No more excuses for Jeff Green, right?

[CelticG1]

Its the same exact thing with the rondo argument.

Do you want him to average the same exact stats game after game? In 82 games (if he was playing all of them) how many dud games do you allow? None? 5?

Same story different player

Green is not on Rondo's level.  Not even close. 




Rondo is a star player when he was healthy.  There is reason to hope and believe he can be a star player when he returns healthy. 


Green is a good player who has the occasional star level game.

It was more comparing people criticizing/ complaining about both.

Vague comments like consistency are so arbitrary and no one feels lile defining them so they can go back and turn their arguement into whatever they want.

So with Rondo people who say he isn't a franchise player wont actually state defined characteristics. They throw things around like "better shooter" "consistency"  "leader" around. So what is consistency? Its whatever each indovidual defines as such. Same with the rest.

Similar to Green. People are expecting him to be more consistent, no excuses etc. So define consistency. Does he need to be double digit scoring 82 games this year?

I know these aren't easily defined characteristics but throwing out a few concrete things to look at doesn't hurt. At least you can look back and say "I didn't think he was consistent but he did average this amount etc etc in 80% of the games he played and shot 50% in majority of those"

[CelticG1]

The flipside is that short of Jeff Green being a stud, people will make excuses for him if he is playing well

Examples:

"Someone is going to have to score points"

"Yeah he scores a lot but his fg percentage isn't good"

"We are a -x when he's on the floor"

"He isn't a good rebounder"

"He doesn't get others involved"

"He's a ball hog"

"He will never be a top 3 option on contending team"

"He only looks good cause we suck"

The thing with this is that whoever makes these threads needs to set a bar. If not you can always make a case either way for him sucking, being good or in between.

So what does Jeff Greens line need to be? Is it just eye ball test so you can make whatever tou want up? Is it 20 ppg and not care about anything else? Is it 14 ppg 50% shooting 6 rebkunds and 30+ wins?

I'd really like to hesr anything or else this atupid conversation goes round and round

Well, if Jeff Green is inefficient, if he's a poor rebounder at the 4 (and especially if that's affecting our team rebounding)..those aren't excuses, they're legitimate criticisms.

Ha again with the vague comments.

What's poor rebounding for the 4 and the 3?

Lets say he plays 50% of both. Is there a particular rebounding number that will automatically qualify him as having a bad season? What are you looking for from him? What will make you satisfied with jeff green this year regarding his contract or whatever else.

Is 18 ppg on 50% shooting 6 rpg in 75% of his games this year more or less gonna satisfy you? If no than what will?

Its gonna be hard to look at jeffs season and see if he's "consistent" "agressive" "scoring" "leading" etc with out putting numbers on it. At least its harder to take those arguments seriously. If he gets the numbers you want and more and we win 10 games are you still satisfied.

I'm not trying to defend jeff green at all by the way. Just trying to get any idea from people what they want or expect out of green.

[CelticG1]

Didn't green play more 2 than 4 last year? Improves his rebound numbers automatically! 

[indeedproceed]

The flipside is that short of Jeff Green being a stud, people will make excuses for him if he is playing well

Examples:

"Someone is going to have to score points"

"Yeah he scores a lot but his fg percentage isn't good"

"We are a -x when he's on the floor"

"He isn't a good rebounder"

"He doesn't get others involved"

"He's a ball hog"

"He will never be a top 3 option on contending team"

"He only looks good cause we suck"

The thing with this is that whoever makes these threads needs to set a bar. If not you can always make a case either way for him sucking, being good or in between.

So what does Jeff Greens line need to be? Is it just eye ball test so you can make whatever tou want up? Is it 20 ppg and not care about anything else? Is it 14 ppg 50% shooting 6 rebkunds and 30+ wins?

I'd really like to hesr anything or else this atupid conversation goes round and round

Well, if Jeff Green is inefficient, if he's a poor rebounder at the 4 (and especially if that's affecting our team rebounding)..those aren't excuses, they're legitimate criticisms.

Ha again with the vague comments.

What's poor rebounding for the 4 and the 3?

Lets say he plays 50% of both. Is there a particular rebounding number that will automatically qualify him as having a bad season? What are you looking for from him? What will make you satisfied with jeff green this year regarding his contract or whatever else.

Is 18 ppg on 50% shooting 6 rpg in 75% of his games this year more or less gonna satisfy you? If no than what will?

