Wow. Tedy Bruschi just castrated Ochocinco

[nickagneta]

Best LB of all time...  Bill Romanowski?  He is tied for the most rings, and has the most Super Bowl starts of any LB.  Clearly, then, he's the best; it has nothing to do with playing on the same team as Montana and Elway.

I agree with everything Dons said, including about the HOF.  If it took Harry Carson -- a 9 time Pro-Bowler, who Bill Belichick called the best all-around LB he ever coached -- 12 years to make the Hall, then Bruschi is never getting in.

Yeah I don't think Bruschi is even in the top ten LBs of his era.

Never mind his era, Bruschi isn't even a top 3 linebacker in Patriots history.

Andre Tippett
Steve Nelson
Nick Buoniconti

[StartOrien]

Yo dawg, that picture just said 1,000 awesome words.

First ones:

"It's gabe time"

[Rondo2287]

I agree Teddy isnt top ten all time, I love him, but I think there was only one season where he was the top LB in the league throughout his career. and that was 2003 if I recall correctly.

[Fafnir]

I agree Teddy isnt top ten all time, I love him, but I think there was only one season where he was the top LB in the league throughout his career. and that was 2003 if I recall correctly.

So he was the best linebacker in football the year Ray Lewis won DPOY?

I don't think he was ever the best LB in football. His career/prime was overlapped by Lewis', Brooks', and Urlacher's career/primes.

[Rondo2287]

I agree Teddy isnt top ten all time, I love him, but I think there was only one season where he was the top LB in the league throughout his career. and that was 2003 if I recall correctly.

So he was the best linebacker in football the year Ray Lewis won DPOY?

I don't think he was ever the best LB in football. His career/prime was overlapped by Lewis', Brooks', and Urlacher's career/primes.

Yes better than Ray Lewis. 

[indeedproceed]

I agree Teddy isnt top ten all time, I love him, but I think there was only one season where he was the top LB in the league throughout his career. and that was 2003 if I recall correctly.

So he was the best linebacker in football the year Ray Lewis won DPOY?

I don't think he was ever the best LB in football. His career/prime was overlapped by Lewis', Brooks', and Urlacher's career/primes.

Yes better than Ray Lewis. 

I can't tell if you're being sarcastic.

[Rondo2287]

I agree Teddy isnt top ten all time, I love him, but I think there was only one season where he was the top LB in the league throughout his career. and that was 2003 if I recall correctly.

So he was the best linebacker in football the year Ray Lewis won DPOY?

I don't think he was ever the best LB in football. His career/prime was overlapped by Lewis', Brooks', and Urlacher's career/primes.

Yes better than Ray Lewis.  

I can't tell if you're being sarcastic.

That year he was the leader and best player of the defense that gave up a league leading 14.9 ppg.  


Correction, sorry, the year I was talking about was 2004. not 2003.  He had the stroke after 2004, that was my mistake.

[Roy H.]

2003 stats:

Bruschi:  81 tackles, 52 assists, 2 sacks, 3 forced fumbles, 1 fumble recovery, 3 interceptions, 14 passes defended, 2 TDs

Lewis:  121 tackles, 42 assists, 1.5 sacks, 2 forced fumbles, 2 fumble recoveries, 6 interceptions, 14 passes defended, 1 TD

Bruschi had a great season, but Lewis was better that year.

[Fafnir]

I agree Teddy isnt top ten all time, I love him, but I think there was only one season where he was the top LB in the league throughout his career. and that was 2003 if I recall correctly.

So he was the best linebacker in football the year Ray Lewis won DPOY?

I don't think he was ever the best LB in football. His career/prime was overlapped by Lewis', Brooks', and Urlacher's career/primes.

Yes better than Ray Lewis.  

I can't tell if you're being sarcastic.

That year he was the leader and best player of the defense that gave up a league leading 14.9 ppg.  


Correction, sorry, the year I was talking about was 2004. not 2003.  He had the stroke after 2004, that was my mistake.

The 2003 season was the year the Pats had the best scoring defense. In the 2004 season they were tied for second with the Eagles.

Again 2003 was also the year Ray Lewis won his second DPOY, and Bruschi wasn't better than him then. Football is a team sport, the best player on the best defensive unit doesn't naturally imply that he's the best player in the league.

[wayupnorth]

Its pretty obvious they don't like ocho, which doesn't surprise me at all with radio guys.  Teddy's little tirade is unwarranted, he honestly sounds bitter that he wasn't there playing.  giving your teammate sincere accolade for a job well done doesn't deserve that.  But Ocho can't do any thing right to Boston radio guys.  Teddy needs to get over himself, and sit down somewhere.

To be fair when you wear three Super Bowl rings, played in two other Super Bowls and are probably a top ten linebacker all time you can pretty much say anything you want to a loser like Ochocinco.

Ray Lewis
Patrick Willis
DeMarcus Ware
Brian Urlacher
James Harrison
Clay Matthews
Lawrence Taylor
Dick Butkus
Mick Singletary
Jack Lambert
Dave Wilcox
Ted Hendrix

 I would say maaaaaaaybe top ten of his era. But top ten all time? Not quite.

If you don't have three rings or more.....need not apply

You taking Trent Dilfer over Marino then too?

