Houston makes Asik and Lin available

[pearljammer10]

Would love Asik, not so much on Lin. If he fit into our trade exception then I think we could get him for a first.

My thoughts exactly. Stay away from Lin.

However I wonder if sending Rondo and pieces to Houston for Lin, Asik draft picks and maybe a Parson or another youngster immediately puts Howards in full on sign mode. Not saying we should do it but I wonder if the tires have been kicked at all on that front.

[dreamgreen]

I'd take Asik, he's nothing special, but seems solid.

[action781]

My cousin threw out this idea to me yesterday that made a lot of sense:

Asik for Bass + Lee

From Boston's side is obvious.  Need for a true center and unload 2 contracts they don't need.

But Houston gets 2 role players that have played well alongside Dwight in the past.  Both are on not good, but manageable contracts if needed to be traded after a season, and would be very fair value contracts if they can each produce similar to what they did in Orlando.  Lee would be a great 2/3 off the bench who can shoot and defend.  Bass can do what Bass does.  He can serve as a starting PF if necessary and can slide to a backup if Houston can find a better one.

I think the deal makes a lot of sense to both sides, but I wonder if Houston can get more elsewhere for Asik.  If so, celts have a plethora of draft picks they could use to sweeten the offer.  I'd think Houston would love to have an extra pick they can use as a trade asset down the road for a starting PG or starting PF.

[Yoki_IsTheName]

My cousin threw out this idea to me yesterday that made a lot of sense:

Asik for Bass + Lee

I'd do that trade in a second.

[connor]

My cousin threw out this idea to me yesterday that made a lot of sense:

Asik for Bass + Lee

I'd do that trade in a second.

Houston could get much better value than Bass and Lee for Asik.

[clover]

I'd take Asik, he's nothing special, but seems solid.

I think you're right.  Maybe Asik and Larkin.

[Vermont Green]

I am still confused about the salary and cap hit.  Hoopsworld and Spotrac list the cap hit for Lin and Asik as about $8.3M per year but the actual salary is $5.1M + $15M.  So does anyone know what happens to this in the event of a trade?

Larry Coon says the following:

Putting this all together, if a team that is $9 million under the cap in 2011-12 wants to submit a four-year offer sheet, and wants to provide a large raise in the third season, they can offer a total of $36 million over four years. The first-year salary is limited to the Non-Taxpayer Mid-Level exception, or $5 million. The second-year salary will be $5.225 million (4.5% raise). This leaves $25.775 million to be distributed over the final two seasons of the contract, with a 4.1% raise from year three to year four.

For the team making this offer, this contract would count for $9.0 million (i.e., the average salary in the contract) of team salary in each of the four seasons if they sign the player. If the player's prior team matches the offer and keeps the player, then the actual salary in each season counts as team salary. The player's original team is allowed to use any available exception (e.g., the Non-Taxpayer Mid-Level or the Early Bird) to match the offer.

This addresses the difference between resigning a player you already have vs. signing with a new team and using an available MLE slot.  Nothing about what happens if traded.

The Celtics may not mind that they have to pay an extra $4M as a hidden (non-cap) cost if they see value in two young players.  I would like to see the Celtics get more than just Lin and Asik (adding Parsons would definitely win me over) but I definitely think there is a potential deal here that involves Rondo and maybe even Bass.

[BudweiserCeltic]

I am still confused about the salary and cap hit.  Hoopsworld and Spotrac list the cap hit for Lin and Asik as about $8.3M per year but the actual salary is $5.1M + $15M.  So does anyone know what happens to this in the event of a trade?

Larry Coon says the following:

Putting this all together, if a team that is $9 million under the cap in 2011-12 wants to submit a four-year offer sheet, and wants to provide a large raise in the third season, they can offer a total of $36 million over four years. The first-year salary is limited to the Non-Taxpayer Mid-Level exception, or $5 million. The second-year salary will be $5.225 million (4.5% raise). This leaves $25.775 million to be distributed over the final two seasons of the contract, with a 4.1% raise from year three to year four.

For the team making this offer, this contract would count for $9.0 million (i.e., the average salary in the contract) of team salary in each of the four seasons if they sign the player. If the player's prior team matches the offer and keeps the player, then the actual salary in each season counts as team salary. The player's original team is allowed to use any available exception (e.g., the Non-Taxpayer Mid-Level or the Early Bird) to match the offer.

This addresses the difference between resigning a player you already have vs. signing with a new team and using an available MLE slot.  Nothing about what happens if traded.

The Celtics may not mind that they have to pay an extra $4M as a hidden (non-cap) cost if they see value in two young players.  I would like to see the Celtics get more than just Lin and Asik (adding Parsons would definitely win me over) but I definitely think there is a potential deal here that involves Rondo and maybe even Bass.

As I understand it, the only teams that would get the full 14 million cap hit is New York and the Bulls respectively. All others get the 8 million cap hit.

[Evantime34]

I am still confused about the salary and cap hit.  Hoopsworld and Spotrac list the cap hit for Lin and Asik as about $8.3M per year but the actual salary is $5.1M + $15M.  So does anyone know what happens to this in the event of a trade?

Larry Coon says the following:

Putting this all together, if a team that is $9 million under the cap in 2011-12 wants to submit a four-year offer sheet, and wants to provide a large raise in the third season, they can offer a total of $36 million over four years. The first-year salary is limited to the Non-Taxpayer Mid-Level exception, or $5 million. The second-year salary will be $5.225 million (4.5% raise). This leaves $25.775 million to be distributed over the final two seasons of the contract, with a 4.1% raise from year three to year four.

