Beasley's Suns Contract Sets the Market Value for Green

[Who]

I say 3 years 20 mil (or 4 yr 25 mil) MAXIMUM or let him walk.

I am not willing to offer him more than $6 million for a single season or $3-4 million on a multi-year deal that lasts 2-3 years.

Not coming off of heart surgery.

So if Falk says to the celtics, "Hey, I've got a really good offer out there for Jeff, but he'll play here for 3 years 18 mil if you say yes" would you let him walk?

Its not a contract that I'm crazy about giving, but considering the "reloading over rebuilding" approach that Danny is taking, along with our limited options to offer productive players any decent money, and the need to give an aging Pierce a solid backup, I would have to give him that contract.  

I think the celts have their hands somewhat tied here after giving Terry the entire MLE and having very limited means to get another productive backup SF.

Yes, I'd let him walk.

I don't trust him to be the same player he was prior to heart surgery.

I don't get why people think Green is going to be a different player post-heart surgery. I mean, its an aortic aneurysm repair - it either works and the issue is fixed, or it doesn't and the patient dies. There's no in between. This isn't an orthopedic issue where your dealing with restoring functionality and range of motion. You have to account for rust from missing a year, but unless Green also had ACL or rotator cuff surgery he will be able to do the same things he did before. The biggest hurdle for him is overcoming the fear aspect - which judging from some of the posts about him it appears he's not the only.

TP.  Having heart surgery doesn't diminish ability to run, jump, or shoot as long as the Celtics doctors clear him.  I trust the Celtics doctors will do their jobs.

I am surprised so many feel that heart surgery isn't a big deal.

Do many athletes come back from this and play at as high level than before? I am asking. I don't know.

They do.  Everything I've read and heard says you are actually fine after this.

It's what Ronny Turiaf had if I'm not mistaken and he's totally fine.

I consider Turiaf a disappointment. I thought he had/has a lot more ability than he has shown in the NBA. He never reached it.

Maybe that has nothing to do with the heart condition. Maybe it does.

Turiaf doesn't set my mind at ease though. 

[Snakehead]

I consider Turiaf a disappointment. I thought he had/has a lot more ability than he has shown in the NBA. He never reached it.

Maybe that has nothing to do with the heart condition. Maybe it does.

Turiaf doesn't set my mind at ease though.  

Fair enough but that has nothing to do with his heart at all though.  That's totally fine.

[Chris]

I actually wonder if Hawes' contract is more of an indication than Beasley (although they both are comparables in a way).

Hawes is a guy who had high hopes early in the season, but because of injuries his stock dropped, and he ended up taking a short-term "prove it" deal.  I think Green will be looking at something similar.

Not because he can't get 3 years/$18 million.  But because he knows that if he takes a short deal, he could be getting MUCH more than that in a year or two.

[RJ87]

I say 3 years 20 mil (or 4 yr 25 mil) MAXIMUM or let him walk.

I am not willing to offer him more than $6 million for a single season or $3-4 million on a multi-year deal that lasts 2-3 years.

Not coming off of heart surgery.

So if Falk says to the celtics, "Hey, I've got a really good offer out there for Jeff, but he'll play here for 3 years 18 mil if you say yes" would you let him walk?

Its not a contract that I'm crazy about giving, but considering the "reloading over rebuilding" approach that Danny is taking, along with our limited options to offer productive players any decent money, and the need to give an aging Pierce a solid backup, I would have to give him that contract. 

I think the celts have their hands somewhat tied here after giving Terry the entire MLE and having very limited means to get another productive backup SF.

Yes, I'd let him walk.

I don't trust him to be the same player he was prior to heart surgery.

I don't get why people think Green is going to be a different player post-heart surgery. I mean, its an aortic aneurysm repair - it either works and the issue is fixed, or it doesn't and the patient dies. There's no in between. This isn't an orthopedic issue where your dealing with restoring functionality and range of motion. You have to account for rust from missing a year, but unless Green also had ACL or rotator cuff surgery he will be able to do the same things he did before. The biggest hurdle for him is overcoming the fear aspect - which judging from some of the posts about him it appears he's not the only.

TP.  Having heart surgery doesn't diminish ability to run, jump, or shoot as long as the Celtics doctors clear him.  I trust the Celtics doctors will do their jobs.

I am surprised so many feel that heart surgery isn't a big deal.

Do many athletes come back from this and play at as high level than before? I am asking. I don't know.

Well, I'm not implying its not a big deal - anytime you deal with the heart its scary. But Green's issue isn't a chronic or progressive condition like HCM or some form of heart disease. It was a singular occurence which has been fixed. There isn't any mechanical or structural issues with his heart. He's not on cardiac medications that will inhibit his ability. There's no reason to assume he won't return to the form he was in prior to the discovery.

