Martin and Birdman

[CelticG1]

I think you guys are kidding youselves.

An overweight blatche is still better than Bass and Wilcox or at least better than the Chinese crop.

Same with Birdman and Martin. Its more about how bad our guys especially wilcox is than how good the others are.

Plus the whole "keeping the younger guy" thing is a little old. These are rentals. We rarely keep these younger guys we aqcuire just like we rarely keep the veteran rentals.

Your kidding yourself if you think white and Shav will be with us next year unless a. They blow up in the playoffs or b. We end up being a lottery team next year.

Shav had rebounded okay in limited minutes and fouls at an incredible rate. Hes also a pretty terrible defender. I mean him and White haven't played much so its hard to judge but I think its incredibly obvious how much better the other guys would be.

I highly dount during the season if these four guys were up for grabs that people would think that Shav and Dj are the better players?

I mean they aren't even that young. Shav is 29 haha

Shav has played very well in the minutes he's been given.  He's rebounded well and defended well, showed hustle, and toughness, all the things we've been looking for from a big off the bench.  The fact that he came over from China and nobody has heard his name mentioned in about three years automatically makes people think he was a terrible pick up.  So far, he has shown otherwise.

DJ White has looked fairly solid in his limited minutes, as well. 

I'm happy to have those guys.  Chris Andersen and Kenyon Martin are spilt milk as far as I'm concerned.

Yeah if your being extremely optimistic that's a fair point. If you are being realistic I think every gm, player and fan would have picked the other guys.

ESPECIALLY if you are talking about in hindsight. Knowing what we know and have seen now I can't see how you can still stick with your guys.

Doc pretty much admitted it being a mistake.

Jajuan Johnson played well in limited min last year too. Are you gonna try and convince me he would be a better pick up than martin and Birdman as welll?

Could you post a link to Doc's quote about signing Randolph and White over Martin and Andersen being a mistake?

Every GM except Danny Ainge (even though twenty-eight other teams' GMs passed on both) would have picked the other guys. 

Finally, yes, I'd rather have Jajuan Johnson than either Chris Andersen or Kenyon Martin.

Haha the last sentence is amazing!

I was talking about in hindsight. In hindsight it is clear that thwy made a mistake and I'm sure in hindsight everyone in the league would agree.

Here's the article

http://m.espn.go.com/general/blogs/blogpost?blogname=bostonceltics&id=4703576&city=boston

"By the time we got around to it, he was gone"

Sounds to me like a missed opportunity. Of course Doc isn't going to lament too much or say DJ and Shav suck! I want Martin! But to me its pretty clear as day that Martin and Birdman were better choices (and probably several others as well)

[Celtics18]

I think you guys are kidding youselves.

An overweight blatche is still better than Bass and Wilcox or at least better than the Chinese crop.

Same with Birdman and Martin. Its more about how bad our guys especially wilcox is than how good the others are.

Plus the whole "keeping the younger guy" thing is a little old. These are rentals. We rarely keep these younger guys we aqcuire just like we rarely keep the veteran rentals.

Your kidding yourself if you think white and Shav will be with us next year unless a. They blow up in the playoffs or b. We end up being a lottery team next year.

Shav had rebounded okay in limited minutes and fouls at an incredible rate. Hes also a pretty terrible defender. I mean him and White haven't played much so its hard to judge but I think its incredibly obvious how much better the other guys would be.

I highly dount during the season if these four guys were up for grabs that people would think that Shav and Dj are the better players?

I mean they aren't even that young. Shav is 29 haha

Shav has played very well in the minutes he's been given.  He's rebounded well and defended well, showed hustle, and toughness, all the things we've been looking for from a big off the bench.  The fact that he came over from China and nobody has heard his name mentioned in about three years automatically makes people think he was a terrible pick up.  So far, he has shown otherwise.

DJ White has looked fairly solid in his limited minutes, as well. 

I'm happy to have those guys.  Chris Andersen and Kenyon Martin are spilt milk as far as I'm concerned.

Yeah if your being extremely optimistic that's a fair point. If you are being realistic I think every gm, player and fan would have picked the other guys.

