Rondo-Paul Trade Thread (Merged)

[Celtics4ever]

Paul doesn't want us either.

http://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/story/_/id/7297944/new-orleans-hornets-chris-paul-sign-boston-celtics-dealt-source-says

[Mike-Dub]

If he did shoot down the idea of an extension like they say and Rajon remains, this totally adds fuel to the fire for their next showdown. Watching that game.

They'll win plenty of regular season games, but how, many titles?  I don't think any... It takes defense to win Championships and the knicks have none and will never have none with Mike D'Antoni at the helm.  The C's have the best head coach in the league, a ton of cap space and veterans that still can play and could even be willing to come off the bench (Ray), and a high quality draft pick.

Edit: Meant to quote Posimos.

[Yoki_IsTheName]

Even if we won't win this year - we won't win as a family!
I don't care about CP3 shooting skills - I KNOW that he s averaging less than 16 points a game last year!!! In bull**** NOH! With such a "ballhog shooters" like belinelli or d.west.
R u kidding me?! Why do we need him? Why do we need his knees?!
Rondo got no $hot?! - So? come on Danny! Give him one more shooter!
Trade Baby for Mayo.And don't waste time and sign Chuck Hayes and Aron Gray - your job is done for this season SO!
---
Perk was our new Chief? So why didn't he signed a contract which Danny gave him?!May be 'cos he wanted 2-3M a year more? - Is this a price for being Celtic?Shmuck!
---
Leave this starting 5.
Rondo-Ray-Truth-KG-JO
-
Take a good bench
Delonte-Mayo-Green-JJ-Hayes&Gray +Moore&Bradley+sign Marquis!
---
And go to WAR!

I doubt that Memphis will give Mayo for BBD. But I like your thinking. This core is still solid, with Rondo as the floor general. Gray would be a solid backup. Find somebody who will take BBD, a scorer (it can't be Mayo but there should be somebody.) and were good.

[Greenbean]

Even if we won't win this year - we won't win as a family!
I don't care about CP3 shooting skills - I KNOW that he s averaging less than 16 points a game last year!!! In bull**** NOH! With such a "ballhog shooters" like belinelli or d.west.
R u kidding me?! Why do we need him? Why do we need his knees?!
Rondo got no $hot?! - So? come on Danny! Give him one more shooter!
Trade Baby for Mayo.And don't waste time and sign Chuck Hayes and Aron Gray - you job is done for this season!
---
Perk was our new Chief? So why didn't he signed a contract which Danny gave him?!May be 'cos he wanted 2-3M a year more? - Is this a price for being Celtic?Shmuck!
---
Leave this starting 5.
Rondo-Ray-Truth-KG-JO
-
Take a good bench
Delonte-Mayo-Green-JJ-Hayes&Gray +Moore&Bradley+sign Marquis!
---
And go to WAR!

im stuck being a fan and a businessman...I am so pro-anything thats beneficial for the team

and if CP3 ensures getting Dwight, I'm all for it

but as a big fan, I don't want to see this family break up , and i agree, if we lose, we lose as a family...but ALSO as a fan, I want to WIN

Yeah it was a bradn new family in 07-08...maybe its time for another new one...

[Greenbean]

I just have to say something here.

I LOVE Rajon ROndo.

There is literally one PG in the league I would trade him for and that is Chris Paul...

I dont understand how some people here would be opposed to a one for one swap with a Paul extension. It's crazy to me.

[Ganguido]

Even if we won't win this year - we won't win as a family!
I don't care about CP3 shooting skills - I KNOW that he s averaging less than 16 points a game last year!!! In bull**** NOH! With such a "ballhog shooters" like belinelli or d.west.
R u kidding me?! Why do we need him? Why do we need his knees?!
Rondo got no $hot?! - So? come on Danny! Give him one more shooter!
Trade Baby for Mayo.And don't waste time and sign Chuck Hayes and Aron Gray - your job is done for this season SO!
---
Perk was our new Chief? So why didn't he signed a contract which Danny gave him?!May be 'cos he wanted 2-3M a year more? - Is this a price for being Celtic?Shmuck!
---
Leave this starting 5.
Rondo-Ray-Truth-KG-JO
-
Take a good bench
Delonte-Mayo-Green-JJ-Hayes&Gray +Moore&Bradley+sign Marquis!
---
And go to WAR!

