If Celtics lose this series the window is officially closed

[Arok325]

I think it's time to face facts.

I think it's time to stop overreacting.

There is still one year remaining on Ray's contract. JO and Shaq are both signed for next year, as are Rondo, KG, and Pierce. That makes 6 rotation players coming back to a top 3 team in the East.

Assuming the MLE is still available, that is another avenue to bring another quality player to the roster.

And if neither are kept, the rights to Green and Davis are chips that can be used to land additional roster help.

The Boston Celtic roster for 2011-12 still projects as that of a high playoff seed.

And I'm saying that there's a difference between being a playoff team, a perennial 3-6 seed, and a contender. Sure we could maintain the status quo for a few years. I'm sure many fans would enjoy that. The fact I'm referring to is that we are no longer a legitimate "top" team.

[Who]

I think a contedor may give us a nice, young piece for Ray.  He could help a lot of contendors out in a big way...especially Chicago

I agree with the idea of trading Ray, and I do think a lot of the contenders will have interest.

However, how many contenders that need a SG have a nice, young piece to give?  The Bulls don't have much other than Taj Gibson, Ronnie Brewer, and CJ Watson.  Would you trade Ray and perhaps BBD for those players?  I don't think I'd bother.

Omer Asik would be someone I have some interest in.

Young seven footer who looks like he'll be a solid starting center for the next 8-10 years. 

[Rondo2287]

I think a contedor may give us a nice, young piece for Ray.  He could help a lot of contendors out in a big way...especially Chicago

I agree with the idea of trading Ray, and I do think a lot of the contenders will have interest.

However, how many contenders that need a SG have a nice, young piece to give?  The Bulls don't have much other than Taj Gibson, Ronnie Brewer, and CJ Watson.  Would you trade Ray and perhaps BBD for those players?  I don't think I'd bother.

Omer Asik would be someone I have some interest in.

Young seven footer who looks like he'll be a solid starting center for the next 8-10 years. 

So with Baby being a FA, Asik and Gibson could be good for us

[Lucky17]

I think it's time to face facts.

I think it's time to stop overreacting.

There is still one year remaining on Ray's contract. JO and Shaq are both signed for next year, as are Rondo, KG, and Pierce. That makes 6 rotation players coming back to a top 3 team in the East.

Assuming the MLE is still available, that is another avenue to bring another quality player to the roster.

And if neither are kept, the rights to Green and Davis are chips that can be used to land additional roster help.

The Boston Celtic roster for 2011-12 still projects as that of a high playoff seed.

And I'm saying that there's a difference between being a playoff team, a perennial 3-6 seed, and a contender. Sure we could maintain the status quo for a few years. I'm sure many fans would enjoy that. The fact I'm referring to is that we are no longer a legitimate "top" team.

I consider a high playoff seed to be a team that can contend for a title.

[BballTim]

I think it's time to face facts.

I think it's time to stop overreacting.

There is still one year remaining on Ray's contract. JO and Shaq are both signed for next year, as are Rondo, KG, and Pierce. That makes 6 rotation players coming back to a top 3 team in the East.

Assuming the MLE is still available, that is another avenue to bring another quality player to the roster.

And if neither are kept, the rights to Green and Davis are chips that can be used to land additional roster help.

The Boston Celtic roster for 2011-12 still projects as that of a high playoff seed.

And I'm saying that there's a difference between being a playoff team, a perennial 3-6 seed, and a contender. Sure we could maintain the status quo for a few years. I'm sure many fans would enjoy that. The fact I'm referring to is that we are no longer a legitimate "top" team.

  Clearly the fact you're referring to is not an actual fact.

[hpantazo]

I think it's time to face facts.

I think it's time to stop overreacting.

There is still one year remaining on Ray's contract. JO and Shaq are both signed for next year, as are Rondo, KG, and Pierce. That makes 6 rotation players coming back to a top 3 team in the East.

