Secret Rondo Trade Conspiracy Thread...

[PosImpos]

Rondo's going to need good players around him to build a contender, but so is Chris Paul.  We've seen recently that superstars don't win titles by themselves anymore in this league.

No single player can win without support, not LeBron or even Bill Russel but take a look at what Chicago is doing with Rose and not a whole lot else (no one I would call elite).

I think Chris Paul is better than Rose or at worst equal.  So if you put Chris Paul on the Celtics, his supporting cast would be plenty.

I happen to think a team with a healthy Rondo and a supporting cast of Deng, Boozer, Noah, et al. with coach Thibs would do absolutely as well as this year's Bulls. 

That team would be a 5-8 seed at best.

  not much worse offensively.

I would seriously, seriously disagree with this.

The Bulls are not a great offensive team, and they lean HEAVILY on their PG position to generate points.  They also lack outside shooting in their starting lineup.  Rondo would exacerbate that problem very heavily.

The Bulls as constructed right now with Rondo instead of Rose in the starting lineup would be a very poor offensive team, even if they were very good defensively.  Rondo is certainly a better passer than Rose, but he wouldn't be able to take advantage of that on the Bulls as much as he does here.

[Evantime34]

Rondo's going to need good players around him to build a contender, but so is Chris Paul.  We've seen recently that superstars don't win titles by themselves anymore in this league.

No single player can win without support, not LeBron or even Bill Russel but take a look at what Chicago is doing with Rose and not a whole lot else (no one I would call elite).

I think Chris Paul is better than Rose or at worst equal.  So if you put Chris Paul on the Celtics, his supporting cast would be plenty.

I happen to think a team with a healthy Rondo and a supporting cast of Deng, Boozer, Noah, et al. with coach Thibs would do absolutely as well as this year's Bulls. 

That team would be a 5-8 seed at best.

  not much worse offensively.

I would seriously, seriously disagree with this.

The Bulls are not a great offensive team, and they lean HEAVILY on their PG position to generate points.  They also lack outside shooting in their starting lineup.  Rondo would exacerbate that problem very heavily.

The Bulls as constructed right now with Rondo instead of Rose in the starting lineup would be a very poor offensive team, even if they were very good defensively.  Rondo is certainly a better passer than Rose, but he wouldn't be able to take advantage of that on the Bulls as much as he does here.

Completely agree. However, just for the sake of discussion I think the Bulls win more games with (a healthy) Chris Paul than Rose. Paul doesn't score as much as Rose but he gets everyone invovled better. You would see Boozer's numbers go up a lot. Plus Rose is not good defensively and Paul is one of the best at the pg spots.

[BballTim]

Rondo's going to need good players around him to build a contender, but so is Chris Paul.  We've seen recently that superstars don't win titles by themselves anymore in this league.

No single player can win without support, not LeBron or even Bill Russel but take a look at what Chicago is doing with Rose and not a whole lot else (no one I would call elite).

I think Chris Paul is better than Rose or at worst equal.  So if you put Chris Paul on the Celtics, his supporting cast would be plenty.

I happen to think a team with a healthy Rondo and a supporting cast of Deng, Boozer, Noah, et al. with coach Thibs would do absolutely as well as this year's Bulls. 

That team would be a 5-8 seed at best.

  not much worse offensively.

I would seriously, seriously disagree with this.

The Bulls are not a great offensive team, and they lean HEAVILY on their PG position to generate points.  They also lack outside shooting in their starting lineup.  Rondo would exacerbate that problem very heavily.

The Bulls as constructed right now with Rondo instead of Rose in the starting lineup would be a very poor offensive team, even if they were very good defensively.  Rondo is certainly a better passer than Rose, but he wouldn't be able to take advantage of that on the Bulls as much as he does here.

  Boozer and Deng are pretty decent offensive players. Noah would love getting alley-oops from Rondo. Bogans, Watson and Brewer are all decent three point shooters. I don't see this as a disaster.

[RJ87]

Why do people think CP3 is so available? Any deal for him is contingent upon him signing an extension - and I don't see him agreeing to another rebuilding project. And the whole "we can sign D12 in the offseason to convince Chris." Bull. The Magic will be dumb not to trade him since its apparent he's got one foot out the door. D12 will be in NJ or LA by this time next year.

[celts55]

I'm sorry but I can't believe that there is anyone who watches the NBA who would not trade Rondo for Chris Paul. Paul is one of the top 10 players in the league.
While I think Rondo is one of the better point guards in the league, he's far from the best.
Maybe it was injuries, but he appears to play hard maybe 2 out of 3 games. The other game he seems disinterested.
He's been in the league 4 years, do you really think he's he's going to get much better at foul or jump shooting? Allowing other teams to double team whom ever is hot.
While I don't disagree he's a good defender, again there are too many games when he gives half hearted effort and I have yet to see him really shut down top scoring point guards.
Lastlt, as much as i hate to agree with Mike D'antoni, when you have shooters like Ray, Pierce, KG, etc, it's not that hard to rack up the assists. Especially now when players get assists if the pass the ball, the guy tahts a dribble, than hits a jumper.

I know it sound like I'm knocking the guy, but I'm just trying to give a fair assesment from the way I see it. He's a nice player, better than a lot, but not one of the best.

The problem is the salary. Not only will Chris Paul look to make nearly twice as much as Rondo in his 2012 contract, you have to double the difference due to luxury tax. While Chris Paul is great, he is not that great. If the C's can afford only one max contract player in 2012, I would rather have any other position than point guard.

I would not argue that point with you as to be honest, I don't really understand the cap implications. I was s[eaking to those on the thread who were saying that they wouldn't trade Rondo for Paul as players. That Paul was on the decline whilt Rondo was getting better, etc.

