Author Topic: CP3 to Clippers is a done deal  (Read 31158 times)

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Re: CP3 to Clippers is a done deal
« Reply #105 on: December 15, 2011, 08:08:23 AM »

Offline jarufu

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the Lakers / Rockets trade would have just made the Hornets another perpetual borderline playoff team for the next 3-4 years.  paying lots of money for a team but not getting a lot of wins, without any true stars.

with this trade, the hornets have a lot less money tied up in players long term, and with the right moves they could become a lot better than just a borderline playoff team within a few years.  

the important thing to remember here is that the hornets need to be sold to an owner.  an owner is going to want to buy a team that has a lot of potential to be shaped as the owner sees fit.  

a prospective buyer won't be as interested in a team that is locked in to a certain roster and a certain fate for the near future, especially one with very little chance of acquiring a truly marketable franchise superstar any time soon.


you see the difference blake griffin made to the clippers last year?  the difference durant made to the sonics / thunder?  the difference rose has made to the bulls?  getting a franchise superstar instantly makes your team relevant and interesting to fans in general, not just fans in your local market.  

that's why a prospective owner would rather get a team with a weak roster that has the chance to draft high and get such a star than a team full of middle of the road talent.

That's an excellent analysis PosImpos, TP.  It's a lot easier to sell the potential to some people that the next CP3 is just a Minny pick away, I would imagine.
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Re: CP3 to Clippers is a done deal
« Reply #106 on: December 15, 2011, 08:37:34 AM »

Online feckless

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the Lakers / Rockets trade would have just made the Hornets another perpetual borderline playoff team for the next 3-4 years.  paying lots of money for a team but not getting a lot of wins, without any true stars.

with this trade, the hornets have a lot less money tied up in players long term, and with the right moves they could become a lot better than just a borderline playoff team within a few years.  

the important thing to remember here is that the hornets need to be sold to an owner.  an owner is going to want to buy a team that has a lot of potential to be shaped as the owner sees fit.  

a prospective buyer won't be as interested in a team that is locked in to a certain roster and a certain fate for the near future, especially one with very little chance of acquiring a truly marketable franchise superstar any time soon.


you see the difference blake griffin made to the clippers last year?  the difference durant made to the sonics / thunder?  the difference rose has made to the bulls?  getting a franchise superstar instantly makes your team relevant and interesting to fans in general, not just fans in your local market.  

that's why a prospective owner would rather get a team with a weak roster that has the chance to draft high and get such a star than a team full of middle of the road talent.

That's an excellent analysis PosImpos, TP.  It's a lot easier to sell the potential to some people that the next CP3 is just a Minny pick away, I would imagine.

It sounds like you guys are saying the Clippers trade is better for New Orleans because it makes them worse than the Lakers trade would hhve made them and therefore they will suck more for a while but have more potential to get lucky and hit the next Durant or Griffin?  Do you really think this is what Stern was thinking when he rejected the Lakers trade and accepted the Clippers trade.  Stern  "Gee this Lakers trade makes the Hornets too good, we can't find a buyer that way.  Let's see if we can't find a trade where the Hornets suck so they can have some real potential?"
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Re: CP3 to Clippers is a done deal
« Reply #107 on: December 15, 2011, 08:41:44 AM »

Offline wdleehi

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the Lakers / Rockets trade would have just made the Hornets another perpetual borderline playoff team for the next 3-4 years.  paying lots of money for a team but not getting a lot of wins, without any true stars.

with this trade, the hornets have a lot less money tied up in players long term, and with the right moves they could become a lot better than just a borderline playoff team within a few years.  

the important thing to remember here is that the hornets need to be sold to an owner.  an owner is going to want to buy a team that has a lot of potential to be shaped as the owner sees fit.  

a prospective buyer won't be as interested in a team that is locked in to a certain roster and a certain fate for the near future, especially one with very little chance of acquiring a truly marketable franchise superstar any time soon.


you see the difference blake griffin made to the clippers last year?  the difference durant made to the sonics / thunder?  the difference rose has made to the bulls?  getting a franchise superstar instantly makes your team relevant and interesting to fans in general, not just fans in your local market.  

that's why a prospective owner would rather get a team with a weak roster that has the chance to draft high and get such a star than a team full of middle of the road talent.