ESPECIALLY if you are talking about in hindsight. Knowing what we know and have seen now I can't see how you can still stick with your guys.

Doc pretty much admitted it being a mistake.

Jajuan Johnson played well in limited min last year too. Are you gonna try and convince me he would be a better pick up than martin and Birdman as welll?

Could you post a link to Doc's quote about signing Randolph and White over Martin and Andersen being a mistake?

Every GM except Danny Ainge (even though twenty-eight other teams' GMs passed on both) would have picked the other guys. 

Finally, yes, I'd rather have Jajuan Johnson than either Chris Andersen or Kenyon Martin.

Haha the last sentence is amazing!

I was talking about in hindsight. In hindsight it is clear that thwy made a mistake and I'm sure in hindsight everyone in the league would agree.

Here's the article

http://m.espn.go.com/general/blogs/blogpost?blogname=bostonceltics&id=4703576&city=boston

"By the time we got around to it, he was gone"

Sounds to me like a missed opportunity. Of course Doc isn't going to lament too much or say DJ and Shav suck! I want Martin! But to me its pretty clear as day that Martin and Birdman were better choices (and probably several others as well)

It's way too early for hindsight.  Martin's playing well for the Knicks with every other big on the team hurt.  Good for him.  Andersen's been okay for the Heat.  And, Shav Randolph's been making a positive contribution for us.  I don't get all the boo-hooing about it. 

Let me ask you this:  Do you really believe that if we have Kenyon Martin and Chris Andersen on our roster instead of Shavlik Randolph and DJ White that we are closer to banner 18 than we are right now? 

I'll answer my own question:  I don't. 

[LooseCannon]

Same with Birdman and Martin. Its more about how bad our guys especially wilcox is than how good the others are.

I'd be willing to get on board with the idea that bringing back Wilcox was probably the worst transaction that Ainge made last summer.

[CelticsFan9]

I know there was a report that Martin said he'd play for anyone, but I don't think it's far-fetched to say that maybe Martin and Anderson just didn't want to come here.

[CelticD]

I think you guys are kidding youselves.

An overweight blatche is still better than Bass and Wilcox or at least better than the Chinese crop.

Same with Birdman and Martin. Its more about how bad our guys especially wilcox is than how good the others are.

Plus the whole "keeping the younger guy" thing is a little old. These are rentals. We rarely keep these younger guys we aqcuire just like we rarely keep the veteran rentals.

Your kidding yourself if you think white and Shav will be with us next year unless a. They blow up in the playoffs or b. We end up being a lottery team next year.

Shav had rebounded okay in limited minutes and fouls at an incredible rate. Hes also a pretty terrible defender. I mean him and White haven't played much so its hard to judge but I think its incredibly obvious how much better the other guys would be.

I highly dount during the season if these four guys were up for grabs that people would think that Shav and Dj are the better players?

I mean they aren't even that young. Shav is 29 haha

i agree wit the part about blatche, but flip the script.

who's to say martin and anderson are gonna outperform shavlik and white if they had the same opportunities? if martin played 6.1 minutes like white does and birdman played 12.8 minutes like randolph does, then i think the situation changes. k mart and birdman are being given the opportunity to show wat they can do. they're gettin the minutes. randolph and white are not gettin consistent minutes like k mart and bird are.

now mind u, im not sayin that randolph and white are better than k mart and birdman, im jus sayin it's noy fair to pass judgment since white and randolph aren't really given a chance.

[Celtics18]

I think you guys are kidding youselves.

An overweight blatche is still better than Bass and Wilcox or at least better than the Chinese crop.

Same with Birdman and Martin. Its more about how bad our guys especially wilcox is than how good the others are.

Plus the whole "keeping the younger guy" thing is a little old. These are rentals. We rarely keep these younger guys we aqcuire just like we rarely keep the veteran rentals.

Your kidding yourself if you think white and Shav will be with us next year unless a. They blow up in the playoffs or b. We end up being a lottery team next year.

Shav had rebounded okay in limited minutes and fouls at an incredible rate. Hes also a pretty terrible defender. I mean him and White haven't played much so its hard to judge but I think its incredibly obvious how much better the other guys would be.

