Am I the only one who doesn't want Love?

[KamikazeK]

Time for a reality check.

We'll be lucky if the guy we draft this year, even if it's in the top 3, turns out to be just as good as love.   Embiid could be a complete bust and Wiggins and Parker could be more Michael Beasley than Michael Jordan.  And even if they turn out great, it's going to take a few years for them to develop.  How much of Rondo's prime do you want to waste?

And while Love and Rondo probably aren't enough to do more than challenge for the ECF, having Love and Rondo makes it so much easier for Boston to attract more talent.  If we're giving up Sully and a top 5 pick in this draft, I can't imagine it would take more than salary filler and, AT MOST, two future 1sts.  That still leaves us with multiple 1st over the next 5 years, Green, Bass, KO and the trade exemption to try and land more stars.

I mean, Rondo/Love/Melo/Asik isn't as sexy as KG/Pierce/Ray, but it would easily be a top 4 team in the East and could be better depending on what you can put around that core.

Mike

In my opinion, I think a Rondo/Bradley/Melo/Love/Asik lineup fights for #1

[Boston Garden Leprechaun]

I'd love to have LOVE. at what cost is the question. I will trust DA on this.

[loco_91]

Am I?

Honestly guys the BEST CASE scenario I see this playing out is we get Love and then somehow get Melo. I am pretty skeptical if a team built around Rondo, Melo and Love could be better than a ECF appearance. I doubt that even happens because I feel like Melo is going to bolt to Chicago to join the limping Derrick Rose and DPOY Noah.

I also don't think the Love trade is even close to the KG trade, he's an offensive player who plays zero D and really just seems like a 2nd tier star to me. I def don't want to give up a top 3 pick for this guy, top 5? potentially if Exum is gone, but not a top 3 pick...Love just doesn't really get me excited and neither does the thought of Rondo/Melo/Love get me THAT amped.

Love is not the most exciting player, but he's really [dang] good. He doesn't have the phenomenal, highlight-reel athleticism of his superstar peers, but he's incredibly skilled at getting his shot. He is also an extremely talented passer.

I've been doing some research on Love and have concluded that he is mostly underrated, for a few reasons.
-The Timberwolves have no floor spacing. They start nonshooters Ricky Rubio, Corey Brewer, and Nikola Pekovic. This frees up opposing teams to double Love at will, limiting his effectiveness in the post despite his excellent passing skills. Whereas some people seem to think that his stats are inflated by playing on a bad team, it is probably the opposite: his scrub teammates rob him of assists and allow opposing teams to gameplan aggressively against him.
-His defense is not that bad. While he is rightly criticized for a lack of physicality, he displays pretty good positioning and feel on D. Since losing weight, he's been more mobile and effective defending the perimeter. I rate him as an average defender overall. The Twolves' defense is collectively bad, but Love is only a small part of the problem.
-His advanced stats are outstanding. His PER of 27 for 2013-14 was third in the league behind Durant (30) and LeBron (29). For reference, all these guys' numbers are epically good: only 4 other players posted a PER of 25 or better, and only 11 other players posted at least a 23. You have to wonder how good his PER would be with Rondo feeding him and with a team that could actually shoot the ball...

[cb8883]

Nope I'm in that camp too. I want this team to build through the draft. Hopefully get a top 4 pick even though it will not happen.

[NorthernLightning]

He's not an average defender, and PER doesn't really factor in defense, which is why his is so high.

[Boston Garden Leprechaun]

Nope I'm in that camp too. I want this team to build through the draft. Hopefully get a top 4 pick even though it will not happen.

i want to build through draft some as well. but everybody in the draft is not a guarantee nor are we guaranteed a top 3 or 5 pick every year. DA will need to wheel and deal as well. a combo of the two for us to be in contention again. JMO.

[Schiller]

I understand why everyone talks mainly about our lottery pick, but is that really the only thing worthy of Kevin Love? I disagree. I think a deal that looks something like this would be even better.

BOS gives: Sullinger + salary filler, 2014 BK pick. 2015 Clippers and PHI pick. 2016 BK pick.
BOS gets: Kevin Love

I like this trade a lot for both teams. Celtics get Love and have their lottery pick to raise to become a potential star. Which I really love.

I'd LOVE to have a home-grown superstar prospect.  We haven't had that since Larry Bird... or arguably Paul Pierce (though Pierce was never a superstar).

Minnesotta gets probably a better offer then they would get from any other team. They receive a budding power forward on a rookie deal and four first round picks within the next two years. That is quite a nice way to rebuild.

I don't think I'd trade our lottery pick for Love. If the deal was something like what I proposed however...

[action781]

But I wouldn't give up a #1-3 pick for Love as I see the potential reward of that player at controlled cost more valuable than Kevin Love at a max contract.

This Moneyball stuff is getting to be a little bit much.  Love at a max contract is a building block that might attract other top flight players to help you win a title.  That player at #1-3 with a "controlled cost" isn't helping you land any additional talent and will require you to waste 2, or possibly more years of Rondo's prime waiting for him to develop.

Cost isn't the issue.  If Boston gets #1-3 and you believe the players there are LeBron/Durant level superstars, you don't trade them for Kevin Love.  If you don't think they're that good, if you think they're basically at Love's level, it makes a lot of sense to do everything you can to get better now and make a run at Melo/Asik and who knows who else.

Mike

On the topic of Kevin Love attracting other top flight players -
I don't buy this.  Rondo + Love's contracts in addition with merely another 2-3 players will already fill our cap up to the point where we can't just "attract" other top flight players.  Love could attract them via trade, then resign them with bird rights, but those situations don't really come together THAT often, and we also have to give up assets in those acquisitions.

