Stephen A Smith: Love not liked by Saunders, Minny FO and Minny Players

[wdleehi]

Not surprised, he is their best player but can't be their leader
not a warrior and never will be

Anyone else remember when Pierce "couldn't be a leader"?



How did that work out?

[D.o.s.]

Question: How is what Kevin Love doing any different than what LeBron did in 2010 -- ignoring the well-intentioned but tonally misguided spectacle of The Decision?

[Fafnir]

Question: How is what Kevin Love doing any different than what LeBron did in 2010 -- ignoring the well-intentioned but tonally misguided spectacle of The Decision?

He's told management he's leaving instead of just telling them to put a winner around him and then bolting.

And to remove "the Decision" is to ignore a very large part of what happened.

[wdleehi]

Question: How is what Kevin Love doing any different than what LeBron did in 2010 -- ignoring the well-intentioned but tonally misguided spectacle of The Decision?

no different then Lebron or KG.


How about Shaq?


Barkley?

[D.o.s.]

^
Right -- LeBron's just the most recent example.

Question: How is what Kevin Love doing any different than what LeBron did in 2010 -- ignoring the well-intentioned but tonally misguided spectacle of The Decision?

He's told management he's leaving instead of just telling them to put a winner around him and then bolting.

And to remove "the Decision" is to ignore a very large part of what happened.

Gotta disagree with that -- the fallout on our end (media/fans/commentary) from The Decision was huge, but the fundamental scenario of it was not: Star player tries to go the distance as the best player, leaves to play with other star players instead.

I also believe that Cleveland would've held onto the idea they could get James to resign even if he'd gone to them and said "trade me."

[playdream]

Not surprised, he is their best player but can't be their leader
not a warrior and never will be

Anyone else remember when Pierce "couldn't be a leader"?



How did that work out?

Pierce was a leader and the captain

[Robb]

I definitely don't think that Love talked to KG.  Garnett is on record saying he doesn't talk to other teams players--or pretty close to that. Even then, I'm not sure as intense as KG is he would like to listen to Love talk about missing the playoffs for 6 years. I can only imagine that kind of conversation with Garnett going very poorly followed by KG calling Love some expletives about cats.

[wdleehi]

Not surprised, he is their best player but can't be their leader
not a warrior and never will be

Anyone else remember when Pierce "couldn't be a leader"?



How did that work out?

Pierce was a leader and the captain

Of course, but he had the label in his career.

[Donoghus]

Not surprised, he is their best player but can't be their leader
not a warrior and never will be

Anyone else remember when Pierce "couldn't be a leader"?



How did that work out?

Pierce was a leader and the captain

Circa....2005-2006-ish, there were serious question marks about Pierce's leadership abilities and how far the team could go with him at the helm.

It seems silly now that think that but it was very different back then.

[Fafnir]

^
Right -- LeBron's just the most recent example.

Question: How is what Kevin Love doing any different than what LeBron did in 2010 -- ignoring the well-intentioned but tonally misguided spectacle of The Decision?

He's told management he's leaving instead of just telling them to put a winner around him and then bolting.

And to remove "the Decision" is to ignore a very large part of what happened.

Gotta disagree with that -- the fallout on our end (media/fans/commentary) from The Decision was huge, but the fundamental scenario of it was not: Star player tries to go the distance as the best player, leaves to play with other star players instead.

I also believe that Cleveland would've held onto the idea they could get James to resign even if he'd gone to them and said "trade me."

I don't get your disagreement, the reason LeBron was vilified wasn't the act of leaving. Other players have done that, Bosh did that, Shaq, Barkley, etc, etc. Heck Kobe did it before backing off via requesting a trade on national radio!

The difference was "The Decision", any analysis that chooses to ignore that is missing the forest for the trees.

[D.o.s.]

Not surprised, he is their best player but can't be their leader
not a warrior and never will be

Anyone else remember when Pierce "couldn't be a leader"?



How did that work out?

Pierce was a leader and the captain

Circa....2005-2006-ish, there were serious question marks about Pierce's leadership abilities and how far the team could go with him at the helm.

It seems silly now that think that but it was very different back then.