I doubt that Memphis will give Mayo for BBD. But I like your thinking. This core is still solid, with Rondo as the floor general. Gray would be a solid backup. Find somebody who will take BBD, a scorer (it can't be Mayo but there should be somebody.) and were good.

This is an example.
If Danny want to stay as a great GM - he need to stop thinking that we could get D-12.If he will be working with proud and thinking of team - Dwight will notice that!
---
Dwight likes Doc and Rondo.
This is enough.
Just dont kill our payroll.
And have a plan B.
 If not Dwight - who cares!
Next summer Kaman will be a FA.I was watching him on European Championship - he s a BEAST! He s great C! Take him!
And fight for good SG (J-Rich) and PF for future.
If Danny will be working carefully KG will stay for 2-3 years.Ray will be able to score 10+ till 40.He s in better shape than 90% of players.Teach JJJ.Check Moore.

We have planty of work to do - instead of asking CP3 to SAVE OUR FRANCHISE! He couldnt do it with his own...

[snively]

http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/216863/Paul_Uninterested_In_Signing_Extension_With_Celtics

"Chris Paul is not interested in signing an extension with the Celtics, according to a source close to the situation.

I expect this will prove true. I think Chris Paul will be very reluctant to sign an extension with Boston prior to the trade or shortly after completion.

He'll want to do like Deron Williams is in NJ and (1) go to Boston, and, (2) give the team a chance to show it can build a long term Championship nucleus around him before deciding whether to sign there long term or not.

The Celtics current title opportunity being offset by their (1) aging stars, and, (2) more likely than not, ensuing long term rebuilding process.

I wonder if Ainge will drop his insistence on Paul signing an extension (which I agree is unrealistic after considering matters from Paul's perspective).
A healthy Paul in 2011/2012 slightly improves our championship hopes.

I honestly think Ainge might do it (if New Orleans bites of course).  With the Knicks and Nets positioning themselves so well for free agency, he might be worried that a Rondo/Pierce recruiting team is destined to come in 2nd place in the Howard sweepstakes, so why not go for broke with the Big 3's last big year and take a big gamble on improving a good but not good enough sales team.

[indeedproceed]

Aside from Rondo not being able to shoot, he's pretty much on par if not better than what CP can do.

That's not true. I'd say Rondo's passing and rebounding are on par with CP3. There is nothing else on the offensive side of the ball that Rondo does better.

Defensively, I'm in the minority when I say I think that they're a lot closer than others might think. I think that KG and Perk, and to a lesser extent Jermaine O'Neal and Sheed, has inflated Rajon Rondo's defensive reputation a bit, to the point where stops that are actually the work of the great rotation in the post get attributed to Rondo on the stat sheet.

I still think Rondo is the better defender, but I don't think he's on another level or anything than Paul.

He's younger, healthier and cheaper. They should focus on finding a scorer which Rondo can feed the ball to.

Rondo is 1 calender year younger, and of the two of them which one played 80 games last season, and which one played less than 70 games last season?

With all due respect Commish. But Rondo has proven to be more healthier than CP3 is.

Well, Rondo has missed an average of fewer games over his career per season (CP3 plays on average 71 games a year, Rondo 77), but Rondo has also been a full-time starter and 35 mpg+ franchise player for less time as well.

CP3 has been playing 36 minutes per game + for every single one of the 6 years he's been in the league, and he's been remarkably consistent, excepting when recovering from injury, and even then, he's been better than almost every PG in the game.