And I think cost very much is an issue.  Look at what's happened recently with the moves of OKC (Harden), LAL (Bynum), Miami (even Mike Miller) because of costs getting too high in the extreme luxury tax era.

[crimson_stallion]

I am 100% in this boat

I don't want Love on this team unless Boston could somehow manage to get him signed to along term deal for LESS than a max deal ($10M is the max I'd pay for Love) and there is pretty much zero chance of that happening.

The thing is, we have two young PF's right now (in Sully and Olynyk) who both have a very similar 'profile' to Kevin Love.  They are both guys with mediocre physical characteristics, and super high IQ.  They are both guys who are great passers, great rebounders and who can stretch the floor with their shooting.  They are both pretty average defenders who struggle against the more physically imposing bigs out there, and they both lack the athleticism and/or length to be any real use as rim protectors.

That description above is Kevin Love in a nut shell.

Is Kevin Love an improvement over either Sully or Olynyk?  Of course.  But then you need to consider the fact that if we took Kevin Love, we'd be taking him on a long term max contact - probaby at least $13M/year over the next 4 years.  On the other hand Sully and Onynyk are due about $5M combined and if they don't pan out, they will both be off the books a year or two from now. So now you need to ask yourself another question...

Is Kevin Love worth 5x Sullinger's contact?  Or 6x Olynyk's contract?  Or 3x the contract of Sully + Olynyk combined?  Is he worth either of those three things PLUS a minimum top 8 lottery pick in an incredibly deep draft? 

The answer, IMHO, is no. 

The biggest weakness with Sully and Olynyk right now is their inability to protect the rim.  If either of those guys is your staring PF, then you need a rim protector starting at center to back them up, otherwise the opponents (whether by layups or post ups) are scoring in the paint at will. Adding Kevin Love does nothing to resolve that problem, yet (depending on where it falls) we may well have an opportunity to resolve that issue very cheaply via the draft, while also keeping a PF that can do 80% of what Love can for 20% the cost.

My real concerns with Love are that:
1) He scores a lot of points but does so ineficently - in six seasons as a pro he has averaged under 46% from the field in five of those years.

2) He has a pretty limited inside game with limited post moves, so the he's basically a chucker

3) He lacks leadership skills, and despite being labelled a superstar for some time now he's never never led his team to the playoffs

4) He's selfish - happy to quit on his team for lack of success, even though he (as their leader) should be the one leading them to success

5) He is one of the worst defensive bigs in the NBA, and doesn't have the physical tooks to get much better

[Drucci]

My real concerns with Love are that:
1) He scores a lot of points but does so ineficently - in six seasons as a pro he has averaged under 46% from the field in five of those years.

2) He has a pretty limited inside game with limited post moves, so the he's basically a chucker

3) He lacks leadership skills, and despite being labelled a superstar for some time now he's never never led his team to the playoffs

4) He's selfish - happy to quit on his team for lack of success, even though he (as their leader) should be the one leading them to success

5) He is one of the worst defensive bigs in the NBA, and doesn't have the physical tooks to get much better

I would add :

6) He has never made the playoffs, and, regardless of whether he is to blame for failing to reach that goal, we can't know how he performs on the big stage. Is he the kind of player who shines in the clutch or one who disappears during the "real" season? We won't know until he gets to his first playoffs, and being clutch during the regular season is not telling of that (see Mo Williams when he was with Cleveland, big in money time during the season and awful in the playoffs).

[bleedGREENdon]

Honestly I would not give a top 4 pick for him.

I would give anything out side the top 4 for him though.
Dream scenerio is say we get a top 4 pick, take either wiggins or exum or Embiid.

Trade 17, Clips next year, our first next year and Philly picks Sully, Jeff Green, Khris humphries, and bogans. That's more than enough for Love.

We have so many [dang] assets, we don't need to forge over our lottery pick this year.

Then we have say

Rondo
Avery
Wiggins
Love
Center

Or

Rondo
Avery
Plug in
Love
Embiid

Or say we keep jeff green

Rondo
Wiggins
Green
Love
Kelly
( this is my favorite team. TBH) no rim protection but boy will we get out and running and score probably 110 points a game, and absolutely spread the ball around.

We obviously need to make another move but we can be a contending team while also having a bright future. We can't just bring love in and think were winning a championship. Love is not championship caliber. Plays no defense.

[bleedGREENdon]

Remember we traded the number 5 pick for Ray Allen
And al Jefferson basically for KEVIN GARNETT( arguably the BEST ALL AROUND BIG MAN MVP of our past 12 years)

I know Sullinger isn't the prospect that big al was, but number 17 and 2 more firsts,Sullinger, and cap relief for Minnesota, honestly should be enough for Minnesota. I don't see the need to trade our top pick for him.

[Onslaught]

I don't have a problem with Love. I don't think we can win it all with him but I don't see use winning it all with anyone we can get in the next few years either. And this includes the overrated draft players.

Buts lets not get nuts here guys. We don't have Love. And we don't even know what draft pick we'll get yet. Who knows what will happen. I trust the people running the Show in Boston and will just sit back and watch.

[clover]

My real concerns with Love are that:
1) He scores a lot of points but does so ineficently - in six seasons as a pro he has averaged under 46% from the field in five of those years.

2) He has a pretty limited inside game with limited post moves, so the he's basically a chucker

To be fair, Love has a higher career TS% (.566) than anyone on the C's currently--while being the number one scoring option on his team. I'd take that volume and mix of shooting any day--including as a number one option for the Celtics.

[Future Celtics Owner]

I think Vonleh is going to be a better pf than love. I hope Danny if given the fifth pick drafts and keep Noah.