2012 - CB Draft: "How's My Team Look?"

[jgod213]

Any thoughts on the Blizz?

Billups
Johnson
---
Millsap
Howard

I think i have what it takes to take the northwest from Who's Jazz assuming i'm able to round out a rotation properly.

Definitely a solid core to build around assuming Chauncey comes back relatively healthy.  Millsap and Howard is impressive though.

Yeah it looks like the real life Clips expect a meaningful contribution from him this season. 

JJ's ballhandling ability should be able to mitigate his exposure while he eases his way back into shape & a rhythm.  Plus he won't be expected to carry a heavy scoring burden at any point.  To me it seems like an ideal situation for a player in his shoes.

[indeedproceed]

The funny thing is that in past drafts, some here have raved on Boozer, lol...I guess it depends on who has him, right?

Personally I hate that kind of rational. "Someone doesn't like my players, must be because of a personal thing."

Come on. Did you see Boozer's playoffs? 42% shooting (terrible) 4 turnovers (terrible), his defense was terrible, Taj Gibson outplayed him!

The regular season? Worst since his rookie year. He's gotten worse by small steps since 2008.

Now, if you think people rated him differently last year, fine. That's likely because he was a year younger, and it was his first season in Chicago, and he didn't play for the first 20 games of it at that. There is usually an acclimation period.

But Boozer was healthy all year, and still posted a near career low in rebound rate (his lowest in 7 years at that), and was even pulled at the end of some games for his defense.

I don't mean to come off as mean or anything here, but the notion that, "I guess people don't like my guys, probably cuz they don't like me as much as other guys" is garbage, and its against the game in the first class.

If we indulge in that, eventually every time people disagree, they're say it was because of some personal crap instead of the fact that maybe people think different things about players.

[RebusRankin]

Different Players are more highly or lowly regarded on this board then they might be in other places. Part of the game.

[indeedproceed]

Here are my Power Rankings after 5 Rounds. They're not official in any way or sort. They're not a consensus, or voted on or anything. Its just how I see the teams sorting out after 5 rounds, and I tried to give some explanation, and my thoughts on each team. Just me.

If your team isn't listed, its cuz you didn't post it in the team rosters thread.

http://forums.celticsblog.com/index.php?topic=59297.0

1) Portland Trailblazers
-Guards:    Chauncey Billups, Joe Johnson
Forwards: Paul Millsap
Centers:   Dwight Howard

Seriously? Billups-Johnson-Millsap-Howard? I mean yeah, Billups will likely be a borderline liability on defense, and little more than a sometimes post-up option and spot shooter, but the criticism pretty much stops there. Joe Johnson covers for any kind of ‘pure point’ issues you have with Chauncey Billups. Paul Millsap is a versatile floor-spacing PF to cover to any ‘crowding issues’, and Dwight Howard is the best center in basketball. Although, he was recently described as a ‘mental midget’.

2) Dallas Mavericks
LeBron’s the best player in the world. Lowry is a very good point guard, plays both ways, and plays hard. Elton Brand has re-modeled himself as a very capable defender and 3rd or 3th option on offense. Andersen Varejao is a tough defender, and what he lacks in athleticism or skill, he makes up for with grit and motor. Ben Gordon I don’t really feel one way or the other about. Well, I mean, I feel like he’s a 7th player on a very good team. They’ve got picks galore Monday so whatever I write now is likely meaningless.

3) LA Lakers
Guards: Jrue Holiday, Tony Allen
Forwards: Rudy Gay, LaMarcus Aldridge
Centers: Al Horford

Hyper-athletic, big, quick, elite defense. These are the words I ponder when thinking about the Lakers. StartOrien compared them to the actual Grizzlies from 2011, and they resemble the Griz but don’t mirror them. They’re more athletic in the frontcourt, a little less skilled. A wash in terms of overall quality (when you factor in the years Z-Bo and Gasol had towards the end). They keep it original with Rudy Gay and Tony Allen, and then brought on Jrue Holiday. Holiday isn’t the ideal replacement for Conley (and its not really fair to think of him like that), and that’s because he’s not really much of a passer. Among starting point guards, only Kyrie Irving, Brandon Jennings, Russell Westbrook, and Brandon Knight have lower assist ratios, which wouldn’t be such a big deal if he was a more versatile scorer, but he’s not. He’s defensively very good, and a decent shooter, but his passing is a concern considering the other guys in the lineup.