Assuming the MLE is still available, that is another avenue to bring another quality player to the roster.

And if neither are kept, the rights to Green and Davis are chips that can be used to land additional roster help.

The Boston Celtic roster for 2011-12 still projects as that of a high playoff seed.

And I'm saying that there's a difference between being a playoff team, a perennial 3-6 seed, and a contender. Sure we could maintain the status quo for a few years. I'm sure many fans would enjoy that. The fact I'm referring to is that we are no longer a legitimate "top" team.

I consider a high playoff seed to be a team that can contend for a title.

me too, you don't have to be one of the top 2-3 teams in the league to contend for the title.

[Chris]

My only question is what happens with the window if they win the championship?

[angryguy77]

My only question is what happens with the window if they win the championship?

Go another year and then blow er up in the following offseason.

We get another championship and have a chance to get Howard a year later.

[Chris]

My only question is what happens with the window if they win the championship?

Go another year and then blow er up in the following offseason.

But why does the championship change that?  Its the same roster. 

I really don't think any decisions for the future of the team should be based on what happens this year, it should be based on what is best for the team next year and beyond. 

So, if the C's get swept out of this round, but Danny has an opportunity to add a piece or two to make them a contender again next year, then he should do it, just like even if they win a championship this year, and there is a great opportunity to reload on the fly, Danny should not pass that up. 

I just hate the idea of reactionary roster moves.  Those almost always cause more harm than good.

[KungPoweChicken]

I think it's time to face facts. If the Celtics lose this series the Big 3 Era has officially ended. We're going the way of the Spurs really quickly. Please don't tell me I'm checking out too early. I think this is more than a fair statement.

First of all, the Celtics right now are the worst team left in the postseason. I honestly think we would lose a 7 game series against every other team that is left. We are the oldest, slowest, least athletic and shortest team in the hunt. We have heart, but heart doesn't turn back father time. All of our core (besides Rondo and Green) are past their times. Pierce, Allen and Garnett are shells of their former selves. You can make the case about their statistical improvements but stats don't tell me what my eyes do. All three have tailed off significantly this season let alone in this series. Allen can't create shots for himself off of high picks. Garnett is not a dominant force in the paint and never really has been but I see his effectiveness being limited in the next couple years. Pierce probably has the most staying power but he's not an overpowering guy anymore.

I'm not sold on Rondo, like most of us these days. I think the criticisms against him are valid. He still has no jumpshot and it's foolish to think he will ever develop one anymore. I've always likened him to Jason Kidd. Superb in every sense of the word in every category except for finding his own shot. The difference is, Rondo is not nearly as consistent. He can't hit free throws and his assist totals are completely dependant on his supporting cast. It's embarrassing watching him play sometimes. The other team guards him like he's a 5th grader. It's like watching a JV player play against Varsity sometimes. Other times he dominates. His best play comes when he pushes the ball but his fast break instincts are terrible. I'm really down on him right now. I think we should pursue trading him in the offseason.

Green is another story. I think he's disappointed due to overinflated expectations. Guys overvalued Perkins so naturally we expect the most from Green. I'm still hopeful but at best he's a good third or fourth option on a good team. He's not a star player and never will be. He has a lot to learn if he's going to be an effective player for us in the future.

I can't even speak to Baby and the rest of the bench. I love West but he's really injury prone. Other than that the rest are all expendable. Actually neverming I'll go back to Baby. Probably my single least favorite player in the league. He brings all negatives in my opinion. He's short, unathletic, has an unwarranted ego and brings nothing but negatives to the game. He's a powerforward who is virtually overmatched against everyone else in the league. He's my least favorite player. Period.

Overall, I think the Heat are going to be a force for the next 10 years. Next year, a year older and no wiser, I think the Celtics will fall short again. This isn't going to be pretty. Unless we get a new young superstar I'm afraid we're going to have to have to ride this out. Sorry for the dose of reality celticsblog. Here's hoping we can rally and win it this year because the short-term future for this team is looking pretty bleak. But hey, we had a good run right?