EDIT: And Ronny Turiaf has had several knee issues in addition to his heart problem.

[Who]

I expect Jeff Green to come back. I expect him to have a long career. I am confident in that. He is and will be NBA player for a long time and should be a useful rotation player at that.

My concern is whether he can regain his previous level of performance + after doing so, can he continue to push on and fulfill the potential he once has?

[celtsfan84]

I say 3 years 20 mil (or 4 yr 25 mil) MAXIMUM or let him walk.

I am not willing to offer him more than $6 million for a single season or $3-4 million on a multi-year deal that lasts 2-3 years.

Not coming off of heart surgery.

So if Falk says to the celtics, "Hey, I've got a really good offer out there for Jeff, but he'll play here for 3 years 18 mil if you say yes" would you let him walk?

Its not a contract that I'm crazy about giving, but considering the "reloading over rebuilding" approach that Danny is taking, along with our limited options to offer productive players any decent money, and the need to give an aging Pierce a solid backup, I would have to give him that contract.  

I think the celts have their hands somewhat tied here after giving Terry the entire MLE and having very limited means to get another productive backup SF.

Yes, I'd let him walk.

I don't trust him to be the same player he was prior to heart surgery.

I don't get why people think Green is going to be a different player post-heart surgery. I mean, its an aortic aneurysm repair - it either works and the issue is fixed, or it doesn't and the patient dies. There's no in between. This isn't an orthopedic issue where your dealing with restoring functionality and range of motion. You have to account for rust from missing a year, but unless Green also had ACL or rotator cuff surgery he will be able to do the same things he did before. The biggest hurdle for him is overcoming the fear aspect - which judging from some of the posts about him it appears he's not the only.

TP.  Having heart surgery doesn't diminish ability to run, jump, or shoot as long as the Celtics doctors clear him.  I trust the Celtics doctors will do their jobs.

I am surprised so many feel that heart surgery isn't a big deal.

Do many athletes come back from this and play at as high level than before? I am asking. I don't know.

Jeff Green's specific condition is extremely rare.  It would be hard to find many athletes who have even had it.  But surgery is meant to fix it completely.  The Celtics doctors shouldn't clear him to play if he is at risk of dying on the court.

Jeff Green had this condition before.  Now it is fixed.  Why would he be a worse player?  It would make just as much sense that he is a better player, since he no longer has an aortic aneurysm.

Any heart surgery is serious for a person.  Of course.  I am just wondering why you assume it would make him worse at basketball?

[Who]

Any heart surgery is serious for a person.  Of course.  I am just wondering why you assume it would make him worse at basketball?

Heart surgery and being a professional athlete ... the two together worries me.

They need to be at their absolute best physically to fulfill their career. Can Jeff Green be his absolute best? Or will be an 8/10 physically instead of a 10/10? Will the injury effect his mentality on the court? Will he (even more) passive than before? Will he be comfortable pushing his body when he is tired through a long schedule? Through injuries?

It's not that I assume Jeff Green will be worse, it's that I don't know. He may be able to (1) resume his career and not miss a beat, or, (2) he may come back and play at a lower level. There is a risk there. It's not like he was a sure thing (prospect) before the heart-surgery either.

What I am uncomfortable with is the risk/reward of his contract demands. I want a one-year contract or a much lower multi-year deal (than he would've gotten pre-heart surgery) to balance out that increased risk. 

[celtsfan84]

Any heart surgery is serious for a person.  Of course.  I am just wondering why you assume it would make him worse at basketball?

Heart surgery and being a professional athlete ... the two together worries me.

It's not that I assume Jeff Green will be worse, it's that I don't know. He may be able to resume his career and not miss a beat or he may come back and play at a lower level. There is a risk there. It's not like he was a sure thing before the heart-surgery either.

What I am uncomfortable with is the risk/reward of his contract demands. I want a one-year contract or a much lower multi-year deal (than he would've gotten pre-heart surgery) to balance out that increased risk.  

I'm not so sure there is an increased risk.  That is for the Celtics doctors to determine, which I am not.  What if he is better than before with his physical issues now fixed?

I think he should get a fair market deal if he is cleared by the doctors, no deal at all if he isn't cleared by the doctors.  I can see a player not running as fast and not jumping as high after doing significant damage to his knee joints (by age or injury).  Why would a player get worse after heart surgery?  As long as his legs function the same way, he should be fine.

I think KG, Ray Allen, and Jason Terry offer much more significant risk than Jeff Green.

[jgod213]

So what does this Suns lineup look like at this point with Nash gone, Gragic & Beasley in, and potentially Hill following Nash to LA?

