Be Honest: Celtics make the playoffs - Good or Bad Thing?

[chambers]

For all their tanking look at the Sixers. They couldn't beat Oak Hill Academy. Ok. They could. But if they were told the game counted in the standings they couldn't.

For all their tanking they have Joel Embid and Noel. Whoop de doo.

We have Sully, Marcus Smart, and James Young.

When you look at who they will supposedly pick next year nbadraft.net has them taking Jahil Okafor and Trey Lyles in the first round and we're taking Willy C Stein and Tyus Jones.

Is that their big plan? That's how they're going to get so great?

They're going to have Okafor, Noel, Embid, and T Lyles and we're going to have Sully, WCS, Smart, Young, and Tyus Jones and that's their plan for getting so much better than the rest of the league?

The foundation of their team is losing. They've made it to the Timberwolves zone. Kindred spirits with the 90s Clippers

You wouldn't trade our assets for theirs at this very moment?
They have Saric, the Lakers pick, their own 2015 pick, Noel and Embid.
They have far superior assets to ours.
What do we have that is even as good as Noel at this point? He's more valuable than Marcus Smart that's for sure.

The fact is that without Brad Stevens as a genius coach, we really don't have much other than Smart and Sullinger and some Brooklyn picks.

It's fine to criticize the 76ers, but to act like we are automatically better because we haven't gutted our roster is naive, and we may look like the foolish ones when we have this conversation in 2-3 years time if they present as the Wizards are now with John Wall and Beal shooting them up to a real threat in the East. What exactly are we hoping for at the moment? To be a better version of Atlanta and cross our fingers we can attract a free agent as good as their #3 draft pick Mr Al Horford.
Let's not forget that it's doubtful the East stays this bad for much longer. Miami will be back next year with Bosh and Dragic as Whiteside improves, New York has cap room, a top 3 pick and a top 20 player in his prime who's had a season of rest.
Cleveland has Lebron, Kyrie and Love and the Bucks have Giannis, Jabari Parker and a top 4 record in the East. Then there's the Bulls and Wizards.

Don't get me wrong Eja you get nothing but respect from me but I just want to make it clear that a lot of us aren't so optimistic about our chances at a title sooner than the 76ers- or at least a real shot at creating a championship team.
Smart and Stevens are great starting pieces, but other then them it's not all green happiness.

[CFAN38]

I'm going to say it - I want to see playoff basketball.

It would be fun.

But realistically this team isn't going to do much damage in the playoffs. They're just not that talented enough....so no I don't think it would be a good thing for the TEAM to make the playoffs this year.

But they've been better than expected this year and they're actually not super bad as most have thought. I do wish they were super bad though because Thomas is our best player and he's a borderline All-Star at best.

Over the long hall this team would have been best served landing a top 8 pick. This simply wasn't going to happen with the state of the rest of the league and BS coaching ability. With so many teams in terrible tank mode the Cs have been pushed up the standings and BS is doing an amazing job with DA's primarily bargain bin roster.

As things currently stand the Playoffs has to be the goal. I made a fanpost about the draft tiers and think that after the top 8 this draft flattens out to a group of 17 comparable prospects. Meaning the Cs will not have a major talent difference at pick 12 compared to 15. If DA really likes a prospect outside that top 8 he has the ammunition to move up and get it (maybe even into the top 8?). The Cs will never draft players with all the picks they have gained so DA will use them to get who he wants.

 Lets get in the playoffs as the 8th seed and steal at least one game from the Hawks. ATL is a great team but they have a roster the Cs can compete with. They lack a star who is going to overwhelm the Cs. Even a first round loss can be a major building block when the team and coach are all young hungry players. Making the playoffs this year will make guys like Smart and KO expect it every year as they should.

[D.o.s.]

Because the C' s have been doing well of late I see it seems okay to change the language from tanking or not tanking to Celtics in playoffs, good thing or bad thing??? how white of you!!!

for the record here's the difference between tanking and not tanking....tanking takes no brains, no skills, no energy, just go out there, play sloppy basketball, and lose.  for this you are rewarded with the possibility of gaining nothing at all.
 on the other hand not tanking makes men out of boys because it makes you learn how to play hard when all the odds are against you it makes winning one game the best feeling in your life. a feeling you will find out you cannot do without. if, by giving it your best, you make the playoffs, you will learn even more important things by players; that do it the best!!!

tanking is all about the luck of the draw, it's a gamble that doesn't even favor you and teaches you nothing but bad work habits.  but putting in the work and winning is a whole different ball game that teaches you how to be a man.

I think this is what he meant.

Per Urban Dictionary:

mighty white of you
Used to describe someone who thinks they've done a great deed, charitable action or sacrifice, but in reality they've done very little to help the human condition.
Earl: I gave that homeless man my half eaten apple.
Roger: Wow, thats mighty white of you.