Rondo let a little pain and a trade of a friend mess him up so bad he wasn't even in the conversation for the top 10 PG's in the league the way he played down the stretch in the regular season.  

I'm not sure which guy I'd vote 'more healthier', but I know who is 'more consistentyer'.

Besides, Rondo can still be under contract. Who's sure if Paul will stay next year?

Nobody, except the New York Knicks...but that wasn't the point.

[LooseCannon]

Reportedly, an extend-and-trade is limited to three years now, so it's probably not in Paul's best interest to agree to an extension unless he is concerned about his health and wants to lock up the sure money.

[BballTim]

Aside from Rondo not being able to shoot, he's pretty much on par if not better than what CP can do.

That's not true. I'd say Rondo's passing and rebounding are on par with CP3. There is nothing else on the offensive side of the ball that Rondo does better.

  Rondo's clearly a better rebounder, though more on the defensive end I would guess. I'd say Rondo is better at getting to the rim, and that IMO he does a better job at directing traffic/creating mismatches in the halfcourt than pretty much any other pg I see.

Defensively, I'm in the minority when I say I think that they're a lot closer than others might think. I think that KG and Perk, and to a lesser extent Jermaine O'Neal and Sheed, has inflated Rajon Rondo's defensive reputation a bit, to the point where stops that are actually the work of the great rotation in the post get attributed to Rondo on the stat sheet.

  Okafor and West are both pretty good defenders, aren't they?

[BballTim]

Rondo let a little pain and a trade of a friend mess him up so bad he wasn't even in the conversation for the top 10 PG's in the league the way he played down the stretch in the regular season.

 

  Haha. Between the plantar fascitis, hand injury and whatever else was bothering him, exactly how much pain was he in? This is a guy who came out of a game for 5-6 minutes after he had his elbow bent the wrong way, and you're claiming that, what, he's some kind of wimp that doesn't play through pain?

  Let's face it, if Rondo's injury had occurred during practice and not on camera, many people here would have been tripping over themselves  in their haste to state that he's mentally weak, and trying to blame his play on his elbow the same way LeBron did the year before.

  And, seriously, wasn't in the conversation for top 10 pgs? That's a phenomena that occurred mainly among his detractors on this board. He was on the fringes of the online (espn/nba.com/yahoo and the like) mvp candidate lists (even late in the year), actually finished in the mvp voting, and finished 4th among point guards for all-nba (13th or 14th overall).

I'm not sure which guy I'd vote 'more healthier', but I know who is 'more consistentyer'.

  If Paul's knee is in the shape many people claim then I don't see a lot of doubt about 'more healthier'.

[indeedproceed]

Rondo's clearly a better rebounder, though more on the defensive end I would guess.

Actually, Rondo is the slightly better rebounder, and its offensive boards that set him above CP3, not defensive boards. Chris Paul is actually a better defensive rebounder over their careers, and ROndo the much better offensive rebounder, by the metrics.

But in terms of overall rebounds grabbed against possible rebound opportunities, their difference is very slim; 7.2 Rebound Rate for Rondo to 6.9 Rebound Rate for Paul.

I'd say Rondo is better at getting to the rim, and that IMO he does a better job at directing traffic/creating mismatches in the halfcourt than pretty much any other pg I see.

Well, simply put, I disagree I guess. I think all things being equal, CP3 having the same weapons Rondo has had, same turnovers created that he can capitalize on, same fast-break opportunities, I think he'd show that on offense he's above rondo in all the categories you mentioned.

Defensively, I'm in the minority when I say I think that they're a lot closer than others might think. I think that KG and Perk, and to a lesser extent Jermaine O'Neal and Sheed, has inflated Rajon Rondo's defensive reputation a bit, to the point where stops that are actually the work of the great rotation in the post get attributed to Rondo on the stat sheet.

  Okafor and West are both pretty good defenders, aren't they?

