Why did we trade MarShon Brooks for jjj and Moore

[TA9]

Well Etwaun wasnt in the trade for MarShon.
JaJuan may be better than Brooks. Just imagine him playing on a bad team. He could be avg 12-15 points while playing solid D.
Doc WOULDNT have played him. And dont bring the situation with Tony allen, Al Jefferson etc up. Our team sucked in the season 2006-07. He didnt have anything to lose, so why not play em?
Our team is trying to win a championship this year. Thats WHY he doesnt play rookies.

Someone wasn't a Celtics fan before the 2008 season.

Tony Allen and Al Jeferson were rookies two years PRIOR to the 07 season.  You might want to look up the 2005 Celtics - then get back to me.

I actually became a fan in the 2006-7 season...
I know that both was drafted 2004. But it doesnt matter thats not my point.
If you compare both teams, it is very clear that the team back in 05-07 didnt even have a chance to win a Championship, I therefore believe that Doc had no reason NOT to play them. If you look at our roster today, we have a great chance to win it all, thats why he perhaps wont risk losing the entire season due to some rookies

[gar]

Ainge = Worst NBA Trader in 2011

That BBD + Wafer for Bass trade is looking pretty good right now.

In terms of this trade, it was Brooks for JJJ + a 2014 NJ second rounder.  I assume Danny's reasoning in that trade was that he was going to take Johnson anyway, so he may as well pick up the free asset, and pay Johnson a lower slotted salary.

If there's fault in Danny, it would be Danny the talent evaluator, not Danny the trader.  I think we need to see where Johnson ends up before we can make that call, though.

Exactly, is too early to tell. Was excited when Brooks was available; but even more so when I learned about Johnson. Pruitt, Giddens, Bradley - if Danny had taken Brooks we would have all been accusing him of being infatuated with tweener guards.

[MBz]

He would be averaging about 3 minutes a game in garbage time if he was on the celts. You can't judge players that don't play and Doc wouldn't play him if he were on this team.

well that would be the sign of a bad coach than. 

I agree.  I think JuJuan Johnson should be playing at least a couple minutes a night.  You invested a first round pick in him, you need to at least give him the opportunity to see game time so he can develop.  If he was 18-19, I'd understand, but he's 22, the kid needs to play.

where & when is the question
kg and bass should have all the minutes at pf, jermaine 20 minutes a night, still have wilcox and the kid stiemsma has looked good enough to deserve minutes
bass has looked really good and I'm sure doc wants to get kg and jo moving so their minutes will be there

Give him 3 minutes in the first quarter.  He's not going to develop if we don't play him at all.

[birdbrady]

Well Etwaun wasnt in the trade for MarShon.
JaJuan may be better than Brooks. Just imagine him playing on a bad team. He could be avg 12-15 points while playing solid D.
Doc WOULDNT have played him. And dont bring the situation with Tony allen, Al Jefferson etc up. Our team sucked in the season 2006-07. He didnt have anything to lose, so why not play em?
Our team is trying to win a championship this year. Thats WHY he doesnt play rookies.

Someone wasn't a Celtics fan before the 2008 season.

Tony Allen and Al Jeferson were rookies two years PRIOR to the 07 season.  You might want to look up the 2005 Celtics - then get back to me.

I actually became a fan in the 2006-7 season...
I know that both was drafted 2004. But it doesnt matter thats not my point.
If you compare both teams, it is very clear that the team back in 05-07 didnt even have a chance to win a Championship, I therefore believe that Doc had no reason NOT to play them. If you look at our roster today, we have a great chance to win it all, thats why he perhaps wont risk losing the entire season due to some rookies

Sorry, the 2005 team was the third seed in the East and won the division.  Many on this board were talking about a run to the ECF at the time and upsetting Detroit (who eventually went to the Finals and lost in 7.)  Doc was not just gonna "throw the rookies out there and tell them to do their best."  That team was trying to win games.  Doc started Tony Allen for much of that season till he stopped playing well.  Al (a rookie out of high school) started a lot that season, and then when the team traded back for Walker (giving a first round pick up in the process - proof the team was trying to win as much that season) - Al was the first big off the bench.  Then, Delonte West eventually became the starting SG and started the decisive 7th game in Boston.

