Danny traded the wrong member of the Starting 5

[Jon]

I'll just leave it at "no."

[Mizzy21390]

I stopped reading when I saw Rondo. smh.

Haha. Me too. Once I saw Rondo's name as the person who should have been traded, I couldn't finish. Sorry to the OP, but Rondo is far more valuable for the C's right now and in the future than Perk is.

[BballTim]

"You've gotta love the beauty of someone who claims that Rondo does an atrocious job of keeping his man in front of him recommending that we sign Steve Nash. It's like posting on a Suns board that Nash isn't a great outside shot so they should replace him with Rondo."

I guess my point is I don’t view Rondo as a great defensive player.  I recognize Steve Nash is a MUCH worse defender.  However, Steve Nash is a MUCH better offensive player/shooter, with the ability to dish the ball as effectively as Rondo.  So if you are going to sacrifice defense for offense, I would have preferred to do so at the PG position, rather than at the C position.

  I guess you don't view him as a great defensive player, but that doesn't make it the case. I don't know that the offense, which has been at or near the top of the league in eFG% with Rondo running things would really be that MUCH better with Nash.

[Roy H.]

I would have considered moving Rondo for Deron or CP3, but not with 25 games left.  Big changes at this stage have too much potential for failure.

As for trading Rondo for Nash, I get the reasoning, but it would kill our defense (which is our bread and butter).  Monta?  Just say no.

[Lord_of_the17Rings]

You're so right about Rondo, he's absolutely terrible, it's a shame we didn't get Williams. Why'd we have to trade Perk anyway? All we would've had to do is sprinkle some pixie dust on his knees, and he would've been good to go in a jiff. Plus, I hear Pierce has been drinking that water that MJ had in "Space Jam," so we totally didn't even need Jeff Green! We should be in the front office, not that joker Ainge.

Wow, talk about taking things to the extreme.  I'll have to go back to my original post, but I'm pretty sure I didn't say Rondo is "absolutely terrible".  Although I must admit i liked your reference to 'Space Jam'.  My next challenge to you is to find an appropriate reference from 'Air Bud'.   

I agree with you that Pierce and Ray need some rest, and the addition of Green should provide that.  I think that is what is so painful about the Daniels injury.  If that does not happen, Danny doesn't make this deal, and we are a more complete team.  But we don't live in the "what if" world, and Daniels did get hurt. 

Maybe it was a "[dang]ed if they did and [dang]ed if they didn't" kind of thing.  You don't get a back-up for Pierce and he and Ray have little gas left for the playoffs.  You get the small forward, and now you are relying on a 39 year old with an inflamed achilles to hold it down for the remainder of our Championship quest.

[KCattheStripe]

In the immortal words of Joss Whedon:

[GoGreen9]

Let me preface this by saying that I am a HUGE Perk fan, and I don't agree with this deal at all.  Long term, it may very well help us.  But this year, I don't see how it gives us a better chance to win #18.  And to me, that is all that matters right now.

What I would have felt better about, is if Danny had tried to make a move with Rondo.  (Note: I also think this trade was as much of an indictment on Rondo's offensive limitations as they were about Perk.)  Danny made several comments about needing more scoring options on the floor to close out games, and how it would open things up for Rondo.

I am not saying that is was possible to get Deron Williams, and NJ came up with a pretty attractive package, but I really hope that Danny at least looked into the possibility.  To me Williams would have been a big upgrade for this year and going forward.  I also would have been interested in other PG's like Nash or Ellis, both of whom would seem to have been available on some level.  Nash would obviously be a short term solution but would be an equally effective distributor with a much more potent offensive game.  And since I think Rondo is one of the most overrated defensive players (and players) in the league, I don't know how much you lose there either.  Yes, he gets steals (but so did Iverson).  He is atrocious at keeping his man in front of him, and opposing point guards consistently get into the paint.  People say Perk's success was largely a product of his environment.  I would argue (as Chris Paul did) that Rondo's numbers/success is also directly attributable to playing with Paul, Ray, and KG.  I’m not saying he isn’t a good player, but he benefits from the talent around him, just as much as Perk did.

I guess I didn't intend to turn this into a 'bash Rondo' thread, but I feel like Danny was looking at the wrong starter to trade if he wanted to upgrade our offense without sacrificing our defense.  Should we go up against LA or SA in the Finals (god willing), I think we are going to wish we had Perk back.

