JaJuan or BBD?

[Roy H.]

nice stats and a nicely supported argument RH. tp. where did you get the stats from?

Thanks.

http://www.hoopdata.com

and

http://www.82games.com

[CelticsFanNC]

  Not fond of the idea of a rookie backing up an aging KG.

  Hate the idea of glen Davis playing another second in a Celtics uniform.

 

[CelticsFanNC]

  People say that.  I know it's a real popular opinion that Big Baby is selfish, but I don't think it's true.  I watched every game he played last year, and he very rarely took an ill-advised shots.

I disagree.  He averaged 4.6 shot attempts per game from 16-to-23 feet, and hit those shots at a rate of 35%.  That's not an efficient use of offensive possessions.

Baby was much more efficient from 10-to-15 feet (43.7%), but he only attempted 1.1 shots per game from that range.  Similarly, he was good inside (63.1%), but only averaged 3.1 attempts at the rim per game.  

In other words, BBD took most of his shots from areas where he wasn't very good.  By its nature, I'd say those are ill-advised shots.

Is there a stat that shows how many of those were in the last 5 seconds of a shot clock period?
In my own mind he seems to have taken a large portion of bail out shots as the last option from 16-20 feet- similarly to Rondo.

24% of his shots were with 4 or fewer seconds left on the clock; he hit those shots at 35.6%.  

For comparison sake:

KG:  18% of shots with clock winding down; 44.5% shooting
Pierce:  13%; 43.4%
Allen:  14%; 46.3%
Green:  18%; 47.2%
Rondo:  17%; 37.0%

From a quick glance at those stats, it suggests that BBD shoots a slightly higher percentage of his shots with the clock winding down, and that he shoots those shots at a rate below that of his peers.  Defenses probably recognize this; the reason he's being left open is because he's a poor shooter.

    There is a HUGE difference in Davis taking those shots and the others.

  Most times the reason Glen Davis ended up taking shots as the shot clock expired it was due to him holding the ball and trying to find his own shot.  In the cases of all of the others is is due to the entire team making too many extra passes.  That is almost never the case with Davis because once he touches the ball all ball movement stops.

  He ends up taking a lot of them due to his own issues of holding the ball hostage while the others end up taking them because the team as a whole has superior ball movement.

[Celtics18]

I don't think it's an either/or situation.  It's basically going to depend on what kind of offers Davis gets from other teams. 

JJJ is here to stay, at least for his rookie season, regardless of what happens with Baby.

[indeedproceed]

While jj is a very intriguing prospect, it should be noted that for all his considerable faults, glen Davis has actually proved himself to be an NBA quality rotation player. JJ has potential, and not much more yet. I think both are needed.

[LooseCannon]

Glen Davis is a known quantity who strikes me as unlikely to improve over last season.  Assuming we have a season of some sort and Davis returns....

If you feel that a Celtics team of roughly the same level of play as last season is a sufficient title threat to satisfy you, then Glen Davis should be sufficient in the role of backup 4.

If you feel that the Celtics need some sort of improvement to have a decent shot at a title, then committing to giving JaJuan Johnson significant minutes is the sort of gamble on untested talent that the team needs to make in the hopes of finding improvement.

[chambers]

Glen Davis is a known quantity who strikes me as unlikely to improve over last season.  Assuming we have a season of some sort and Davis returns....

If you feel that a Celtics team of roughly the same level of play as last season is a sufficient title threat to satisfy you, then Glen Davis should be sufficient in the role of backup 4.

If you feel that the Celtics need some sort of improvement to have a decent shot at a title, then committing to giving JaJuan Johnson significant minutes is the sort of gamble on untested talent that the team needs to make in the hopes of finding improvement.

What about the Glen Davis from the two years previous to last year? If he got back to his 6th man of the year level I would love to have him back- particularly if it's not expensive.

[xmuscularghandix]

I'll take the tall one that can dunk and block shots... oh and doesn't have delusions of being a "starter in the league".

[Inside-Out]

I'll take the tall one that can dunk and block shots... oh and doesn't have delusions of being a "starter in the league".

Amen.

[KP43]

I'll take the tall one that can dunk and block shots... oh and doesn't have delusions of being a "starter in the league".

halleluja! TP

[raynman]

JJJ should stay and develop.. BBD should go.. But we still need an 'enforcer' - The Kurt Thomases and the Turiafs come to mind..

[nickagneta]

Really?

People want to just give a four year senior college player chosen 27th in the 1st round, who hasn't played a single minute in the NBA the backup PF spot over a player that has proven himself as a valuable NBA role player?

Really?

How many four year college PFs chosen after the 15th pick in the 1st round have even made it in the NBA over the last ten years, never mind be so productive as to land the back up PF spot on a contending team?

Before you go researching the number is extremely extremely small.

[BASS_THUMPER]

big baby davis




no..

glen davis



yes

[CelticsFanNC]

  Hopefully if and when we have a season, Ainge has something up his sleeve to fill the back up front court spots and well as getting more athletic up and down the roster.  

  Unfortunately we will probably see another year of the black hole that ate everything, Glen Davis unless someone is dumb enough to give him a decent pay day.  It's not the worst scenario in the world but there are a whole lot of tires I would kick before settling on Davis.

[EJPLAYA]

Really?

People want to just give a four year senior college player chosen 27th in the 1st round, who hasn't played a single minute in the NBA the backup PF spot over a player that has proven himself as a valuable NBA role player?

Really?

How many four year college PFs chosen after the 15th pick in the 1st round have even made it in the NBA over the last ten years, never mind be so productive as to land the back up PF spot on a contending team?

Before you go researching the number is extremely extremely small.

I think you’ll find most people on that side of the argument aren’t really so infatuated with JaJuan, rather not in agreement with you as to BBD’s value. I’d sign almost anyone out there over BBD right now because I feel he is a selfish player more interested in his “role” on the team than winning a championship. He is an out of shape cry baby who can’t seem to realize what his strengths and weaknesses are. For some reason he thinks he is a shooter, and no matter who he is out there with thinks he should be launching up shots. He longer works hard at the thing that used to make many of us love his contribution to the team, hustle and taking charges, and therefore his skill set is very small at this weight/point.

Someone once again tell me the value of an under sized PF/C that can’t rebound, score under the basket, shoot from the outside, defend on the perimeter, score under the rim, or block shots… I think many of us don’t see it and that’s why we’d rather have a guy with upside than BBD.