2013 Patriots Football

[birdwatcher]

At 4-1 in a weak division, we're more than likely headed to the playoffs. We're a third of the way into the season, so there's plenty of time to assess the strengths of the talent we have and work our offense around them. The defense is playing outstanding, and barring anymore key injuries, I expect them to only get better. Gronk won't be an instant fix, but he will finally give us an option over the middle, and give us some much needed blocking. The running game is fine, albeit a bit thin depth wise with the injuries. Yesterday we just stopped running. To think this team won't be there in the end to contend for a Super Bowl makes me wonder where people's heads are at. In the end, defense truly does win championships. We've had the most prolific offense the league has ever seen and we haven't won since we had one of the strongest defenses of all time. Go figure.

[KGs Knee]

Tom's missed far more throws than usual.

Not to take this quote out of context, but a few of my buddies who are Pats fans have said the same thing.  His throws look weak and wobbly at times.

I wonder if his frustration level is affecting his play.  He hasn't been bad from what little I've seen, but what I have seen hasn't been great either.

[kozlodoev]

Oh yeah, and Brady hasn't exactly been great this season, either.  He's been pretty good, but far from elite.  The receiver and TE situation hasn't helped him out, but other quarterbacks have made more out of less on other teams. A team with an elite quarterback should never have such an anemic offense, regardless of who is playing at receiver and TE.

"Pretty good"? He's been god-awful. He's consistently missing open receivers, missing throws, patting the ball and generally playing un-Brady-like.

Sure, he can get a free pass for a couple of games because of the new receiving corps, but overall it is increasingly looking like it's a QB problem and Brady has to figure it out.

[kozlodoev]

Tom's missed far more throws than usual.

Not to take this quote out of context, but a few of my buddies who are Pats fans have said the same thing.  His throws look weak and wobbly at times.

I wonder if his frustration level is affecting his play.  He hasn't been bad from what little I've seen, but what I have seen hasn't been great either.

It is true that he's had an uncharacteristic amount of less then precise throws.

What worries me considerably more is that he's been a total buzzkill on offence more than once by missing wide open guys. At least twice yesterday he missed wide open receivers for plays that would have kept drives going.

[Fafnir]

Tom's missed far more throws than usual.

Not to take this quote out of context, but a few of my buddies who are Pats fans have said the same thing.  His throws look weak and wobbly at times.

I wonder if his frustration level is affecting his play.  He hasn't been bad from what little I've seen, but what I have seen hasn't been great either.

It is true that he's had an uncharacteristic amount of less then precise throws.

What worries me considerably more is that he's been a total buzzkill on offence more than once by missing wide open guys. At least twice yesterday he missed wide open receivers for plays that would have kept drives going.

No confidence in his receivers or line would be my guess.

As a Bears fan I can tell you how badly that can screw with a QB even on plays that are "clean" you can see it.

[kozlodoev]

Tom's missed far more throws than usual.

Not to take this quote out of context, but a few of my buddies who are Pats fans have said the same thing.  His throws look weak and wobbly at times.

I wonder if his frustration level is affecting his play.  He hasn't been bad from what little I've seen, but what I have seen hasn't been great either.

It is true that he's had an uncharacteristic amount of less then precise throws.

What worries me considerably more is that he's been a total buzzkill on offence more than once by missing wide open guys. At least twice yesterday he missed wide open receivers for plays that would have kept drives going.

No confidence in his receivers or line would be my guess.

As a Bears fan I can tell you how badly that can screw with a QB even on plays that are "clean" you can see it.

Brady has done more with less before - he was just that good. That's why I'm worried.

[Fafnir]

Tom's missed far more throws than usual.

Not to take this quote out of context, but a few of my buddies who are Pats fans have said the same thing.  His throws look weak and wobbly at times.

I wonder if his frustration level is affecting his play.  He hasn't been bad from what little I've seen, but what I have seen hasn't been great either.

