Stephen A Smith: Love not liked by Saunders, Minny FO and Minny Players

[LooseCannon]

People are jumping to all sorts of conclusions hear based on his game but what if Love is just a nasty ass person to be around and that's why people don't like him. It would explain some things as to why that team with that talent last year didn't gel. And maybe explain the poor performance in other years.

The performance of the Timberwolves over recent years is easily explained by the quality of Love's teammates and doesn't require an interpretation of Love as a team-killing player.

Don't necessarily agree. He has to take some if not a good amount of blame too. This could explain why. Last year he had Pekovic, Martin, Rubio, Dieng, and even Brewer who show in spurts that he could be a very good role player. That's decent talent and it couldn't post a winning record.

Swap Love for Brandon Bass and the Celtics and Wolves probably swap win-loss records.   Minnesota might even fare a bit worse. That's how weak I think Love's teammates are.

You're swapping Bass, so my reply is OF COOURRRSSE! 0.0

Try swapping someone equally as talented (not on our team... yet) and the argument might be different. You can't swap Bass with Love as if Bass is even as good as Love's shoe! That says nothing about Love's teammates, that's about it being BASS! If we only get Love and he is only exchanged for Bass and our win-loss record was the same, that would mean Love is not half as good as he's made to be. I suspect if it was a swap of Bass and Love our win-loss record would be MUCH better (if Love is what he looks to be to most). It's a no brainer that Minny would have had a MUCH more horrible record with Bass.

Maybe I don't understand what you are saying?

I'm saying Love's teammates aren't that good and they'd slip from 40 to 25 wins (and possibly lower) if you replaced Love with a borderline starting-caliber PF.  Can you really say that a Love-less Minnesota has more talent than Orlando?

[freshinthehouse]

Anyone that follows the Minny sports scene could tell that Kevin was not that loved* in TWolves organization.  Now if he went to better environment I think he could learn to be a team-first guy, but I would not be shocked if rifts developed between him and his teammates/ownership/coaches in his next stop.




*pun very much intended.

[kraidstar]

one thing is very clear - love hasn't elevated his teammates the way some elite players do. KG took a team of scrubs to the playoffs year in and year out in minnesota, he was always clearly the leader and best player on the court for them, anyone could jump into a t-wolves game and see that within a minute. k-love is not in that same league. if the c's do trade for love, i think we'll still have more work to do to become a contender, he'll be a big help but i don't see him as being a transcendent player.

[RebusRankin]

Minnesota is a terrible team and terribly run.

[D.o.s.]

Anyone that follows the Minny sports scene could tell that Kevin was not that loved* in TWolves organization.  Now if he went to better environment I think he could learn to be a team-first guy, but I would not be shocked if rifts developed between him and his teammates/ownership/coaches in his next stop.




*pun very much intended.

Agreed, it doesnt seem to be a closely guarded secret -- its just not one that merits a lot of national attention when, you know, he isn't trying to get out as fast as possible.

[mmmmm]

People are jumping to all sorts of conclusions hear based on his game but what if Love is just a nasty ass person to be around and that's why people don't like him. It would explain some things as to why that team with that talent last year didn't gel. And maybe explain the poor performance in other years.

The performance of the Timberwolves over recent years is easily explained by the quality of Love's teammates and doesn't require an interpretation of Love as a team-killing player.

Don't necessarily agree. He has to take some if not a good amount of blame too. This could explain why. Last year he had Pekovic, Martin, Rubio, Dieng, and even Brewer who show in spurts that he could be a very good role player. That's decent talent and it couldn't post a winning record.

Except, I don't agree that that is really  all that decent of a set of 'talent'.

I mean, seriously, Rubio stinks.   He's just plain awful.   He should not be allowed to shoot the ball - he just hurts his team everytime he jacks it up.   And he's not getting any better each year.  And from all accounts, the TWolves keep acting like he's their star player.

Pekovic, Martin are both solid veterans.  And Brewer is a valuable defensive role player.  But none of those guys are close to being Scottie Pippen to Love as Jordan.   They are all role players.

Dieng is probably the brightest light among the names you listed, but he was just a rookie and only got playing time late in the season.

That's not a _terrible_ team.  But I don't see how that measures up as a _decent_ team (one that could believe they have a chance of winning a playoff series).

Most important from Love's perspective has to be:  How was that team going to improve?   What possible next step could they take to actually become a legit contender?   And why should Love believe that they (Minnesota) would take that next step?)

[Greenbean]

Ill reserve judgement on any player who has spent their entire career in Minnesota. Losing stinks and any player who is quiet and blends in in a losing culture I want no part of.

Not to say Love was or is the best teammate because I have no idea, but he strikes me as competitive.