[bobdelt]

They could have sent Rondo to Utah for Deron Williams. Much better offer than what the Jazz actually got. Rondo wasnt traded for him, he's not going to be traded for anybody.

[greenpride32]

They could have sent Rondo to Utah for Deron Williams. Much better offer than what the Jazz actually got. Rondo wasnt traded for him, he's not going to be traded for anybody.

Who says Utah would rather have Rondo over Favors?  The reality is outside of Boston, Rondo isn't highly viewed.

[dasani]

there is no secret conspiracy. this is what "certain" fans want because they think this is an easy way to the ship with the aging big three. it actually would probably backfire pretty badly, with Rondo looking better with whatever team he is sent to (ala Tony, Perk, Posey)while CP3 will be a major disappoint due to overblown expectations. be careful what you wish for folks. you can't fix problems with band-aids folks, trust me Rondo is not the problem with this team.

[Brendan]

Why do people think CP3 is so available? Any deal for him is contingent upon him signing an extension - and I don't see him agreeing to another rebuilding project. And the whole "we can sign D12 in the offseason to convince Chris." Bull. The Magic will be dumb not to trade him since its apparent he's got one foot out the door. D12 will be in NJ or LA by this time next year.

People assume CP3 is available because the team is owned by the league and losing money, and he's probably leaving soon anyways. Rondo cuts salary and replaces much of what CP3 has, and cannot leave. CP3 would be equivalent of having Rondo on his good days, without the bad days.

They could have sent Rondo to Utah for Deron Williams. Much better offer than what the Jazz actually got. Rondo wasnt traded for him, he's not going to be traded for anybody.

Unlikely - Utah pulled that deal in secret, I don't think Ainge had a chance to do that, and if he did, I think he would have pulled the trigger.

[Brendan]

there is no secret conspiracy. this is what "certain" fans want because they think this is an easy way to the ship with the aging big three. it actually would probably backfire pretty badly, with Rondo looking better with whatever team he is sent to (ala Tony, Perk, Posey)while CP3 will be a major disappoint due to overblown expectations. be careful what you wish for folks. you can't fix problems with band-aids folks, trust me Rondo is not the problem with this team.

Perk hasn't looked great, Tony had plenty of bad play to start the season, has played great since Gay went down, and Posey got worse every year. Other than that I totally agree.

[popcontest]

If you move Rondo, you will all know hard what his true value is to this team. Similar to what happened with Posey, Perkins, Tony Allen.

Trading Rondo will be the end of the Boston Celtics.

Danny meant what he said. Rondo isn't going anywhere.

The Big Three on the other hand....

[bobdelt]

Unlikely - Utah pulled that deal in secret, I don't think Ainge had a chance to do that, and if he did, I think he would have pulled the trigger.

I don't think any trade is done in complete secrecy. They had to shop him around a little bit, to try to get the best package available. You think they called one team, and one team only, and took that offer? Not every trade needs to be like the Carmelo drama queen extravaganza, but I bet Utah called a few more teams about D Williams than just the nets.

Maybe the C's weren't called, but I assume GM's knew he was on the trading block long before the media found out.

[Moranis]

Rondo's going to need good players around him to build a contender, but so is Chris Paul.  We've seen recently that superstars don't win titles by themselves anymore in this league.

No single player can win without support, not LeBron or even Bill Russel but take a look at what Chicago is doing with Rose and not a whole lot else (no one I would call elite).

I think Chris Paul is better than Rose or at worst equal.  So if you put Chris Paul on the Celtics, his supporting cast would be plenty.

I happen to think a team with a healthy Rondo and a supporting cast of Deng, Boozer, Noah, et al. with coach Thibs would do absolutely as well as this year's Bulls. 

That team sounds like an 8th seed if you're lucky, most likely a lottery team.

considering they were the 8th seed the year before with a younger Rose, Noah missing 18 games, and no Boozer at all, I have hard time believing that adding Boozer and swapping Rose (of last year) for Rondo wouldn't yield a better result.

[bobdelt]

They could have sent Rondo to Utah for Deron Williams. Much better offer than what the Jazz actually got. Rondo wasnt traded for him, he's not going to be traded for anybody.

Who says Utah would rather have Rondo over Favors?  The reality is outside of Boston, Rondo isn't highly viewed.

Then why is a 2x all star?

[Who]

Rondo's going to need good players around him to build a contender, but so is Chris Paul.  We've seen recently that superstars don't win titles by themselves anymore in this league.

No single player can win without support, not LeBron or even Bill Russel but take a look at what Chicago is doing with Rose and not a whole lot else (no one I would call elite).

I think Chris Paul is better than Rose or at worst equal.  So if you put Chris Paul on the Celtics, his supporting cast would be plenty.

I happen to think a team with a healthy Rondo and a supporting cast of Deng, Boozer, Noah, et al. with coach Thibs would do absolutely as well as this year's Bulls. 

That team would be a 5-8 seed at best.

  not much worse offensively.

I would seriously, seriously disagree with this.

The Bulls are not a great offensive team, and they lean HEAVILY on their PG position to generate points.  They also lack outside shooting in their starting lineup.  Rondo would exacerbate that problem very heavily.

The Bulls as constructed right now with Rondo instead of Rose in the starting lineup would be a very poor offensive team, even if they were very good defensively.  Rondo is certainly a better passer than Rose, but he wouldn't be able to take advantage of that on the Bulls as much as he does here.

  Boozer and Deng are pretty decent offensive players. Noah would love getting alley-oops from Rondo. Bogans, Watson and Brewer are all decent three point shooters. I don't see this as a disaster.

Agreed -- Bulls supporting cast is very under-rated.