I highly dount during the season if these four guys were up for grabs that people would think that Shav and Dj are the better players?

I mean they aren't even that young. Shav is 29 haha

i agree wit the part about blatche, but flip the script.

who's to say martin and anderson are gonna outperform shavlik and white if they had the same opportunities? if martin played 6.1 minutes like white does and birdman played 12.8 minutes like randolph does, then i think the situation changes. k mart and birdman are being given the opportunity to show wat they can do. they're gettin the minutes. randolph and white are not gettin consistent minutes like k mart and bird are.

now mind u, im not sayin that randolph and white are better than k mart and birdman, im jus sayin it's noy fair to pass judgment since white and randolph aren't really given a chance.

Birdman is playing 13.6 minutes per contest and not producing as well as Shav Randolph. 

[CelticG1]

I know there was a report that Martin said he'd play for anyone, but I don't think it's far-fetched to say that maybe Martin and Anderson just didn't want to come here.

Just google Kenyon Martin on celtics or something lile that.

He said celtics were very close to signing him and in the 11th hour but didn't pull the trigger. I believe its in a jackie mac article where she kinda makes fun of the celtics for signing Keyon Dooling for more money as a Coaching mentor or sonething, which is even more hilarious as he has bailed on the team at this point

[CelticG1]

I think you guys are kidding youselves.

An overweight blatche is still better than Bass and Wilcox or at least better than the Chinese crop.

Same with Birdman and Martin. Its more about how bad our guys especially wilcox is than how good the others are.

Plus the whole "keeping the younger guy" thing is a little old. These are rentals. We rarely keep these younger guys we aqcuire just like we rarely keep the veteran rentals.

Your kidding yourself if you think white and Shav will be with us next year unless a. They blow up in the playoffs or b. We end up being a lottery team next year.

Shav had rebounded okay in limited minutes and fouls at an incredible rate. Hes also a pretty terrible defender. I mean him and White haven't played much so its hard to judge but I think its incredibly obvious how much better the other guys would be.

I highly dount during the season if these four guys were up for grabs that people would think that Shav and Dj are the better players?

I mean they aren't even that young. Shav is 29 haha

Shav has played very well in the minutes he's been given.  He's rebounded well and defended well, showed hustle, and toughness, all the things we've been looking for from a big off the bench.  The fact that he came over from China and nobody has heard his name mentioned in about three years automatically makes people think he was a terrible pick up.  So far, he has shown otherwise.

DJ White has looked fairly solid in his limited minutes, as well. 

I'm happy to have those guys.  Chris Andersen and Kenyon Martin are spilt milk as far as I'm concerned.

Yeah if your being extremely optimistic that's a fair point. If you are being realistic I think every gm, player and fan would have picked the other guys.

ESPECIALLY if you are talking about in hindsight. Knowing what we know and have seen now I can't see how you can still stick with your guys.

Doc pretty much admitted it being a mistake.

Jajuan Johnson played well in limited min last year too. Are you gonna try and convince me he would be a better pick up than martin and Birdman as welll?

Could you post a link to Doc's quote about signing Randolph and White over Martin and Andersen being a mistake?

Every GM except Danny Ainge (even though twenty-eight other teams' GMs passed on both) would have picked the other guys. 

Finally, yes, I'd rather have Jajuan Johnson than either Chris Andersen or Kenyon Martin.

Haha the last sentence is amazing!

I was talking about in hindsight. In hindsight it is clear that thwy made a mistake and I'm sure in hindsight everyone in the league would agree.

Here's the article

http://m.espn.go.com/general/blogs/blogpost?blogname=bostonceltics&id=4703576&city=boston

"By the time we got around to it, he was gone"

Sounds to me like a missed opportunity. Of course Doc isn't going to lament too much or say DJ and Shav suck! I want Martin! But to me its pretty clear as day that Martin and Birdman were better choices (and probably several others as well)

It's way too early for hindsight.  Martin's playing well for the Knicks with every other big on the team hurt.  Good for him.  Andersen's been okay for the Heat.  And, Shav Randolph's been making a positive contribution for us.  I don't get all the boo-hooing about it. 

