Author Topic: Asik trade rumors (deal reportedly off)  (Read 201004 times)

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Re: Steve Bulpett on the rumors: Rockets stirring interest in Asik
« Reply #585 on: December 19, 2013, 06:36:26 AM »

Offline crimson_stallion

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Quote from: droopdog7
Asik is behind arguably the best center in the league.  That's not exactly the same as not being good enough to start on a good team.  And if I'm Houston, I just as soon let Asik rot on the bench than trade him for the rumored trade.  I'm thinking that is the better option for them.

This whole concept is irrelevant.

Asik is playing behind arguably the best center in the league, but that doesn't mean he's a starting calibre center.  Last year Jordan Hill was playing behind Dwight Howard.  A couple of years back Keyon Dooling was playing behind Rajon Rondo.

Fact is that Asik is not a clear cut, starting center.  He is not on the same level as say, Marcin Gortat, who is a two-way player.

People talk about Asik as being close to Tyson Chandler level - Asik has never had anything close to Chandler's athleticism, nor does he average up around 60% from the field as Chandler has over the past few years. 

Also how many teams tid Chandler float around on before he found his niche in Dallas? His defense was a game changer on a Dallas offense that included elite scorer in Dirk Nowitski and some very good support pieces in Jason Terry, JJ Barera, Shawn Marion and Vince Carter.  Dallas was a great offensive team, so adding Chandler gave them the defensive anchor they desperately needed to improve their defense and get over the top.

Boston does not have a single elite offensive player.  Boston's offense pretty much sucks.  Their defense is already very solid.  Their rebounding is also already pretty solid.  The two areas Asik helps a team are two areas that Boston isn't really desperate for help in.  Boston is desperate for scoring, and our offense gets worse by trading Bass and Lee (two of our better offensive palyers) for Asik.  It may well demote us to the worst offensive team in the NBA, unless Rondo can come back and take his game to a whole other level in leading this team beyond expectations.

Fact is that it's true - Asik really is a borderline starter.  He wasn't good enough to start in Houston beside Dwight Howard, and he wasn't good enough to start in Chicago alongside Noah / above Boozer. 

It would not surprise me in the least if both Olynyk and Sullinger are bigger impact players than Asik this time next season...maybe even Faverani.

Asik is good enough to start on a team with lots of offensive firepower and a severe lack of size and post defense - in other words he would be a dead set perfect fit in New York or in Miami.  Anywhere that doesn't fit that desciption he'd have to fight for a starting spot and would eventually get it probably only because he is too [dang] expensive to leave sitting on the bench.

Plus he has a terrible attitude.  For a 27 year old who has barely proven he is good enough to start, he's already complaining about coming off the bench...while guys like Pierce, Ray Allen and Andre Blatche have accepted and excelled in those roles.   

You may be surprised how close in value the Lee + Bass combination is to Asik.  Yes Asik is slightly higher than those guys (if he's playing), but add in a 1st round pick and you could easilly argue that Houston is better off after the trade.

Re: Boston Herald says Rockets already turned down the c's offer
« Reply #586 on: December 19, 2013, 06:45:32 AM »

Offline BleedGreen1989

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I'll believe it when Asik is traded elsewhere.
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Re: Asik trade rumors (Boston in the mix; update on page 16)
« Reply #587 on: December 19, 2013, 07:07:06 AM »

Offline BleedGreen1989

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I'm not sure if this asik thing will happen, but I'm very excited to announce that I just traded Lance Stephensen (16.4), Zack Randolph (17.7) and David West (16.7) for Kevin Love (29.3) in my head-to-head points league.  A top 3 fantasy player!  This is a big moment for the 2013-14 New England Leprechauns.  He joins Paul George, newly returned Kobe Bryant and soon to be returning Rajon Rondo as the core of the future champions of the "NBA Rocks" ESPN Fantasy Basketball league.

You need to trade Rondo and Kobe for draft picks and prospects so you can tank and land a stud in the draft. That team isn't going anywhere ;)
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Re: Asik trade rumors (Boston in the mix; update on page 16)
« Reply #588 on: December 19, 2013, 07:13:55 AM »

Offline BleedGreen1989

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Woj > Bulpett x1000

This.

Funny, it seems all the Boston guys are reporting this deal is dead, while Woj, Berger, and other national guys are saying different.

Perhaps Danny holding firm on his offer and leaking the deal is "dead" to get the message through that he's not desperate and will just walk?