So in other words - like I said - if the rookies can play, then they will play.  If they can't play well..then they won't play.  Has nothing to do with "Doc just doesn't play the rookies."  Biggest myth in ....history.

[TA9]

Well Etwaun wasnt in the trade for MarShon.
JaJuan may be better than Brooks. Just imagine him playing on a bad team. He could be avg 12-15 points while playing solid D.
Doc WOULDNT have played him. And dont bring the situation with Tony allen, Al Jefferson etc up. Our team sucked in the season 2006-07. He didnt have anything to lose, so why not play em?
Our team is trying to win a championship this year. Thats WHY he doesnt play rookies.

Someone wasn't a Celtics fan before the 2008 season.

Tony Allen and Al Jeferson were rookies two years PRIOR to the 07 season.  You might want to look up the 2005 Celtics - then get back to me.

I actually became a fan in the 2006-7 season...
I know that both was drafted 2004. But it doesnt matter thats not my point.
If you compare both teams, it is very clear that the team back in 05-07 didnt even have a chance to win a Championship, I therefore believe that Doc had no reason NOT to play them. If you look at our roster today, we have a great chance to win it all, thats why he perhaps wont risk losing the entire season due to some rookies

Sorry, the 2005 team was the third seed in the East and won the division.

That was the season 2004-2005.
I was talking about 2005-2006 where we didnt make the Playoffs
I agree that Doc plays talented rookies. But if you look at our draft picks in the year 2005 (Gerald Green, Ryan Gomes, Orien Greene). If we had a chance competing for the Championship that year and we had those rookies on our team.. Gomes would have got playing time no doubt about that, but Green and Greene wouldnt even have touched the floor.
Thats just my theory, but heck why argue bout the past
End of line Doc DOES play talented Rookies.

[birdbrady]

Well Etwaun wasnt in the trade for MarShon.
JaJuan may be better than Brooks. Just imagine him playing on a bad team. He could be avg 12-15 points while playing solid D.
Doc WOULDNT have played him. And dont bring the situation with Tony allen, Al Jefferson etc up. Our team sucked in the season 2006-07. He didnt have anything to lose, so why not play em?
Our team is trying to win a championship this year. Thats WHY he doesnt play rookies.

Someone wasn't a Celtics fan before the 2008 season.

Tony Allen and Al Jeferson were rookies two years PRIOR to the 07 season.  You might want to look up the 2005 Celtics - then get back to me.

I actually became a fan in the 2006-7 season...
I know that both was drafted 2004. But it doesnt matter thats not my point.
If you compare both teams, it is very clear that the team back in 05-07 didnt even have a chance to win a Championship, I therefore believe that Doc had no reason NOT to play them. If you look at our roster today, we have a great chance to win it all, thats why he perhaps wont risk losing the entire season due to some rookies

Sorry, the 2005 team was the third seed in the East and won the division.

That was the season 2004-2005.
I was talking about 2005-2006 where we didnt make the Playoffs
I agree that Doc plays talented rookies. But if you look at our draft picks in the year 2005 (Gerald Green, Ryan Gomes, Orien Greene). If we had a chance competing for the Championship that year and we had those rookies on our team.. Gomes would have got playing time no doubt about that, but Green and Greene wouldnt even have touched the floor.
Thats just my theory, but heck why argue bout the past
End of line Doc DOES play talented Rookies.

Dude, can you just admit you were wrong?  First you confused Jefferson, Tony Allen, etc being rookies on the 2007 team - when they were rookies on the 05 3 seed Celtics and played virtually every night.  Now youre saying if we were a title contender in 06 - then Gerald Green wouldn't have played? You might want to look it up, but Gerald and Oriene Greene rarely played in 06 anyways...because they sucked! Title contender or not.  Thank you for further proving my point that Doc doesn't play you if you aren't good.

Btw, might as wel throw this out there.  2008 - Glen Davis was in the rotation for a bit there.  Hell, he was the player of the game in teh team's biggest win of the regular season that year (@Detroit.)  Played great (defensively on Duncan) in the team's second biggest regular season game (beating the defending champs on a Sunday afternoon without KG.)  He remained in the rotation until he stopped playing well.  Lost his job to....second year guy Leon Powe.