Let me ask you this:  Do you really believe that if we have Kenyon Martin and Chris Andersen on our roster instead of Shavlik Randolph and DJ White that we are closer to banner 18 than we are right now? 

I'll answer my own question:  I don't.

Well yes I think we would certainly have been better off with Martin and Birdman. You honestly don't? I mean if we are talking championships maybe just forfeit this season cause odds are against us.

You think Shav and Dj bring us closer to banner 18? I at least think Martin and Birdman could help in a playoff series. It would also take away a rotation player on each of those teams.

The celtics over there last 10 games are 3-7 while the knicks virtually one big man have been 9-1 over the last 10.

Seriously its like shooting fish in a barrell.

Only arguments I can hop on board with is the who cares we are going to lose anyway one.

Its just funny because I would take martin and birdman over wilcox and maybe even bass at this point as well. Thats how horrific those 2 have been this year

[CelticD]

I think you guys are kidding youselves.

An overweight blatche is still better than Bass and Wilcox or at least better than the Chinese crop.

Same with Birdman and Martin. Its more about how bad our guys especially wilcox is than how good the others are.

Plus the whole "keeping the younger guy" thing is a little old. These are rentals. We rarely keep these younger guys we aqcuire just like we rarely keep the veteran rentals.

Your kidding yourself if you think white and Shav will be with us next year unless a. They blow up in the playoffs or b. We end up being a lottery team next year.

Shav had rebounded okay in limited minutes and fouls at an incredible rate. Hes also a pretty terrible defender. I mean him and White haven't played much so its hard to judge but I think its incredibly obvious how much better the other guys would be.

I highly dount during the season if these four guys were up for grabs that people would think that Shav and Dj are the better players?

I mean they aren't even that young. Shav is 29 haha

i agree wit the part about blatche, but flip the script.

who's to say martin and anderson are gonna outperform shavlik and white if they had the same opportunities? if martin played 6.1 minutes like white does and birdman played 12.8 minutes like randolph does, then i think the situation changes. k mart and birdman are being given the opportunity to show wat they can do. they're gettin the minutes. randolph and white are not gettin consistent minutes like k mart and bird are.

now mind u, im not sayin that randolph and white are better than k mart and birdman, im jus sayin it's noy fair to pass judgment since white and randolph aren't really given a chance.

Birdman is playing 13.6 minutes per contest and not producing as well as Shav Randolph.

my point is, birdman was wit the heat since january 23rd. the heat have played in 35 games since then. birdman has seen the court 33 times. out of those 33 times, birdman has had 30 games wit 10+ minutes. randolph was wit the celtics since march 1st. the celtics have played 17 games since then. randolph has seen the court 9 times. out of those 9 times he's had 5 games wit 10+ minutes.

i was tryin to highlight and explain that birdman gets far more consistent minutes than randolph does. im not tryna decide which one is better.

[Celtics18]

I think you guys are kidding youselves.

An overweight blatche is still better than Bass and Wilcox or at least better than the Chinese crop.

Same with Birdman and Martin. Its more about how bad our guys especially wilcox is than how good the others are.

Plus the whole "keeping the younger guy" thing is a little old. These are rentals. We rarely keep these younger guys we aqcuire just like we rarely keep the veteran rentals.

Your kidding yourself if you think white and Shav will be with us next year unless a. They blow up in the playoffs or b. We end up being a lottery team next year.

Shav had rebounded okay in limited minutes and fouls at an incredible rate. Hes also a pretty terrible defender. I mean him and White haven't played much so its hard to judge but I think its incredibly obvious how much better the other guys would be.

I highly dount during the season if these four guys were up for grabs that people would think that Shav and Dj are the better players?

I mean they aren't even that young. Shav is 29 haha

Shav has played very well in the minutes he's been given.  He's rebounded well and defended well, showed hustle, and toughness, all the things we've been looking for from a big off the bench.  The fact that he came over from China and nobody has heard his name mentioned in about three years automatically makes people think he was a terrible pick up.  So far, he has shown otherwise.

