Clippers and Celtics Talking Deal

[Xepa]

If this falls through I see the Celtics giving the Clips the proverbial middle finger and trade Pierce to Houston for Lin and Asik (and change) so Houston can buyout Pierce and have the money to bring in both CP3 and D12 to play with Harden.

actually I won't mind this at all

Houston would get so much more for just Asik alone. Morey is a master trader. Son't screw with Morey hahahah. This is an absurd proposal, and Houston wouldn't mortgage the farm like this unless Dwight already has a contract signed in ink.

Now if you have a link that says differently, let me know. But I'm on Clutchfans regularly and I haven't seen this pop up anywhere. It's pure foolishness.

[BleedGreen1989]

If this falls through I see the Celtics giving the Clips the proverbial middle finger and trade Pierce to Houston for Lin and Asik (and change) so Houston can buyout Pierce and have the money to bring in both CP3 and D12 to play with Harden.

actually I won't mind this at all

Houston would get so much more for just Asik alone. Morey is a master trader. Son't screw with Morey hahahah. This is an absurd proposal, and Houston wouldn't mortgage the farm like this unless Dwight already has a contract signed in ink.

Now if you have a link that says differently, let me know. But I'm on Clutchfans regularly and I haven't seen this pop up anywhere. It's pure foolishness.

Yea this is homerism at its finest. Houston could get a wayyyy better deal for Asik and still save $ in the process.

[chambers]

After this trade what makes Clippers better (on paper) than last seasons Celtics that makes them think they can win the chip?

Well take KG off our roster and put DeAndre Jordan on our roster as starting center for 82 games and the playoffs.
Take Pierce off our roster and put Caron Butler there next to Jeff Green doing the same.
Take Vinny Del Negro and we'll have him as our coach, and the Clippers can have Doc for a full season.

Who wins 9 times out of 10 with those changes?

[LGC88]

I'm sure this is all Ainge's plan, don't blame doc, he's not the one who wants to run out of boston.
If clippers don't do the deal (that would be a big opportunity to miss) then everybody is back in boston for a last season with a proper goodbye at the end of the season for PP & KG. Stadium will be still full and happy.
I don't see anything wrong with what Danny is trying to do. Don't blame Doc, he has nothing to do with that.

PS: Btw, what happen to Krook?

[connor]

This move is about appeasing Paul.

For every Celtics fan here saying that...

As a Clippers season ticket holder, I can tell you that Clipper players and associated personnel are all pretty [dang] sure he's staying. He's told people in his circles that he's staying, and even Billups last week said on TV that he thinks Paul will be back. I can rattle off like 10+ sources that have said they're pretty sure he'll be back.

You're looking at this from a perspective of Paul's leaving if this deal doesn't go through. Invalid argument.

...as a Lakers fan, I'm 60% sure Dwight is leaving us to go to Houston. So if this was a hypothetical to appease Dwight, different situation as Laker fans feel that if something doesn't get done he'll leave. Not the same for Paul.

...and no one takes the Atlanta situation seriously. CP3/Dwight aren't going to team up there. SAS and other have said that and CP3 loves LA too much.

...just bringing in outside world opinions to this forum. That is all.

From the Celtics side...is DeAndre Jordan and low first rounders better than cap space? What's your track record in attracting big FAs? Not great. I'd do the deal, trade Rondo and Green for picks, then let Jordan be the tank commander for a Wiggins campaign. League requires 90% of salary cap for a roster, and Jordan fills those league requirements well.

Thanks for the LA perspective.

I have been operating under the assumption that this deal is in large part a way of getting CP3 to stay. I just assumed that after this year's playoff performance it seemed pretty obvious that you need to make some changes to be a serious contender. Jordan is useless in the 4th quarter (which is why people here are skeptical about him). Bledsoe can probably bring you in some help, but nobody at KG's level (at least for 2 years anyway).

Fair enough if you have sources/rumors saying he loves LA too much to stay, but there have also been rumors that he wants to team up with Dwight Howard and the talk out of LA is that they're not sending you Howard.

Are you really that confident given that Houston, Dallas and Atlanta all could have enough cap room to sign them both and create big 3's of their own (Harden, Dirk, Horford)?

I just see it as a fairly big gamble, given that if this deal doesn't go down we could turn around and help Houston attract CP3 if they can get Howard to sign.

Also would us waiving/trading Pierce to a team who waives him and letting him sign for vet. minimum make a difference for you? Jordan/Bledsoe and a first for KG,PP, Doc? PP at vet. minimum is a HUGE discount.

[Celtics4ever]

I'm sure this is all Ainge's plan, don't blame doc, he's not the one who wants to run out of boston.
If clippers don't do the deal (that would be a big opportunity to miss) then everybody is back in boston for a last season with a proper goodbye at the end of the season for PP & KG. Stadium will be still full and happy.
I don't see anything wrong with what Danny is trying to do. Don't blame Doc, he has nothing to do with that.

And we suck for ten years instead of five....

[Casperian]

There is so much extremism in people's views on this.  I mean you can like Doc as a coach, and not completely hate him for wanting to move on.  All the 'he stabbed us in the back' type comments and over the top emotional responses are just silly.  get a grip people.  The team was going to change significantly either way.

