Celtics/Clippers trade scenarios via ESPN's Larry Coon

[hpantazo]

Ainge will be hated by many celtics fans if this goes down, but as he did when he took over the team during the Jim Obrien era, he is not afraid of making the tough decisions for the benefit of the future of the team.

I can't argue against this move. We are not going to be able to contend with the current team, and we are not able to acquire enough talent to add to them, so the only alternative is to move on and get assets.

This trade would be more than we can reasonably expect to get for Pierce and KG at this stage in their careers.

For those people who think we deserve more return for Pierce or KG, what would you honestly be willing to give up to get Manu Ginobili next season after watching him play in the playoffs this year?

[connor]

You guys are nuts if you think Jordan is a player to build around, he's not.

I can understand taking him on as an asset to be moved later, but not as a piece to keep.

No one is arguing for building around Deandre Jordan or Eric Bledsoe. It's about acquiring young assets for a future deal. The other option is to lose KG and Pierce for nothing.

I've seen more than a few posters claim he would be a great fit with Rondo, Green etc..

Anyways, I've said my peace on the matter.  If we get him, I hope he is moved for other assets, asap.

I would love to move him for other assets, but at the moment I don't see any deals out there that would bring back a great return for a rebuilding C's team. So instead you let him go into next season as our starting center and hopefully continue to develop and see what options come about as we move down the road.

Same thing for Bledsoe. I think a lot of people out there are still calling him only a backup at this point. Lets get him some real minutes so he can bring his stock up even more and then move him to a team desperate for a point guard.

We are rebuilding not reloading. Just because they aren't the perfect pieces for us doesn't mean we shouldn't bring them in. We need young talent to test out and use as trade chips.

Like you said above Jordan is a luxury piece for a contending team. Why not wait a bit until a team like that comes calling and is willing to dump some of their promising assets for a guy who could help put them over the top?

Rebuilding is about being smart and patient. We need to collect as many potential assets as possible by taking advantage of other teams urgency and then package those to springboard us back to being competitive. This is a great opportunity to kickstart that.

[kgainez]

Ainge will be hated by many celtics fans if this goes down, but as he did when he took over the team during the Jim Obrien era, he is not afraid of making the tough decisions for the benefit of the future of the team.

I can't argue against this move. We are not going to be able to contend with the current team, and we are not able to acquire enough talent to add to them, so the only alternative is to move on and get assets.

This trade would be more than we can reasonably expect to get for Pierce and KG at this stage in their careers.

For those people who think we deserve more return for Pierce or KG, what would you honestly be willing to give up to get Manu Ginobili next season after watching him play in the playoffs this year?

correct again.
PP shot..what? 30% in the playoffs?  and looked all around old.

you guys are kidding yourselves if anyone is salivating at a chance to get PP as a started. If he goes anywhere else, I can guarantee him coming off the bench.

[CoachBo]

Jordan and Bledsoe are hardly "assets," as overused as that term is around here to try to validate the stiffs Ainge accumulated prior to the Garnett and Allen deals - West, Gerald Green, etc.

Pitino would be proud of this deal - throwing your arms up and giving up, swapping Hall of Famers for a bag of Donald Sterling's trash.

"Best we can hope to get?" Absurd.

No Blake Griffin? No deal. I'll wait for Pierce and Garnett to retire and take the cap room, before I'll take two vastly limited pieces of flotsam from Los Angeles.

[danglertx]

Ainge will be hated by many celtics fans if this goes down, but as he did when he took over the team during the Jim Obrien era, he is not afraid of making the tough decisions for the benefit of the future of the team.

I can't argue against this move. We are not going to be able to contend with the current team, and we are not able to acquire enough talent to add to them, so the only alternative is to move on and get assets.

This trade would be more than we can reasonably expect to get for Pierce and KG at this stage in their careers.

For those people who think we deserve more return for Pierce or KG, what would you honestly be willing to give up to get Manu Ginobili next season after watching him play in the playoffs this year?

How do you know this team couldn't contend with Rondo and Sully coming back and another year of Green maturing?  If San Antonio beats the Heat, what happens to the Heat?  They are going to have to make changes pretty soon. 