In any case, I still trust Woj and Berger over any other "source". They are not wrong very often.
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Re: Boston Herald says Rockets already turned down the c's offer
« Reply #589 on: December 19, 2013, 07:14:03 AM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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Quote
I'll believe it when Asik is traded elsewhere.

Could be, they could be using us for leverage.   However, the Broadcast seemed fairly certain about it.   I knew it was not going to happen last night because they played.  But I read somewhere it could happen today.  No knows but DA.

Re: Boston Herald says Rockets already turned down the c's offer
« Reply #590 on: December 19, 2013, 07:36:48 AM »

Offline Tr1boy

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I bet you guys its due to Danny offering a protected 1st for 2015 or 2014 and Morey wants it unprotected.

Or Morey wants a 2014 pick but Danny is refusing.

Atlanta has no need to give up milsap. They just signed him this past season and is playing well.  Plus Horford is not really a pf. That would be one slow front court duo

It will be interesting what unfolds today. Asik should be traded one way or another. Morey doesn't want to be thinking about him anymore and also wants flexibility on Feb 21

Re: Asik trade rumors (Boston in the mix; update on page 16)
« Reply #591 on: December 19, 2013, 07:54:01 AM »

Offline BleedGreen1989

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The latest from Marc Stein today (12/19)...

Quote
The day has arrived for the Houston Rockets to live up to their vow to trade disgruntled center Omer Asik.

The Rockets have been telling rival teams for two weeks that they will trade Asik by Thursday, and according to sources close to the process, they gradually continued to move in that direction Wednesday.

ESPN.com reported Tuesday that the Boston Celtics had emerged as the strongest rivals to the Philadelphia 76ers in terms of Asik's likely destination. Entering the final hours before the Rockets' self-imposed deadline, sources said Houston officials spent much of Wednesday weighing the merits of Boston's offer of forward Brandon Bass, guard Courtney Lee and a future first-round draft pick for the 7-footer from Turkey while remaining engaged in talks with Philadelphia and leaving open the possibility that other teams could still join the bidding.

The Rockets, sources said, have been interested in prying veteran center Spencer Hawes away from the Sixers along with a future first-round pick, but they won't know until Thursday whether Philadelphia is prepared to part with that much for Asik or whether Boston's offer is the best available.

The Boston Herald reported late Wednesday that the Celtics actually made the offer featuring Bass, Lee and a protected first-rounder last week, only for Houston to reject it.

When this process began, Rockets officials were hopeful of getting more for Asik, who is regarded as one of the league's elite interior defenders. But the combination of Asik's offensive limitations and a $15 million balloon payment next season in the final year of his contract appears to have made it difficult for Houston to generate the interest it anticipated.


Sources said the quality of the draft pick that the Celtics are willing to surrender from their stash of nearly 10 future first-rounders over the next half-decade will be a key factor in determining whether the proposed Asik-to-Boston deal goes through.

Most sources connected to the talks, however, expressed belief Wednesday that the Rockets ultimately will go through with a trade, since Asik's demotion from the starting lineup and desire to be dealt following Dwight Howard's arrival in July have hung over the team for the past month.

The Rockets will have a better chance of getting a trade construction they like if a third team can be recruited as a facilitator, but sources said Wednesday that the Atlanta Hawks and Cleveland Cavaliers -- two teams widely anticipated to be at the heart of the Asik talks -- were not engaged in active negotiations with Houston.


The Hawks, sources said, have been resistant to making versatile forward Paul Millsap available to the Rockets, while Cleveland's interest was said to be as a potential third team to absorb the contract of Celtics forward Jeff Green. But sources say Boston has refused to make Green available in Asik scenarios, offering Bass instead.

Both Bass and Lee played with Howard in Orlando, but there are questions about how well Bass' game meshes with Howard's compared to power forwards with better shooting range. On the plus side, Bass has only one season left on his contract after this one at $6.9 million.

There are league sources, meanwhile, who have maintained all month that the Rockets' plan to trade Asik by Dec. 19 was hatched in part because of general manager Daryl Morey's confidence in being able to strike a deal with Philadelphia, where former Rockets assistant general manager Sam Hinkie is now running the Sixers' front office.

It appears that Morey may not have another option other than Boston for Asik. Especially if he wants a first rounder.