4) Boston Celtics
Guards: TBD
Forwards: Kevin Durant, Ersan Ilyasova, Anthony Randolph
Centers: Andrew Bynum

Great 1-2 punch of Durant/Bynum. In all likelihood the best 1-2 punch of the draft. Everything else, I’m not crazy about. Ilyasova brings a lot to the table as a starter, but he brings some negatives as well. Just looking at his basic stats, he looks like a lights out 3pt shooter from the 4, and a terrific rebounder. Couple that with his reputation as an active player on both sides of the ball, and it’s a no-brainer; pair him with a low-post scorer, call it a day. But Illy’s 3pt numbers are so good because he got just white-hot after the all-star break, and speaking as an Ilyasova fan, that’s worrying. Ilyasova’s talent has never been the question, its been consistency. Plus, Illy isn’t a great P&R partner for Durant, not a bad one, but not elite, which is what you’d like to see here. Neither Bynum or Ilyasova has a reliable mid-range shot, and that limits the offense considerably in my opinion. At the end of the day though, the biggest issue facing this team is that they’re going to have to put together two starters after the 5th round. A lot of teams can get by with just one, but two is going to be tough.

5) Atlanta Hawks
Guards: George Hill, Kobe
Forwards: David West
C: Duncan

Kobe-Duncan-West is a great core. Its not Kobe-Gasol-Bynum, but while I don’t think its ‘as good’ I don’t think its too much worse either, and its constructed in a way that I think favors Kobe even more. Duncan is a better passer than Gasol, and both Dunan and West are on par with Gasol as jump shooters. While I don’t think either one matches Bynum as a ‘dump-down’ option, I’d put Duncan right there with Gasol. George Hill is a great addition too, as he can actually defend and shoot, as well as play as a point guard. It’s a team assembled around Kobe, and done well. Gonna be slim pickins for a SF, but as long as he can shoot the 3 and defend, it should be okay.

6) Detroit Pistons
Guards: Chris Paul, Wes Matthews
Forwards: Danny Granger
Centers: Nene

Chris Paul is a freakin magic-man. He’s the best point guard in the league. He’s a elite scorer, elite passer, elite defender, and elite leader. I was praying he’d fall to me at 1.5, and was disappointed when I learned he wouldn’t. After that though, the team lacks players I’d call elite. Nene is a good player, Wes Matthews is a good player, Danny Granger, I’m mixed on. Now, there is another factor to consider here, and that’s the known fact that Chris Paul makes players better. If any of these guys played on a team with Chris Paul for a season, their stock would rise. Open looks, getting the ball in the most advantageous position possible to get a good look, even if it isn’t wide open. The role players all have very defined roles as well; Nene is the defender and post operator, Matthews is a shooter and defender, Granger is a 2nd option scorer, as he should be. Good potential here, but I do wish there was a bit more of a ‘wow’ factor in a role next to Chris Paul.

7) Indiana Pacers
Guards: Rondo, Avery Bradley
Forwards: Batum, Scola
Centers: Monroe

Rondo made a believer out of me this post-season. Not that he’s a top-5 point guard, I already knew that. He made me believe that he’s a top-20 player, on his own, with or without the Big 3. That alone frames this team, because it, as opposed to the Celtics which still revolve mostly around KG and Pierce, is built around Rondo. High-level defense, good shooters, tough post players. Rondo-Monroe is a great 1-2 punch to start, and should be a dominating 1-2 punch when Monroe really comes into his own in a year or so. Avery Bradley and Batum are both guys who could (should) be lockdown defenders for years, and should be both 15 ppg guys with Rondo giving them the looks. Scola is likely headed for a slow decline, but it’ll be slow and he’s played slow and tough, and I think nobody will really notice for a couple of years anyways. Very strong team.

Utah Jazz
Guards: Deron Williams, Gordon Hayward
Forwards: Zach Randolph, Danilo Gallinari, Andrei Kirilenko
Centers: (none)

Very athletic, offensively very dangerous. Hinges on a couple of risky plays in Z-Bo and Kirilenko, but they’re not really outrageous bets. Gallinari’s shooting is the only real issue I have, seemed to fall off a bit last year from range, and unless he’s hitting 38% from 3, I feel like he’s just an average guy getting 10 shots.

9) Phoenix Suns
Guards: Steve Nash, DeMar DeRozan
Forwards: Kevin Love, Tayshaun Prince
Centers: Joakim Noah

Really like this team. Nash-Love-Noah fits together very well, and I don’t think Tayshaun Prince is a bad addition either. Really not in love with DeMar DeRozan there. But, that aside the team should be a killer in transition, and pretty decent in the half-court as well. Steve Nash hasn’t has as good a P&R option as Kevin Love since healthy Amare Stoudemire.