David West is not a good defender. Emeka Okafor I'd put on par with Perkins. Better help defender, worse man on man post defender.

But as you go down the line, the defenders get worse and worse. Carl Landry, Aaron Gray, Jason Smith, just a rotating carousel of terrible defenders.

[indeedproceed]

Rondo let a little pain and a trade of a friend mess him up so bad he wasn't even in the conversation for the top 10 PG's in the league the way he played down the stretch in the regular season.

  Haha. Between the plantar fascitis, hand injury and whatever else was bothering him, exactly how much pain was he in? This is a guy who came out of a game for 5-6 minutes after he had his elbow bent the wrong way, and you're claiming that, what, he's some kind of wimp that doesn't play through pain?

No, I'm saying that he's not as good at consistently playing through adversity as Chris Paul has proven himself to be, which aids your 'more healthier' point, because CP3 has proven time and time again that he can bounce back.

 Let's face it, if Rondo's injury had occurred during practice and not on camera, many people here would have been tripping over themselves  in their haste to state that he's mentally weak, and trying to blame his play on his elbow the same way LeBron did the year before.

I don't know why you said this, or what it has to do with how many clemintines I ate at lunch today.

The number is 4, J Edgar. They're delicious.

 And, seriously, wasn't in the conversation for top 10 pgs? That's a phenomena that occurred mainly among his detractors on this board. He was on the fringes of the online (espn/nba.com/yahoo and the like) mvp candidate lists (even late in the year), actually finished in the mvp voting, and finished 4th among point guards for all-nba (13th or 14th overall).

Rajon Rondo's play from the All-Star break through to the end of the year was awful. Just simply terrible, and tough to watch. In that period of time, yeah, Rondo was not playing like a top 10 pg.

However, he was playing like the top PG in the world for the first month of the season, and that carried what was overall an otherwise forgettable year into a nice performance by the numbers.

I'm not sure which guy I'd vote 'more healthier', but I know who is 'more consistentyer'.

  If Paul's knee is in the shape many people claim then I don't see a lot of doubt about 'more healthier'.

Yes, if Chris Paul's health proves to limit his efficacy long-term, and Rondo's does not, that makes Rondo 'More Healthier'.

[BballTim]

Rondo's clearly a better rebounder, though more on the defensive end I would guess.

Actually, Rondo is the slightly better rebounder, and its offensive boards that set him above CP3, not defensive boards. Chris Paul is actually a better defensive rebounder over their careers, and ROndo the much better offensive rebounder, by the metrics.

But in terms of overall rebounds grabbed against possible rebound opportunities, their difference is very slim; 7.2 Rebound Rate for Rondo to 6.9 Rebound Rate for Paul.

  Rondo's rebounding edge really shows in the playoffs, where his rate is closer to being the best of any guard in history than it is to CP3's.

I'd say Rondo is better at getting to the rim, and that IMO he does a better job at directing traffic/creating mismatches in the halfcourt than pretty much any other pg I see.

Well, simply put, I disagree I guess. I think all things being equal, CP3 having the same weapons Rondo has had, same turnovers created that he can capitalize on, same fast-break opportunities, I think he'd show that on offense he's above rondo in all the categories you mentioned.

  Boston shoots in the first 10 seconds of the shot clock 34% of the time, NO 33% of the time. Boston's opponents have a turnover rate of .148 (3rd in the league), NO is .144 (tied for 6th). CP3 *does* have those same opportunities to capitalize on.

[IrishGreen]

Does anyone else feel that this is a step backwards??

There is absolutely no way in hell that we will challenge for a Championship with Paul playing PG. Yes, he is probably an all round better player than Rondo, but he can't run a team in the same manner.

There will be less training time in the GYM this year so you need someone that knows his team inside out and Rondo is that person. It will take Paul about a year to understand the ins and outs of our plays and what Doc exactly wants. A year will be too late, KG and Co will have all aged and we will be essentially taking backward steps.