Yup. Paul Pierce was, for all intents and purposes, an angrier Carmelo Anthony before KG and Ray showed up.

[D.o.s.]

^
Right -- LeBron's just the most recent example.

Question: How is what Kevin Love doing any different than what LeBron did in 2010 -- ignoring the well-intentioned but tonally misguided spectacle of The Decision?

He's told management he's leaving instead of just telling them to put a winner around him and then bolting.

And to remove "the Decision" is to ignore a very large part of what happened.

Gotta disagree with that -- the fallout on our end (media/fans/commentary) from The Decision was huge, but the fundamental scenario of it was not: Star player tries to go the distance as the best player, leaves to play with other star players instead.

I also believe that Cleveland would've held onto the idea they could get James to resign even if he'd gone to them and said "trade me."

I don't get your disagreement, the reason LeBron was vilified wasn't the act of leaving. Other players have done that, Bosh did that, Shaq, Barkley, etc, etc. Heck Kobe did it before backing off via requesting a trade on national radio!

The difference was "The Decision", any analysis that chooses to ignore that is missing the forest for the trees.

I think you're missing some of the nuance -- no one in the history of the game, arguably, 'should have done more' than LeBron James in Cleveland. The Decision set the tone deaf nature of the discourse around him, for sure, but there's no way he was escaping the same kind of criticism he's faced in this thread, even without it.

The only thing The Decision did was make the chorus all consuming.

[GreenWarrior]

Question: How is what Kevin Love doing any different than what LeBron did in 2010 -- ignoring the well-intentioned but tonally misguided spectacle of The Decision?

Lebron had just decided to leave a team that lost in the eastern conference finals and a 50+ win team.

and made a spectacle of it in the process.

no ones blaming him for wanting out of Cleveland because it's Cleveland. their chances of improving the team much more weren't that good. much like Minn.

Lebron was willing to take less money to go to Miami. but not in Cleveland - a team that just lost in the eastern conference finals and a 50+ win team. seems to me they could have just used some tweeking and probably could have if he had taken less money.

I liken the Cleveland/Boston rivalry to that of Chi/Det in the 90's. Cleveland needed to endure the losing and go through the growing pains to take that next step. but Lebron took the easy way out and comes off looking gutless.

[saltlover]

Not surprised, he is their best player but can't be their leader
not a warrior and never will be

Anyone else remember when Pierce "couldn't be a leader"?



How did that work out?

Pierce was a leader and the captain

Circa....2005-2006-ish, there were serious question marks about Pierce's leadership abilities and how far the team could go with him at the helm.

It seems silly now that think that but it was very different back then.

Because "leadership" is always associated with winning.  If you don't win, you're not a leader.  If you do, you are.  If you used to win, but don't any more, you've lost your leadership abilities (see: all the Kobe articles about him being a bad teammate and compare them to the Kobe is a fierce competitor who drives him teammates to give their very best from a half-decade ago).  If you didn't win in the past, but now you do, you've found what it takes to be a leader.  LeBron was a great leader last year, but now he's sullen and quit on his team.  It's amazing, this weird narrative of "leadership."

Rare is the player who can lose and be called a leader.

[wdleehi]

Not surprised, he is their best player but can't be their leader
not a warrior and never will be

Anyone else remember when Pierce "couldn't be a leader"?



How did that work out?

Pierce was a leader and the captain

Circa....2005-2006-ish, there were serious question marks about Pierce's leadership abilities and how far the team could go with him at the helm.

It seems silly now that think that but it was very different back then.

Because "leadership" is always associated with winning.  If you don't win, you're not a leader.  If you do, you are.  If you used to win, but don't any more, you've lost your leadership abilities (see: all the Kobe articles about him being a bad teammate and compare them to the Kobe is a fierce competitor who drives him teammates to give their very best from a half-decade ago).  If you didn't win in the past, but now you do, you've found what it takes to be a leader.  LeBron was a great leader last year, but now he's sullen and quit on his team.  It's amazing, this weird narrative of "leadership."

Rare is the player who can lose and be called a leader.

And a lot of this labeling came from his actions in the playoffs.