10) NYK
Guards-Ricky Rubio and Courtney Lee
Fowards- Carmelo Anthony,Serge Ibaka,and Andrea Bargs
Center- Kendrick Perkins

Rubio isn’t healthy yet, and might not be until well into next season. Carmelo Anthony is still Carmelo Anthony, a confirmed coach killer, and ultimate player-diva, who isn’t nearly as efficient as his skill-level says he should be as a scorer. Serge Ibaka is still a work in progress who puts up great stat lines but ultimately isn’t a great team-defender. Perkins is still a tough-nosed sonofabiscuit, who isn’t a good anchor defensively and is very limited offensively. Bargnani is still a very gifted offensive player and a very flawed player at the same time. There are a lot of problems with this team.
But oh, man, if it works. If Rubio gets healthy and gets the room to do what he does without someone getting in the way. If Melo finally buys in and learns to only put a part of the team on his back every night (instead of the whole thing) and passes smarter, D’s up harder, and takes smarter shots, if Bargnani shows that in a smaller role he can be a ‘bigger’ impact player, and if Perkins returns to his pre-injury form, while Ibaka gets that 15 foot jump shot just a little more consistent…

Team could be really good, or ordinary. Won’t be bad.

11) Houston Rockets
Guards: Russell Westbrook, Iman Shumpert
Forwards: Paul George, Jonas Valanciunas
Center: Marcin Gortat

I but Westbrook as a ‘superduperstar’, and I buy Marcic Gortat as a 13-10 guy on a very good team. I buy Paul George as a great prospect and good player now, and Iman Shumpert as a tenacious defender if not much else. But I don’t buy Jonas Valanciunas as a power forward, or as a starting center on a contending team, and I don’t get his selection or inclusion here at all. For that matter, I don’t really get Shumpert’s either. Why Shumpert, when there were so many other viable options at the SG, he’s gonna be out like half of next season. Not the team I expected to see fielded, and have to think there is a larger game here.

12) New Orleans Hornets

Guards: Tony Parker, Ray Allen
Forwards: David Lee, Shane Battier
Centers: Tyson Chandler

David Lee is like my own personal Shia Lebouf. Internet: “Hey man, they’re making another Indiana Jones movie, and its going to have Harrison Ford and Karen Allen in it, and awesome other actors like Ray Winstone, and John Hurt” Me: “That sounds awesome! Tell me more, I love all of those things!” Internet: “Plus, Shia Lebouf is going to be like Indiana Jones’s understudy or something, like a passing of the torch” Me: “Meh. I’ll wait for DVD.”

That’s how I feel about David Lee. As to the actual team, Tony Parker and Tyson Chandler are obviously beasts, and Shane Battier is a personal favorite, but I don’t think Ray Allen could guard any other shooting guard other than…well like anyone, anymore. On top of that, David Lee.  On paper there is a top of talent and production here, but I really don’t like the way it all fits together. I don’t hate it, I’m assuming they’ll make the playoffs, but if David Lee was replaced by like Paul Millsap or something, I’d be higher on this squad.

13) Oklahoma City Thunder
Guards: Monta Ellis
Forwards: Kawhi Leonard, Blake Griffin
Centers: Marc Gasol

I like Gasol, Griffin, and Leonard well enough. Actually Gasol and Griffin I like more than well enough, I like them a ton. Playing next to Gasol, a versatile offensive center and gifted passer, Griffin should be a lot better, because his runway gets larger. Kawhi Leonard is a good option as a tough defender and spot shooter from the 3, and he’s a really good rebounder for the position, and can play some time at the 4. Monta Ellis should also provide crazy scoring, and he should have all the picks his mind can handle.

14) Denver Nuggets
Guards: Mike Conley, OJ Mayo
Forwards: Carlos Boozer, Trevor Ariza
Centers: KG

Mike Conley is the point guard this league has forgotten about. He’s actually pretty darn good. He’s not elite, but he is a legitimate starter, and within the top 15 of the league. We all know about Kevin Garnett, so no need to dwell on him. But after Conley and KG, this team has a few questions. One, Boozer’s play has been pretty below expectations in Chicago, and you have to think ‘bouncing back’ is not an option at this point. He’s been getting worse since 2008. Trevor Ariza, after his fantastic half a year in LA, has never been the guy he’s supposed to be, although I guess he’s a serviceable starter. OJ Mayo has much the same concern, without the actual prior success to back it up.

15) Miami
Gaurds: Brandon Jennings, JET
Forwards: Josh Smith, Kris Humphries
Centers: Al Jefferson

I like Al Jefferson’s growth this past year, and finally became the best player on a playoff team. I hated his playoffs though. Hated them. He just wilted under Tim Duncan. I liked Josh Smith’s growth this year too, and while maybe I’m in the minority but I think his maturity issues are mostly gone. His shot selection isn’t great, but last year it kinda had to be, and I think he could be reined in. I really think Kris Humphries shouldn’t be a starter on a good team, cuz I think he’s not really a good player. Brandon Jennings had a good year last year, and JET is the Jet. I’m not big on either player (sacrilege in JET’s case, I know), but I think I should be a lot more impressed by Brandon Jennings than I am. He’s never been a very good ‘pure point’ player, but he had his best scoring season by a long shot, both in terms of volume and efficiency. His assists and turnover mostly stayed put, but they weren’t ever that great in the first place. But even picking at that, I feel like I am ‘looking’ for reasons to hate on Jennings rather than looking for reasons to endorse him at this point. 

