lopez 34.5). How is there anything not to be happy about here? I'm puzzled....

 

[celticsclay]

Facts:
-Brooklyn are EASILY the 2nd worst team in the East.
-The only two teams clearly worse than them in the NBA are the 76ers and Lakers.
-The only 3 teams that will give them competition for that #3 pick are the Nuggets, Blazers and *maybe* Pelicans if Davis gets hurt for 25 games+.

People like to refer to their previous playoff appearances as case for them making some kind of 'run'. I'm not sure what 'run' people are expecting and that hasn't been explained. Any run that sees them go from the 3rd worst finish to the 5th worst finish is still a potentially franchise changing result for the Celtics.

If you are going to reference their previous recent playoff appearances then it's only fair to analyze their previous competition for those playoff appearances.
If we think about all the teams that Brooklyn beat out for the 8th seed last year in the East, every single one of them except for the 76ers has improved to be clearly better than the Nets this season. They've upgraded their rosters while  the Nets have downgraded their roster.

Pistons are better
Bobcats are better
Knicks are better
Magic are better
Heat are better
Pacers are better

They are the 2nd worst team talent wise in the East. There are potentially 2 or 3 teams in the West that are worse than them being:
Lakers
Nuggets.
To be generous we'll add in the injury riddled Pelicans who will likely start winning more games with their core rotation returning this week.

At the very worst, the Nets record will reflect the odds on favorite for pick #5. Why?
Because there are only 2 teams worse than them, and the only other teams that can compete with them in terms of losses are the Nuggets and an injured Pelicans line up.

The only way the Nets are getting out of a bottom 5 finish is if Lopez is healthy all year and a team like New York or New Orleans suffers a season ending injury to Carmelo or Davis. Even then the Knicks/Pelicans would still be favorited to finish above the Nets overall. And that's without Lopez missing any games.

Again, if anyone can name 4 teams definitively worse than the Nets I'd like to hear it.

thank you. you get it.

[celticsclay]

My guess is Brooklyn is 3rd last
Only Philly and lakers look worser

Philly because it's Philly
LA - surprising considering they got bass, hibbert, Williams 

Nets at least have solid vet talent in BroLo, joe Johnson, bogdanovic
And a good coach in Lionel hollins

It's still probably too early for normal people to get concerned.  But if you're a weirdo like me who has been worried about Brooklyn all season.. In their last 5 games they beat three .500ish teams (Boston, Suns and Pistons) and lost to two contenders (Cavs and Thunder).  Previously they managed to beat the Hawks and take the Warriors into overtime.  Their recent play is reflective of the 35-40 team I was concerned they might be.    Still... 5-13...  top 10 pick seems likely.

I'll say this... there's a bunch of guys who I could see being moved this year (Khris MIddleton and Tobias Harris, for instance) who can't be traded until December 15th or Jan 17th depending on when they signed offseason contracts.   It's by far in our best interest to see Brooklyn struggle for another month.   If they creep close to .500, we might lose our chance to trade the pick for something tangible.

First, let's face it: If any of us were "normal" people instead of weirdos, we probably wouldn't be hanging out all day on CB.

I'm working on a short night of sleep, so bear with me...

I have a tangential concern. I don't want to trade the draft pick, but if Brooklyn gets close to .500, they might decide to take a shot at the playoffs and become buyers, rather than sellers, at the trade deadline. First deadline is 12/15. Before then, they have six games: at the Knicks, and home against GS, Houston, Philly, the Clippers and Orlando. There are four, maybe even five, wins in that group. I absolutely believe that Houston and the Clippers (and the other non-Philly teams) are better than the Nets on paper, but they have done little to prove it on the court.

So if the Nets go into the trade deadline at 9-15 or 10-14, is there a possibility that they become buyers, rather than sellers, at the trade deadline? Pick up a few expiring contracts or veterans in exchange for the Bogdanovics of the world in the hopes that they pick up the 8-slot in the playoffs? I'm not just thinking of our pick this year but also of future picks. Do they become any more attractive for free agents over the summer if Lopez and Young look good? Note: The 10 games after December 15 are only slightly more difficult and they could easily go 6-4 in those. They don't have to be a playoff team, they just have to think that there's a chance they are.

I look at their roster on paper and they are not much better than they were at the beginning of the season. But the fact remains that they've been winning and getting darn close against a few other top teams. Their defense has come together; if they had played GS last night instead of a few weeks ago, would it have been a different outcome?