DJ White has looked fairly solid in his limited minutes, as well. 

I'm happy to have those guys.  Chris Andersen and Kenyon Martin are spilt milk as far as I'm concerned.

Yeah if your being extremely optimistic that's a fair point. If you are being realistic I think every gm, player and fan would have picked the other guys.

ESPECIALLY if you are talking about in hindsight. Knowing what we know and have seen now I can't see how you can still stick with your guys.

Doc pretty much admitted it being a mistake.

Jajuan Johnson played well in limited min last year too. Are you gonna try and convince me he would be a better pick up than martin and Birdman as welll?

Could you post a link to Doc's quote about signing Randolph and White over Martin and Andersen being a mistake?

Every GM except Danny Ainge (even though twenty-eight other teams' GMs passed on both) would have picked the other guys. 

Finally, yes, I'd rather have Jajuan Johnson than either Chris Andersen or Kenyon Martin.

Haha the last sentence is amazing!

I was talking about in hindsight. In hindsight it is clear that thwy made a mistake and I'm sure in hindsight everyone in the league would agree.

Here's the article

http://m.espn.go.com/general/blogs/blogpost?blogname=bostonceltics&id=4703576&city=boston

"By the time we got around to it, he was gone"

Sounds to me like a missed opportunity. Of course Doc isn't going to lament too much or say DJ and Shav suck! I want Martin! But to me its pretty clear as day that Martin and Birdman were better choices (and probably several others as well)

It's way too early for hindsight.  Martin's playing well for the Knicks with every other big on the team hurt.  Good for him.  Andersen's been okay for the Heat.  And, Shav Randolph's been making a positive contribution for us.  I don't get all the boo-hooing about it. 

Let me ask you this:  Do you really believe that if we have Kenyon Martin and Chris Andersen on our roster instead of Shavlik Randolph and DJ White that we are closer to banner 18 than we are right now? 

I'll answer my own question:  I don't.

Well yes I think we would certainly have been better off with Martin and Birdman. You honestly don't? I mean if we are talking championships maybe just forfeit this season cause odds are against us.

You think Shav and Dj bring us closer to banner 18? I at least think Martin and Birdman could help in a playoff series. It would also take away a rotation player on each of those teams.

The celtics over there last 10 games are 3-7 while the knicks virtually one big man have been 9-1 over the last 10.

Seriously its like shooting fish in a barrell.

Only arguments I can hop on board with is the who cares we are going to lose anyway one.

Its just funny because I would take martin and birdman over wilcox and maybe even bass at this point as well. Thats how horrific those 2 have been this year

I wasn't making a "who cares we are going to lose anyway" argument.  My argument is that I like the way Shav Randolph has been playing with the minutes he's been given.  He's rebounding at a very high rate, playing good defense, and bringing good energy.  I'm not convinced that Kenyon Martin or Chris Andersen would have been more valuable. 

Using the two teams' respective records over the last ten games is hardly "case closed" type evidence. 

[Celtics18]

I think you guys are kidding youselves.

An overweight blatche is still better than Bass and Wilcox or at least better than the Chinese crop.

Same with Birdman and Martin. Its more about how bad our guys especially wilcox is than how good the others are.

Plus the whole "keeping the younger guy" thing is a little old. These are rentals. We rarely keep these younger guys we aqcuire just like we rarely keep the veteran rentals.

Your kidding yourself if you think white and Shav will be with us next year unless a. They blow up in the playoffs or b. We end up being a lottery team next year.

Shav had rebounded okay in limited minutes and fouls at an incredible rate. Hes also a pretty terrible defender. I mean him and White haven't played much so its hard to judge but I think its incredibly obvious how much better the other guys would be.

I highly dount during the season if these four guys were up for grabs that people would think that Shav and Dj are the better players?

I mean they aren't even that young. Shav is 29 haha

i agree wit the part about blatche, but flip the script.

who's to say martin and anderson are gonna outperform shavlik and white if they had the same opportunities? if martin played 6.1 minutes like white does and birdman played 12.8 minutes like randolph does, then i think the situation changes. k mart and birdman are being given the opportunity to show wat they can do. they're gettin the minutes. randolph and white are not gettin consistent minutes like k mart and bird are.

now mind u, im not sayin that randolph and white are better than k mart and birdman, im jus sayin it's noy fair to pass judgment since white and randolph aren't really given a chance.

