knicks fans reactions on lin leaving and having an incompetent owner

[Chris]

I have a feeling Knicks fans will be changing their tune (or at least should be) soon.  

Lin caught lightning in a bottle.  He came into a perfect situation, where he was in the perfect system, where the stars were hurt, and they needed him to step up, and where he was having an incredible hotstreak.  

That led to an incredible 15 minutes of fame, and like some of the great entertainers who died at the height of their greatness, when he got injured, the flaws in his game had not yet been properly exposed, and everyone only remembers the good times.

I have a feeling once he gets settled in Houston, and the 15 minutes is up when he can't live up to the insane hype that was built on an unprecedented hot streak in a perfect situation, he is just going to be another overpaid backup PG, who no one wants.  

Define overpaid.  MSG's market cap jumped $71 million during his run and dropped $50 million yesterday alone after his departure was announced.

How can a guy who provides enormous return on investment be overpaid from a financial standpoint?  You really think the Knicks won't make back his contract on his marketability alone?  It is impossible to overpay Jeremy Lin.

Overpaid because I think it was his 15 minutes of fame.  I think once the shine wears off the new toy, that marketability will all but disappear.

I think what people are missing is that he wasn't marketable just because he was Chinese American, he was marketable because he was Chinese American, and he was leading the Knicks on an unprecedented run.  

However, before he got injured, the wheels had already slowed down, and now that D'Antoni is gone, and the league has a book on him, I have a feeling he will really fall back to earth.  And at that point, I don't see him being much more marketable than any other mediocre backup PG.  

He was a fad.  And the Knicks got out before it crashed.

[Snakehead]

I will say this, I think there's at least a shot Knicks fans are vindicated and that Lin proves to be a one hit wonder, or at least not nearly as good as he was for his midseason stretch last season.  

For instance, he averaged 21 and 8 for the month of February and then 14 and 6 for the month of March.  

Could it be the rookie wall?  Sure.  But that's an awful quick wall after one month of good play.  And that's not to say he might not have a good career, but he also might simply be a middle of the pack starting PG and not ever be anything truly special.

Still, the Knicks took a terrible PR blow here and will likely lose marketing dollars.  

Even a middle of the pack playmaking PG is a much needed piece to help this squad contend.

I wouldn't blame other teams for passing on such huge tax penalties, but the Knicks have paid similar amounts before and already have foolishly burned their Amnesty to get Chandler when they already had Amar'e.

I'm not saying it's a great move by the Knicks.  I'm just saying that it might not be the franchise-haunting move that ESPN and other media outlets seem to make it out to be.  

I think there's probably a better chance that Lin ends up being a guy who puts up 15 and 6-7 for his career than a guy who puts up 20 and 10.  That's nothing to scoff at, it's still good.  But it's not something that they can't recover from.  It's also not something that Raymond Felton hasn't done before.  

I think the bigger regret they'll probably have it from a marketing standpoint with New York's large Asian American population.  

I cosign this.  I do think from a business perspective it is a mistake from everything I've heard but I don't like Lin's fit with their roster and I don't expect him to make some sort of leap.

Fit within the roster?  Since when do the Knicks care about that?  They didn't when they traded half their team to pair one volume scorer (amare) with another (melo).  They didn't when they added JR Smith and kept him.  They didn't when they got Felton who is a PG who cant hit an open 3.  Why care about that now with Jeremy Lin?

.... so they should keep making mistakes?

I'm fine with scorers at other positions but you need a PG that can distribute if you are going that route.

Felton had a bad year on Portland, no doubt.  However, he 28 and here are his numbers with the Knicks the year before:

17 pts, 42% FG, 33% 3pt FG, 3.6 rb, 9 assists


That's a better fit than Lin to me.  He doesn't need to dominate the ball like Lin does and he can distrubute better.  He is a good pick and roll PG and that's what they need to make Amare effective.

[jyyzzoel]

Love how the Knicks fans just drop F words on Dolan.

I still don't understand, I thought they'd match any offer "up to a billion dollars" and when Houston changed the offer all of a sudden they won't?

that 3rd year of the contract KILLED the knicks. i love how it was initially something like 10 mill a year for the 3rd year, and then the rockets found a legal loophole and changed the 3rd year to 15 mill - which was brilliant by the rockets, and really angered the knicks (from what ive read) because it meant they would have to pay a ridiculous amount in luxury tax.