Reminds me of the wonderful world of european soccer.

Does anyone else have the feeling that the internet brought some form of "hooliganization" into american sports?

[Xepa]

This move is about appeasing Paul.

For every Celtics fan here saying that...

As a Clippers season ticket holder, I can tell you that Clipper players and associated personnel are all pretty [dang] sure he's staying. He's told people in his circles that he's staying, and even Billups last week said on TV that he thinks Paul will be back. I can rattle off like 10+ sources that have said they're pretty sure he'll be back.

You're looking at this from a perspective of Paul's leaving if this deal doesn't go through. Invalid argument.

...as a Lakers fan, I'm 60% sure Dwight is leaving us to go to Houston. So if this was a hypothetical to appease Dwight, different situation as Laker fans feel that if something doesn't get done he'll leave. Not the same for Paul.

...and no one takes the Atlanta situation seriously. CP3/Dwight aren't going to team up there. SAS and other have said that and CP3 loves LA too much.

...just bringing in outside world opinions to this forum. That is all.

From the Celtics side...is DeAndre Jordan and low first rounders better than cap space? What's your track record in attracting big FAs? Not great. I'd do the deal, trade Rondo and Green for picks, then let Jordan be the tank commander for a Wiggins campaign. League requires 90% of salary cap for a roster, and Jordan fills those league requirements well.

Thanks for the LA perspective.

I have been operating under the assumption that this deal is in large part a way of getting CP3 to stay. I just assumed that after this year's playoff performance it seemed pretty obvious that you need to make some changes to be a serious contender. Jordan is useless in the 4th quarter (which is why people here are skeptical about him). Bledsoe can probably bring you in some help, but nobody at KG's level (at least for 2 years anyway).

Fair enough if you have sources/rumors saying he loves LA too much to stay, but there have also been rumors that he wants to team up with Dwight Howard and the talk out of LA is that they're not sending you Howard.

Are you really that confident given that Houston, Dallas and Atlanta all could have enough cap room to sign them both and create big 3's of their own (Harden, Dirk, Horford)?

I just see it as a fairly big gamble, given that if this deal doesn't go down we could turn around and help Houston attract CP3 if they can get Howard to sign.

Also would us waiving/trading Pierce to a team who waives him and letting him sign for vet. minimum make a difference for you? Jordan/Bledsoe and a first for KG,PP, Doc? PP at vet. minimum is a HUGE discount.

Chris Paul owns LAC. Every. Single. Roster. Move. last year was made by Paul. Every single one, down to Vet Min signings like Matt Barnes.

Chris Paul owns the team. So it's not like he's blaming management for having terrible pieces around him.

The entire premise of this scenario is that Pierce is bought out to sign with LAC. If that's not a part of the assumption I really don't see the point of Bledsoe+DeAndre for 37 year old KG. Now KG+Pierce? Yah I can see that, if push comes to shove. I'm operating under the assumption that Pierce isn't traded to somewhere else. Honestly I think Pierce would just retire unless he was traded to at least a semi-contender (Like Goldan State or Brooklyn).

...and yah Chris Paul resigning is always a gamble. However, I still feel that the job gets done by trading Bledsoe for Granger or Afflalo (two trades that have been PROPOSED to the Clippers).

With that said...

...my ultimate dream is to do the megatrade, then get Ray Allen after he opts out of the final year with the Heat. Re-unite the big 3.

Paul-Allen-Pierce-Griffin-KG with Crawford off the bench. We'll take your Bass salary as well.

Yes I am a sick, twisted Lakers fan. I know.

[BballTim]

This move is about appeasing Paul.

For every Celtics fan here saying that...

As a Clippers season ticket holder, I can tell you that Clipper players and associated personnel are all pretty [dang] sure he's staying. He's told people in his circles that he's staying, and even Billups last week said on TV that he thinks Paul will be back. I can rattle off like 10+ sources that have said they're pretty sure he'll be back.

You're looking at this from a perspective of Paul's leaving if this deal doesn't go through. Invalid argument.

...as a Lakers fan, I'm 60% sure Dwight is leaving us to go to Houston. So if this was a hypothetical to appease Dwight, different situation as Laker fans feel that if something doesn't get done he'll leave. Not the same for Paul.

...and no one takes the Atlanta situation seriously. CP3/Dwight aren't going to team up there. SAS and other have said that and CP3 loves LA too much.

...just bringing in outside world opinions to this forum. That is all.

From the Celtics side...is DeAndre Jordan and low first rounders better than cap space? What's your track record in attracting big FAs? Not great. I'd do the deal, trade Rondo and Green for picks, then let Jordan be the tank commander for a Wiggins campaign. League requires 90% of salary cap for a roster, and Jordan fills those league requirements well.

Thanks for the LA perspective.

I have been operating under the assumption that this deal is in large part a way of getting CP3 to stay. I just assumed that after this year's playoff performance it seemed pretty obvious that you need to make some changes to be a serious contender. Jordan is useless in the 4th quarter (which is why people here are skeptical about him). Bledsoe can probably bring you in some help, but nobody at KG's level (at least for 2 years anyway).