PHI- Doesnt seem to want to trade Hawes/Young (never thought Asik made sense for them anyways)
CLE- Apparently dropped out and doesn't want to surrender AV
ATL- Doesnt want to part with Milsap (understandably because he's the better player and cheaper player)
POR- Doesnt want to part with Lopez/mess with team chemistry I imagine

Really don't see another team deciding all of a sudden they want to fork over a bunch of stuff for Asik.
*CB Miami Heat*
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Re: Asik trade rumors (Boston in the mix; update on page 16)
« Reply #592 on: December 19, 2013, 07:56:15 AM »

Offline Tr1boy

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Scott Souza: #Celtics Brandon Bass asked if he hears rumors: "No, I do not." Asked if he knew of Asik rumor: "No, I do not." Asked if he's lying: "No." Twitter @scott_souza

I think he is lying =]

Re: Asik trade rumors (Boston in the mix; update on page 16)
« Reply #593 on: December 19, 2013, 07:59:19 AM »

Offline Clench123

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Scott Souza: #Celtics Brandon Bass asked if he hears rumors: "No, I do not." Asked if he knew of Asik rumor: "No, I do not." Asked if he's lying: "No." Twitter @scott_souza

I think he is lying =]

lol. Yea, he's lying.

Anybody knows what time we're suppose to find out today?

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Re: Boston Herald says Rockets already turned down the c's offer
« Reply #594 on: December 19, 2013, 08:03:41 AM »

Offline csfansince60s

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I bet you guys its due to Danny offering a protected 1st for 2015 or 2014 and Morey wants it unprotected.

Or Morey wants a 2014 pick but Danny is refusing.

Atlanta has no need to give up milsap. They just signed him this past season and is playing well.  Plus Horford is not really a pf. That would be one slow front court duo

It will be interesting what unfolds today. Asik should be traded one way or another. Morey doesn't want to be thinking about him anymore and also wants flexibility on Feb 21

There was also conjecture by one of the talking heads that Morey wanted this settled before the team plane left for the road-trip today. Not sure what time that was.

Re: Asik trade rumors (Boston in the mix; update on page 16)
« Reply #595 on: December 19, 2013, 08:08:28 AM »

Offline TwinTower14

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Just reading that his nickname is the "Turkish Hammer"...C's need to get this guy, for his nickname alone...

Re: Asik trade rumors (Boston in the mix; update on page 16)
« Reply #596 on: December 19, 2013, 08:15:43 AM »

Offline csfansince60s

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This from a RealGM twitter:

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ClutchFans ‏@clutchfans 6h

Yes. If they wanted to use that time on Friday, they still could. RT @DHYLNP: @clutchfans Meaning they have all day Friday to get it done?
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ClutchFans ‏@clutchfans 6h

Just the same, Omer Asik is getting traded tomorrow. Rockets have a deal now they are willing to do, just waiting on best offers.
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    ClutchFans ‏@clutchfans 6h

    Source: Rockets have been informed by league that the deadline is 12/20 (not 12/19) to make trade & still be able to trade received players.

So the Rockets have til tomorrow and they supposedly have an acceptable offer (ours), but they're waiting for a better one.

Doubt anyone steps up, and we get Asik for Danny's offer of supposedly, Bass, Green and a protected first, not sure what year.

Re: Boston Herald says Rockets already turned down the c's offer
« Reply #597 on: December 19, 2013, 08:16:44 AM »

Offline clover

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Maybe Asik is better than Bass or Lee but not by much. The Pick is what this is all about Houston wants it. That pick could be someone more valuable than Asik (who was taken in the second round). So if the one who gets be best player wins the trade, I say it is not a slam dunk by any means. Just a step in the rebuilding process.

A 7 footer who can make a defensive impact like Asik is worth a lot more than Bass and Lee.

Asik could be a DPOY candidate if he gets a starting gig and is able to play 30+ minutes a night.

The advanced statistics suggest that Bass has been an elite defensive player this year, and Lee is a decent (if not spectacular) defensive player himself.

On the other hand both Bass and Lee are far more skilled offensively than Asik is - Omar is practically useless offensively and would barely be an upgrade over Perk in that regard.

In fact I seriously question whether Asik is much (if any) more of an impact player for us right now than Hump is.  Hump has defended reasonably well, has blocked some shots, has a decent jumper, and has been an absolute beast on the boards. 

The problem with this deal is that the Celtics last I checked were a top 10 defense in the NBA...but one of the absolute worst offenses. 

Lee has probably been our most consistent scorer off the bench and one of the few guys who has been able to hit the three with consistency, while Bass has developed his offensive game this year with a better post game and more aggression driving to the basket.  For a team as bad as we are offensively, losing Bass and Lee would hurt us on that end of the floor without a doubt.   