That's an excellent analysis PosImpos, TP.  It's a lot easier to sell the potential to some people that the next CP3 is just a Minny pick away, I would imagine.

It sounds like you guys are saying the Clippers trade is better for New Orleans because it makes them worse than the Lakers trade would hhve made them and therefore they will suck more for a while but have more potential to get lucky and hit the next Durant or Griffin?  Do you really think this is what Stern was thinking when he rejected the Lakers trade and accepted the Clippers trade.  Stern  "Gee this Lakers trade makes the Hornets too good, we can't find a buyer that way.  Let's see if we can't find a trade where the Hornets suck so they can have some real potential?"


The three-way trade puts them in no mans land in the NBA.  Maybe just good enough to make the playoffs to lose in the first round, but not bad enough to get a high pick.

And, there would be not player that you could see them build around in the future.

With the Clippers trade, they got one of the top under 30 SGs in the league.  They got the Clippers first pick from last year.  They got the a 1st next year that is likely to be a very good pick in a deep draft.  And they got roster flexibility going forward. 


Re: CP3 to Clippers is a done deal
« Reply #108 on: December 15, 2011, 08:46:27 AM »

Online Roy H.

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the Lakers / Rockets trade would have just made the Hornets another perpetual borderline playoff team for the next 3-4 years.  paying lots of money for a team but not getting a lot of wins, without any true stars.

with this trade, the hornets have a lot less money tied up in players long term, and with the right moves they could become a lot better than just a borderline playoff team within a few years.  

the important thing to remember here is that the hornets need to be sold to an owner.  an owner is going to want to buy a team that has a lot of potential to be shaped as the owner sees fit.  

a prospective buyer won't be as interested in a team that is locked in to a certain roster and a certain fate for the near future, especially one with very little chance of acquiring a truly marketable franchise superstar any time soon.


you see the difference blake griffin made to the clippers last year?  the difference durant made to the sonics / thunder?  the difference rose has made to the bulls?  getting a franchise superstar instantly makes your team relevant and interesting to fans in general, not just fans in your local market.  

that's why a prospective owner would rather get a team with a weak roster that has the chance to draft high and get such a star than a team full of middle of the road talent.

That's an excellent analysis PosImpos, TP.  It's a lot easier to sell the potential to some people that the next CP3 is just a Minny pick away, I would imagine.

It sounds like you guys are saying the Clippers trade is better for New Orleans because it makes them worse than the Lakers trade would hhve made them and therefore they will suck more for a while but have more potential to get lucky and hit the next Durant or Griffin?  Do you really think this is what Stern was thinking when he rejected the Lakers trade and accepted the Clippers trade.  Stern  "Gee this Lakers trade makes the Hornets too good, we can't find a buyer that way.  Let's see if we can't find a trade where the Hornets suck so they can have some real potential?"

In a way, yes.  Often, long-term cap flexibility and upside on your roster is more appealing than an aging, expensive borderline playoff team.

Kevin Martin turns 29 in a couple of months, and has battled injuries 3 of the past 4 years.  Scola is 31.  Odom is 32.  They also took on a significant amount of salary past this season. 

How good is a team made up of Okafor/Scola/Odom/Martin?  At best, a 5th seed? Is that the future you want to commit to for the next 2-3 seasons, before your stars get old and retire? 

In the NBA, it's often better to be bad and rebuilding rather than mediocre and hopeless. 