The Knicks aren't getting much better.  The Hawks are headed for a rebuild.  The Pacers might be better but they are going to lose a couple role players.  I'm not sure about the Nets.  The Bulls might be back but who knows.  Next year is far from a sure thing for any team.

The only way I do the deal with LA is if we get Griffin, Jordon, Butler and two firsts.  And I call it off if we go anywhere near Vinny Del Negro as coach.

[danglertx]

Jordan and Bledsoe are hardly "assets," as overused as that term is around here to try to validate the stiffs Ainge accumulated prior to the Garnett and Allen deals - West, Gerald Green, etc.

Pitino would be proud of this deal - throwing your arms up and giving up, swapping Hall of Famers for a bag of Donald Sterling's trash.

"Best we can hope to get?" Absurd.

No Blake Griffin? No deal. I'll wait for Pierce and Garnett to retire and take the cap room, before I'll take two vastly limited pieces of flotsam from Los Angeles.

Yes! Yes! Yes!  Exactly what I think. 

The group of scrubs we'd be getting couldn't get out of the first round with Chris Paul, a decent supporting cast and Griffin. 

Bledsoe has one year left and isn't a max guy so his value is almost nothing.  Jordon might be more valuable if he were on a one year deal, at least he'd be expiring.  And Butler is nothing but future cap space. 

We'd be monumentally stupid to trade for an overpaid dunker, and two about to be free agents.  Throwing in two late first round picks doesn't help.  Some of those picks are an albatross every year because they come with money you have to guarantee.  Teams draft some foreign guy that they don't have to sign or give those picks aways.  The chances of really hitting on picks 25 and up are maybe 10 to 20% at best.

[connor]

Jordan and Bledsoe are hardly "assets," as overused as that term is around here to try to validate the stiffs Ainge accumulated prior to the Garnett and Allen deals - West, Gerald Green, etc.

Pitino would be proud of this deal - throwing your arms up and giving up, swapping Hall of Famers for a bag of Donald Sterling's trash.

"Best we can hope to get?" Absurd.

No Blake Griffin? No deal. I'll wait for Pierce and Garnett to retire and take the cap room, before I'll take two vastly limited pieces of flotsam from Los Angeles.

Ok rather than arguing the talent of Jordan and Bledsoe, what about the options we then have of trading those players?

KG most likely will only waive his no-trade clause to go to LAC so thats really the only option we have to move him other than letting him ride out his contract and taking the cap room.

Why not trade for Jordan, Bledsoe and Butler's expiring deal? Then turn around and trade Jordan and Bledsoe for expiring deals and picks.

A team like Orlando would love to have Bledsoe and could send us back Turkoglu's expiring contract and a future first (at a minimum). Then we get 3 first (albeit 2 late firsts) and the same cap room we would get from KG and PP retiring, plus our we get bad enough for a solid 2014 lottery pick. 

I'd rather take that route than another first round exit and the same amount of cap room without the picks and another late teens selection of our own.

These guys give us OPTIONS. With KG you can either run it back or trade him to LAC.

[Evantime34]

Jordan and Bledsoe are hardly "assets," as overused as that term is around here to try to validate the stiffs Ainge accumulated prior to the Garnett and Allen deals - West, Gerald Green, etc.

Pitino would be proud of this deal - throwing your arms up and giving up, swapping Hall of Famers for a bag of Donald Sterling's trash.

"Best we can hope to get?" Absurd.

No Blake Griffin? No deal. I'll wait for Pierce and Garnett to retire and take the cap room, before I'll take two vastly limited pieces of flotsam from Los Angeles.

This does remind me of a Clippers deal. When we traded the Suns Joe Johnson and a first round pick for Tony Delk and Rodney Rodgers.

Except in this case we would be the one getting the young talent. Pitino's problem was trading away players and draft picks to try to win now without any superstars.

This deal is more than we are going to get from anyone else. I really like both of their games athletic with a ton of upside.

[rondohondo]

To me it makes more sense to trade Bass and Lee instead of PP so we can clear long term salary . For a favor of taking on Bass and Terry or Lee , the C's then waive PP so he can join Doc and KG in LA

Bos sends: KG, Doc, Bass, Lee
Lac sends: Jordan, Bledsoe, Butler(expiring)1st rnd pick or 2.