It is true that he's had an uncharacteristic amount of less then precise throws.

What worries me considerably more is that he's been a total buzzkill on offence more than once by missing wide open guys. At least twice yesterday he missed wide open receivers for plays that would have kept drives going.

No confidence in his receivers or line would be my guess.

As a Bears fan I can tell you how badly that can screw with a QB even on plays that are "clean" you can see it.

Brady has done more with less before - he was just that good. That's why I'm worried.

He's always had guys he trusted to run the system though even when the talent was equally poor and make the right blitz reads. I also think this line is probably among the worst he's had to deal with too.

[kozlodoev]

He's always had guys he trusted to run the system though even when the talent was equally poor and make the right blitz reads. I also think this line is probably among the worst he's had to deal with too.

I know the line played pretty poorly yesterday, but overall they've been good in pass protection for the season. Brady has had an eternity to make throws on most nights.

[Cman]

Bottom line, the Patriots look like a mediocre team right now, and while I expect that to improve somewhat, I don't think the fundamental issues are going to be solved this year.  What you see is what you get.  Another year, another team not good enough to help Brady get over the championship drought.

Well, we've got a long ways to go before the end of the season.

But I don't get the whole "help Brady" thing. He's a member of this team like everyone else, and he's had his fair share of mistakes, just like everyone else.

What drives me nuts (and PhoSita , not saying you're saying this), is when people argue that the Pats have failed bc they haven't surrounded Brady with enough weapons, as if all the team has to do is sign a big name FA wide receiver and all problems are solved. Exhibit A would be the $60M that Miami invested in Mike Wallace, who has been... underwhelming.

EDIT: Oh, and the other thing that drives me nuts: "All you got to do with Brady is get physical with him, it throws him off his game"
HUH?!!?? This is perhaps the most generic argument that applies to: Every. Single. Quarter. Back. Its not rocket science. You sack the QB enough and he can't make plays. But, in general, its hard to do because of the OL.

[Roy H.]

What drives me nuts (and PhoSita , not saying you're saying this), is when people argue that the Pats have failed bc they haven't surrounded Brady with enough weapons, as if all the team has to do is sign a big name FA wide receiver and all problems are solved. Exhibit A would be the $60M that Miami invested in Mike Wallace, who has been... underwhelming.

In general, I think it's a bad idea to refuse to bring back your QB's favorite target, especially when the guy is willing to sign for a bargain contract.  I've heard a lot of fans say that Wes Welker wouldn't help the offense, and I think that that's crazy talk.

[Chris]

What drives me nuts (and PhoSita , not saying you're saying this), is when people argue that the Pats have failed bc they haven't surrounded Brady with enough weapons, as if all the team has to do is sign a big name FA wide receiver and all problems are solved. Exhibit A would be the $60M that Miami invested in Mike Wallace, who has been... underwhelming.

In general, I think it's a bad idea to refuse to bring back your QB's favorite target, especially when the guy is willing to sign for a bargain contract.  I've heard a lot of fans say that Wes Welker wouldn't help the offense, and I think that that's crazy talk.

While I agree with this, WAS Welker willing to sign for a bargain?  Maybe he would have a year earlier, before being franchised...and I will get on board with it being a mistake not to lock him up then.  But, I get the distinct impression that this past year, he was in a Ray Allen type situation.  Meaning, there was bad blood there, and he was going to have to get OVERPAID to return to the Pats.  Just because he signed a below-market value contract with Denver does not mean he would have with the Pats.

Anyways, I also have a hard time blaming the Pats too much for this, because even with his erratic behavior, I don't think they counted on the guy they had pegged to replace a lot of the shorter receptions (Hernandez) to be encarcerated, nor did they expect their top reciever (Gronk) to still be out.  Not to mention Vereen was going to be a big part of the passing game as well, taking over for Woodhead.

If you had Gronk, Hernandez, Amendola, and Edelman as your top 4 guys, with Vereen out of the backfield, you would be OK working the rookies in.

