Where does Rondo rank among PGs?

[wdleehi]

I see him 4th after Paul, Williams and Rose.


He is in the same group as Westbrook, Nash, Billups and Parker.  I just see him at the head of that class.



Wall has a good chance of joining that class (0r the top class) in the future. 

[vinnie]

I put Westbrook ahead of Rondo, which is why I chose 5th/6th. Rondo, however, is a different player than all of these guys.

[BballTim]

I have a hard time ranking Rondo against those guys because it seems like comparing apples to oranges to me.

  I'd agree with this. Not only does Rondo have a different skill set than most of the other point guards listed but he plays in a different system where he's asked to do different things than those guys.

[Marcus13]

CP3
D-Will
Rose
Westbrook
Rondo

[Roy H.]

Guys I would put above him:

Deron
CP3
Rose

Guys I would put on his level:

Nash (better offense, worse defense)
Westbrook
Wall

Wall and Westbrook are not on Rondo's level, they could be, and maybe they could be better, but right now Rondo is a better PG.

Rose is very good, a great player, but he's not a better PG. Rose is a better scorer, stronger player, but he doesn't defend or create for others like Rondo. And I know I'm biased, because I love Rondo's game and dislike the way Rose plays, but they're on a similar level.

From my perspective, there's no cookie-cutter definition for "point guard".  Sure, Rondo is a better passer than a lot of other guys.  However, he also doesn't score like some other guys do.  In determining offensive impact, you have to look at both of those things, as well as efficiency, range, etc.   There's more to being a point guard on the offensive end than just making great passes.

As for defense, I think Rondo's has slacked off a bit this year (although it's still very good), while Rose and Westbrook are being underrated on that end.  Rondo is still the best defender of the three, but the gap isn't a huge one.

[OsirusCeltics]

Second after Chris Paul

If Rondo was more consistent and had a more polished offensive game, he would be the best

I still fear Chris Paul in the 4th quarter or any playoff situation lol

[Vermont Green]

I am interpreting the question to mean right now, no consideration for potential.  In that context, I have Rondo below:

Paul
Williams
Rose
Nash
Parker
Billups
Westbrook

It is interesting to me that Rondo's rank on this board is below what I think it would have been a few months ago.  In my case, as soon as Rondo learns to shoot and makes team pay for the lay off him defense, he catapults up the list, maybe even as high as 3.  I don't see him passing Williams or Paul anytime soon though.

[IrishGreen]

With headband... 1
Without headband... 10

I actually agree with this. TP

[greenpride32]

Rondo is in the 2nd tier behind CP3, Rose, and D-Will.

I disagree with all the "it depends on what you're looking for since Rondo has different skill sets" arguements.  Guys like Nash, CP3, Deron, are all great passers (if you disagree you probaby haven't watched many of their games). They just shoot more than Rondo since they are more capble at creating their own offense. 

Also on D, Rondo mainly gets his steals from gambling; he's not exacty a lock down in your face type defender.  CP3 gets just as many steals.  You can't really say Rondo gets a lot more assists and steals than any other PG (my point being he doesn't have unique attributes over any other PG's such that he should be "viewed" differently); but you can say other PG's are more effective at scoring and shooting.

[housecall]

I have two ranking for pgs,the season they're in and their overall career.Winning championships counts more in career assessment whereas team standings count more in season assessment in my opinion.

season:
1A.D.Rose 1B.Rondo
2.T.Parker  

over his career:
1.D.Will
2.CP3
3.T.Parker
4A.D.Rose 4B.Rondo  

[BballTim]

Guys I would put above him:

Deron
CP3
Rose

Guys I would put on his level:

Nash (better offense, worse defense)
Westbrook
Wall

Wall and Westbrook are not on Rondo's level, they could be, and maybe they could be better, but right now Rondo is a better PG.

Rose is very good, a great player, but he's not a better PG. Rose is a better scorer, stronger player, but he doesn't defend or create for others like Rondo. And I know I'm biased, because I love Rondo's game and dislike the way Rose plays, but they're on a similar level.

From my perspective, there's no cookie-cutter definition for "point guard".  Sure, Rondo is a better passer than a lot of other guys.  However, he also doesn't score like some other guys do.  In determining offensive impact, you have to look at both of those things, as well as efficiency, range, etc.   There's more to being a point guard on the offensive end than just making great passes.