Alright, well first off, this doesn't really hurt our chances as much as you would like to think. As I have said in past threads, there is no team in the East that can really take advantage of the size we lost in the past days.

To touch on the Rondo comments, that is absolutely ludacris. First off, there isn't a better PG in the NBA that would fit in Boston better than Rondo does. Are you serious with your Nash/Ellis comments? Ellis isn't even a true PG, and the offense wouldn't run nearly as smooth as it does with Rondo. He's a score first player, and wouldn't get anyone their looks like Rondo does. Nash wouldn't either, and considering he is very old, it would be an awful move. If we got him, and let go of Rondo, our title chances would be destroyed for this year, and for many years to come.


Finally, since I am new here, I would like to say I think Rondo is the best PG in the NBA. I don't see how he's overrated defensively, or offensively. If you would like to state why you think this, I would love to rebuttle.

[GreenBlood23]

If you think Perk is a bigger lost than Rondo would have been if he was the one traded...

There's a flight to Oklahoma leaving soon!

dear god...people are acting like they traded bill russell

Been saying this   It's not the end of the world, certainly not the end for #18.

[soap07]

Finally, since I am new here, I would like to say I think Rondo is the best PG in the NBA. I don't see how he's overrated defensively, or offensively. If you would like to state why you think this, I would love to rebuttle.

Chris Paul/Deron are better, not by much, but better.

[dpaps]

I would trade Rondo for DWill. I have no problem that we didnt but I think deron is that good. I think the OP has some fair points. I also think Rondo could be a lot better at keeping his man infront of him. I def wouldn't trade him for monta, nor nash. But like roy said, dwill and cp3 are probably better.

[GoGreen9]

"You've gotta love the beauty of someone who claims that Rondo does an atrocious job of keeping his man in front of him recommending that we sign Steve Nash. It's like posting on a Suns board that Nash isn't a great outside shot so they should replace him with Rondo."

I guess my point is I don’t view Rondo as a great defensive player.  I recognize Steve Nash is a MUCH worse defender.  However, Steve Nash is a MUCH better offensive player/shooter, with the ability to dish the ball as effectively as Rondo.  So if you are going to sacrifice defense for offense, I would have preferred to do so at the PG position, rather than at the C position.

"Dear god...people are acting like they traded bill Russell."

I think this is a bit of an overstatement.  I recognize Perk is not Bill Russell, nor is a he even an All Star.  But I think he was a vital part of this team on the defensive side of the ball.  I do find it interesting that the prevailing theme among fans and NBA analysts following game 7, was that “if Perk had been playing”, we would have won the Championship.  But now that he is gone, he is “a skinnier version of Greg Kite”, as someone just mentioned in this thread.


"I have one question for the thread originator; if you didn't mean for this to be a "bash Rondo" thread, what exactly were your intentions?"

My intentions were to state that I would have liked Danny (and he may very well have) to explore a change at PG prior to this trade.  I think there are other PG’s in this league that can effectively run this team (as mentioned, D. Williams, Ellis, Nash and others).  I think from a defensive standpoint, which does win Championships, keeping Perk would have made more sense.

Once again, how in the world does Ellis/Nash or Williams fit in this offense better than Rondo?

[j804]

Yeah we should have shipped out the Captain

[GoGreen9]

I would trade Rondo for DWill. I have no problem that we didnt but I think deron is that good. I think the OP has some fair points. I also think Rondo could be a lot better at keeping his man infront of him. I def wouldn't trade him for monta, nor nash. But like roy said, dwill and cp3 are probably better.

D-Will is not even close to as good as of a defender Rondo is. He relies on his strength for, and isn't that quick. I think it's laughable, at best, to think D-Will would keep his man in front of him better than Rondo. I could entertain a CP3 argument for him being better than Rondo, but he isn't. If the main reason you think we should get rid of Rondo is because he can't keep his man in front of him, you couldn't be more wrong.

[Lord_of_the17Rings]

Let me preface this by saying that I am a HUGE Perk fan, and I don't agree with this deal at all.  Long term, it may very well help us.  But this year, I don't see how it gives us a better chance to win #18.  And to me, that is all that matters right now.

What I would have felt better about, is if Danny had tried to make a move with Rondo.  (Note: I also think this trade was as much of an indictment on Rondo's offensive limitations as they were about Perk.)  Danny made several comments about needing more scoring options on the floor to close out games, and how it would open things up for Rondo.

