Amico/Fox sports: Bucks open to Larry Sanders trade for draft picks...

[Fafnir]

Sometimes i feel like people enyirely overlook the salary cap and the importance of managing it.

Picking up Sanders would be like getting blackout drunk and playing GM

11 million a year for an elite rim protector that increases value playing next to Rondo isn't over the top at all. Tyson Chandler is 14 million a year and their stats are basically identical.
In fact compare Chandler's championship year in Dallas and they're like twins.
Compare his stats to Chandler's DPOY season and they're very similar- one of the major differences being that Sanders has had Brandon Jennings and Monta Ellis as his guards, compared to Jason Kidd, JJ Barea and Raymond Felton.
Playing with a pass first PG like Rondo makes his FG% increase instantly with lobs, alley oops and easy passes around the rim.

I mean he's not cheap by any means, but he's not murder against the cap.

Tyson Chandler was an elite offensive player the year he won the title and the next year.

He was the best pick and roll man in the NBA for those two years and had TS% around .700. He also created a ton of extra offensive possessions with his tip out offensive boards when he didn't just get the put back.

Larry Sanders offensive game is nothing like Chandlers.

[chambers]

Sometimes i feel like people enyirely overlook the salary cap and the importance of managing it.

Picking up Sanders would be like getting blackout drunk and playing GM

11 million a year for an elite rim protector that increases value playing next to Rondo isn't over the top at all. Tyson Chandler is 14 million a year and their stats are basically identical.
In fact compare Chandler's championship year in Dallas and they're like twins.
Compare his stats to Chandler's DPOY season and they're very similar- one of the major differences being that Sanders has had Brandon Jennings and Monta Ellis as his guards, compared to Jason Kidd, JJ Barea and Raymond Felton.
Playing with a pass first PG like Rondo makes his FG% increase instantly with lobs, alley oops and easy passes around the rim.

I mean he's not cheap by any means, but he's not murder against the cap.

Tyson Chandler was an elite offensive player the year he won the title and the next year.

He was the best pick and roll man in the NBA for those two years and had TS% around .700. He also created a ton of extra offensive possessions with his tip out offensive boards when he didn't just get the put back.

Larry Sanders offensive game is nothing like Chandlers.

Larry Sanders offense does have a way to go compared to Chandlers, but with the right point guard and pick and roll artist, he'd have a much better FG%
I don't see Chandler getting 65 and 70% FG with Ellis and Jennings as his guards, with Tobias Harris instead of Dirk.
It's also about which players complement a big man like this, which is why I feel Rondo is a great fit.

[fairweatherfan]

I'd like Larry Sanders on this team, I think he's a good fit for the personnel we have now.

...but not at that contract.  That's a huge gamble that turns into a Wallace-like albatross if it doesn't pan out.  Sanders hasn't shown enough to make that gamble for me.

[RJ87]

At this point, the Bucks should be sending back draft picks.  He's been that bad.

* He's averaging 6.7 points per game.  That's really bad, but is the second highest total of his four-year career;

* He's shooting 43.3% from the field, which is atrocious for a guy of his size and athleticism.  An anomaly?  Nope.  He's shot below 46% in three out of his four seasons.  He's been a terrible FT shooter, too;

* He's got character issues, both in public and in the locker room;

* He's vastly overpaid starting next year ($44 million over four years);

* He's overrated as a defender, and can't stay out of foul trouble (5.0 PF per 36 minutes).

I've called this guy "Javale McGee 2.0", but that's probably vastly unfair to Javale.  It just doesn't make sense to give up draft picks for the pleasure of having Sanders take up 20% of your salary cap for the next four seasons.

As crazy as it is to say, I'm not even sure if I'd do Wallace + a #2 for Sanders.  You probably have to, I guess, for the potential.  However, between Sanders' attitude, offensive ineptitude, and terrible contract (again, a year longer than Wallace's), I'd be very hesitant.

You haven't watched him enough Roy. He's most certainly not an over rated defender.
The bucks are going to demand a top 12 pick for him or 2 firsts.
Check out his defensive stats compared to the top 5 bigs in the NBA.

I agree with Roy. He's very overrated defensively. He's more flashy with the blocked shots so people notice him more. But he still lacks strength and struggles defending in the low post one on one. He think he'd be a great investment if we had another high IQ defensive anchor in the middle ala KG, but I believe we need more of a rock next Sully - someone who understands the game, is willing to do the dirty work - like what Robin Lopez is providing for Lamarcus Aldridge in Portland. Dare I say, an Omer Asik type. 

[Fafnir]

I'd like Larry Sanders on this team, I think he's a good fit for the personnel we have now.

...but not at that contract.  That's a huge gamble that turns into a Wallace-like albatross if it doesn't pan out.  Sanders hasn't shown enough to make that gamble for me.

Yeah I think he's a pretty good guy to put with Sullinger defensively.

But when a team is trying to a dump a player 40 games into a new contract yikes...

I mean if they'd take Wallace for him I'd make the gamble on him, the extra upside is worth the extra year's risk in my mind. But that'd be a non-starter for the Bucks unless we gave them a bunch of value draft pick wise.

Which is something I'm firmly against, this team needs young talent badly.

[Roy H.]

Let's try this another way:  if Larry Sanders really is a guy capable of averaging 16+ points, 13 rebounds, 50%+ shooting, 3.5 blocks, and top-of-the-league interior defense -- all on a sub-max contract -- why are the Bucks willing to trade him?

[CFAN38]

At this point, the Bucks should be sending back draft picks.  He's been that bad.