Their offense is as expected. Their defense, which we thought would be the weak spot, has been better than expected. RHJ appears to be legit. As John Cage would say, "I'm troubled."


I understand several things, including the fact that the above is a worst-case scenario. They've been extraordinarily healthy and players such as Jack and Young who have never been superstars are playing above grade level. At least a few teams looked like they weren't taking the Nets seriously. And finally, any moves they make this year, ex-picking up a big free agent this summer, likely hurts them next year.

I am not claiming that this is a playoff team, but it is clearly better than we expected and the first ten games probably included the hardest stretch until we get to March. How many teams are worse than the Nets? On paper, only a couple. But the season isn't played on paper. If they beat Philly plus one of the Knicks, Warriors or Houston, they are 7-13 after 20 games, a run rate of 29 wins for the season, awfully close to the 30-35 wins that many of us laughed at at the beginning of the season. Still not bad, since that would have gotten us 6 or 7 last year and, given a bit more parity in the league, possibly better this year. But I'm sure gonna miss that Top-3 pick that I was sure we would get. I think Tommy better start learning how to pronounce "Poeltl."

In any case, thanks for reading my ramblings on a Wednesday morning.

Mike

One thing this doesn't mention is that the Nets owner has publicly stated interest in selling the team. Throughout my following of the NBA when teams are being prepared to be sold they strip down long term salary obligations rather than try to make short term money with a first round playoff trip. It is really hard for me to imagine the nets taking on any salary based on this (there is also the fact that there have been numerous articles suggesting they are doing the opposite)

[LarBrd33]

My guess is Brooklyn is 3rd last
Only Philly and lakers look worser

Philly because it's Philly
LA - surprising considering they got bass, hibbert, Williams 

Nets at least have solid vet talent in BroLo, joe Johnson, bogdanovic
And a good coach in Lionel hollins

It's still probably too early for normal people to get concerned.  But if you're a weirdo like me who has been worried about Brooklyn all season.. In their last 5 games they beat three .500ish teams (Boston, Suns and Pistons) and lost to two contenders (Cavs and Thunder).  Previously they managed to beat the Hawks and take the Warriors into overtime.  Their recent play is reflective of the 35-40 team I was concerned they might be.    Still... 5-13...  top 10 pick seems likely.

I'll say this... there's a bunch of guys who I could see being moved this year (Khris MIddleton and Tobias Harris, for instance) who can't be traded until December 15th or Jan 17th depending on when they signed offseason contracts.   It's by far in our best interest to see Brooklyn struggle for another month.   If they creep close to .500, we might lose our chance to trade the pick for something tangible.

First, let's face it: If any of us were "normal" people instead of weirdos, we probably wouldn't be hanging out all day on CB.

I'm working on a short night of sleep, so bear with me...

I have a tangential concern. I don't want to trade the draft pick, but if Brooklyn gets close to .500, they might decide to take a shot at the playoffs and become buyers, rather than sellers, at the trade deadline. First deadline is 12/15. Before then, they have six games: at the Knicks, and home against GS, Houston, Philly, the Clippers and Orlando. There are four, maybe even five, wins in that group. I absolutely believe that Houston and the Clippers (and the other non-Philly teams) are better than the Nets on paper, but they have done little to prove it on the court.

So if the Nets go into the trade deadline at 9-15 or 10-14, is there a possibility that they become buyers, rather than sellers, at the trade deadline? Pick up a few expiring contracts or veterans in exchange for the Bogdanovics of the world in the hopes that they pick up the 8-slot in the playoffs? I'm not just thinking of our pick this year but also of future picks. Do they become any more attractive for free agents over the summer if Lopez and Young look good? Note: The 10 games after December 15 are only slightly more difficult and they could easily go 6-4 in those. They don't have to be a playoff team, they just have to think that there's a chance they are.

I look at their roster on paper and they are not much better than they were at the beginning of the season. But the fact remains that they've been winning and getting darn close against a few other top teams. Their defense has come together; if they had played GS last night instead of a few weeks ago, would it have been a different outcome?

Their offense is as expected. Their defense, which we thought would be the weak spot, has been better than expected. RHJ appears to be legit. As John Cage would say, "I'm troubled."


I understand several things, including the fact that the above is a worst-case scenario. They've been extraordinarily healthy and players such as Jack and Young who have never been superstars are playing above grade level. At least a few teams looked like they weren't taking the Nets seriously. And finally, any moves they make this year, ex-picking up a big free agent this summer, likely hurts them next year.