Yeah, but it's been traditionally used in a racist way, though it technically didn't originate as a racist notion.

Still, probably a saying that shouldn't be used in modern-day language lol

For a moment there I forgot how politically correct we are suppose to be and how easily some try to drag us down the slippery slope of racism. if people would lighten up it might be an easier world to live in.

Couldn't agree more. There's a lot of people in the world today making a living off of being a professional victim. Sad to see as it insults people who actually are victims. Everyone is just looking for something to be outraged about.

Particularly the people getting upset about other people getting upset, it would seem.

[TheReaLPuba]

Bad thing. 


The only reason we are talking about this is because the lack of playoff level teams in the East.  A sub 500 team playoff team is not something I look forward to in the NBA as a fan. 


It is great how well the Celtics are playing now, but the team still needs more talent.  I rather the higher pick to give Ainge a better chance to get who he feels is the best possible talent instead of hoping a few more teams make draft mistakes.   


Not hoping they lose more games, just that one of the teams ahead of them hold serve and keep the 8th spot in the East.

Yea the East is still pretty horrific. But someones got to play in these playoffs.

IF the C's do make the playoffs who are they really missing out on in terms of "great" college players?

[GetLucky]

At this point, why not? The game against the Pacers was the first one in a long while that I was actively rooting for the Celtics' shots to go in the and the Paces' to roll out. When I say actively rooting for, I mean jumping off my couch, screaming at the TV, and annoying my family.

For the past few years I've been relatively indifferent (thinking every make is progress but every miss is closer to a lottery pick). However, this team deserves to make an unadulterated push; they're the first one in a while that's legitimately fun to watch. Even the 2013 Big 3 (Rondo, KG, Pierce) wasn't this entertaining.

The only downside of making the playoffs is that we won't be able to speculate about our team's 1.7% or 2.2% (14th and 13th best odds, respectively) chance at a top 3 pick. And yeah, that stinks in terms of entertainment during the offseason. But I'd rather give this team what they deserve than have more lottery conspiracies to Google.

[Moranis]

I think we just saw that if Bron was on the Sixers it wouldn't make a difference. Tanking...it almost never works

Sure it does.  Oklahoma City tanked and landed Durant, Westbrook, and Harden.  San Antonio tanked and landed Duncan.  Cleveland tanked and landed James (and did it again and landed Irving).  Orlando tanked and landed Howard.  Miami tanked and landed Wade.  Houston tanked and landed Ming.  Tanking works as much as any other method of landing elite level talent and in fact probably works at a higher rate than any other method.  The appeal of tanking is you are assured of a high level draft pick, which means high level talent.  You have to draft correctly and it certainly helps if you get lucky in the drafts you tank in, but teams do it because it works, not because it fails all the time.

Maybe I should have said "Tanking. It almost never gets you championships".

Hardly anything gets you championships.  Only 1 team in 30 gets one each year.  Of course the defending champion tanked their way to their best player and 5 titles with him.  And sure the team that won the two before that added 2 great players in free agency, but they certainly tanked for their anchor and captain (and clear HOF player Wade).  Who you know brought Miami 3 titles and 2 other title appearances.  Even Dallas essentially tanked to end up with Dirk (traded Kidd 1.5 years before the Dirk draft).  Boston landed Pierce after failing in their tank for Duncan (so the tank for Duncan failed, but Boston ended up with a franchise cornerstone and the Finals MVP of their lone recent title).  The Lakers really are the recent champion that never tanked to land to their franchise player acquiring Shaq in free agency and Kobe and Gasol in trades (though Kobe was acquired before ever playing in the league).  Heck even the Rockets went from a team in the NBA finals to tanking for Sampson and the Dream in consecutive drafts in the course for like 3 seasons (the year after the finals they were still good, so they went from playoff team to tanking in 2 seasons and back to playoff team in the whole span of 2 drafts).  Even the Bulls went from the Eastern Conference Semis to tanking for Jordan in the span of 3 seasons. 

Tanking quite simply works.  You just have to get lucky and tank in the right draft (which of course you don't know ahead of time) and then make the right draft pick when you get there (so don't pull a Detroit and draft Darko Milicic with Anthony, Wade, and Bosh on the board). 

[TheReaLPuba]

I think we just saw that if Bron was on the Sixers it wouldn't make a difference. Tanking...it almost never works

Sure it does.  Oklahoma City tanked and landed Durant, Westbrook, and Harden.  San Antonio tanked and landed Duncan.  Cleveland tanked and landed James (and did it again and landed Irving).  Orlando tanked and landed Howard.  Miami tanked and landed Wade.  Houston tanked and landed Ming.  Tanking works as much as any other method of landing elite level talent and in fact probably works at a higher rate than any other method.  The appeal of tanking is you are assured of a high level draft pick, which means high level talent.  You have to draft correctly and it certainly helps if you get lucky in the drafts you tank in, but teams do it because it works, not because it fails all the time.