16) Orlando Magic
Guards: Marcus Thorton, Gerald Henderson, Jeff Teague
Forwards: Amar'e Stoudemire, Luol Deng
Centers: JaVale McGee

This team revolves around Amar’e Stoudemire, and honestly I wonder just how much revolving will be done. His injuries seem to be adding up, and his contract was uninsurable for a reason. I like the back-court of Teague and Henderson, with Thorton coming off the bench, and honestly I’m getting to be more of a fan of JaVale McGee’s crazy persona. In the playoffs he looked downright dangerous at times, and he ought to bring a lot of energy to the starting 5. Luol Deng is Luol Deng, a above average starter, sometimes elite defender, and jack-of-all trades offensive weapon. Basically the new Tayshaun Prince.

17) Cleveland Cavs
Cleveland Cavs: Yoki_IsTheName
Guards:    Kyrie Irving, Brandon Rush
Forwards:  Thaddeus Young, Michael Kidd-Gilchrist, Harrison Barnes
Centers:   Andrew Bogut

Superduperstar in the making, check. Tough-nosed absurdly versatile defender who has been repeatedly compared to Scottie Pippen, check. Versatile scorer with sweet, sweet shooting stroke, check. Mix in a elite (when healthy) rebounder and elite defender at center just entering his prime and a useful combo-forward to keep the fast breaks burning up the court, you got a stew cooking. I don’t think this is a playoff team this year but like the Wolves last year, it will be ‘cant miss tv this season’, and a playoff thread next season. After that…

18) San Antonio Spurs
Guards: James Harden, John Wall
Forwards: Taj Gibson
Centers: Brook Lopez

Love James Harden, I think the Finals are going to leave a bad taste in people’s mouths, but I wouldn’t worry about it at all long-term. Love Taj Gibson, he, along with Kenneth Faried and Thad Young, is pretty much the reason people have been quoting this exchange: “What is he, a power forward? A small forward? A tweener?” “No, HE’S A BASKETBALL PLAYER!”

Not wild about Brook Lopez or John Wall though, I think Wall had a better sophomore season than people realize, but there is just so much room for improvement. Brook Lopez, man I don’t even know about that guy. Doesn’t like rebounds. Can’t stay on the court. Has an affinity for Disney Movies that should be endearing to the modern NBA nerd-base, but somehow isn’t.

[ronaldo943]

indeed proceed where would you rank the wizarrds?

[indeedproceed]

indeed proceed where would you rank the wizarrds?

Somewhere between 13-16.

[ronaldo943]

indeed proceed where would you rank the wizarrds?

Somewhere between 13-16.

and 16 teams make the playoffs right?

[Gomesfan]

Stunned at where you rank knicks??? Rubio will be healthy before start of camp and cant link multiple articles that say he is not only schedule but ahead of schedule!!

[RebusRankin]

Detroit will take 6th for now.

[Roy H.]

The funny thing is that in past drafts, some here have raved on Boozer, lol...I guess it depends on who has him, right?

Trust me, having Boozer hasn't been quite so rosy as you make it out to be.  There's always been a lot of skepticism about him, and that's before he had arguably his second worst season as a pro.

[Celtic Fan Forever]

Ouch.. Last IP??

You do realize Doc is coaching this team right?

[Who]

Chris Paul is a freakin magic-man. He’s the best point guard in the league. He’s a elite scorer, elite passer, elite defender, and elite leader. I was praying he’d fall to me at 1.5, and was disappointed when I learned he wouldn’t.

You would have preferred CP3 over D-Wade?

[Lucky17]

I think this is an opportune time to remind people that the Coaches round is ongoing throughout the weekend.

Also, commissioner WDleehi and everyone who's helped with constructive criticism, trade announcements, and keeping the boards up to date (IP, Roy, Who, Gainesville Celtic, The Walker Wiggle, etc.) should be receiving your TPs. Please give.

[jgod213]

Awesome contribution IP. Very well done. And im not just saying that because of where you place the Blazers...

Ok, yeah I am.

but really my only quibble is I think im a bit more of a fan of SAS than you.

[indeedproceed]

Chris Paul is a freakin magic-man. He’s the best point guard in the league. He’s a elite scorer, elite passer, elite defender, and elite leader. I was praying he’d fall to me at 1.5, and was disappointed when I learned he wouldn’t.

You would have preferred CP3 over D-Wade?

Yes, absolutely