For the team making this offer, this contract would count for $9.0 million (i.e., the average salary in the contract) of team salary in each of the four seasons if they sign the player. If the player's prior team matches the offer and keeps the player, then the actual salary in each season counts as team salary. The player's original team is allowed to use any available exception (e.g., the Non-Taxpayer Mid-Level or the Early Bird) to match the offer.

This addresses the difference between resigning a player you already have vs. signing with a new team and using an available MLE slot.  Nothing about what happens if traded.

The Celtics may not mind that they have to pay an extra $4M as a hidden (non-cap) cost if they see value in two young players.  I would like to see the Celtics get more than just Lin and Asik (adding Parsons would definitely win me over) but I definitely think there is a potential deal here that involves Rondo and maybe even Bass.

I don't completely understand why this is the case but I have read it over and over which makes me believe it is so. Had New York or Chicago matched the offers they would have been on the hook for $15 MM in the last year. However, when they signed with Houston, the money got distributed evenly.

As to the Bass and Lee deal earlier, the Rockets want to unload Asik and Lin's salary, not take back salary. I bet they move one or both to teams under the cap for a pick, giving them more room to maneuver financially.

[#1P4P]

The rumor of Howard wanting more star power should give enough indication that Asik and Lin have been made available, but not in exchange for role players.

The market for a strong, rebounding, defensive Center that hasn't been injury prone is strong. Asik is not being traded for less than a Green caliber player; he should net them a sign and trade with one of the solid PF on the market or Eric Bledsoe (perhaps Asik to Portland - W Matthews to LAC - Bledsoe to Houston trade might do it).

Lin... doesn't have the value that Asik has, but there has to be market for him. Sacramento might be a good fit.

[Geo123]

Would love Asik, not so much on Lin. If he fit into our trade exception then I think we could get him for a first.

We have a trade exception? Especially one that fits Asik's contract?! (~8 million)

No as of right now.  There's speculation that we might get one through the Nets trade.  At leas tthat's what I read on this web site. 

Also, I really don't think that we would get Asik that cheap.  If the Rockets decide to move him then they have gotten D Howard and somne of the teams that lost out on him like the Hawks and the Mavs in particular will go after him.  To me, if Howard signs with the Rockets then Asik + will be used in a S & T for Josh Smith.... 

[rondoallaturca]

As I understand it, the only teams that would get the full 14 million cap hit is New York and the Bulls respectively. All others get the 8 million cap hit.

This is correct. As such, that means there's no reason not to try to get Asik.

Lin on the other hand? I don't care if Rondo is staying or gone, there's no reason whatsoever we should be getting Lin.

[manl_lui]

nobody really wants Lin lol

[rondoallaturca]

nobody really wants Lin lol

And it's not the kid's fault. He's a solid player. He's just ideally a backup PG, and for his contract, he'd be quite an expensive backup PG.

[Fafnir]

I am still confused about the salary and cap hit.  Hoopsworld and Spotrac list the cap hit for Lin and Asik as about $8.3M per year but the actual salary is $5.1M + $15M.  So does anyone know what happens to this in the event of a trade?

Larry Coon says the following:

Putting this all together, if a team that is $9 million under the cap in 2011-12 wants to submit a four-year offer sheet, and wants to provide a large raise in the third season, they can offer a total of $36 million over four years. The first-year salary is limited to the Non-Taxpayer Mid-Level exception, or $5 million. The second-year salary will be $5.225 million (4.5% raise). This leaves $25.775 million to be distributed over the final two seasons of the contract, with a 4.1% raise from year three to year four.

For the team making this offer, this contract would count for $9.0 million (i.e., the average salary in the contract) of team salary in each of the four seasons if they sign the player. If the player's prior team matches the offer and keeps the player, then the actual salary in each season counts as team salary. The player's original team is allowed to use any available exception (e.g., the Non-Taxpayer Mid-Level or the Early Bird) to match the offer.

This addresses the difference between resigning a player you already have vs. signing with a new team and using an available MLE slot.  Nothing about what happens if traded.

The Celtics may not mind that they have to pay an extra $4M as a hidden (non-cap) cost if they see value in two young players.  I would like to see the Celtics get more than just Lin and Asik (adding Parsons would definitely win me over) but I definitely think there is a potential deal here that involves Rondo and maybe even Bass.

I don't completely understand why this is the case but I have read it over and over which makes me believe it is so. Had New York or Chicago matched the offers they would have been on the hook for $15 MM in the last year. However, when they signed with Houston, the money got distributed evenly.

Basically its because of the Gilbert Arenas rule.

Asik/Lin both were second year rookies who were FAs as their contracts were up. But they were not UFAs due to not having enough service time in the league

But the Knicks/Bulls didn't have bird rights (need 3 years of service to a team/contract) so they can't use that exception to get around the cap.

So if a team is under the apron they are protected with salary limits for the first two years limited to the MLE (so teams can retain 2nd roun picks) in the third/fourth year the salary can escalate up hugely.

This is to keep the system of rookies being cost controlled for four years, after that they can be paid the really big bucks.

The averaging happens so that teams can't just offer big poison pill contracts without cap space. So to offer 9 million on average over 4 (or 3) years to a Gilbert Arenas RFA you have to have 9 million dollars in cap room. Thus the cap hit is amortized over the length of the deal.

A matching team isn't afforded this luxury as they're using the MLE and then paying the actual amount, just like if they were a first round rookie whom you signed to a standard contract (with 2 years locked in, 2 options and then you have to pony up)