Doc plays rookies if they prove they belong on the court.  He has no bias against rookies.  There's no merit to the contrary.  I've just proven that.  Just emotional fans who want to see a 1st round draft pick play for the sake of playing.  If anyone in the future who believes that "Doc just doesn't play the rookies" - just link them to this thread and my posts.

[33_Larry Legend_33]

They should have fired Red Auerbach for drafting Michael Smith a few picks ahead of Tim Hardaway...

This stuff happens...drafts are an inexact science.  The final chapters haven't been written on JJJ yet.  Shoot, we're still working on preface.

[TA9]

Well Etwaun wasnt in the trade for MarShon.
JaJuan may be better than Brooks. Just imagine him playing on a bad team. He could be avg 12-15 points while playing solid D.
Doc WOULDNT have played him. And dont bring the situation with Tony allen, Al Jefferson etc up. Our team sucked in the season 2006-07. He didnt have anything to lose, so why not play em?
Our team is trying to win a championship this year. Thats WHY he doesnt play rookies.

Someone wasn't a Celtics fan before the 2008 season.

Tony Allen and Al Jeferson were rookies two years PRIOR to the 07 season.  You might want to look up the 2005 Celtics - then get back to me.

I actually became a fan in the 2006-7 season...
I know that both was drafted 2004. But it doesnt matter thats not my point.
If you compare both teams, it is very clear that the team back in 05-07 didnt even have a chance to win a Championship, I therefore believe that Doc had no reason NOT to play them. If you look at our roster today, we have a great chance to win it all, thats why he perhaps wont risk losing the entire season due to some rookies

Sorry, the 2005 team was the third seed in the East and won the division.

That was the season 2004-2005.
I was talking about 2005-2006 where we didnt make the Playoffs
I agree that Doc plays talented rookies. But if you look at our draft picks in the year 2005 (Gerald Green, Ryan Gomes, Orien Greene). If we had a chance competing for the Championship that year and we had those rookies on our team.. Gomes would have got playing time no doubt about that, but Green and Greene wouldnt even have touched the floor.
Thats just my theory, but heck why argue bout the past
End of line Doc DOES play talented Rookies.

Dude, can you just admit you were wrong?  First you confused Jefferson, Tony Allen, etc being rookies on the 2007 team - when they were rookies on the 05 3 seed Celtics and played virtually every night.  Now youre saying if we were a title contender in 06 - then Gerald Green wouldn't have played? You might want to look it up, but Gerald and Oriene Greene rarely played in 06 anyways...because they sucked! Title contender or not.  Thank you for further proving my point that Doc doesn't play you if you aren't good.

Btw, might as wel throw this out there.  2008 - Glen Davis was in the rotation for a bit there.  Hell, he was the player of the game in teh team's biggest win of the regular season that year (@Detroit.)  Played great (defensively on Duncan) in the team's second biggest regular season game (beating the defending champs on a Sunday afternoon without KG.)  He remained in the rotation until he stopped playing well.  Lost his job to....second year guy Leon Powe.

Doc plays rookies if they prove they belong on the court.  He has no bias against rookies.  There's no merit to the contrary.  I've just proven that.  Just emotional fans who want to see a 1st round draft pick play for the sake of playing.  If anyone in the future who believes that "Doc just doesn't play the rookies" - just link them to this thread and my posts.

Lol dude I wont admit that im wrong. Call me Stubborn or whatever, but thats just how I see it...
And no i didnt confuse Allen, Jefferson etc. for being drafted in 2007? Tony is my favorite player all time, even followed him thru his OSU days. The guy is a 7 year veteran it doesnt even make sense that he was drafed in 2007. I just chose 06-07 season as an [dang] Example!
Doc plays talented Rookies, but he definetely DOESNT play rookies that suck. Thats it.
Orien Green logged 80 games in 2005, while starting 5 of the games in an avg of 15 min. This guy SUCKS, why did Doc play him? Their team sucked straight up so why not play him?

[Stig]

If we had drafted Marshon Brooks, he wouldn't be getting any minutes, and people on these forums would be wondering why we don't send him to the D-League or trade him for another big man. I guarantee it.