Its gonna be hard to look at jeffs season and see if he's "consistent" "agressive" "scoring" "leading" etc with out putting numbers on it. At least its harder to take those arguments seriously. If he gets the numbers you want and more and we win 10 games are you still satisfied.

I'm not trying to defend jeff green at all by the way. Just trying to get any idea from people what they want or expect out of green.

I thought it was just 'known' what was okay as a rebounder.

Of the 80 PF's last season who played 500 or more minutes, Jeff Green ranks 77th out of 80, with a rebound rate of 8.3

Among SF's, he would rank 44th out of 61 qualifying players.

Among SF's he's about average, maybe slightly below, but among PF's he's among the worst in the league.

Now considering that he actually did spend half his time at both, hopefully he would've rebounded better as a 4 and likely worse as a 3, so if we make those 9.3 and 7.3 effectively (the movement probably wouldn't be that big), Jeff Green would still rank 73rd out of 80 among PF's.

Average for a PF is around a 12-14 rebound rate, so call it 13. Small forwards are around a 9-10 or so. Jeff's well below average as a rebounding 4, and slightly below average as a 3.

So, that's rebounding.

[GreenFaith1819]

Haven't read through entire thread, but I think the WHOLE team needs excuses right now - not just Jeff.

I wouldn't single out just him...

[Fred Roberts]

I would say no. There are no expectations this year for wins, so Jeff should go out there and do his all every game to get points, rebounds, blocked shots etc.

I've been a huge cheerleader for Jeff in the past. His time is now or never. I will be incredibly disappointed if he isn't a major impact player this year.

[Eric M VAN]

I would like to make an excuse for Jeff Green.

 

[Tr1boy]

Anyone know what is wrong with this guy again? Gerald wallace is killing him to the starting position


Imo the problem i see with him is he cant play without the ball. He needs to ball in his hands to score.

[D.o.s.]

Anyone know what is wrong with this guy again? Gerald wallace is killing him to the starting position


Imo the problem i see with him is he cant play without the ball. He needs to ball in his hands to score.

"wrong" implies abnormal.

I said it earlier in this thread, and I'll say it again--no one would need to make excuses for Jeff Green if he didn't seem like he should be so much better than he is.

[Galeto]

My biggest gripes about have to do with his lack of rebounding and playmaking.  I don't expect him to be a big-time scorer at SF because he lacks the handle to consistently get high-quality shots but he should be a much better rebounder and what the heck happened to the guy who the main playmaker for his Georgetown team?

I'm still waiting for him to break out a spin move or crossover.  It's baffling how he doesn't have two of the biggest staples in a perimeter player's repertoire in his arsenal.  Dang, Sullinger breaks out a spin move about five times a game.  Green might not have done a spin move five times in his career.

[timobusa]

I didn't know Coach Brad Stevens could be so animated!

[Tr1boy]

Either one of Green or Wallace has to go by trade deadline. As of right now, my choice is keeping Gerald Wallace regardless of his contract. In terms of pure talent, Jeff Green has more tools, but in terms of everything else the choice is Wallace. Especialy playing the game the right way or knowing what to do out there.

[fitzhickey]

I didn't know Coach Brad Stevens could be so animated!

this just makes me happy
he looks like a happy kid

[chambers]

It's going to be hard for him without KG, Pierce and Rondo to distract opposing defenses. Green is now the focus of every defense and will attract their best defender all game long.

We also don't have anyone that's spreading the floor and the poor guy has no room to drive to the hole.
Last season he had Pierce, Rondo, KG all dragging defenses away from the rim (except for Rondo), and our ball movement meant he could sit in the corner and drive or shoot on ball swings.

It's going to take him a while to adjust but he might find his feet.

Wait till Rondo gets back and he struggles with this lack of spacing. Every team is going to force all these guys to shoot jumpshots and our lack of shooters for spacing is going to kill penetration in general.

Only 3 games in though so wait till we work out proper rotations and Green has the 3 or 4 slotted as the starter with his name next to it.

At the moment he's the number one option- so he takes all the attention- he's not used to that. He may adjust but his personality tells me he's not comfortable in that role.
Gotta give him a real shot to take the mantle as the first or second option. Even with Rondo there we'll want him as our leading scorer and attacking the basket in tandem with Rondo.
If Olynyk and Sully can hit jumpshots to keep defenders honest then it will be easier for him.

[lightspeed5]

lebron would never put up 4 pts like that