2011 CB draft: How does my team look?/division rankings

[TheTruthFot18]

PG: Cp3, Jennings
SG: JRich, Roy /Webster
SF: Magette, Dunlevey /Webster
PF: Bass, Beasley (6th man)
C: Mcgee, Birdman

Decided to push Beasley to 6th man for more scoring off the bench (and so he doesn't get winded by the end of the game). Also I know some people like the Webster pick but I just happened to need a bench 2/3 option more then anything else.

Anyone willing to part with a bench 4/5 PM with offers. I still have 10.8, 11.17, 13.17.

I kind of miss being the team everyone hates now that I got a few compliments. O well, nicknames never really die  

If you had one above average defender aside from CP3 in that group, it would be scary.

Aghh now you have me twitching. The trades don't seem to be flowing as much as they were earlier so that could be a problem. Thanks for the input though TP!

[action781]

PG: Cp3, Jennings
SG: JRich, Roy /Webster
SF: Magette, Dunlevey /Webster
PF: Bass, Beasley (6th man)
C: Mcgee, Birdman

Decided to push Beasley to 6th man for more scoring off the bench (and so he doesn't get winded by the end of the game). Also I know some people like the Webster pick but I just happened to need a bench 2/3 option more then anything else.

Anyone willing to part with a bench 4/5 PM with offers. I still have 10.8, 11.17, 13.17.

I kind of miss being the team everyone hates now that I got a few compliments. O well, nicknames never really die  

If you had one above average defender aside from CP3 in that group, it would be scary.

Do you plan on playing an uptempo game?  I feel like you have a roster with several players that would thrive in that kind of game.  I think CP3 could as well (he can pretty much do anything), but is probably more valuable in a half court game.

Especially with the lack of solid half court defense, you might want to employ a kind of gamble and get out and run defensive strategy.  Mcgee and birdman swatting a few shots could ignite a few breaks too

[The Walker Wiggle]

But I really wonder how good he can be in an immediate capacity. He's not a lights out athlete, and he's not a 'star' at age 20, so I think we can safely put ideas of an all-star appearance to rest in 2012, but that doesn't mean he can't be a serviceable point guard.

I just wonder if he'll be a serviceable starting point guard.

Well, the nineteen year old Rubio outscored the nineteen year old Brandon Jennings, more than doubled Jennings' assists rate and collected more steals and rebounds, while playing in the superior Spanish league. So if Rubio sees the same increase in usage that Jennings saw coming into the NBA he'll have a better rookie campaign. And we both remember how you felt about Jennings rookie season...

But here are Kevin Pelton's projections using Ridnour's 30 mpg:

8.9 points per game
4.6 rebounds per game
7.3 assists per game
1.8 steals per game

For a rookie point guard who will turn 21 just before the season, those would be excellent numbers. Rubio is unlikely to be effective as a scorer - Ridnour averaged 11.8 points in the same minutes - but this projection would put him just outside the league's top 10 in assists per game and comfortably in the top 10 in steals...

... While just 11 point guards handed out an assist on at least 10 percent of their teams' plays in 2010-11. Eight of the 11 have been All-Stars at some point, and the others are career starters...

...And if he indeed grabs 8.4 percent of all available rebounds, as his translation indicates, he would lead all point guards. The Oklahoma City Thunder's Russell Westbrook was tops in rebounding from the point guard spot in 2010-11, grabbing 7.7 percent of available rebounds.

Also the White Chocolate comparison is just lazy. Coming in to the league Williams was three inches shorter, a better shooter and finisher if more indiscriminate, and not nearly as good a defender or rebounder.

Rubio's model for success is the defensive point guard who generates possessions by collecting rebounds and steals at a high rate and creates opportunities for teammates through upper-echelon ball-handling and passing. Think rookie Jason Kidd, Rajon Rondo or Nate McMillan. Which isn't to say he can't or won't fail, but he's not going to fail the same way that Jascevicious or Rodriguez did.

P.S. And I just saw the Bogut/Stat question. Hell hath no fury like a Wiggle Waggled, eh?

Hahaha - that was good - up to this point I've just only gotten leading questions in lieu of any team assessment at all.

Any concerns about starting a kid with absolutely zero minutes at the NBA level at the PG position?

[StartOrien]

I like trades, guys!

[TheTruthFot18]

I like trades, guys!

WHo's on the block?

[StartOrien]

I like trades, guys!

WHo's on the block?

Everybody! Even Tony Parker!

[Roy H.]

Well, the nineteen year old Rubio outscored the nineteen year old Brandon Jennings, more than doubled Jennings' assists rate and collected more steals and rebounds, while playing in the superior Spanish league. So if Rubio sees the same increase in usage that Jennings saw coming into the NBA he'll have a better rookie campaign.

Wait, did you just call out another poster for a "lazy" argument, when you just posted the above?