I agree with everything you said, except two things: I don't believe the Celtics would lose a 7 games series to every team left in the playoffs. Also, I don't see the Heat being a dominant team for the next 10 years. Maybe you were exaggerating there, but Wade is already getting up there in age.

I don't want to see the Big Three shopped this offseason. What Danny needs to do is trade for Chris Paul. A lot easier said than done, I know. But this Celtic team needs a real star player, not Rondo. Basically, Ainge should try trading anything he has, outside the Big Three, to get it done: Rondo, Green, Clippers pick for Paul.

CP3 could be what lures Dwight Howard to Boston.

[angryguy77]

My only question is what happens with the window if they win the championship?

Go another year and then blow er up in the following offseason.

But why does the championship change that?  Its the same roster.  

I really don't think any decisions for the future of the team should be based on what happens this year, it should be based on what is best for the team next year and beyond.  

So, if the C's get swept out of this round, but Danny has an opportunity to add a piece or two to make them a contender again next year, then he should do it, just like even if they win a championship this year, and there is a great opportunity to reload on the fly, Danny should not pass that up.  

I just hate the idea of reactionary roster moves.  Those almost always cause more harm than good.

The way I see it is the Heat will get better along with NY and Chicago. Imo, I don't think we will be able to keep up unless our bench significantly improves. Our core will be one year older as well. I'd rather rebuild than be a second tier contender, who unless by an act of God won't seriously contend.

I'm not saying to blow it up if they win it all this year. We should do what we can to improve the team and take another shot. We would have nothing to lose to go at it again.

I guess I would take getting bounced this year as a sign that we are declining.

Now, lets hope that we look back and laugh at us thinking of such things during the playoffs when we are standing over (insert team here) rotting corpses in June.

[Arok325]

I don't think I'm being unreasonable at all. I think that rebuilding is the only way we can reload and that the only way to be proactive here is to be a bit reactionary. Let's be realistic here. 

When I say rebuild I don't necessarily mean trade "everyone." I simply think that we should explore all possible trade avenues and if we're given the chance to get a young player we shouldn't hesitate.

I think that Danny Ainge also thinks this way and it is why he traded Perkins in the first place and why he championed trading Larry Bird so many years ago. There's nothing beyond poetry about going down with the ship and I for one want off that boat. And yes, you do need to be a top team to compete for a championship.

[Chris]

My only question is what happens with the window if they win the championship?

Go another year and then blow er up in the following offseason.

But why does the championship change that?  Its the same roster.  

I really don't think any decisions for the future of the team should be based on what happens this year, it should be based on what is best for the team next year and beyond.  

So, if the C's get swept out of this round, but Danny has an opportunity to add a piece or two to make them a contender again next year, then he should do it, just like even if they win a championship this year, and there is a great opportunity to reload on the fly, Danny should not pass that up.  

I just hate the idea of reactionary roster moves.  Those almost always cause more harm than good.

The way I see it is the Heat will get better along with NY and Chicago. Imo, I don't think we will be able to keep up unless our bench significantly improves. Our core will be one year older as well. I'd rather rebuild than be a second tier contender, who unless by an act of God won't seriously contend.

I'm not saying to blow it up if they win it all this year. We should do what we can to improve the team and take another shot. We would have nothing to lose to go at it again.

I guess I would take getting bounced this year as a sign that we are declining.

Now, lets hope that we look back and laugh at us thinking of such things during the playoffs when we are standing over (insert team here) rotting corpses in June.

But this is my point.  This is an emotional fan's point of view.  We need our GM to not think like that.  If they need this series to know whether or not this team is good enough to try to win again next year, then they aren't doing their job.

Danny should already know exactly where this team stands, and winning a couple extra rounds in the playoffs should not change that opinion when we are talking about something as dramatic as blowing up one of the top 4 or 5 teams in the league.