He is putting up big numbers because he is getting minutes that he would NOT HAVE GOTTEN in Boston. Remember, Nets suck.

I agree he won't get 23 minutes in Boston, but I can't see why we can't play him for 10-15 minutes a game, that would be more than the minutes of Johnson, Moore and Bradley put together.

Even if Brooks can't help us win, he'll be able to put on good stats, and be a valuable trade piece next year. It'll take Johnson 2-3 years to get there, as a end of 1st round pick, the best he can develop to is probably the same level as Brandon Bass. So it's not like we give up Brooks for the amazing future of Johnson...

[syfy9]

This is a bit off topic...

But if Doc wants rookies who fits into his schemes very well, would you think he would teach his son a little bit of his offense/defense? Learn the complicated system as a teenager, maybe?

Pipe Dream, Austin Rivers in a green jersey, though.

[mqtcelticsfan]

He would be averaging about 3 minutes a game in garbage time if he was on the celts. You can't judge players that don't play and Doc wouldn't play him if he were on this team.

well that would be the sign of a bad coach than. 

I agree.  I think JuJuan Johnson should be playing at least a couple minutes a night.  You invested a first round pick in him, you need to at least give him the opportunity to see game time so he can develop.  If he was 18-19, I'd understand, but he's 22, the kid needs to play.

where & when is the question
kg and bass should have all the minutes at pf, jermaine 20 minutes a night, still have wilcox and the kid stiemsma has looked good enough to deserve minutes
bass has looked really good and I'm sure doc wants to get kg and jo moving so their minutes will be there

Give him 3 minutes in the first quarter.  He's not going to develop if we don't play him at all.

Because it's always a great idea to put a guy not up to speed defensively in against starters when you're trying to win.

[LooseCannon]

It doesn't matter how well Brooks can score (and scoring tends to be overrated).  He won't play under Doc if he can't play defense unless a lot of players are injured.  (See Walker, Bill)  How is Brooks on defense?  I have no idea, so I'm just asking.

If the Celtics drafted Brooks and had a healthy Pierce and Green, we could easily be asking why Ainge didn't take Johnson.

Stiemsma should be an interesting case to examine for the "Doc doesn't play rookies" theory.  Will he get PT because the Celtics need warm bodies at center or is he earning his way into the rotation?

[Stig]

It doesn't matter how well Brooks can score (and scoring tends to be overrated).  He won't play under Doc if he can't play defense unless a lot of players are injured.  (See Walker, Bill)  How is Brooks on defense?  I have no idea, so I'm just asking.

If the Celtics drafted Brooks and had a healthy Pierce and Green, we could easily be asking why Ainge didn't take Johnson.

Stiemsma should be an interesting case to examine for the "Doc doesn't play rookies" theory.  Will he get PT because the Celtics need warm bodies at center or is he earning his way into the rotation?

Brooks isn't a top defender, but not too bad either, he's 6'5 with 7'1 wingspan. Yesterday in the game with Hawks he dished a nice block on TMAC. Bradley was said to be the best defending guard of 2010, but we all see how he played...Every rookie needs to learn defense in NBA, Brooks has size so he can improve too.

I wasn't expecting Ainge to pick a big guy in the draft, the reason is following: It usually takes longer time to develop a big man, especially a pick at the end of first round. This year is the last run of big3, if we want to pick rookies to help, we need to pick someone can help now. We haven't got a good backup shooting guard since Tony Allen left. So to me Brooks was a perfect choice.

[cman88]

I still think Johnson is going to be a nice player for the celtics...the kid already has an nba ready midrange game out to the 3 point line

but right now, I think there might be a fear defensively on Doc's part in putting a rookie out there...johnson was getting alot of fouls in the pre-season

he'll get his shot eventually

[dlpin]

Oh, come on. With a veteran team and no training camp, obviously the rookies won't be ready and playing solid minutes.

As for all these "we should have picked X" ideas, realize you are talking about gunners on bad teams. Brooks played in garbage time, and still frequently got lit up by other scrubs. He scored 17 on the hawks? Great, he allowed McGrady to score 12 and was -15 for the game.