Is it that easy to extrapolate stats?  "Player A put up better stats than Player B at the same age in [insert lower league], so clearly he's going to be a better NBA prospect?"  That's kind of like arguing "Michael Beasley scored more points in the Big 12 than Kevin Durant did, so we can expect him to have a better rookie year, as well".  Oops.  Under the "he outproduced Player X at Level Y" argument, however, the Celtics made a *major* mistake in trading Marshon Brooks this year, though.  That kid (under this theory) should have been taken in the top-five.  Clearly, it doesn't work that way, and I see nothing that distinguishes Europe from the NCAA in that regard.

Also, it's all well and good to argue Rubio's stats at age 19 in the Spanish League.  However, how can you then neglect to mention his stats at age 20 in the same league?  

I expect better from you, Wiggle. You're one of the better arguers in the game; "Rubio will be successful because Jennings was" doesn't pass the smell test.

[celticpride07]

we should do some team rankings with rosters being close to done

[Who]

Atlantic

(1) Phily - dependent on how Hedo Turkoglu is utilized
(2) New Jersey
(3) Boston
(4) New York

Central

(1) Indiana
(2) Chicago
(3) Detroit
(4) Milwaukee

Southwest

(1) Washington
(2) Orlando
(3) Atlanta
(4) Miami

I see six clear cut playoff teams. Final two spots yet to be won.

[TheTruthFot18]

we should do some team rankings with rosters being close to done

I like!

[Who]

Southwest

(1) San Antonio
(2) Cleveland
(3) Dallas
(4) Memphis

Northwest

(1) Portland
(2) Oklahoma
(3) Denver
(4) Utah

Pacific

(1) Sacramento
(2) Phoenix
(3) Golden State
(4) Los Angeles

I am thinking those are the top seven teams. Unsure on the final playoff seed.

[TheTruthFot18]

Southwest

1.   San Antonio
2.   Memphis
3.   Dallas
4.   Cleveland

Northwest

1.   Oklahoma City
2.   Portland
3.   Utah
4.   Denver

Pacific

1.   Sacramento
2.   Phoenix
3.   Golden State
4.   LA

OKC, SAC may be lethal. And who ever has the 3,4,5 of the real Grizzlies (Dallas??), I REALLY like. But then again I did jump on the Grizz bandwagon. But hey I liked them last year once AI was booted.

[The Walker Wiggle]

Wait, did you just call out another poster for a "lazy" argument, when you just posted the above? ....

Also, it's all well and good to argue Rubio's stats at age 19 in the Spanish League.  However, how can you then neglect to mention his stats at age 20 in the same league?  

I expect better from you, Wiggle. You're one of the better arguers in the game; "Rubio will be successful because Jennings was" doesn't pass the smell test.

Hey first off, all apologies to IP. I'd never characterize the man himself as lazy, in fact he did yeoman's work last year, as the most generous GM involved, both with his time and considered opinions and he's found a way to do even more work this year. I was just bagging on the Jason Williams comparison - but doing a bad job of it I guess.

As for Rubio's play last year I did mention it in my first reply.

And it just turns out that Jennings stats translated fairly well according to the in-fashion models (only he managed to maintain his Euroleague scoring efficiency at a far higher usage rate, no mean feet). Obviously I have to lean pretty hard on these to ground any Rubio talk. Scoring and scoring efficiency are difficult to predict across leagues, while rebounding and assist stats tend to by fairly predictive of NBA production. Rubio has had a lot of success passing, rebounding - and stealing - the basketball so there's some cause for optimism. But, sure, that's all it is cause for optimism.

I've said it before, we're all of us bright guys, deeply involved in the NBA and basketball, most of us have already made up our minds. I expected Rubio to skew divisive to unpopular, and I don't expect anyone to change their minds on THE Walker Wiggle's say so. (Although he does have a pretty good track record... Hmm...) In the end, Rubio was a fun pick and I may have stepped in some B.S. I've done it before.

I guess I'd only add as my last defense, it was just a one line question to begin with, so I don't feel my response was too, too unconsidered?

[celticpride07]

i don't think the rosters are officially updated yet but bold teams are playoff teams to me.

western conference

Southwest

(1) spurs
(2) cavs
(3) mavs
(4) grizzles

Northwest

(1) OKC
(2) portland
(3) denver
(4) Utah

Pacific

(1) PHX
(2) Kings
(3) Golden State
(4) Los Angeles

eastern conference

atlantic
1. sixers
2. knicks
3. cetlics
4. nets

central
1. pacers
2. bulls
3. bucks
4. pistons

southeast
1. washington
2. magic
3. alanta
4. miami

i think the west is a lot stronger than the east and some of the teams in the east can still make playoffs.

[StartOrien]

Again, can't reccomend that nbaplaybook article I posted earlier on Ricky Rubio more. Really good work.