[Chris]

To be fair, Felton got fat during the lockout, when half the league (including some of the C's) got fat, thinking the season would be cancelled.

I think Felton will end up one of the bargains of the summer. 

He stayed fat though.

On a terrible team that quit on their coach worse than any team I have ever seen.  

Believe me, I am not standing up for the guy.  He mailed the season in.  But from a value standpoint, he is a player that I think is in an ideal buy low situation.  Now, he is back where he wanted to be all along, and he should be motivated to revitalize his career.  

I'm not a Woodson fan myself so I have my doubts.

I actually liked the move to get Felton, I just didn't feel like it should have impacted their Lin decision. Given that Kidd is essentially a glorified SG in many aspects and that Lin is definitely more a combo guard than a PG it seemed to still work in my view.

Well, it just comes down to the fact that I don't think Lin is that good a player.  He had a tremendous hot streak, as NBA teams didn't yet have a book on how to defend him, and he was given a green light to do what he wanted.  That wasn't going to hold up.  

[kozlodoev]

Since then Raymond Felton has gotten fat and Amar'e has gotten old, plus he didn't sustain that level of play for long either.

Sure, and Lin is coming off a torn knee ligament. It's probably going to take him half of his new contract to get back to where he was.

He had a meniscus tear which is a far less severe injury than a ligament injury.

True. Still, it's a surgery. You're always rolling the dice when you sign guys like that.

[Change]

Still shocked about the decision. James Dolan was never shy dishing out cash. $10s millions of dollar on coaches he fired, Hundreds of millions of dollars on scrubs. Why stop here? Was it an ego thing?

I think it was.

I think Dolan along with some of the Knicks players didn't like how things went with the Rockets and his contract. (Melo and Smith's comments)

smh at James Dolan. He made it personal instead of looking at it as a business decision. Sounds like a guy who used to play for the Celtics.

[celtsfan84]

I have a feeling Knicks fans will be changing their tune (or at least should be) soon.  

Lin caught lightning in a bottle.  He came into a perfect situation, where he was in the perfect system, where the stars were hurt, and they needed him to step up, and where he was having an incredible hotstreak.  

That led to an incredible 15 minutes of fame, and like some of the great entertainers who died at the height of their greatness, when he got injured, the flaws in his game had not yet been properly exposed, and everyone only remembers the good times.

I have a feeling once he gets settled in Houston, and the 15 minutes is up when he can't live up to the insane hype that was built on an unprecedented hot streak in a perfect situation, he is just going to be another overpaid backup PG, who no one wants.  

Define overpaid.  MSG's market cap jumped $71 million during his run and dropped $50 million yesterday alone after his departure was announced.

How can a guy who provides enormous return on investment be overpaid from a financial standpoint?  You really think the Knicks won't make back his contract on his marketability alone?  It is impossible to overpay Jeremy Lin.

Overpaid because I think it was his 15 minutes of fame.  I think once the shine wears off the new toy, that marketability will all but disappear.

I think what people are missing is that he wasn't marketable just because he was Chinese American, he was marketable because he was Chinese American, and he was leading the Knicks on an unprecedented run.  

However, before he got injured, the wheels had already slowed down, and now that D'Antoni is gone, and the league has a book on him, I have a feeling he will really fall back to earth.  And at that point, I don't see him being much more marketable than any other mediocre backup PG.  

He was a fad.  And the Knicks got out before it crashed.

Yi Jianlian drew some great international TV numbers.  And he never played for the Knicks once.

As long as Lin is better than Yi, he should be fine from a marketing standpoint.  Do you think Yi is better than Lin?

[Fafnir]

17 pts, 42% FG, 33% 3pt FG, 3.6 rb, 9 assists


That's a better fit than Lin to me.  He doesn't need to dominate the ball like Lin does and he can distrubute better.  He is a good pick and roll PG and that's what they need to make Amare effective.

He got those numbers dominating the ball just like Lin did.

During Felton's best stretch of play he never got close to what Lin achieved during his brief stretch. Never manufactured so many quality shot attempts at the rim or otherwise broke down the defense. He just got lots of P&R touches from D'Antoni.

Of course his contract correctly values all of this.