On the other hand, gaining Asik does nothing to help us on that end of the floor.  He has zero offensive presence.  We would probably get about 10 points, 8 rebounds and a block from either Hump or Faverani if we played either one of those guys 30 minutes a night...

So as far as pure talent goes, we really aren't getting much more back with Asik than we are giving out with Lee and Bass. We're giving up two borderline starters (Lee) for one slightly better borderline starter (Asik).

So does this mean I would say no to the deal?  Not at all, I would say yes.  Why?  Because of the contracts.

Asik is only earning $8M this season which is not too bad considering his production...even if he turns out a mediocre producer for us (quite possible) he's not being paid enough to make it a massive deal.  His contract is heavilly back-loaded though, so next year he earns almost double that money...and suddenly he becomes a relatively young, relatively skilled 7 footer on a $15M expiring contract.  Suddenly our situation becomes a little like this...

2014-2015:
Kris Humphries ($12M), Bogans ($5M), Crawford ($5M) and Brooks ($3M) can all expire...up to $25M coming off the books

2015-2016:
Omar Asik ($15M) comes off the books

2016-2017:
Gerald Wallace ($10M) comes off the books

This means we have the ability to:

* Sign at least one (maybe two) max contract players in the 2014-2015 season, along with acquiring multiple draft picks in that loaded 2014 draft

* Sign one young max contract player (max contract for younger guys is only $12M - $15M) in the 2015-2016 season plus a draft pick in the 2015 draft

* Sign one very good support player (or a couple of midlevel guys) in the 2016-1017 season along with adding draft picks

That is a LOT of potential talent that we can add to this team in the relative short term, and making this move for Asik could give us the cap room (combined with existing young talent and draft picks) to make us contenders again within two seasons.

Where do you get Crawford and Brooks at $5M and $3M? Hoopshype have them at $2M and $1M this year?

They do, with this deal, save about $4M next year by having Asik's $8M instead of Bass and Lee at a combined $12M.

Resigning Bradley and Crawford, or the equivalent, would probably take a combined $7-8M more than they're making this year, however. And Rondo also gets a $1M boost.

Re: Asik trade rumors (Boston in the mix; update on page 16)
« Reply #598 on: December 19, 2013, 08:20:55 AM »

Offline TwinTower14

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This from a RealGM twitter:

https://twitter.com/clutchfans

Quote
ClutchFans ‏@clutchfans 6h

Yes. If they wanted to use that time on Friday, they still could. RT @DHYLNP: @clutchfans Meaning they have all day Friday to get it done?
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ClutchFans ‏@clutchfans 6h

Just the same, Omer Asik is getting traded tomorrow. Rockets have a deal now they are willing to do, just waiting on best offers.
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    ClutchFans ‏@clutchfans 6h

    Source: Rockets have been informed by league that the deadline is 12/20 (not 12/19) to make trade & still be able to trade received players.

So the Rockets have til tomorrow and they supposedly have an acceptable offer (ours), but they're waiting for a better one.

Doubt anyone steps up, and we get Asik for Danny's offer of supposedly, Bass, Green and a protected first, not sure what year.

Yea - Mannix was saying on the post game last night that he thinks the deal will get done before Houston gets on the plane this afternoon. 

Re: Asik trade rumors (Boston in the mix; update on page 16)
« Reply #599 on: December 19, 2013, 08:25:37 AM »

Offline BleedGreen1989

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This from a RealGM twitter:

https://twitter.com/clutchfans

Quote
ClutchFans ‏@clutchfans 6h

Yes. If they wanted to use that time on Friday, they still could. RT @DHYLNP: @clutchfans Meaning they have all day Friday to get it done?
Expand

    Reply
    Retweet
    Favorite

ClutchFans ‏@clutchfans 6h

Just the same, Omer Asik is getting traded tomorrow. Rockets have a deal now they are willing to do, just waiting on best offers.
Expand

    Reply
    Retweet
    Favorite

    ClutchFans ‏@clutchfans 6h

    Source: Rockets have been informed by league that the deadline is 12/20 (not 12/19) to make trade & still be able to trade received players.

So the Rockets have til tomorrow and they supposedly have an acceptable offer (ours), but they're waiting for a better one.

Doubt anyone steps up, and we get Asik for Danny's offer of supposedly, Bass, Green and a protected first, not sure what year.

The deal is Bass, Lee, 2015 first. Not Green.
*CB Miami Heat*
Kyle Lowry, Dwayne Wade, 13th pick in even numbered rounds, 18th pick in odd numbered rounds.