#DeflateGate (Court of Appeals Reinstates Suspension)

[Donoghus]

Wow. I predicted the suspension, but the draft picks are overboard. A first and a fourth when there was no evidence that the front office knew what was going on?

Especially after the Wells Report had said this:

“We do not believe that the evidence establishes that any other Patriots personnel participated in or had knowledge of the violation of the Playing Rules or the deliberate effort to circumvent the rules described in this Report. In particular, we do not believe there was any wrongdoing or knowledge of wrongdoing by Patriots ownership, Patriots Head Coach Bill Belichick or any other Patriots coach in the matters investigated. We also do not believe there was any wrongdoing or knowledge of wrongdoing by Patriots Head Equipment Manager Dave Schoenfeld.”

So the league essentially took the Wells report at face value regarding Brady and then dismissed the same report when it came to the head coach/ownership?

[D.o.s.]

My issue is if its a nonevent, why not comply ?

I don't know -- it's possible that someone actually suggested that he refuse and lawyer up for the benefit of the NFLPA -- who are already a weak players union, for one.

Personally speaking, I don't believe in the "if you're innocent you shouldn't have anything to hide" line of thinking, and doubly doubt it when sports owners are involved instead of actual laws.

It's not about having anything to hide, it's about cooperating.  The Pats and Brady did not.  They laughed it off.  Now, they're not laughing.

That's a bit of a judgement call, I think, and oversimplifies the relationship between the players and the front office (doesn't have anything to do with the team, who nominally fall on the side of the front office, for the record)

[Roy H.]

Wow. I predicted the suspension, but the draft picks are overboard. A first and a fourth when there was no evidence that the front office knew what was going on?

Especially after the Wells Report had said this:

“We do not believe that the evidence establishes that any other Patriots personnel participated in or had knowledge of the violation of the Playing Rules or the deliberate effort to circumvent the rules described in this Report. In particular, we do not believe there was any wrongdoing or knowledge of wrongdoing by Patriots ownership, Patriots Head Coach Bill Belichick or any other Patriots coach in the matters investigated. We also do not believe there was any wrongdoing or knowledge of wrongdoing by Patriots Head Equipment Manager Dave Schoenfeld.”

So the league essentially took the Wells report at face value regarding Brady and then dismissed the same report when it came to the head coach/ownership?

Exactly. It's an absolute strict liability "we are punishing you for the sins of your employees" thing, which just seems like dangerous precedent. (Not that the NFL cares about consistency).

[Finkelskyhook]

All that based on a hunch? 

Imagine what would've happened  it was based on facts.

Tough to get facts when the guilty party won't surrender the evidence.  Brady hasn't complied from the beginning.

Apparently spending an entire day getting questioned isn't complying?

[clover]

And if I'm Brady I'm blowing off my HOF induction and the media going forward. Either you're with Brady or you're with the terrorists.

If you were Brady, you'd give up the evidence, right ? If you were clean that is.

There is no way on Earth I'd ever give my cell phone to anyone, ESPECIALLY not Ted Wells. That league has bigger leaks than the Titanic.

They weren't asking for him to hand over his phone--only the relevant texts in a process that would have been managed by Brady's people.

[clover]

All that based on a hunch? 

Imagine what would've happened  it was based on facts.

Tough to get facts when the guilty party won't surrender the evidence.  Brady hasn't complied from the beginning.

Apparently spending an entire day getting questioned isn't complying?

Not when he won't hand over a flurry of relevant texts--and when the league just basically stated that Brady lied to them during their inquiry.

[Neurotic Guy]

4 games

1st round pick in upcoming draft

4th round pick in following draft

$1 million dollars


That's getting appealed.

The 1st round pick in addition to the suspension is a joke.



My guess, it gets appealed down to 2 games and the loss of the 1st round pick gets reduced to a second.

The pick bothers me more than the suspension.  This is a bigger loss in terms of draft picks than what the Saints suffered.

That's ridiculous.  4th Rounder?  Sure.  $1 million?  Why not.  4 games?  Way too much, but we'll live.  1st Rounder?  lol NOPE.

Screw the NFL, all they're doing is trying to get back on the public's good side after they royally screwed up the Ray Rice case, and the saddest part is that they're succeeding.

You think they're succeeding? I would posit the opposite.

This just reinforces my idea that this league office is a joke.  They are absolutely ALL OVER THE PLACE with these punishments

I'm of the belief that off the field issues that have no effect on the game should be punished far less harshly then things that actually effect the game.  In fact, I wouldn't suspend any player for arrests, but that is just me.

I understand that perspective, but let me ask you if the entertainment value of watching Tom Brady is hindered more by him being "generally aware of inappropriate deflation actions" or if Tom knocked Giselle out in an elevator.    Given that entertainment is the lifeblood of the sport, I'd put to you that the sport is more impacted by the domestic violence.