[Chris]

I have a feeling Knicks fans will be changing their tune (or at least should be) soon.  

Lin caught lightning in a bottle.  He came into a perfect situation, where he was in the perfect system, where the stars were hurt, and they needed him to step up, and where he was having an incredible hotstreak.  

That led to an incredible 15 minutes of fame, and like some of the great entertainers who died at the height of their greatness, when he got injured, the flaws in his game had not yet been properly exposed, and everyone only remembers the good times.

I have a feeling once he gets settled in Houston, and the 15 minutes is up when he can't live up to the insane hype that was built on an unprecedented hot streak in a perfect situation, he is just going to be another overpaid backup PG, who no one wants.  

Define overpaid.  MSG's market cap jumped $71 million during his run and dropped $50 million yesterday alone after his departure was announced.

How can a guy who provides enormous return on investment be overpaid from a financial standpoint?  You really think the Knicks won't make back his contract on his marketability alone?  It is impossible to overpay Jeremy Lin.

Overpaid because I think it was his 15 minutes of fame.  I think once the shine wears off the new toy, that marketability will all but disappear.

I think what people are missing is that he wasn't marketable just because he was Chinese American, he was marketable because he was Chinese American, and he was leading the Knicks on an unprecedented run.  

However, before he got injured, the wheels had already slowed down, and now that D'Antoni is gone, and the league has a book on him, I have a feeling he will really fall back to earth.  And at that point, I don't see him being much more marketable than any other mediocre backup PG.  

He was a fad.  And the Knicks got out before it crashed.

Yi Jianlian drew some great international TV numbers.  And he never played for the Knicks once.

As long as Lin is better than Yi, he should be fine from a marketing standpoint.  Do you think Yi is better than Lin?

Yi might be better than Lin when its all said and done.

Also, I am not sure Lin is the international draw that Yi was.  Lin is American.  He is just popular with Chinese Americans.  

[Fafnir]

Since then Raymond Felton has gotten fat and Amar'e has gotten old, plus he didn't sustain that level of play for long either.

Sure, and Lin is coming off a torn knee ligament. It's probably going to take him half of his new contract to get back to where he was.

He had a meniscus tear which is a far less severe injury than a ligament injury.

True. Still, it's a surgery. You're always rolling the dice when you sign guys like that.

Yeah I just think it was worth it.

On a sidenote I think this is the best thing for Lin, better to get away from Melo far far away.

So I'm happy with it, reduces the chances the Knicks could become a spoiler instead of just an also ran (barring Amar'e suddenly becoming good again)

[celtsfan84]

I have a feeling Knicks fans will be changing their tune (or at least should be) soon. 

Lin caught lightning in a bottle.  He came into a perfect situation, where he was in the perfect system, where the stars were hurt, and they needed him to step up, and where he was having an incredible hotstreak. 

That led to an incredible 15 minutes of fame, and like some of the great entertainers who died at the height of their greatness, when he got injured, the flaws in his game had not yet been properly exposed, and everyone only remembers the good times.

I have a feeling once he gets settled in Houston, and the 15 minutes is up when he can't live up to the insane hype that was built on an unprecedented hot streak in a perfect situation, he is just going to be another overpaid backup PG, who no one wants. 

Define overpaid.  MSG's market cap jumped $71 million during his run and dropped $50 million yesterday alone after his departure was announced.

How can a guy who provides enormous return on investment be overpaid from a financial standpoint?  You really think the Knicks won't make back his contract on his marketability alone?  It is impossible to overpay Jeremy Lin.

Overpaid because I think it was his 15 minutes of fame.  I think once the shine wears off the new toy, that marketability will all but disappear.

I think what people are missing is that he wasn't marketable just because he was Chinese American, he was marketable because he was Chinese American, and he was leading the Knicks on an unprecedented run. 

However, before he got injured, the wheels had already slowed down, and now that D'Antoni is gone, and the league has a book on him, I have a feeling he will really fall back to earth.  And at that point, I don't see him being much more marketable than any other mediocre backup PG. 

He was a fad.  And the Knicks got out before it crashed.

Yi Jianlian drew some great international TV numbers.  And he never played for the Knicks once.

As long as Lin is better than Yi, he should be fine from a marketing standpoint.  Do you think Yi is better than Lin?

Yi might be better than Lin when its all said and done.