With all of that said, yesterday was not about the recievers.  Yesterday was about the trenches, where the Pats got KILLED.  So many missed assignments by linemen absolutely killed Brady, and took away any chance of a rhythm early.  Knocking Brady around has always been the key to making him ineffective, and the bungles got him on his back foot from the first play of the game.  The issue wasn't with the recievers, it was that Brady stopped stepping into throws, because he was getting wrecked. 

[kozlodoev]

What drives me nuts (and PhoSita , not saying you're saying this), is when people argue that the Pats have failed bc they haven't surrounded Brady with enough weapons, as if all the team has to do is sign a big name FA wide receiver and all problems are solved. Exhibit A would be the $60M that Miami invested in Mike Wallace, who has been... underwhelming.

In general, I think it's a bad idea to refuse to bring back your QB's favorite target, especially when the guy is willing to sign for a bargain contract.  I've heard a lot of fans say that Wes Welker wouldn't help the offense, and I think that that's crazy talk.

It will surely _help_ but the question is how much. Ultimately, what would help even more is Brady throwing the ball like he's capable of throwing the ball.

[Cman]

With all of that said, yesterday was not about the recievers.  Yesterday was about the trenches, where the Pats got KILLED.  So many missed assignments by linemen absolutely killed Brady, and took away any chance of a rhythm early.  Knocking Brady around has always been the key to making him ineffective, and the bungles got him on his back foot from the first play of the game.  The issue wasn't with the recievers, it was that Brady stopped stepping into throws, because he was getting wrecked.

No question. The rookies have actually been coming along quite nicely.

The O-Line was uncharacteristically bad yesterday -- in general I think they are one of the top O-Lines in the NFL.

And the defense has been great for the Pats this year, especially relative to the past few years.

But I guess the Pats shouldn't have spent all that money on Talib, and instead have spent it on... Mike Wallace.
(sorry, that's just a not too subtle jab at talking heads on radio, who don't understand that the Pats can't bring in the expensive WR FAs while also fielding a complete team....).

[Cman]

What drives me nuts (and PhoSita , not saying you're saying this), is when people argue that the Pats have failed bc they haven't surrounded Brady with enough weapons, as if all the team has to do is sign a big name FA wide receiver and all problems are solved. Exhibit A would be the $60M that Miami invested in Mike Wallace, who has been... underwhelming.

In general, I think it's a bad idea to refuse to bring back your QB's favorite target, especially when the guy is willing to sign for a bargain contract.  I've heard a lot of fans say that Wes Welker wouldn't help the offense, and I think that that's crazy talk.

I'm in agreement with you.

It would be great to have Welker back with the Pats, playing on the contract that he's got in Denver.
We can go back and forth all day until we are blue in the face about whether Welker would have done that or not for the Pats (I think not, but whatever).

Let me throw a different question out there for you folks to ponder: is Josh McDaniels to blame?
He comes back in the fold and the Pats lose to the Giants. Pats offense is stymied at times last year (think back to that game against Baltimore), and is stymied at times this year. How much do we blame receivers/OLine/Brady/BB, and how much do we blame McDaniels? I haven't see his name come up a lot, but can't say I'm overwhelmed with what he's done...

[Roy H.]

While I agree with this, WAS Welker willing to sign for a bargain?  Maybe he would have a year earlier, before being franchised...and I will get on board with it being a mistake not to lock him up then.  But, I get the distinct impression that this past year, he was in a Ray Allen type situation.  Meaning, there was bad blood there, and he was going to have to get OVERPAID to return to the Pats.  Just because he signed a below-market value contract with Denver does not mean he would have with the Pats.

We can go back and forth all day until we are blue in the face about whether Welker would have done that or not for the Pats (I think not, but whatever).

I'm basing my opinion on reports that Welker gave the Pats a chance to match, but they declined to do so.