I am not claiming that this is a playoff team, but it is clearly better than we expected and the first ten games probably included the hardest stretch until we get to March. How many teams are worse than the Nets? On paper, only a couple. But the season isn't played on paper. If they beat Philly plus one of the Knicks, Warriors or Houston, they are 7-13 after 20 games, a run rate of 29 wins for the season, awfully close to the 30-35 wins that many of us laughed at at the beginning of the season. Still not bad, since that would have gotten us 6 or 7 last year and, given a bit more parity in the league, possibly better this year. But I'm sure gonna miss that Top-3 pick that I was sure we would get. I think Tommy better start learning how to pronounce "Poeltl."

In any case, thanks for reading my ramblings on a Wednesday morning.

Mike

One thing this doesn't mention is that the Nets owner has publicly stated interest in selling the team. Throughout my following of the NBA when teams are being prepared to be sold they strip down long term salary obligations rather than try to make short term money with a first round playoff trip. It is really hard for me to imagine the nets taking on any salary based on this (there is also the fact that there have been numerous articles suggesting they are doing the opposite)

Yeah here's an article about their ownership group from today I believe:  http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/14275670/mikhail-prokhorov-close-acquiring-100-percent-brooklyn-nets-barclays-center

Anyways... Brooklyn has 40 million in cap space next year.  Beyond Lopez (22 mil) and Thad (12 mil) they don't have any significant contracts and both of those guys seem to have value at this point.    My concern for our 2017 and 2018 picks from them is that they can just spend money on players to put around their core of Brook and Thad.

[Ilikesports17]

I'm very worried about Brooklyn right now but as we get deeper into the year their lack of depth should become more pronounced and should doom them.

[celticsclay]

My guess is Brooklyn is 3rd last
Only Philly and lakers look worser

Philly because it's Philly
LA - surprising considering they got bass, hibbert, Williams 

Nets at least have solid vet talent in BroLo, joe Johnson, bogdanovic
And a good coach in Lionel hollins

It's still probably too early for normal people to get concerned.  But if you're a weirdo like me who has been worried about Brooklyn all season.. In their last 5 games they beat three .500ish teams (Boston, Suns and Pistons) and lost to two contenders (Cavs and Thunder).  Previously they managed to beat the Hawks and take the Warriors into overtime.  Their recent play is reflective of the 35-40 team I was concerned they might be.    Still... 5-13...  top 10 pick seems likely.

I'll say this... there's a bunch of guys who I could see being moved this year (Khris MIddleton and Tobias Harris, for instance) who can't be traded until December 15th or Jan 17th depending on when they signed offseason contracts.   It's by far in our best interest to see Brooklyn struggle for another month.   If they creep close to .500, we might lose our chance to trade the pick for something tangible.

First, let's face it: If any of us were "normal" people instead of weirdos, we probably wouldn't be hanging out all day on CB.

I'm working on a short night of sleep, so bear with me...

I have a tangential concern. I don't want to trade the draft pick, but if Brooklyn gets close to .500, they might decide to take a shot at the playoffs and become buyers, rather than sellers, at the trade deadline. First deadline is 12/15. Before then, they have six games: at the Knicks, and home against GS, Houston, Philly, the Clippers and Orlando. There are four, maybe even five, wins in that group. I absolutely believe that Houston and the Clippers (and the other non-Philly teams) are better than the Nets on paper, but they have done little to prove it on the court.

So if the Nets go into the trade deadline at 9-15 or 10-14, is there a possibility that they become buyers, rather than sellers, at the trade deadline? Pick up a few expiring contracts or veterans in exchange for the Bogdanovics of the world in the hopes that they pick up the 8-slot in the playoffs? I'm not just thinking of our pick this year but also of future picks. Do they become any more attractive for free agents over the summer if Lopez and Young look good? Note: The 10 games after December 15 are only slightly more difficult and they could easily go 6-4 in those. They don't have to be a playoff team, they just have to think that there's a chance they are.

I look at their roster on paper and they are not much better than they were at the beginning of the season. But the fact remains that they've been winning and getting darn close against a few other top teams. Their defense has come together; if they had played GS last night instead of a few weeks ago, would it have been a different outcome?

Their offense is as expected. Their defense, which we thought would be the weak spot, has been better than expected. RHJ appears to be legit. As John Cage would say, "I'm troubled."


I understand several things, including the fact that the above is a worst-case scenario. They've been extraordinarily healthy and players such as Jack and Young who have never been superstars are playing above grade level. At least a few teams looked like they weren't taking the Nets seriously. And finally, any moves they make this year, ex-picking up a big free agent this summer, likely hurts them next year.