[BballTim]

I think it's time to face facts. If the Celtics lose this series the Big 3 Era has officially ended. We're going the way of the Spurs really quickly. Please don't tell me I'm checking out too early. I think this is more than a fair statement.

First of all, the Celtics right now are the worst team left in the postseason. I honestly think we would lose a 7 game series against every other team that is left. We are the oldest, slowest, least athletic and shortest team in the hunt. We have heart, but heart doesn't turn back father time. All of our core (besides Rondo and Green) are past their times. Pierce, Allen and Garnett are shells of their former selves. You can make the case about their statistical improvements but stats don't tell me what my eyes do. All three have tailed off significantly this season let alone in this series. Allen can't create shots for himself off of high picks. Garnett is not a dominant force in the paint and never really has been but I see his effectiveness being limited in the next couple years. Pierce probably has the most staying power but he's not an overpowering guy anymore.

I'm not sold on Rondo, like most of us these days. I think the criticisms against him are valid. He still has no jumpshot and it's foolish to think he will ever develop one anymore. I've always likened him to Jason Kidd. Superb in every sense of the word in every category except for finding his own shot. The difference is, Rondo is not nearly as consistent. He can't hit free throws and his assist totals are completely dependant on his supporting cast. It's embarrassing watching him play sometimes. The other team guards him like he's a 5th grader. It's like watching a JV player play against Varsity sometimes. Other times he dominates. His best play comes when he pushes the ball but his fast break instincts are terrible. I'm really down on him right now. I think we should pursue trading him in the offseason.

Green is another story. I think he's disappointed due to overinflated expectations. Guys overvalued Perkins so naturally we expect the most from Green. I'm still hopeful but at best he's a good third or fourth option on a good team. He's not a star player and never will be. He has a lot to learn if he's going to be an effective player for us in the future.

I can't even speak to Baby and the rest of the bench. I love West but he's really injury prone. Other than that the rest are all expendable. Actually neverming I'll go back to Baby. Probably my single least favorite player in the league. He brings all negatives in my opinion. He's short, unathletic, has an unwarranted ego and brings nothing but negatives to the game. He's a powerforward who is virtually overmatched against everyone else in the league. He's my least favorite player. Period.

Overall, I think the Heat are going to be a force for the next 10 years. Next year, a year older and no wiser, I think the Celtics will fall short again. This isn't going to be pretty. Unless we get a new young superstar I'm afraid we're going to have to have to ride this out. Sorry for the dose of reality celticsblog. Here's hoping we can rally and win it this year because the short-term future for this team is looking pretty bleak. But hey, we had a good run right?

I agree with everything you said, except two things: I don't believe the Celtics would lose a 7 games series to every team left in the playoffs. Also, I don't see the Heat being a dominant team for the next 10 years. Maybe you were exaggerating there, but Wade is already getting up there in age.

I don't want to see the Big Three shopped this offseason. What Danny needs to do is trade for Chris Paul. A lot easier said than done, I know. But this Celtic team needs a real star player, not Rondo. Basically, Ainge should try trading anything he has, outside the Big Three, to get it done: Rondo, Green, Clippers pick for Paul.

CP3 could be what lures Dwight Howard to Boston.

  Assuming you want Chris Paul, why would you refrain from trading any of the big three to get him?

[cman88]

the celtics need to get younger, more athletic...despite the "hate" on this forum, Rondo IS the guy to build around...who doesnt want to play with an unselfish player who can average 12assists a night? he makes every players job easier and that should be an asset for any player on the FA market looking for where to go. plus, bostons relevance the past few years "should" keep us in the market for good players

rondos jump shot is only going to get better....what Ainge wants to avoid is what happened in the late 80s where we kept older players on the decline for nostalgia reasons which ended up with the celtics being non-relevant for years

if the Magic are looking to trade dwight howard this summer, I say the celtics should go for it...