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Re: CP3 to Clippers is a done deal
« Reply #109 on: December 15, 2011, 08:51:09 AM »

Offline jarufu

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In the NBA, it's often better to be bad and rebuilding rather than mediocre and hopeless

And I was typing up a long-winded analogy about buying a half-finished something-or-other.  Beautiful, Roy, thanks!
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Re: CP3 to Clippers is a done deal
« Reply #110 on: December 15, 2011, 09:42:27 AM »

Offline Moreover

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the Lakers / Rockets trade would have just made the Hornets another perpetual borderline playoff team for the next 3-4 years.  paying lots of money for a team but not getting a lot of wins, without any true stars.

with this trade, the hornets have a lot less money tied up in players long term, and with the right moves they could become a lot better than just a borderline playoff team within a few years.  

the important thing to remember here is that the hornets need to be sold to an owner.  an owner is going to want to buy a team that has a lot of potential to be shaped as the owner sees fit.  

a prospective buyer won't be as interested in a team that is locked in to a certain roster and a certain fate for the near future, especially one with very little chance of acquiring a truly marketable franchise superstar any time soon.


you see the difference blake griffin made to the clippers last year?  the difference durant made to the sonics / thunder?  the difference rose has made to the bulls?  getting a franchise superstar instantly makes your team relevant and interesting to fans in general, not just fans in your local market.  

that's why a prospective owner would rather get a team with a weak roster that has the chance to draft high and get such a star than a team full of middle of the road talent.

That's an excellent analysis PosImpos, TP.  It's a lot easier to sell the potential to some people that the next CP3 is just a Minny pick away, I would imagine.

It sounds like you guys are saying the Clippers trade is better for New Orleans because it makes them worse than the Lakers trade would hhve made them and therefore they will suck more for a while but have more potential to get lucky and hit the next Durant or Griffin?  Do you really think this is what Stern was thinking when he rejected the Lakers trade and accepted the Clippers trade.  Stern  "Gee this Lakers trade makes the Hornets too good, we can't find a buyer that way.  Let's see if we can't find a trade where the Hornets suck so they can have some real potential?"

The Clippers trade is better because it brings a lot more value. That's why Stern rejected it. It wasn't because it made  the Hornets good or bad, that's actually secondary.

Think this way: Lamar Odom was worth a late first rounder. Kevin Martin trade value was Carl Landry just a couple of months ago. Scola isn't much more valuable than that, he's a 32 years old owed $50 million. Dragic is an average prospect.

So, with the Lakers/Rockets offer either the Hornets would be able to compete for a low playoff seed for a couple of years and then be terrible without any asset or be terrible right away with a handful of late first rounders. That at the cost of taking in $50 million in salaries.

With the Clippers offer, they get valuable young assets and they can be terrible right away with those assets or they can flip them immediately for more veteran players and be a playoff contender for a few years if they so desire. That without being buried in salaries right from the bat.

The Lakers/Rockets offer was ridiculously bad. I think Dell Demps should be investigated. No reason whatsoever to accept an offer like that one. There were dozens of offers better than that one available had he done his job properly. It's puzzling and suspicious he'd accept that offer.

Re: CP3 to Clippers is a done deal
« Reply #111 on: December 15, 2011, 10:43:11 AM »

Offline Kane3387

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The move is about acquiring assets and having the opportunity to possibly win a title if management does a their job in making those assets increase in value. The laker trade might have guaranteed a first round exit, but it also guaranteed that they would never have a shot at the the title in the next 8 years.

Now they have Eric Gordon and possibly two top 5 picks. Suck it up and lose this year and marginally improve the next with Eric Gordon and possibly Perry Riley and Harrison Barnes, etc. Then have another lottery pick in 2013 and in the 2013-14 season contend for the playoffs.

This is exactly what OKC did, but the key is to hit a homerun with one of these picks and a couple doubles with the others. They could easily have a future big three by the beginning of next season (2 on cheap deals) if they pick well in the draft. They could also have some cash to bring in some solid FAs while their high draft choices are on rookie deals.


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Re: CP3 to Clippers is a done deal
« Reply #112 on: December 15, 2011, 04:51:54 PM »

Offline LB3533

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Good luck New Orleans....you're gonna need it.