I am not claiming that this is a playoff team, but it is clearly better than we expected and the first ten games probably included the hardest stretch until we get to March. How many teams are worse than the Nets? On paper, only a couple. But the season isn't played on paper. If they beat Philly plus one of the Knicks, Warriors or Houston, they are 7-13 after 20 games, a run rate of 29 wins for the season, awfully close to the 30-35 wins that many of us laughed at at the beginning of the season. Still not bad, since that would have gotten us 6 or 7 last year and, given a bit more parity in the league, possibly better this year. But I'm sure gonna miss that Top-3 pick that I was sure we would get. I think Tommy better start learning how to pronounce "Poeltl."

In any case, thanks for reading my ramblings on a Wednesday morning.

Mike

One thing this doesn't mention is that the Nets owner has publicly stated interest in selling the team. Throughout my following of the NBA when teams are being prepared to be sold they strip down long term salary obligations rather than try to make short term money with a first round playoff trip. It is really hard for me to imagine the nets taking on any salary based on this (there is also the fact that there have been numerous articles suggesting they are doing the opposite)

Yeah here's an article about their ownership group from today I believe:  http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/14275670/mikhail-prokhorov-close-acquiring-100-percent-brooklyn-nets-barclays-center

Anyways... Brooklyn has 40 million in cap space next year.  Beyond Lopez (22 mil) and Thad (12 mil) they don't have any significant contracts and both of those guys seem to have value at this point.    My concern for our 2017 and 2018 picks from them is that they can just spend money on players to put around their core of Brook and Thad.

that article doesn't really seem to have any actual information. my point was not about next year or the year after. Just that it seems particularly unlikely that they would take on salary this season while preparing for a move. Find me something where they take on salary (this season) and i will be surprised.

[LarBrd33]

My guess is Brooklyn is 3rd last
Only Philly and lakers look worser

Philly because it's Philly
LA - surprising considering they got bass, hibbert, Williams 

Nets at least have solid vet talent in BroLo, joe Johnson, bogdanovic
And a good coach in Lionel hollins

It's still probably too early for normal people to get concerned.  But if you're a weirdo like me who has been worried about Brooklyn all season.. In their last 5 games they beat three .500ish teams (Boston, Suns and Pistons) and lost to two contenders (Cavs and Thunder).  Previously they managed to beat the Hawks and take the Warriors into overtime.  Their recent play is reflective of the 35-40 team I was concerned they might be.    Still... 5-13...  top 10 pick seems likely.

I'll say this... there's a bunch of guys who I could see being moved this year (Khris MIddleton and Tobias Harris, for instance) who can't be traded until December 15th or Jan 17th depending on when they signed offseason contracts.   It's by far in our best interest to see Brooklyn struggle for another month.   If they creep close to .500, we might lose our chance to trade the pick for something tangible.

First, let's face it: If any of us were "normal" people instead of weirdos, we probably wouldn't be hanging out all day on CB.

I'm working on a short night of sleep, so bear with me...

I have a tangential concern. I don't want to trade the draft pick, but if Brooklyn gets close to .500, they might decide to take a shot at the playoffs and become buyers, rather than sellers, at the trade deadline. First deadline is 12/15. Before then, they have six games: at the Knicks, and home against GS, Houston, Philly, the Clippers and Orlando. There are four, maybe even five, wins in that group. I absolutely believe that Houston and the Clippers (and the other non-Philly teams) are better than the Nets on paper, but they have done little to prove it on the court.

So if the Nets go into the trade deadline at 9-15 or 10-14, is there a possibility that they become buyers, rather than sellers, at the trade deadline? Pick up a few expiring contracts or veterans in exchange for the Bogdanovics of the world in the hopes that they pick up the 8-slot in the playoffs? I'm not just thinking of our pick this year but also of future picks. Do they become any more attractive for free agents over the summer if Lopez and Young look good? Note: The 10 games after December 15 are only slightly more difficult and they could easily go 6-4 in those. They don't have to be a playoff team, they just have to think that there's a chance they are.

I look at their roster on paper and they are not much better than they were at the beginning of the season. But the fact remains that they've been winning and getting darn close against a few other top teams. Their defense has come together; if they had played GS last night instead of a few weeks ago, would it have been a different outcome?

Their offense is as expected. Their defense, which we thought would be the weak spot, has been better than expected. RHJ appears to be legit. As John Cage would say, "I'm troubled."


