Who will win MVP? Lebron or Rose?

[chambers]

It's voted by the coaches and the media and I really think it's between these two unless durant has an out of body second half of the regular season (which is very possible when teams are playing sloppy/lethargic before the playoffs).

Rose has improved so much and is absolutely dominating but lebron has become the 'man' on the new super team and he is putting up better stats than derrek.
Lebron has wade on his team which people say detracts from his 'votability' but remember- the coaches and selected media make the decision so stats aren't necessarily gonna decide this.

Does Lebrons move to miami hurt his chances with the media or does it help him considering how well he/the heat have done after all the preseason doubt?
Rose is such a humble/likable character- he's almost become the anti-villain to lebron in the East.

What you guys think?

[nba is the worst]

Considering the history and which players ever won three straight (Russell, Chamberlain, Bird), I will be very surprised if LeBron gets voted in.

But with all the lbj hype, it could happen - especially since there's no definition for MVP given the voters by the league...

[soap07]

I think there's another thread floating around here somewhere on the MVP debate but either way:


Can, will and should be LeBron.

[nba is the worst]

I think there's another thread floating around here somewhere on the MVP debate but either way:


Can, will and should be LeBron.

Why?

You don't define "MVP" as "player with best stats", do you?

 

[Witch-King]

ESPN certainly thinks that LeBron may be the front-runner in the league MVP award race so far this season. That guy had a triple-double last night, though the Eastern Conference All-Stars trailed almost the entire all-star game.

Either way, you can't really knock Kobe and Blake Griffin for holding it down in front of the home crowd during all-star weekend. Kevin Durant was the second highest scorer in the All-Star game with 34 points, though he didn't do very well in his first try at the NBA 3-point contest on Saturday night.

[soap07]

I think there's another thread floating around here somewhere on the MVP debate but either way:


Can, will and should be LeBron.

Why?

You don't define "MVP" as "player with best stats", do you?

 

Best stats on one of the best teams and will likely be the second best team record-wise in the NBA by the end of the year. He's also the best player in the league.

[chambers]

could someone gimme the link to the Espn MVP rankings?
I can't find them for the life of me.
I is stoopid 

please confirm i am and link it up!

[nba is the worst]

could someone gimme the link to the Espn MVP rankings?
I can't find them for the life of me.
I is stoopid 

please confirm i am and link it up!

http://espn.go.com/nba/awards
(Doesn't make you stupid)!

[PosImpos]

It should be Lebron and I think at the end of the day it will be Lebron.

He's clearly still the best player in the league and you don't need to look any farther than the Cavs to see how important he is.

Forget Derrick Rose.  As I said in the All-Star Weekend thread, the league MVP should never be an after-thought in the All-Star game.

[nba is the worst]

It should be Lebron and I think at the end of the day it will be Lebron.

He's clearly still the best player in the league and you don't need to look any farther than the Cavs to see how important he is.

Forget Derrick Rose.  As I said in the All-Star Weekend thread, the league MVP should never be an after-thought in the All-Star game.

I, for one, hope you're wrong.

No reason he should be at the same elevation as Russell, Chamberlain, and Bird (and above MJ, Magic, and Kareem).

Hopefully the politics involved (that gave us Steve Nash as B2B MVP) will spare us.

[jdpapa3]

I have to go with Dirk here. Rarely a time when the player actually shows you how the team would fare without them, but Dallas was awful and went 2-7. You can argue that Butler was out, too, but the Mavs lost to Toronto at home with no Dirk and a healthy Caron! So, if you take Dirk's winning pct% this year, he is at about 81% winning, which puts them right below the Spurs current mark now.

Lebron's games out (0-2) are tougher to call since they lost @Denver and @Chicago. I just get the feeling that they'd be a playoff team with Wade and Bosh and an average NBA player where James is. I think Dallas would be a lottery team with an average PF where Dirk stands.

I do think that it is a 3 horse race. Lebron's obstacle in the discussion is his teammates, but that's what he signed up for. Rose's obstacle is his efficiency(54% TS) and I think the Bulls' overall defensive improvement has more to do with their jump than Rose's leap. I do think Rose still has a very good shot at it. I just can't stop looking at that 62% TS that Dirk has on a very high USG rate. I think that guys like Lebron and Rose have that spectacular plays streak in them and that ends up LOOKING better to the fans, but a basket is a basket.

Haven't even mentioned Dwight, but you can easily make a case that he is the most valuable in the league and could be the first pick in a leaguewide "start from scratch" fantasy draft.

[soap07]

I have to go with Dirk here. Rarely a time when the player actually shows you how the team would fare without them, but Dallas was awful and went 2-7. You can argue that Butler was out, too, but the Mavs lost to Toronto at home with no Dirk and a healthy Caron! So, if you take Dirk's winning pct% this year, he is at about 81% winning, which puts them right below the Spurs current mark now.

Lebron's games out (0-2) are tougher to call since they lost @Denver and @Chicago. I just get the feeling that they'd be a playoff team with Wade and Bosh and an average NBA player where James is. I think Dallas would be a lottery team with an average PF where Dirk stands.