Birdman is playing 13.6 minutes per contest and not producing as well as Shav Randolph.

my point is, birdman was wit the heat since january 23rd. the heat have played in 35 games since then. birdman has seen the court 33 times. out of those 33 times, birdman has had 30 games wit 10+ minutes. randolph was wit the celtics since march 1st. the celtics have played 17 games since then. randolph has seen the court 9 times. out of those 9 times he's had 5 games wit 10+ minutes.

i was tryin to highlight and explain that birdman gets far more consistent minutes than randolph does. im not tryna decide which one is better.

My point is that Shav's being given more of a chance than many seem to be recognizing.  And, he's been productive in those minutes. 

[CelticD]

I think you guys are kidding youselves.

An overweight blatche is still better than Bass and Wilcox or at least better than the Chinese crop.

Same with Birdman and Martin. Its more about how bad our guys especially wilcox is than how good the others are.

Plus the whole "keeping the younger guy" thing is a little old. These are rentals. We rarely keep these younger guys we aqcuire just like we rarely keep the veteran rentals.

Your kidding yourself if you think white and Shav will be with us next year unless a. They blow up in the playoffs or b. We end up being a lottery team next year.

Shav had rebounded okay in limited minutes and fouls at an incredible rate. Hes also a pretty terrible defender. I mean him and White haven't played much so its hard to judge but I think its incredibly obvious how much better the other guys would be.

I highly dount during the season if these four guys were up for grabs that people would think that Shav and Dj are the better players?

I mean they aren't even that young. Shav is 29 haha

i agree wit the part about blatche, but flip the script.

who's to say martin and anderson are gonna outperform shavlik and white if they had the same opportunities? if martin played 6.1 minutes like white does and birdman played 12.8 minutes like randolph does, then i think the situation changes. k mart and birdman are being given the opportunity to show wat they can do. they're gettin the minutes. randolph and white are not gettin consistent minutes like k mart and bird are.

now mind u, im not sayin that randolph and white are better than k mart and birdman, im jus sayin it's noy fair to pass judgment since white and randolph aren't really given a chance.

Birdman is playing 13.6 minutes per contest and not producing as well as Shav Randolph.

my point is, birdman was wit the heat since january 23rd. the heat have played in 35 games since then. birdman has seen the court 33 times. out of those 33 times, birdman has had 30 games wit 10+ minutes. randolph was wit the celtics since march 1st. the celtics have played 17 games since then. randolph has seen the court 9 times. out of those 9 times he's had 5 games wit 10+ minutes.

i was tryin to highlight and explain that birdman gets far more consistent minutes than randolph does. im not tryna decide which one is better.

My point is that Shav's being given more of a chance than many seem to be recognizing.  And, he's been productive in those minutes.

i know randolph is being given more of chance but thats not the point. my point isnt to say that randolph isnt productive, im simply sayin that it isnt fair to put birdman over randolph or randolph over birdman, because randolph has not had consistent minutes as opposed to birdman. as opposed to  and than means im comparing them. im not saying anything about randolph as an individual, im not sayin he is or isnt productive, im just comparing him to birdman.

if i didnt make my point any clearer then i apologize my for my whack explanation skillz, my spellin, and my grammar.

[Celtics18]

I think you guys are kidding youselves.

An overweight blatche is still better than Bass and Wilcox or at least better than the Chinese crop.

Same with Birdman and Martin. Its more about how bad our guys especially wilcox is than how good the others are.

Plus the whole "keeping the younger guy" thing is a little old. These are rentals. We rarely keep these younger guys we aqcuire just like we rarely keep the veteran rentals.

Your kidding yourself if you think white and Shav will be with us next year unless a. They blow up in the playoffs or b. We end up being a lottery team next year.

Shav had rebounded okay in limited minutes and fouls at an incredible rate. Hes also a pretty terrible defender. I mean him and White haven't played much so its hard to judge but I think its incredibly obvious how much better the other guys would be.