I am not saying that is was possible to get Deron Williams, and NJ came up with a pretty attractive package, but I really hope that Danny at least looked into the possibility.  To me Williams would have been a big upgrade for this year and going forward.  I also would have been interested in other PG's like Nash or Ellis, both of whom would seem to have been available on some level.  Nash would obviously be a short term solution but would be an equally effective distributor with a much more potent offensive game.  And since I think Rondo is one of the most overrated defensive players (and players) in the league, I don't know how much you lose there either.  Yes, he gets steals (but so did Iverson).  He is atrocious at keeping his man in front of him, and opposing point guards consistently get into the paint.  People say Perk's success was largely a product of his environment.  I would argue (as Chris Paul did) that Rondo's numbers/success is also directly attributable to playing with Paul, Ray, and KG.  I’m not saying he isn’t a good player, but he benefits from the talent around him, just as much as Perk did.

I guess I didn't intend to turn this into a 'bash Rondo' thread, but I feel like Danny was looking at the wrong starter to trade if he wanted to upgrade our offense without sacrificing our defense.  Should we go up against LA or SA in the Finals (god willing), I think we are going to wish we had Perk back.

Alright, well first off, this doesn't really hurt our chances as much as you would like to think. As I have said in past threads, there is no team in the East that can really take advantage of the size we lost in the past days.

To touch on the Rondo comments, that is absolutely ludacris. First off, there isn't a better PG in the NBA that would fit in Boston better than Rondo does. Are you serious with your Nash/Ellis comments? Ellis isn't even a true PG, and the offense wouldn't run nearly as smooth as it does with Rondo. He's a score first player, and wouldn't get anyone their looks like Rondo does. Nash wouldn't either, and considering he is very old, it would be an awful move. If we got him, and let go of Rondo, our title chances would be destroyed for this year, and for many years to come.


Finally, since I am new here, I would like to say I think Rondo is the best PG in the NBA. I don't see how he's overrated defensively, or offensively. If you would like to state why you think this, I would love to rebuttle.

First off GoGreen9, I agree with you that Rondo is a great for this offense.  He is truly one of the few pass first guards in the league which meshes very well with a team that has 3 legit scorers on the court with him.  He also happens to be one heck of a passer.  Catching Cousy's single season assist record was remarkable.

I disagree with your comment that Nash would not be able to distribute the ball to the big three as equally or more effectively.  Steve Nash, even at his current age is one of the best passer/decision makers in the game.  And the fact that he is a great shooter and is not afraid to shoot when open, would not be a detriment to the big 3. It would help them.

In terms of asking me to state why I think Rondo is an overrated player, my feeling is that while Rondo is a great fit, there are other point guards that could fit very well on this team.  As Bill Simmons mentioned the other day, I'm not sure if there has ever been a player that has “brought more to the table” and “taken more off of the table” than Rondo.  As already mentioned he is an exceptional passer and floor leader.  He is a great rebounder at the guard position.  And while I don't agree with most that he is a great defensive player, he is certainly better than a lot of other guards.  His also has flaws.  He struggles to take and hit wide open jump shots (not even taking them is more of the problem).  He shoots 50% from the free throw line.  And while I recognize his assist to turnover ration is very good, he still turns the ball over at inopportune times, whether it is continuing to insist on throwing lobs to KG (even though KG hasn't been comfortable receiving those in over a year), or holding the ball for 20 seconds out of the 24 second shot clock waiting for a specific play to develop. (These last two ‘flaws’ are obviously my personal subjective opinion on what I see).

Again, I agree with you that Rondo is a great fit for this team.  But I would assert this team could win a Championship with some other PG's out there.  I respect your opinion that he is the best PG in the league, but I absolutely would not put him in the same class as D Williams, CP3 or D. Rose.

[Edgar]

Again, I agree with you that Rondo is a great fit for this team.  But I would assert this team could win a Championship with some other PG's out there.  I respect your opinion that he is the best PG in the league, but I absolutely would not put him in the same class as D Williams, CP3 or D. Rose.

Wrong, he was a great fit for 2008 team
now hes an all star
a star on his own
and in the same class of D williams, CP3 or derrick Rose

p.s. witha  different skill set
now if you love points and points only I can undcerstand you
but perkie doesnt score a lot of points either