Also, I am not sure Lin is the international draw that Yi was.  Lin is American.  He is just popular with Chinese Americans. 

Allow me to assure you, since you are not sure.  Lin is wildly popular in China, a country with over a billion people.  They are fine with him being a Chinese man born in America.

[Snakehead]

17 pts, 42% FG, 33% 3pt FG, 3.6 rb, 9 assists


That's a better fit than Lin to me.  He doesn't need to dominate the ball like Lin does and he can distrubute better.  He is a good pick and roll PG and that's what they need to make Amare effective.

He got those numbers dominating the ball just like Lin did.

During Felton's best stretch of play he never got close to what Lin achieved during his brief stretch. Never manufactured so many quality shot attempts at the rim or otherwise broke down the defense. He just got lots of P&R touches from D'Antoni.

Of course his contract correctly values all of this.

I'd love to see usage numbers because I'm not sure he handled the ball like Lin but you could be right.  Makes sense in that offense I suppose.

Regardless, I'd rather have pick and roll being run so I can utitlize Amare in the role he is meant to play than not and have Lin just run at the defense and have Amare stand around.  That makes the whole offense more effective in my mind.

(And also lets emphasize that "brief stretch" please)

[CelticSooner]

I have a feeling Knicks fans will be changing their tune (or at least should be) soon.  

Lin caught lightning in a bottle.  He came into a perfect situation, where he was in the perfect system, where the stars were hurt, and they needed him to step up, and where he was having an incredible hotstreak.  

That led to an incredible 15 minutes of fame, and like some of the great entertainers who died at the height of their greatness, when he got injured, the flaws in his game had not yet been properly exposed, and everyone only remembers the good times.

I have a feeling once he gets settled in Houston, and the 15 minutes is up when he can't live up to the insane hype that was built on an unprecedented hot streak in a perfect situation, he is just going to be another overpaid backup PG, who no one wants.  

I agree with this. The Lin story last season was fun to watch but he's still unproven. Knicks would be shelling out lots of cash for a guy that could be flash in a pan and never leaves the bench.

I'm hoping he lights it up in Houston and NY fans get all depressed though. 

[celtsfan84]

To be fair, Felton got fat during the lockout, when half the league (including some of the C's) got fat, thinking the season would be cancelled.

I think Felton will end up one of the bargains of the summer. 

He stayed fat though.

On a terrible team that quit on their coach worse than any team I have ever seen.  

Believe me, I am not standing up for the guy.  He mailed the season in.  But from a value standpoint, he is a player that I think is in an ideal buy low situation.  Now, he is back where he wanted to be all along, and he should be motivated to revitalize his career.  

I'm not a Woodson fan myself so I have my doubts.

I actually liked the move to get Felton, I just didn't feel like it should have impacted their Lin decision. Given that Kidd is essentially a glorified SG in many aspects and that Lin is definitely more a combo guard than a PG it seemed to still work in my view.

Well, it just comes down to the fact that I don't think Lin is that good a player.  He had a tremendous hot streak, as NBA teams didn't yet have a book on how to defend him, and he was given a green light to do what he wanted.  That wasn't going to hold up.  

The important part to remember is this leaves the Knicks with really no ceiling.  They are obviosuly capped out right now and have no room for improvement.

A 23 year old asset offered them room for improvement or at least trade value for improvement.

Whether you like Lin or not, think he is overpaid or not, think he is worse than Yi or not, you have to admit that letting a 23 year old asset leave for nothing is monumentally stupid.

[kozlodoev]

Since then Raymond Felton has gotten fat and Amar'e has gotten old, plus he didn't sustain that level of play for long either.

Sure, and Lin is coming off a torn knee ligament. It's probably going to take him half of his new contract to get back to where he was.

He had a meniscus tear which is a far less severe injury than a ligament injury.

True. Still, it's a surgery. You're always rolling the dice when you sign guys like that.

Yeah I just think it was worth it.

On a sidenote I think this is the best thing for Lin, better to get away from Melo far far away.

So I'm happy with it, reduces the chances the Knicks could become a spoiler instead of just an also ran (barring Amar'e suddenly becoming good again)

I agree a gamble may be worth it. I am not sure a gamble at this price is. I don't see him having an impact commeasurate with his salary once he starts popping on the scouting reports.