PG - Dragic/Marshall/Brooks
SG - Dudley/ Childress
SF - Beasley
PF - Morris/ Warrick
C  - Gortat/Lopez

That is a dicey second unit.  Looks like the suns will continue to be active throughout FA because that lineup is not going to get it done for a full season.

[Who]

So what does this Suns lineup look like at this point with Nash gone, Gragic & Beasley in, and potentially Hill following Nash to LA?

PG - Dragic/Marshall/Brooks
SG - Dudley/ Childress
SF - Beasley
PF - Morris/ Warrick
C  - Gortat/Lopez

That is a dicey second unit.  Looks like the suns will continue to be active throughout FA because that lineup is not going to get it done for a full season.

I really hope they do not use Beasley as a SF. He is a train wreck there.

Especially so in a limited lineup like that.

[RJ87]

Any heart surgery is serious for a person.  Of course.  I am just wondering why you assume it would make him worse at basketball?

Heart surgery and being a professional athlete ... the two together worries me.

They need to be at their absolute best physically to fulfill their career. Can Jeff Green be his absolute best? Or will be an 8/10 physically instead of a 10/10? Will the injury effect his mentality on the court? Will he (even more) passive than before? Will he be comfortable pushing his body when he is tired through a long schedule? Through injuries?

It's not that I assume Jeff Green will be worse, it's that I don't know. He may be able to (1) resume his career and not miss a beat, or, (2) he may come back and play at a lower level. There is a risk there. It's not like he was a sure thing (prospect) before the heart-surgery either.

What I am uncomfortable with is the risk/reward of his contract demands. I want a one-year contract or a much lower multi-year deal (than he would've gotten pre-heart surgery) to balance out that increased risk. 

It seems that you're concern is more of his ability to deal with the mental aspect. Unfortunately, there's no way to predict how Jeff will react - that's the only aspect I wouldn't trust. I 100% believe his heart is fine and there will be no ill effects. You just have to hope he trusts his body, but you can say that for ALL injuries. KG and his knee for example, he may never admit it but I suspect a lot of his limitations during the 09-10 season were just as mental as it was physical. I hope Jeff, being a lot younger, can bounce back quicker.

[wdleehi]

I have been saying that the numbers we have been hearing around here (9 million a season, multi years) was to much for a guy coming off a year off because of a heart issue.



He is definitely a "prove it" player this year.  

[wdleehi]

Any heart surgery is serious for a person.  Of course.  I am just wondering why you assume it would make him worse at basketball?

Heart surgery and being a professional athlete ... the two together worries me.

They need to be at their absolute best physically to fulfill their career. Can Jeff Green be his absolute best? Or will be an 8/10 physically instead of a 10/10? Will the injury effect his mentality on the court? Will he (even more) passive than before? Will he be comfortable pushing his body when he is tired through a long schedule? Through injuries?

It's not that I assume Jeff Green will be worse, it's that I don't know. He may be able to (1) resume his career and not miss a beat, or, (2) he may come back and play at a lower level. There is a risk there. It's not like he was a sure thing (prospect) before the heart-surgery either.

What I am uncomfortable with is the risk/reward of his contract demands. I want a one-year contract or a much lower multi-year deal (than he would've gotten pre-heart surgery) to balance out that increased risk. 

It seems that you're concern is more of his ability to deal with the mental aspect. Unfortunately, there's no way to predict how Jeff will react - that's the only aspect I wouldn't trust. I 100% believe his heart is fine and there will be no ill effects. You just have to hope he trusts his body, but you can say that for ALL injuries. KG and his knee for example, he may never admit it but I suspect a lot of his limitations during the 09-10 season were just as mental as it was physical. I hope Jeff, being a lot younger, can bounce back quicker.

It is things like this that puts him into the "prove it" contact position.


The heart issue, whether or not it can reoccur, is there and will effect his value around the league.

[Fafnir]

So what does this Suns lineup look like at this point with Nash gone, Gragic & Beasley in, and potentially Hill following Nash to LA?

PG - Dragic/Marshall/Brooks
SG - Dudley/ Childress
SF - Beasley
PF - Morris/ Warrick
C  - Gortat/Lopez

That is a dicey second unit.  Looks like the suns will continue to be active throughout FA because that lineup is not going to get it done for a full season.

I really hope they do not use Beasley as a SF. He is a train wreck there.

Especially so in a limited lineup like that.

Better off dropping Warrick from the rotation, use Morris/Beasley as your PFs.

[GeorgeV]

Maybe I am not gonna be popular around here, but I think Green is a far better all around player than beasley.
Also beasley is a KNUCKLEHEAD, and green is a level head guy in wich you can rely.
And a think both have similar level of talent
7 to 8 mill. for me should be ok