* He's averaging 6.7 points per game.  That's really bad, but is the second highest total of his four-year career;

* He's shooting 43.3% from the field, which is atrocious for a guy of his size and athleticism.  An anomaly?  Nope.  He's shot below 46% in three out of his four seasons.  He's been a terrible FT shooter, too;

* He's got character issues, both in public and in the locker room;

* He's vastly overpaid starting next year ($44 million over four years);

* He's overrated as a defender, and can't stay out of foul trouble (5.0 PF per 36 minutes).

I've called this guy "Javale McGee 2.0", but that's probably vastly unfair to Javale.  It just doesn't make sense to give up draft picks for the pleasure of having Sanders take up 20% of your salary cap for the next four seasons.

As crazy as it is to say, I'm not even sure if I'd do Wallace + a #2 for Sanders.  You probably have to, I guess, for the potential.  However, between Sanders' attitude, offensive ineptitude, and terrible contract (again, a year longer than Wallace's), I'd be very hesitant.

You haven't watched him enough Roy. He's most certainly not an over rated defender.
The bucks are going to demand a top 12 pick for him or 2 firsts.
Check out his defensive stats compared to the top 5 bigs in the NBA.

I agree with Roy. He's very overrated defensively. He's more flashy with the blocked shots so people notice him more. But he still lacks strength and struggles defending in the low post one on one. He think he'd be a great investment if we had another high IQ defensive anchor in the middle ala KG, but I believe we need more of a rock next Sully - someone who understands the game, is willing to do the dirty work - like what Robin Lopez is providing for Lamarcus Aldridge in Portland. Dare I say, an Omer Asik type.

For those who like stats

NBA Stats - Player Tracking Defensive Impact #NBAStats http://on.nba.com/KGvJlO

Sanders is flawed but he protects the rim, he may not be an elite man defender but he has the makings for an elite team defender. Sully has the strength to body up anyone in the league leaving Sanders free to help.

[crownontherocks]

I forget where I read this but I saw online that bucks almost cut sanders in the Beginning of training camp before he got his contract ex   

[Roy H.]

Sanders is flawed but he protects the rim, he may not be an elite man defender but he has the makings for an elite team defender. Sully has the strength to body up anyone in the league leaving Sanders free to help.

As much as I like any stat that rates Perk the #1 defensive center in the league, I wonder about one that ranks Chris Kaman and Andrew Bynum #2 and #3.

That said, Sanders is a good defender.  I just think he's a bit overrated.

[ssspence]

Roy ~~ reminding me a little of the Eric Gordon discussion, would you trade Wallace and a pick for him? If the Bucks are scared enough of Sanders in that locker room.... they just might do it. Wallace's deal lines up perfectly with the end of GA's rookie deal -- Crash can mentor him over the next couple of seasons.

My take on Sanders: some players don't belong in a bad franchise. Couldn't the Cs help him grow up, while also teaching him how to play the game? Presumably his offensive numbers would improve playing with Rondo.

Bogans and Butler would need to be added to make it work -- like this:

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=p8hyspc

[Who]

Let's try this another way:  if Larry Sanders really is a guy capable of averaging 16+ points, 13 rebounds, 50%+ shooting, 3.5 blocks, and top-of-the-league interior defense -- all on a sub-max contract -- why are the Bucks willing to trade him?

Because they are overreacting to a few bad situations L.Sanders has caused.

If not for those, no way would Milwaukee be contemplating moving L.Sanders.

[Roy H.]

Roy ~~ reminding me a little of the Eric Gordon discussion, would you trade Wallace and a pick for him? If the Bucks are scared enough of Sanders in that locker room.... they just might do it. Wallace's deal lines up perfectly with the end of GA's rookie deal -- Crash can mentor him over the next couple of seasons.

My take on Sanders: some players don't belong in a bad franchise. Couldn't the Cs help him grow up, while also teaching him how to play the game? Presumably his offensive numbers would improve playing with Rondo.

I don't know.  I agree it's like the argument I make for Eric Gordon:  you're trading a sunk cost for a productive player (or, in Sanders' case, a guy who *could* be a productive player).

The difference is that Sanders has that extra year on his contract, and he's shown zero maturity.  He seems like an overpaid malcontent.

If he turns back into the player he was last year, then it's obviously worth it.  If he continues to follow the career path of Javale McGee, he's not, and we've paid a #1 for the privilege of adding a year to Wallace's contract.

Ultimately, I don't know.  If you put lottery protection on the pick, maybe it's worth it.  I guess I probably do it in the hopes that Sanders improves enough to boost his trade value, at which point you move him to recoup the #1 and get an expiring.  It's a risk, though.

[fitzhickey]

Let's try this another way:  if Larry Sanders really is a guy capable of averaging 16+ points, 13 rebounds, 50%+ shooting, 3.5 blocks, and top-of-the-league interior defense -- all on a sub-max contract -- why are the Bucks willing to trade him?

I agree with Roy and RJ87, he does seem overrated on D, and his offensive game is basically not there.

He could be something, but if he continues to spiral downwards like this he is gone.

[D.o.s.]

I'm with Chambers, I think Roy's letting his idea of what Sanders is like color his judgement on how beneficial he'd be to the team.

He's going to be the cheapest, youngest defensive center we can get our hands on--unless there's someone in the draft who really looks like an Anthony Davis-level defender.

I'd probably bite on Wallace + Clippers 1st (or the worse Between the Celtics/Atlanta-Brooklyn picks).

[get_banners]

my take on sanders is: he's slightly overpaid for his current production, and he needs to grow up quickly. too risky for a team like us. he'd be a good gamble for a team w/ lots of veterans and an elder statesmen as a coach.