Maybe I should have said "Tanking. It almost never gets you championships".

Hardly anything gets you championships.  Only 1 team in 30 gets one each year.  Of course the defending champion tanked their way to their best player and 5 titles with him.  And sure the team that won the two before that added 2 great players in free agency, but they certainly tanked for their anchor and captain (and clear HOF player Wade).  Who you know brought Miami 3 titles and 2 other title appearances.  Even Dallas essentially tanked to end up with Dirk (traded Kidd 1.5 years before the Dirk draft).  Boston landed Pierce after failing in their tank for Duncan (so the tank for Duncan failed, but Boston ended up with a franchise cornerstone and the Finals MVP of their lone recent title).  The Lakers really are the recent champion that never tanked to land to their franchise player acquiring Shaq in free agency and Kobe and Gasol in trades (though Kobe was acquired before ever playing in the league).  Heck even the Rockets went from a team in the NBA finals to tanking for Sampson and the Dream in consecutive drafts in the course for like 3 seasons (the year after the finals they were still good, so they went from playoff team to tanking in 2 seasons and back to playoff team in the whole span of 2 drafts).  Even the Bulls went from the Eastern Conference Semis to tanking for Jordan in the span of 3 seasons. 

Tanking quite simply works.  You just have to get lucky and tank in the right draft (which of course you don't know ahead of time) and then make the right draft pick when you get there (so don't pull a Detroit and draft Darko Milicic with Anthony, Wade, and Bosh on the board).

I hate losing though. Tanking only ensures a high draft pick and you can still mess up on who you pick.

[D.o.s.]

You can still mess up a suboptimal draft pick, too.

If you hate losing, is there a difference between watching the team lose in the regular season and watching them lose in the playoffs?

[Snakehead]

You can still mess up a suboptimal draft pick, too.

If you hate losing, is there a difference between watching the team lose in the regular season and watching them lose in the playoffs?

Making it to the Playoffs is a victory in its own.  Especially with our team (one not expected to make it).  Obviously yes.

[D.o.s.]

I'll be sure to pick up a commemorative participation trophy from the Garden's merch stand.

[Snakehead]

I'll be sure to pick up a commemorative participation trophy from the Garden's merch stand.

Don't see what there is to be so sarcastic and negative about.

Sorry we won't have the 13th pick man.  Tired of losing the lottery.  Making the Playoffs is positive for the team.

I'll get you a plaque that says we had the 13th pick instead of the 16th or whatever maybe that'll help you feel better.

[slamtheking]

Boston landed Pierce after failing in their tank for Duncan (so the tank for Duncan failed, but Boston ended up with a franchise cornerstone and the Finals MVP of their lone recent title). 

lost me on this --> Pierce was taken in the draft after Duncan's draft.  we were stuck with Billups and Mercer in that draft.

C's had been bad for several years which ended up with 4 top ten picks that generated Antoine, Billups (moved for Kenny Anderson), Mercer and Pierce.   while that looked like a promising core in PP's rookie year,  that line-up didn't get far in a very weak Eastern conference.

[Eja117]

For all their tanking look at the Sixers. They couldn't beat Oak Hill Academy. Ok. They could. But if they were told the game counted in the standings they couldn't.

For all their tanking they have Joel Embid and Noel. Whoop de doo.

We have Sully, Marcus Smart, and James Young.

When you look at who they will supposedly pick next year nbadraft.net has them taking Jahil Okafor and Trey Lyles in the first round and we're taking Willy C Stein and Tyus Jones.

Is that their big plan? That's how they're going to get so great?

They're going to have Okafor, Noel, Embid, and T Lyles and we're going to have Sully, WCS, Smart, Young, and Tyus Jones and that's their plan for getting so much better than the rest of the league?

The foundation of their team is losing. They've made it to the Timberwolves zone. Kindred spirits with the 90s Clippers

You wouldn't trade our assets for theirs at this very moment?
They have Saric, the Lakers pick, their own 2015 pick, Noel and Embid.
They have far superior assets to ours.
What do we have that is even as good as Noel at this point? He's more valuable than Marcus Smart that's for sure.

The fact is that without Brad Stevens as a genius coach, we really don't have much other than Smart and Sullinger and some Brooklyn picks.

