2011 CB Draft Interest Thread/Team Assignment+Lottery

[The Walker Wiggle]

Also the Spurs the year before played Horry at the 4 with Duncan at the 5 for more minutes than Duncan played with Nazr Mohammed.

Speaking of Mohammed, anybody else see that Presti shrewdly extended him for one year $2 million?

That's Ibaka, Perkins, Collison, Mohammed making a combined $14 million next season, less than Zach Randolph.

[indeedproceed]

Also the Spurs the year before played Horry at the 4 with Duncan at the 5 for more minutes than Duncan played with Nazr Mohammed.

Speaking of Mohammed, anybody else see that Presti shrewdly extended him for one year $2 million?

That's Ibaka, Perkins, Collison, Mohammed making a combined $14 million next season, less than Zach Randolph.

I was really surprised he (mohammed) took that deal.

Good deal from Presti.

[Fafnir]

Ah so the Heat don't count. Yeah they weren't a serious team anyways.

And Bynum still started 18 out of the 23 games through the playoffs.  So I can't take that point too seriously.

Bynum played 17 minutes a game in the playoffs the year they played Orlando and 24 minutes per game last year.

Odom played 32 and 29 MPG those respective years.

What's more imporant how much you play, who starts, or who finishes. Odom gets the check mark in two of those categories, Bynum gets it in one.

[Fafnir]

Also the Spurs the year before played Horry at the 4 with Duncan at the 5 for more minutes than Duncan played with Nazr Mohammed.

Speaking of Mohammed, anybody else see that Presti shrewdly extended him for one year $2 million?

That's Ibaka, Perkins, Collison, Mohammed making a combined $14 million next season, less than Zach Randolph.

I was really surprised he (mohammed) took that deal.

Good deal from Presti.

I don't think he'd have gotten offers for more than the minimum under the new CBA (whatever that is).

I do wonder if he got an upfront payment, something that look nice in the face of a looming lock out.

[mgent]

The last 5 NBA champions all had PFs that were 7 footers.  Size is the biggest factor in the NBA, hands down.  Let me know the last time a team won with a tweener SF like Ilyasova or Jamison.

Lamar Odom.

Plus the Heat won it all with undersized Haslem playing almost all of their PF minutes. The rest of their PF mintues were taken up by a combination of Antoine Walker and James Posey.

So one smaller guy and two 3/4 tweeners.

That's why I don't say size, I just say quality.

It's a combination of size and quality at both positions.  For instance if you have Shaq, that's enough size/quality to get away with a simple rebounder like Haslem or shooter like Toine/Posey at PF.

But I don't think it's a huge coincidence that Kevin Garnett, Pau Gasol, Rasheed Wallace, Tim Duncan, etc. gave their new teams instant championships.

Having a 7 footer at the PF position gives you an immediate advantage in defense, rebounding, and inside scoring against most teams.  We all know those are the 3 most important things for a champion.

[indeedproceed]

The last 5 NBA champions all had PFs that were 7 footers.  Size is the biggest factor in the NBA, hands down.  Let me know the last time a team won with a tweener SF like Ilyasova or Jamison.

Lamar Odom.

Plus the Heat won it all with undersized Haslem playing almost all of their PF minutes. The rest of their PF mintues were taken up by a combination of Antoine Walker and James Posey.

So one smaller guy and two 3/4 tweeners.

By last 5 I meant both Lakers teams, not 06.

Lamar Odom is a decent enough point, but let's be fair the Magic were using a SF at PF.  Also Odom is strong, a beast rebounder, and a good low post defender + scorer.  He can play SF because he has amazing handles and decent speed/jump shot, but he's more of a PF than your typical tweener (played zero SF this year).  And Bynum still started 18 out of the 23 games through the playoffs.  So I can't take that point too seriously.

In 09/10 (aka the data we had available walking into the draft), Ersan Ilyasova had a better rebounding rate (15.5) than KG, Amar'e, Millsap, Aldridge, David West, Nowitzki, etc... (Lamar Odom's was 17.3)

Ilyasova was also known at the time as a pesky defender, and a good (and improving) outside shooter.

Just saying.

[Who]

Presti shouldn't have re-signed Nazr Mohammed.

They needed a backup center with legit size for center + good quickness / mobility + someone who is a solid defender. Nazr has the size but, like Perk, he lacks quickness and mobility plus, unlike Perk, he is lousy defender.

Nazr's lack of athleticism + poor defense forces Oklahoma to play too small (S.Ibaka + N.Collison) too regularly when facing teams who can take advantage of Perk's flaws.

They needed a proper counter to Perk's weak points and Nazr isn't that. Someone with legitimate athleticism and defensive ability.

Their current big man rotation simply isn't versatile enough in matching up against opponents.

[mgent]

Ah so the Heat don't count. Yeah they weren't a serious team anyways.

And Bynum still started 18 out of the 23 games through the playoffs.  So I can't take that point too seriously.

Bynum played 17 minutes a game in the playoffs the year they played Orlando and 24 minutes per game last year.

Odom played 32 and 29 MPG those respective years.

What's more imporant how much you play, who starts, or who finishes. Odom gets the check mark in two of those categories, Bynum gets it in one.

I don't really get the Heat comment, are you making fun of me?

The fact that Bynum started more games was obviously not the main point of that paragraph.  I don't see how anything you said supports the other side of the debate.

[Fafnir]

Ah so the Heat don't count. Yeah they weren't a serious team anyways.

And Bynum still started 18 out of the 23 games through the playoffs.  So I can't take that point too seriously.

Bynum played 17 minutes a game in the playoffs the year they played Orlando and 24 minutes per game last year.