I highly dount during the season if these four guys were up for grabs that people would think that Shav and Dj are the better players?

I mean they aren't even that young. Shav is 29 haha

i agree wit the part about blatche, but flip the script.

who's to say martin and anderson are gonna outperform shavlik and white if they had the same opportunities? if martin played 6.1 minutes like white does and birdman played 12.8 minutes like randolph does, then i think the situation changes. k mart and birdman are being given the opportunity to show wat they can do. they're gettin the minutes. randolph and white are not gettin consistent minutes like k mart and bird are.

now mind u, im not sayin that randolph and white are better than k mart and birdman, im jus sayin it's noy fair to pass judgment since white and randolph aren't really given a chance.

Birdman is playing 13.6 minutes per contest and not producing as well as Shav Randolph.

my point is, birdman was wit the heat since january 23rd. the heat have played in 35 games since then. birdman has seen the court 33 times. out of those 33 times, birdman has had 30 games wit 10+ minutes. randolph was wit the celtics since march 1st. the celtics have played 17 games since then. randolph has seen the court 9 times. out of those 9 times he's had 5 games wit 10+ minutes.

i was tryin to highlight and explain that birdman gets far more consistent minutes than randolph does. im not tryna decide which one is better.

My point is that Shav's being given more of a chance than many seem to be recognizing.  And, he's been productive in those minutes.

i know randolph is being given more of chance but thats not the point. my point isnt to say that randolph isnt productive, im simply sayin that it isnt fair to put birdman over randolph or randolph over birdman, because randolph has not had consistent minutes as opposed to birdman. as opposed to  and than means im comparing them. im not saying anything about randolph as an individual, im not sayin he is or isnt productive, im just comparing him to birdman.

if i didnt make my point any clearer then i apologize my for my whack explanation skillz, my spellin, and my grammar.

I guess I misunderstood you.  I'm not quite sure I understand you even now, but I'll let it go. 

[ScoobyDoo]

I was going to write a New Topic on this subject this morning but you did the work for me...  TP, good post.

I've never been a big "fan" of the personalities of either the "Birdman" or Kenyon Martin.

However -

If I were the Celtics GM  looking at the big man market this season and my goal was to win an NBA championship, I would have absolutely, 100%, without question, signed both the Birdman and Kenyon martin ASAP, ASAP, ASAP.

Why?

1. A lineup with KG, Birdman and martin would be one of the most aggressive, antagonistic group of big men in the league. Not many people would oook forward to heading down the lane - and I think the three of them would've fed off each other's intensity very well.

2. Birdman would have been a good fit next to KG and in our system. The two of them are long together and could have been fairly dynamic defensively.

3. Martin and Birdman are both veterans who have played in big games and they both also bring a very physical edge in the paint, something I'd very much like to have seen KG get some help with.

KG / Birdman / Wilcox
Bass / Martin / Green
Pierce / Green
Lee / Jet / Crawford
Bradley / Jet / Williams

That is one helluva "motley crew" if I ever saw one, but not one that I would like to play against very much at all.   

I believe that the addition of Martin and Birdman, even with our losses of Rondo and Sully would have been enough to get us out of the east.

Why?

1. I like my defensive match ups of Pierce and Green on James
2. I like my defensive match ups of Lee and Bradley on Wade

3. I then think that the combo of KG, Birdman and Martin, could really beat up on Miami's front line.

I'm not saying I don't like Randolph, he's played some nice ball and I wish Doc had given him some run with KG before KG went down, but he's never played in big games in the NBA in the playoffs - so he's more unproven.

I also think that while I'm "Ok" with DJ and Shavlik, these guys are replaceable. I would have gone with the vets if I was focused on trying to get a ring.

Had Sully not gone down, I may have hedged on martin - But Birdman was always a no brainer to me, like him or not...

Sometimes you have to take the best available - even with the warts.
     

[bobbyv]

I still don't understand why we didn't sign them. They both should have been signed months ago. Now we might be stuck with Wilcox and Shav as our primary rotation bigs in the playoffs