[CoachBo]

Not surprised, he is their best player but can't be their leader
not a warrior and never will be

Anyone else remember when Pierce "couldn't be a leader"?



How did that work out?

Pretty much.

If you're trying to conflate the gas from Screamin' A. Smith into some salient point, then you must be really worried that your draft night fun - drafting a guy who cannot shoot - might be spoiled.

Watching Ainge draft isn't any fun for me at all. I'll happily take Kevin Love, and I have no interest at all in the ESPN gasbag's opinion. None.

[moiso]

The Wolves roster is horrible.  Every player is flawed.  The two guys who can score- pekovic and Martin can't guard anyone.  Rubio can't shoot.  Dieng looked good for a few weeks.  I don't see how people think that the Wolves should have been better than they were.

[Future Celtics Owner]

http://grantland.com/the-triangle/you-realize-how-badly-the-t-wolves-screwed-up-the-2009-draft-right/

The twolves are to blame. Duncan has been getting so much praise on this board but most of us believe that KG for most of his career was as good or better or on the same level as Duncan. What did the twolves have to show for it....one wcf appearance.

[chambers]

People are jumping to all sorts of conclusions hear based on his game but what if Love is just a nasty ass person to be around and that's why people don't like him. It would explain some things as to why that team with that talent last year didn't gel. And maybe explain the poor performance in other years.

The performance of the Timberwolves over recent years is easily explained by the quality of Love's teammates and doesn't require an interpretation of Love as a team-killing player.

Don't necessarily agree. He has to take some if not a good amount of blame too. This could explain why. Last year he had Pekovic, Martin, Rubio, Dieng, and even Brewer who show in spurts that he could be a very good role player. That's decent talent and it couldn't post a winning record.

Still want the C's to trade for him but this thought that he is blameless for his team's won-loss record since being there is, IMHO, just absurd. If you are player on a team you don't just get credit for the wins, you have to own up to the losses too.

Don't overlook how much injuries affected them this season. They had a bad run particularly with Pekovic.

[freshinthehouse]

Duncan has been getting so much praise on this board but most of us believe that KG for most of his career was as good or better or on the same level as Duncan.

As someone who loves KG and got to watch him a lot in prime, I can easily say he is a step below Duncan.  KG was unreal, but Duncan was at another level.  KG, even in his prime, could disappear in tense situations.  That's why Boston was such a good fit for him, because Pierce thrived in those same situations.  This was never an issue with Duncan.

[freshinthehouse]

And in regard to Minny, when it came to games decided by 3 points or less they had one of the worst records in NBA history.  To me, when you are losing a lot of one possession games, that reflects poorly on your star players.

That being said, I'd still gladly take KLove if we could get him at a good price.

[Sixth Man]

The Wolves roster is horrible.  Every player is flawed.  The two guys who can score- pekovic and Martin can't guard anyone.  Rubio can't shoot.  Didn't looked good for a few weeks.  I don't see how people think that the Wolves should have been better than they were.

Couldn't one make exactly the same observations about the current Celts squad?  Don't Rondo, Green, Olynyk and Sullinger resemble flawed and/or limited players with other individual areas of expertise?  Rondo can't shoot and has all kind of attitude and coachability issues, Green is asleep half the time, Olynyk can't defend and Sully struggles around the basket and can't defend certain players.  If one or more of these players is traded to Minny for Love, will Love be in the same dead-end situation in Boston as he is currently in? 

And yet, I see poster after poster here screaming about how we simply MUST trade Sully and three (or even FOUR) 1st rounders, including both from this draft.  Even with an extension for Rondo, a trade for Love is merely an intermediate move which will leave us still very very far from Shangri-La...

[Rondo9]

The Wolves roster is horrible.  Every player is flawed.  The two guys who can score- pekovic and Martin can't guard anyone.  Rubio can't shoot.  Didn't looked good for a few weeks.  I don't see how people think that the Wolves should have been better than they were.

Couldn't one make exactly the same observations about the current Celts squad?  Don't Rondo, Green, Olynyk and Sullinger resemble flawed and/or limited players with other individual areas of expertise?  Rondo can't shoot and has all kind of attitude and coachability issues, Green is asleep half the time, Olynyk can't defend and Sully struggles around the basket and can't defend certain players.  If one or more of these players is traded to Minny for Love, will Love be in the same dead-end situation in Boston as he is currently in? 

And yet, I see poster after poster here screaming about how we simply MUST trade Sully and three (or even FOUR) 1st rounders, including both from this draft.  Even with an extension for Rondo, a trade for Love is merely an intermediate move which will leave us still very very far from Shangri-La...

Difference is management. The Celtics management is way better the Timberwolves. I disagree with your assessment with the Celtics players.