It's fine to criticize the 76ers, but to act like we are automatically better because we haven't gutted our roster is naive, and we may look like the foolish ones when we have this conversation in 2-3 years time if they present as the Wizards are now with John Wall and Beal shooting them up to a real threat in the East. What exactly are we hoping for at the moment? To be a better version of Atlanta and cross our fingers we can attract a free agent as good as their #3 draft pick Mr Al Horford.
Let's not forget that it's doubtful the East stays this bad for much longer. Miami will be back next year with Bosh and Dragic as Whiteside improves, New York has cap room, a top 3 pick and a top 20 player in his prime who's had a season of rest.
Cleveland has Lebron, Kyrie and Love and the Bucks have Giannis, Jabari Parker and a top 4 record in the East. Then there's the Bulls and Wizards.

Don't get me wrong Eja you get nothing but respect from me but I just want to make it clear that a lot of us aren't so optimistic about our chances at a title sooner than the 76ers- or at least a real shot at creating a championship team.
Smart and Stevens are great starting pieces, but other then them it's not all green happiness.

I would take Smart over Noel every day of the year. Embiid doesn't scare me at all and Euros that aren't here don't scare me either.

But no matter what assets they have they are teaching theirs to lose. We are teaching ours to win. It's not the assets. It's what you do with them.

[celticsclay]

For all their tanking look at the Sixers. They couldn't beat Oak Hill Academy. Ok. They could. But if they were told the game counted in the standings they couldn't.

For all their tanking they have Joel Embid and Noel. Whoop de doo.

We have Sully, Marcus Smart, and James Young.

When you look at who they will supposedly pick next year nbadraft.net has them taking Jahil Okafor and Trey Lyles in the first round and we're taking Willy C Stein and Tyus Jones.

Is that their big plan? That's how they're going to get so great?

They're going to have Okafor, Noel, Embid, and T Lyles and we're going to have Sully, WCS, Smart, Young, and Tyus Jones and that's their plan for getting so much better than the rest of the league?

The foundation of their team is losing. They've made it to the Timberwolves zone. Kindred spirits with the 90s Clippers

You wouldn't trade our assets for theirs at this very moment?
They have Saric, the Lakers pick, their own 2015 pick, Noel and Embid.
They have far superior assets to ours.
What do we have that is even as good as Noel at this point? He's more valuable than Marcus Smart that's for sure.

The fact is that without Brad Stevens as a genius coach, we really don't have much other than Smart and Sullinger and some Brooklyn picks.

It's fine to criticize the 76ers, but to act like we are automatically better because we haven't gutted our roster is naive, and we may look like the foolish ones when we have this conversation in 2-3 years time if they present as the Wizards are now with John Wall and Beal shooting them up to a real threat in the East. What exactly are we hoping for at the moment? To be a better version of Atlanta and cross our fingers we can attract a free agent as good as their #3 draft pick Mr Al Horford.
Let's not forget that it's doubtful the East stays this bad for much longer. Miami will be back next year with Bosh and Dragic as Whiteside improves, New York has cap room, a top 3 pick and a top 20 player in his prime who's had a season of rest.
Cleveland has Lebron, Kyrie and Love and the Bucks have Giannis, Jabari Parker and a top 4 record in the East. Then there's the Bulls and Wizards.

Don't get me wrong Eja you get nothing but respect from me but I just want to make it clear that a lot of us aren't so optimistic about our chances at a title sooner than the 76ers- or at least a real shot at creating a championship team.
Smart and Stevens are great starting pieces, but other then them it's not all green happiness.

I would take Smart over Noel every day of the year. Embiid doesn't scare me at all and Euros that aren't here don't scare me either.

But no matter what assets they have they are teaching theirs to lose. We are teaching ours to win. It's not the assets. It's what you do with them.

Ahh yes... debating the 76ers again. They are now two wins ahead of the Knicks and the Twolves and have gotten within 1 win of the lakers who Lakers announcers insist are going to start cutting the minutes of boozer. (Side note when you are comparing to two teams that have won 14 all year, 2 is a lot!.)

This sets up a few points..
1) The 76ers most likely will end up with the 3rd or 4th pick. Obviously they can win it also, but there is a reasonable chance they finish with the 4th worst record.

2) There is potential for some weird bum tanking down the stretch. The 76ers own the lakers pick and they are virtually tied for 3rd and 4th worst record. The Lakers have so much incentive to not get that pick, but the 76ers have so much incentive not to pass the Lakers.

Edit: For those that didn't know the Lakers pick is top 5 protected

[mef730]

2) There is potential for some weird bum tanking down the stretch. The 76ers own the lakers pick and they are virtually tied for 3rd and 4th worst record. The Lakers have so much incentive to not get that pick, but the 76ers have so much incentive not to pass the Lakers.

Edit: For those that didn't know the Lakers pick is top 5 protected

I was just thinking about that.  I'm rooting for the playoffs, but I've decided if that, somehow, the universe could promise me that the Celts and one other lottery team with a "good" record jumped to the top 3, thus pushing the Lakers to #6, I'd have to change my mind.

Mike