C's would be clearing about 10 mil in long term salary by sending Lee and Bass and getting back Butler's expiring

Who's with me ?

[celticpride07]

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=mplkf2n

pipe dream that works is the clippers take our bad contracts and we waive pierce and he goes to clippers as well

griffin
butler
bledsoe
jordan

for

doc rivers
garnett
terry
bass
lee

waived pierce

[Neurotic Guy]

remember the KG trade: Al Jefferson, Gerald Green, Sebastian Telfair, Ryan Gomes, Theo Ratliff and 2 firsts netted us Kevin Garnett (at the time a top 10 player in the NBA).

(incidentally, with the 2 picks, the T-wolves received Wayne Ellington and Jonny Flynn -- the Wolves got nothing of substance for KG other than Jefferson)

I bring this up because we should compare the assetts the C's would have if the rumored trade(s) with the Clips happens.

C's would have:
Rondo, Jeff Green, Bass, Lee, JET, Bradley, Bledsoe, Jordan, Melo, Sully, Wilcox, Crawford their own picks plus 2 more.   Compare this with the crap (other than Al) they sent to land KG. 

It's ALL about assetts and luck once the rebuild begins. 

Roughly, the short-term plan could be lottery pick in 2014, then use assetts to make a run at a star.  In the meantime, hope that Jordan, Bledsoe, Green, Sully and Bradley keep improving their value.

I like the kickstart on the rebuild a lot. 

 

[connor]

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=mplkf2n

pipe dream that works is the clippers take our bad contracts and we waive pierce and he goes to clippers as well

griffin
butler
bledsoe
jordan

for

doc rivers
garnett
terry
bass
lee

waived pierce

People need to stop talking about Blake Griffin because there is no chance of that happening. Its a waste of breath (and I will be the first to admit I'm wholly wrong and kiss Danny Ainge's feet if it does happen).

As for sending Bass, Terry and Lee, I like the idea of making them take on Garnett and Terry for Jordan, Bledsoe and Butler. Then trading Pierce to a team for an expiring contract and a pick. That team would have to agree to waive Pierce so that he can sign with LAC.

I think Lee and Bass are actually trade-able. Lee underperformed and Bass came on strong at the end.

Ideally I'd like to send Lee to Memphis for their trade exception and turn around and send that trade exception to Houston (along with either a 2nd rounder or one of LAC's firsts) for Thomas Robinson. Grizzlies fans seem interested:
http://boards.grizzliesonline.com/index.php?showtopic=15964&st=0

[Celtics4ever]

Jordan and Bledsoe are hardly "assets," as overused as that term is around here to try to validate the stiffs Ainge accumulated prior to the Garnett and Allen deals - West, Gerald Green, etc.

I think they are better players than Gerald Greene and West.   Get real.  You want to tell me Telfair, Gomes, West and rookie Jeff Green are better than Bledsoe and Jordan.  I certainly feel bad for the players you coach, CoachBo. 

Ainge will be hated by many celtics fans if this goes down

Not like they love him now even though he brought rebirth to Boston basketball and a championship.   There are people who will hate him if he doesn't get something for them either.   When you try to please people as a GM , your a fool,   we all have seen local guys like Chris Herren, signed here that didn't pan out.   Pick a plan and go with it, a bad plan is better than none.

Some of us have lived outside of the big three era.   I remember clearly how bad it suck when the real big three were gone.   We were horrible for years.   I still stayed with the team.   But loses Parish, McHale and Bird and getting nothing for them was brutal.

[boscel33]

I guess if we get Jordan, we can finally not have to draft a big.   

[TripleOT]

If Jordan doesn't work out next season, he'll be an $11m expiring deal next summer.  Despite the horrific FY shooting, he has value as an athletic rim defender.  This past season, he actually showed a post move, a little hook shot.  80% of his almost 500 shots last season were dunks or layups.

13% of his shots were the little jump hook, which he converted 57% of the time.  He has some upside as a post scorer, although if he doesn't improve his FT shooting, will never see the floor in crunch time. On a non-contender, I expect his numbers to bump up as he gets more than the 6 FGA he gets a game with the Clips.  FWIW, he lead the league in FG% this past season.