As for defense, I think Rondo's has slacked off a bit this year (although it's still very good), while Rose and Westbrook are being underrated on that end.  Rondo is still the best defender of the three, but the gap isn't a huge one.

  His opponent's numbers are better almost across the board from last year when he was seen as one of the best defenders in the league.

[drza44]

For what it's worth, I took a shot at this question about a month ago using the various advanced stats that are out there (PER, win shares, adjusted +/-, wins produced, and Roland Rating from 82games.com) ( http://www.celticsblog.com/2011/1/31/1966276/rondo-vs-the-elite-pgs-by-the-numbers ):

The numbers I looked at argued for Paul and Nash in first and second, with a cluster of about 5 others (Rose, Williams, Rondo, Westbrook and Parker) with an argument behind the top-2.

Of course, since then both Paul and Nash have struggled with injury so I don't know how health should factor into the decision, but health aside I think those rankings are pretty reasonable.

That'd have me with Rondo as borderline top-5, with his competition being the usual suspects mentioned thus far in the thread.

[BballTim]

Rondo is in the 2nd tier behind CP3, Rose, and D-Will.

I disagree with all the "it depends on what you're looking for since Rondo has different skill sets" arguements.  Guys like Nash, CP3, Deron, are all great passers (if you disagree you probaby haven't watched many of their games). They just shoot more than Rondo since they are more capble at creating their own offense. 

Also on D, Rondo mainly gets his steals from gambling; he's not exacty a lock down in your face type defender.  CP3 gets just as many steals.  You can't really say Rondo gets a lot more assists and steals than any other PG (my point being he doesn't have unique attributes over any other PG's such that he should be "viewed" differently); but you can say other PG's are more effective at scoring and shooting.

  I checked 82games a week or so ago and he was first or close to first among all starting point guards for allowing the lowest opposing efg%, fewest rebound, fewest assists and forces about the most turnovers. Sounds like his defense goes a little beyond "gambling for steals". I also disagree with your claim that plenty of other point guards pass the ball as well as Rondo.

[feckless]

For me all around player is different than PG.  Those with the best understanding of the game in order:  Nash, Kidd, Rondo/Paul.    --Williams,  Rose, and Westbrook may all be better players but lesser heads.  Nash and Kidd are old so for me to run a team I choose Rondo or Paul.  I would note that my memory is that Rajon usually comes out on top when playing Paul head to head.

[BballTim]

Guys I would put above him:

Deron
CP3
Rose

Guys I would put on his level:

Nash (better offense, worse defense)
Westbrook
Wall

Wall and Westbrook are not on Rondo's level, they could be, and maybe they could be better, but right now Rondo is a better PG.

Rose is very good, a great player, but he's not a better PG. Rose is a better scorer, stronger player, but he doesn't defend or create for others like Rondo. And I know I'm biased, because I love Rondo's game and dislike the way Rose plays, but they're on a similar level.

From my perspective, there's no cookie-cutter definition for "point guard".  Sure, Rondo is a better passer than a lot of other guys.  However, he also doesn't score like some other guys do.  In determining offensive impact, you have to look at both of those things, as well as efficiency, range, etc.   There's more to being a point guard on the offensive end than just making great passes.

As for defense, I think Rondo's has slacked off a bit this year (although it's still very good), while Rose and Westbrook are being underrated on that end.  Rondo is still the best defender of the three, but the gap isn't a huge one.

  I checked their production vs opponents production on 82games counting net possessions as the added differences of shots + .44*FTA + turnovers + rebounds. If you use more possessions than your opponent you lose possessions, using less means gaining possessions.

  Paul gains you 3 points and and .5 posessions and 4 assists

  Williams gains 6 points and 4 assists and loses 5 possessions

  Rose gains 14 points and 2 assists and loses 12 possessions

  Westbrook gains 10 points and 2 assists and loses 9 possessions

  Rondo loses 5 points and gains 7 possessions and adds 8 assists

  This isn't the only way to judge point guards, but it's meant to demonstrate than Rondo's other contributions raise his impact to their level. It really does depend on what you're looking for and how much you value scoring over passing and defending.