I would definitely definitely definitely take Trent Dilfer's career over Dan Marino's.  Not even a question. Who would you rather be? A champion or a synonym for loser?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YNooFZPfmgE&feature=results_main&playnext=1&list=PL4FF023A436A18C30

Yeahhh. I think I would still rather "be" Marino. You have your one ring, I'll keep my mutiple passing records.


In principle you are right, but really? You consider Dilfers career a success and Marinos a failure?

[greenpride32]

I heard on the radio today somebody suggested Bruschi holds a grudge against 85 because it was a block made by 85 on Tedy in a preseason game one year that effectively ended his career.  Bruschi's tirade was a bit out of character and overboard so it does seem to hold some weight.  But I don't remember the play or anything; does anyone recall the incident or have a Youtube of it? I may have not heard the story 100%, but it was definitely suggested there was some type of grudge between the 2 from an on field incident.

[Finkelskyhook]

I heard on the radio today somebody suggested Bruschi holds a grudge against 85 because it was a block made by 85 on Tedy in a preseason game one year that effectively ended his career.  Bruschi's tirade was a bit out of character and overboard so it does seem to hold some weight.  But I don't remember the play or anything; does anyone recall the incident or have a Youtube of it? I may have not heard the story 100%, but it was definitely suggested there was some type of grudge between the 2 from an on field incident.

I don't know that it really matters.  What Bruschi said holds weight because it's true.  Johnson needs to learn the system, play the game to his overrated abilities, and stop bringing unnecessary attention to himself.  It's really that simple.  

[Eja117]

Its pretty obvious they don't like ocho, which doesn't surprise me at all with radio guys.  Teddy's little tirade is unwarranted, he honestly sounds bitter that he wasn't there playing.  giving your teammate sincere accolade for a job well done doesn't deserve that.  But Ocho can't do any thing right to Boston radio guys.  Teddy needs to get over himself, and sit down somewhere.

To be fair when you wear three Super Bowl rings, played in two other Super Bowls and are probably a top ten linebacker all time you can pretty much say anything you want to a loser like Ochocinco.

Ray Lewis
Patrick Willis
DeMarcus Ware
Brian Urlacher
James Harrison
Clay Matthews
Lawrence Taylor
Dick Butkus
Mick Singletary
Jack Lambert
Dave Wilcox
Ted Hendrix

 I would say maaaaaaaybe top ten of his era. But top ten all time? Not quite.

If you don't have three rings or more.....need not apply

Yeah, that argument doesn't hold up.  But hey, if you've got Bruschi over LT, more power to you.  Bruschi made one Pro Bowl in his career.  He was a heart and soul guy, a leader, and a champion, and he played his role well.  However, that's what he was:  a very important role player, rather than a dominant guy who could take over games on his own.

Bruschi didn't have to get all coked up and send hookers to his opponents to play well.

[Eja117]

"This guy was the best because for a long time this guy was a key cog on the defense of the best team of all time, and certainly of the free agent era".

Clearly, Sam Jones is the best SG of all-time, and the second best player.  Right?

No of course not. He gets in line behind Dwayne Wade.

[Eja117]

Its pretty obvious they don't like ocho, which doesn't surprise me at all with radio guys.  Teddy's little tirade is unwarranted, he honestly sounds bitter that he wasn't there playing.  giving your teammate sincere accolade for a job well done doesn't deserve that.  But Ocho can't do any thing right to Boston radio guys.  Teddy needs to get over himself, and sit down somewhere.

To be fair when you wear three Super Bowl rings, played in two other Super Bowls and are probably a top ten linebacker all time you can pretty much say anything you want to a loser like Ochocinco.

Ray Lewis
Patrick Willis
DeMarcus Ware
Brian Urlacher
James Harrison
Clay Matthews
Lawrence Taylor
Dick Butkus
Mick Singletary
Jack Lambert
Dave Wilcox
Ted Hendrix

 I would say maaaaaaaybe top ten of his era. But top ten all time? Not quite.

DeMarcus Ware is a top ten LB of all time? 

Probably not, and neither is Patrick Willis or Clay Matthews, yet.  But there are lots of great names left off that list who are ahead of Bruschi.  Junior Seau, for instance.  Ray Nitscke.  Jack Ham.  Derrick Brooks.  Charles Haley (high-bred).   Harry Carson.  Chuck Bedarick.  Willie Lanier.  Bobby Bell.  Nick Buoniconti.

Lots and lots of great names that rank ahead of Bruschi.  I doubt he'd make the top ten middle linebackers of all-time.  That's not a slight on Bruschi; there have just been a lot of great linebackers.

It's interesting that you say he's not a top 10 linebacker or top middle linebacker, because he played both at a high level. And he played defensive end. Did Lawrence Taylor do that? Taylor has two rings. Granted that's three Super Bowl appearances short of Bruschi, but still.

People say my arguments don't hold up.  But this is the thing. How does theirs? I say "This guy was the best because for a long time this guy was a key cog on the defense of the best team of all time, and certainly of the free agent era".  The response is basically "Oh yeah. Well That guy is better just cause he's better!  Ray Lewis is so intense. He picks up grass! And Urlacher was on the front of a video game!"   

My argument is "This guy is good because he won"

The other argument is "This guy is good because he is good".   That's the argument between Montana and Marino. It's such an easy conclusion.

Big difference between a 15th man and a Pro Bowler like Trent Dilfer. And I guarantee Dan Marino would be crying if he saw that pic or if he looked in Robert Horry's jewelry box.