Fair enough if you have sources/rumors saying he loves LA too much to stay, but there have also been rumors that he wants to team up with Dwight Howard and the talk out of LA is that they're not sending you Howard.

Are you really that confident given that Houston, Dallas and Atlanta all could have enough cap room to sign them both and create big 3's of their own (Harden, Dirk, Horford)?

I just see it as a fairly big gamble, given that if this deal doesn't go down we could turn around and help Houston attract CP3 if they can get Howard to sign.

Also would us waiving/trading Pierce to a team who waives him and letting him sign for vet. minimum make a difference for you? Jordan/Bledsoe and a first for KG,PP, Doc? PP at vet. minimum is a HUGE discount.

Chris Paul owns LAC. Every. Single. Roster. Move. last year was made by Paul. Every single one, down to Vet Min signings like Matt Barnes.

Chris Paul owns the team. So it's not like he's blaming management for having terrible pieces around him.

  Everything I read said CP3 wanted the Clips to trade for KG last year. I don't think his influence is quite as extensive as you claim.

  Unless he'd rather have a good backup than a much better shot at a title, which I suppose is possible.

[kgainez]

I don't get how anyone can support Doc after this.

He's pulling *female dog* moves to get himself the upperhand in Clippersland. He's created a wall in a scenario that ultimately wouldve left both organizations with a win-win.

In addition, I think it's crazy to me that Doc is only being loyal to KG and PP. As much as I think they deserve another ring, there's also another part of me that wants them to fall flat on their faces because of the way they've gone about this.

Personal loyalty over loyalty to the organization that signs your checks. This is just disgusting to me. Doc is throwing the Cs under the bus while persuading players to go with him as he drives that bus.

grow up.  you're acting silly, making up some kind of  pretend personal conflict in your head.  they all were great celtics,  just because grown men look out for their own best interest doesn't mean you have to create up some kind of hatred for them.   

i have a right to my beliefs
dont you ever try to tell me otherwise

i have no problem with what they did as great celtics. i'm talking about the now. if you want to continue to frolic with them, have at it.
as for me? i will not.

[kgainez]

RT @BA_Turner: Doc Rivers been informed Clippers won't accept Celtics offer. Rivers prepared to stay in Boston, sources.

I think the Clippers are right to reject this trade. Not worth consideration.

Boston asking for too much.

I disagree. I think their insecurity about Chris Paul leaving is what shot this deal down. If Paul was already on the books they would have pulled the trigger.

This move is about appeasing Paul.

From the Celtics side...is DeAndre Jordan and low first rounders better than cap space? What's your track record in attracting big FAs? Not great. I'd do the deal, trade Rondo and Green for picks, then let Jordan be the tank commander for a Wiggins campaign. League requires 90% of salary cap for a roster, and Jordan fills those league requirements well.

best point made in this thread

[beantownboy171]

Here are my two cents, because i feel like the arguements around the board dont do our case justice.

For one, to any clipper fans looking for a discussion. Youre right, chris paul may stay without our help. But this move is about winning a championship . Kevin Garnett changes the culture of the team he is on, and will improve your defense drastically. If Blake Gridfin really has a head on his shoulders to become a superstar then having a mentor like Garnett is invaluable.

Secondly, no ones brought up the effect this trade will have on your cap space next summer. Between garnett and jordan you will have 20 million coming off the books next summer. If you arent able to acquire dwight howard, you will be able to position yourself to add another big piece next offseason and players want to play for doc rivers.

Bringing me to my next point, players want to play for doc rivers. So when we make this trade we are giving you financial flexibility, a desirable coach and  a shot to win now.

This is more of my own personal opinion, but i feel as though these negotiations were handled sneakily on your side. I think eric bledsoe was on the table originally, and then once the smoke turned to fire and the trade became public knowledge. I think bledsoe was used to bring us to thw negotiating table and then once danny agree to discuss it you thought he would cave under public pressure. This is 100% speculation on my part, andjust a theory but because the two names jordan and bledsoe have been floated for so long, i really feel im right. So i personally dont feel as though Ainge should cave.

If there is one misconception the clippers have its that we have zero chance of competing next year. If Chris paul missed half the season and the playoffs with a torn acl how wpuld you have fared? We didnt have sulling either, and jeff green was still recovering from heart surgery. Our yiung players still need leadership and we are trading that away as well.

So yes, i think you have to trade one truly valuable trade chip to get this deal done. I dont think it will get done. Thats fine. Maybe we should both move on.

[CelticConcourse]

Alright, it looks like this deal is not going through regardless.

[hpantazo]

Alright, it looks like this deal is not going through regardless.

No it doesn't. They are in the negotiating, posturing stage. We will find out by wednesday or so. All reports this morning say the negotiations are "stalled", not dead. This is typical GM posturing.

[crownontherocks]

 Don't rule out this trade: Jordan, Butler, Green + a 1st rounder for Doc, KG + the Terry/Lee contracts. Clips keep Bledsoe.

Bill simmons