[PhoSita]

Wow. I predicted the suspension, but the draft picks are overboard. A first and a fourth when there was no evidence that the front office knew what was going on?

As F&M said, it's got to be tied to how the franchise reacted to the allegations and the ensuing investigation, or else the league has more stuff in its back pocket relating to the organization that it didn't put into the report.

[Eja117]

And if I'm Brady I'm blowing off my HOF induction and the media going forward. Either you're with Brady or you're with the terrorists.

If you were Brady, you'd give up the evidence, right ? If you were clean that is.

There is no way on Earth I'd ever give my cell phone to anyone, ESPECIALLY not Ted Wells. That league has bigger leaks than the Titanic.

They weren't asking for him to hand over his phone--only the relevant texts in a process that would have been managed by Brady's people.

Do you actually trust the NFL on any level whatsoever? Do you actually trust Ted Wells? They would have said "This is incomplete" and "This isn't relevant" till they had the whole phone. They interviewed McNally like 5 times and Tom for 8 hours. This whole "Well Brady didn't cooperate" thing is a joke. Brady's privacy is worth more than 4 games.
Anything whatsoever that was even eyebrow raising would have been all over the internet in 5 minutes. It wasn't an option. Has any player ever had to hand over his phone? Incognito I believe. Players have to resist that. Next thing they'll want access to their Facebook, and they wanted his email and phone records too. They think they're the NSA. Screw them. I totally support Brady on that.

[Eja117]

All that based on a hunch? 

Imagine what would've happened  it was based on facts.

Tough to get facts when the guilty party won't surrender the evidence.  Brady hasn't complied from the beginning.

Apparently spending an entire day getting questioned isn't complying?

Not when he won't hand over a flurry of relevant texts.

If you think Brady's people were going to decide what the relevant texts were then you are very naive.

[aingeforthree]

My issue is if its a nonevent, why not comply ?

I don't know -- it's possible that someone actually suggested that he refuse and lawyer up for the benefit of the NFLPA -- who are already a weak players union, for one.

Personally speaking, I don't believe in the "if you're innocent you shouldn't have anything to hide" line of thinking, and doubly doubt it when sports owners are involved instead of actual laws.

It's not about having anything to hide, it's about cooperating.  The Pats and Brady did not.  They laughed it off.  Now, they're not laughing.

That's a bit of a judgement call, I think, and oversimplifies the relationship between the players and the front office (doesn't have anything to do with the team, who nominally fall on the side of the front office, for the record)

How is it a judgement call ?

Brady didn't comply with his phone, documents, & records.  The Pats organization itself blocked interviews to important witnesses (Jim Mcnally, I.E.) when requested.

[Eja117]

I'm on Colts fan sites letting them know who they play week 5.

[aingeforthree]

All that based on a hunch? 

Imagine what would've happened  it was based on facts.

Tough to get facts when the guilty party won't surrender the evidence.  Brady hasn't complied from the beginning.

Apparently spending an entire day getting questioned isn't complying?

Not when he won't hand over a flurry of relevant texts.

If you think Brady's people were going to decide what the relevant texts were then you are very naive.

Wasn't just the phone and texts.  It was emails, or any electronic documents, information, records, etc.  So that doesn't exactly scream innocence.

[clover]

And if I'm Brady I'm blowing off my HOF induction and the media going forward. Either you're with Brady or you're with the terrorists.

If you were Brady, you'd give up the evidence, right ? If you were clean that is.

There is no way on Earth I'd ever give my cell phone to anyone, ESPECIALLY not Ted Wells. That league has bigger leaks than the Titanic.

They weren't asking for him to hand over his phone--only the relevant texts in a process that would have been managed by Brady's people.

Do you actually trust the NFL on any level whatsoever? Do you actually trust Ted Wells? They would have said "This is incomplete" and "This isn't relevant" till they had the whole phone. They interviewed McNally like 5 times and Tom for 8 hours. This whole "Well Brady didn't cooperate" thing is a joke. Brady's privacy is worth more than 4 games.
Anything whatsoever that was even eyebrow raising would have been all over the internet in 5 minutes. It wasn't an option. Has any player ever had to hand over his phone? Incognito I believe. Players have to resist that. Next thing they'll want access to their Facebook, and they wanted his email and phone records too. They think they're the NSA. Screw them. I totally support Brady on that.

I get it--no matter what you're blaming the league and exonerating Brady.

It's a free country but the rules of the league that has made Brady a very wealthy man apart from his wife's earnings has rules that say he should have cooperated with their process. Lying and refusing to hand over electronic evidence is not cooperating.

[JSD]

Can Kraft even appeal?