I do think that it is a 3 horse race. Lebron's obstacle in the discussion is his teammates, but that's what he signed up for. Rose's obstacle is his efficiency(54% TS) and I think the Bulls' overall defensive improvement has more to do with their jump than Rose's leap. I do think Rose still has a very good shot at it. I just can't stop looking at that 62% TS that Dirk has on a very high USG rate. I think that guys like Lebron and Rose have that spectacular plays streak in them and that ends up LOOKING better to the fans, but a basket is a basket.

Haven't even mentioned Dwight, but you can easily make a case that he is the most valuable in the league and could be the first pick in a leaguewide "start from scratch" fantasy draft.

Dirk is only averaging 22.7/6.6 a game. That doesn't scream MVP to me - not when compared to other folks. Yes, he's been efficient but that is some poor rebounding (only an 11.2 rebound rate). Dwight's team just frankly hasn't been good enough.

I think Cleveland has shown quite conclusively just how valuable LeBron is to a team.

[soap07]

It should be Lebron and I think at the end of the day it will be Lebron.

He's clearly still the best player in the league and you don't need to look any farther than the Cavs to see how important he is.

Forget Derrick Rose.  As I said in the All-Star Weekend thread, the league MVP should never be an after-thought in the All-Star game.

I'm all for LeBron being the MVP and all, but I think an ASG performance is utterly irrelevant.

[Fafnir]

I have to go with Dirk here. Rarely a time when the player actually shows you how the team would fare without them, but Dallas was awful and went 2-7. You can argue that Butler was out, too, but the Mavs lost to Toronto at home with no Dirk and a healthy Caron! So, if you take Dirk's winning pct% this year, he is at about 81% winning, which puts them right below the Spurs current mark now.

Lebron's games out (0-2) are tougher to call since they lost @Denver and @Chicago. I just get the feeling that they'd be a playoff team with Wade and Bosh and an average NBA player where James is. I think Dallas would be a lottery team with an average PF where Dirk stands.

I do think that it is a 3 horse race. Lebron's obstacle in the discussion is his teammates, but that's what he signed up for. Rose's obstacle is his efficiency(54% TS) and I think the Bulls' overall defensive improvement has more to do with their jump than Rose's leap. I do think Rose still has a very good shot at it. I just can't stop looking at that 62% TS that Dirk has on a very high USG rate. I think that guys like Lebron and Rose have that spectacular plays streak in them and that ends up LOOKING better to the fans, but a basket is a basket.

Haven't even mentioned Dwight, but you can easily make a case that he is the most valuable in the league and could be the first pick in a leaguewide "start from scratch" fantasy draft.

Dirk is only averaging 22.7/6.6 a game. That doesn't scream MVP to me - not when compared to other folks. Yes, he's been efficient but that is some poor rebounding (only an 11.2 rebound rate). Dwight's team just frankly hasn't been good enough.

I think Cleveland has shown quite conclusively just how valuable LeBron is to a team.

Dirk carries the Mavs offense to an amazing degree, well beyond what his raw scoring numbers indicate. He's just as important to the Mavs offense as Rose is to the Bulls.

[soap07]

I have to go with Dirk here. Rarely a time when the player actually shows you how the team would fare without them, but Dallas was awful and went 2-7. You can argue that Butler was out, too, but the Mavs lost to Toronto at home with no Dirk and a healthy Caron! So, if you take Dirk's winning pct% this year, he is at about 81% winning, which puts them right below the Spurs current mark now.

Lebron's games out (0-2) are tougher to call since they lost @Denver and @Chicago. I just get the feeling that they'd be a playoff team with Wade and Bosh and an average NBA player where James is. I think Dallas would be a lottery team with an average PF where Dirk stands.

I do think that it is a 3 horse race. Lebron's obstacle in the discussion is his teammates, but that's what he signed up for. Rose's obstacle is his efficiency(54% TS) and I think the Bulls' overall defensive improvement has more to do with their jump than Rose's leap. I do think Rose still has a very good shot at it. I just can't stop looking at that 62% TS that Dirk has on a very high USG rate. I think that guys like Lebron and Rose have that spectacular plays streak in them and that ends up LOOKING better to the fans, but a basket is a basket.

Haven't even mentioned Dwight, but you can easily make a case that he is the most valuable in the league and could be the first pick in a leaguewide "start from scratch" fantasy draft.

Dirk is only averaging 22.7/6.6 a game. That doesn't scream MVP to me - not when compared to other folks. Yes, he's been efficient but that is some poor rebounding (only an 11.2 rebound rate). Dwight's team just frankly hasn't been good enough.

I think Cleveland has shown quite conclusively just how valuable LeBron is to a team.

Dirk carries the Mavs offense to an amazing degree, well beyond what his raw scoring numbers indicate. He's just as important to the Mavs offense as Rose is to the Bulls.

Even beyond his raw numbers though, LeBron has a better PER, more assists, rebounds better WS/48, steals, etc.

I just don't see it with Dirk - his usage rate is 27.8, his lowest since 2004.

Dirk has been very efficient this year, but I just don't see efficiency equalling MVP dominance when stacked up against LeBron.