Greg Stiemsma's Potential = Perk or Better?

[clover]

I think when comparing the two players, it makes the most sense to look at how good they are now and how good we think they'll be in the future.

When you're comparing potential no it doesn't.

If you're saying which you'd rather have now, which this thread isn't, then your logic makes sense.

Even then there is a big difference in playing 15-20 minutes as a backup and being a starter. Especially given Greg's inability to avoid fouling 7 times per 36 minutes.

Perk has only averaged more than 27 minutes a game once ('08-'09) and that was only 29 minutes. 

[Fafnir]

I think when comparing the two players, it makes the most sense to look at how good they are now and how good we think they'll be in the future.

When you're comparing potential no it doesn't.

If you're saying which you'd rather have now, which this thread isn't, then your logic makes sense.

Even then there is a big difference in playing 15-20 minutes as a backup and being a starter. Especially given Greg's inability to avoid fouling 7 times per 36 minutes.

Perk has only averaged more than 27 minutes a game once ('08-'09) and that was only 29 minutes. 

Yes but he often played more minutes when needed. Greg has only played 27 minutes 3 times this year, and with his foul issues can't be counted on for more than 15 minutes a game on any given night.

[Fafnir]

Plus fouling is not a good play! I know people love to say say, "good play make them earn their points". But often times a better positioned defender is setup to contest so that it isn't a layup.

Factor in getting into the penalty sooner and how shallow we are at the bigs (3 deep ugh)...

[TripleOT]

I'm a big Steamer fan, but on the big stage at MSG against the Knicks, he put up a stat line of 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 and 3 fouls in 10 minutes.

Before he's hailed as a better player than one of the toughest and most battle tested centers int he league, Steamer's going to have to prove he can get things done in big games and pressure situations.   

[clover]

I'm a big Steamer fan, but on the big stage at MSG against the Knicks, he put up a stat line of 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 and 3 fouls in 10 minutes.

Before he's hailed as a better player than one of the toughest and most battle tested centers int he league, Steamer's going to have to prove he can get things done in big games and pressure situations.   

Not his best night, for sure.  But he's already shown on the big stage in LA and in the bright lights of Miami, I don't think it's a question of who can stand the spotlight.

I didn't see the game, but it sounds like the greater defensive lapses by far were out on the perimeter, not inside.  And when Dooling is taking 5 of the bench's 8 total shots, I'm not immediately certain that that is Stiemer's fault.

[Fafnir]

I'm a big Steamer fan, but on the big stage at MSG against the Knicks, he put up a stat line of 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 and 3 fouls in 10 minutes.

Before he's hailed as a better player than one of the toughest and most battle tested centers int he league, Steamer's going to have to prove he can get things done in big games and pressure situations.  

I didn't see the game, but it sounds like the greater defensive lapses by far were out on the perimeter, not inside.

He was just bad last night, fouled and gave up several easy dunks to Chandler due to losing him while watching the ball.

The C's played awful defensively both on the perimeter and in the paint in general.

[BballTim]

I'm a big Steamer fan, but on the big stage at MSG against the Knicks, he put up a stat line of 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 and 3 fouls in 10 minutes.

Before he's hailed as a better player than one of the toughest and most battle tested centers int he league, Steamer's going to have to prove he can get things done in big games and pressure situations.   

  For the record,I'm on the "Perk" side of this debate, but we've had plenty of games that were as big or bigger than that one.

[wdleehi]

Until I see Stiemsma put together a playoff year (or a long stretch) like Perk did in 08-09, I have to vote Perk


14 games, 36.6 minutes.  11.9 points, 11.5 rebounds, 2.6 blocks and .575 FG shooting.

[Fafnir]

Until I see Stiemsma put together a playoff year (or a long stretch) like Perk did in 08-09, I have to vote Perk


14 games, 36.6 minutes.  11.9 points, 11.5 rebounds, 2.6 blocks and .575 FG shooting.

That was Perkins at his most impressive. He knew he couldn't afford to get into foul trouble and for the entire playoffs he managed to avoid it for the most part. This is while extending his minutes greatly beyond what he typically played.

[myteamisbetterthanyours]

Until I see Stiemsma put together a playoff year (or a long stretch) like Perk did in 08-09, I have to vote Perk


14 games, 36.6 minutes.  11.9 points, 11.5 rebounds, 2.6 blocks and .575 FG shooting.

That was Perkins at his most impressive. He knew he couldn't afford to get into foul trouble and for the entire playoffs he managed to avoid it for the most part. This is while extending his minutes greatly beyond what he typically played.

TP.. Perk was huge for us that year..

But you're right, let's see what Greg does in the playoffs.. But I have no doubt in my mind that he'll improve next year and hopefully we'll be able to let Perk's legacy as a champion defensive giant/enforcer rest in peace

[GreenFaith1819]

Until I see Stiemsma put together a playoff year (or a long stretch) like Perk did in 08-09, I have to vote Perk


14 games, 36.6 minutes.  11.9 points, 11.5 rebounds, 2.6 blocks and .575 FG shooting.

Loved his play during that series. He and Rondo carried us. KG was already out, and Powe went down in Game 2, I believe.

[mctyson]

I think when comparing the two players, it makes the most sense to look at how good they are now and how good we think they'll be in the future.

When you're comparing potential no it doesn't.

I interpret the OP's point to be Stiemer's potential and if that is equal to Perk (or better) now.  Not if Stiemer's potential will be equal to Perk's or someone else's best stretch of ball.

This is relevant because Perk was traded last year, and many people flipped because we haven't had a true (reliable) center since.

In other words - does Stiemer in the not-too-distant future represent what C's fans feel we lost in Perk?  Or is he better than that? Or worse?

To answer this very easily, I look at both players now.  Stiemer's advanced metrics support that he is better than Perk right now.  At the very least we can say the Stiemer is 90% of Perk right now.  That is a conservative point of view.  When you take into account that Stiemer is: (a) still a rookie, (b) not practicing due to injury, (c) not completely healthy, (d) not getting the same minutes as Perkins, it is hard not to say that Stiemer is just as good.

So my answer is, Stiemer's potential is at least equal to Perk.

[Evantime34]

In order for Stiemer to fill the Perk void he needs to rebound like Perk did, I think he is a better shot blocker, certainly a better shooter and probably a better finisher inside. Perkins however is much better on ball defender against the elite centers like Dwight and Bynum.

[Fafnir]

If Greg Stiemsma keeps on working hard, stays healthy enough to play (bruised foot and plantar fasciitis, boots considered) in about 2-3 years, can he reach Kendrick Perkins ceiling? Can he be better? His play of the late, although skill-wise not on Perk's level yet, has been making me forget about Perk.

The is the OP. His specific reference is can Greg reach Kendrick's ceiling.

[Fafnir]

In order for Stiemer to fill the Perk void he needs to rebound like Perk did, I think he is a better shot blocker, certainly a better shooter and probably a better finisher inside. Perkins however is much better on ball defender against the elite centers like Dwight and Bynum.

The numbers say they're equal at the rim with Perkins haveing a better overall percentage on "inside" shots.

The question is how many of Perkin's turnovers are when he has an easy dunk and fumbles it compared to Stiemsma's. Neither is all that great at the rim for a big man anyways.