I understand several things, including the fact that the above is a worst-case scenario. They've been extraordinarily healthy and players such as Jack and Young who have never been superstars are playing above grade level. At least a few teams looked like they weren't taking the Nets seriously. And finally, any moves they make this year, ex-picking up a big free agent this summer, likely hurts them next year.

I am not claiming that this is a playoff team, but it is clearly better than we expected and the first ten games probably included the hardest stretch until we get to March. How many teams are worse than the Nets? On paper, only a couple. But the season isn't played on paper. If they beat Philly plus one of the Knicks, Warriors or Houston, they are 7-13 after 20 games, a run rate of 29 wins for the season, awfully close to the 30-35 wins that many of us laughed at at the beginning of the season. Still not bad, since that would have gotten us 6 or 7 last year and, given a bit more parity in the league, possibly better this year. But I'm sure gonna miss that Top-3 pick that I was sure we would get. I think Tommy better start learning how to pronounce "Poeltl."

In any case, thanks for reading my ramblings on a Wednesday morning.

Mike

One thing this doesn't mention is that the Nets owner has publicly stated interest in selling the team. Throughout my following of the NBA when teams are being prepared to be sold they strip down long term salary obligations rather than try to make short term money with a first round playoff trip. It is really hard for me to imagine the nets taking on any salary based on this (there is also the fact that there have been numerous articles suggesting they are doing the opposite)

Yeah here's an article about their ownership group from today I believe:  http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/14275670/mikhail-prokhorov-close-acquiring-100-percent-brooklyn-nets-barclays-center

Anyways... Brooklyn has 40 million in cap space next year.  Beyond Lopez (22 mil) and Thad (12 mil) they don't have any significant contracts and both of those guys seem to have value at this point.    My concern for our 2017 and 2018 picks from them is that they can just spend money on players to put around their core of Brook and Thad.

that article doesn't really seem to have any actual information. my point was not about next year or the year after. Just that it seems particularly unlikely that they would take on salary this season while preparing for a move. Find me something where they take on salary (this season) and i will be surprised.

Well they can't outright take on extra salary for this season.  You have to roughly match the salary you send out.   But what they can do is probably try and plug holes by trading someone like Bojan Bogdanovic or Shane Larkin for vets.   

[mef730]

Well they can't outright take on extra salary for this season.  You have to roughly match the salary you send out.   But what they can do is probably try and plug holes by trading someone like Bojan Bogdanovic or Shane Larkin for vets.   

Fair point, hadn't thought about that.

[Ramble]I remain concerned that a Brooklyn team that isn't clearly terrible makes moves to become a playoff team this year. That's why the "lose early, lose often" is so important to us. If they appear to be somewhat competent, I worry less about this year and more about their becoming attractive to free agents.

Plus side: I think they're really going to have trouble pulling it off. They've got too many factors working against them, including the fact that any injury to one of the top 6 spells doom. As for free agency, Conley, DeRozan and Wade are all unrestricted, but which of those three is going to go to Brooklyn? Certainly not the first two.You could make the argument that nobody else is going to give Wade the kind of money that he wants, so Brooklyn would be the default option, but that's a tough sell for me. I've gotta think this guy wants to go out on a winner. Heck, he'd be better off in Philadelphia than Brooklyn. I'm not sure what's left. Brandon Jennings? I guess. He's unrestricted. But one of the thing working against Brooklyn this year in free agency is that so many of the top FAs are big men. Joe Johnson will be gone-can Thaddeus Young play the 3?[/Ramble]

Mike

[Evantime34]

The Nets have played pretty well recently, but to be fair as a healthy team not a lot of us expected them to be a bottom five team.

My argument for them being a bottom 5 team has always been a lack of depth and how injuries would effect them. With how thin they are any injury could cause them to go into a tailspin. If they don't have any injuries this year I could see the Nets as a team closer to the 10-15 range than the 1-5 range. However, it's very unlikely they will go through an entire season without injuries.

As to this years picks being worth a lot more than future Nets picks, I think that is unlikely. Lots have mentioned how the Nets will improve the next two years by using their cap space. This is extremely unlikely imo, since there are a ton of teams much better than Brooklyn with cap space that players would rather go to. The Nets aren't even the best free agent destination in their own city!

[mef730]

The Nets are even the best free agent destination in their own city!

What, we're breaking New York down by boroughs now?

(Yes, I know what you meant.) 

Mike