Odom played 32 and 29 MPG those respective years.

What's more imporant how much you play, who starts, or who finishes. Odom gets the check mark in two of those categories, Bynum gets it in one.

I don't really get the Heat comment, are you making fun of me?

No I want to make sure we only discuss serious points, for a serious argument.

The fact that Bynum started more games was obviously not the main point of that paragraph.  I don't see how anything you said supports the other side of the debate

Yeah but Lamar Odom isn't a 7 foot PF, so I didn't take it seriously. based on your serious arguments beforehand.

[The Walker Wiggle]

Presti shouldn't have re-signed Nazr Mohammed.

They needed a backup center with legit size for center + good quickness / mobility + someone who is a solid defender. Nazr has the size but, like Perk, he lacks quickness and mobility plus, unlike Perk, he is lousy defender.

Nazr's lack of athleticism + poor defense forces Oklahoma to play too small (S.Ibaka + N.Collison) too regularly when facing teams who can take advantage of Perk's flaws.

They needed a proper counter to Perk's weak points and Nazr isn't that. Someone with legitimate athleticism and defensive ability.

Their current big man rotation simply isn't versatile enough in matching up against opponents.

Hrm. On the one hand, I don't argue with your assessment of Mohammed. On the other, I'm not sure there are three better 4/5 rotations. There's L.A., possibly Chicago, but let's wait and see if Boozer can be a steadier contributor. Dallas? Only if the team resigns Chandler. Ditto Memphis and Marc Gasol. (And that rotation, like the Lakers', only goes three deep.)

The Thunders' is certainly the best dollar for dollar.

Could Cole Aldrich develop in to the big, mobile defender you're looking for? He's also on the payroll.

[RebusRankin]

Looking to draft Dwight Howard or Carmelo Anthony and then trade them to NY or LA for expiring contracts, picks and filler. 

[mgent]

Ah so the Heat don't count. Yeah they weren't a serious team anyways.

And Bynum still started 18 out of the 23 games through the playoffs.  So I can't take that point too seriously.

Bynum played 17 minutes a game in the playoffs the year they played Orlando and 24 minutes per game last year.

Odom played 32 and 29 MPG those respective years.

What's more imporant how much you play, who starts, or who finishes. Odom gets the check mark in two of those categories, Bynum gets it in one.

I don't really get the Heat comment, are you making fun of me?

No I want to make sure we only discuss serious points, for a serious argument.

The fact that Bynum started more games was obviously not the main point of that paragraph.  I don't see how anything you said supports the other side of the debate

Yeah but Lamar Odom isn't a 7 foot PF, so I didn't take it seriously. based on your serious arguments beforehand.

Yeah guy, that's enough.  This is the internet, why don't you save the instigation.

I guess Pau Gasol doesn't count as a 7 foot PF, who else would I be talking about?Obviously I missed something since we were talking about SF tweeners and Lamar Odom doesn't have any of the weaknesses attributed to a PF who is playing out of position.  

I don't see how you're countering the points that the past 5 NBA champions had 7 foot PFs or that size matters.  The Lakers have versatile players, that doesn't change the fact that they are widely considered one of the bigger/longer teams in the league.

[nickagneta]

The last 5 NBA champions all had PFs that were 7 footers.  Size is the biggest factor in the NBA, hands down.  Let me know the last time a team won with a tweener SF like Ilyasova or Jamison.

Lamar Odom.

Plus the Heat won it all with undersized Haslem playing almost all of their PF minutes. The rest of their PF mintues were taken up by a combination of Antoine Walker and James Posey.

So one smaller guy and two 3/4 tweeners.

By last 5 I meant both Lakers teams, not 06.

Lamar Odom is a decent enough point, but let's be fair the Magic were using a SF at PF.  Also Odom is strong, a beast rebounder, and a good low post defender + scorer.  He can play SF because he has amazing handles and decent speed/jump shot, but he's more of a PF than your typical tweener (played zero SF this year).  And Bynum still started 18 out of the 23 games through the playoffs.  So I can't take that point too seriously.

In 09/10 (aka the data we had available walking into the draft), Ersan Ilyasova had a better rebounding rate (15.5) than KG, Amar'e, Millsap, Aldridge, David West, Nowitzki, etc... (Lamar Odom's was 17.3)

Ilyasova was also known at the time as a pesky defender, and a good (and improving) outside shooter.

Just saying.

Yeah, but as was argued to the hilt, he was a role playing bench guy being thrown into a full time starter's role and you projected starter's results. Hindsight shows he didn't improve his numbers with more MPG and more games started as ever before.

You rode that Lebron horse as far as you could take it and in hindsight, did probably as good as Lebron could have in real life. You took him so far and couldn't close it out with him as the main guy. I commend you. I thought that team had major flaws but went to the Finals anyway.

As I think I argued last year, your team was probably not even as good as though Cleveland teams that Lebron had in real life and they didn't win anything either.

[Fafnir]

Yeah guy, that's enough.  This is the internet, why don't you save the instigation.

Perhaps you shouldn't talk about not taking other people's points seriously then? Or refer to me as "guy". If you want me to be serious with you, return the favor. Otherwise Kwit's going to have to pull out the JPEG I was waiting for since I started "serious" dropping.

Size does matter in the NBA, I never disputed that. But your fixation on the 7 foot PF is misguided, especially when there are several recent counter-examples where a Finals team's primary line up involved undersized PFs, tweeners, and guys who actually weren't 7 feet.

More important is quality of the talent of the team, you can get by with solid big men if you have talent elsewhere. But no one gets anywhere with bad big men.

[StartOrien]

What was IP's regular rotation?

Jennings
-
Lebron
Ilyasova
Noah