KG vs Gasol, who will miss the Finals for the first time the trade?

[GreenNote]

I was just thinking about this comparison between KG and Gasol (not from a technical perspective ...) and realized that KG and
Gasol have been to the Finals every time they played in the
playoffs since they were traded.

I understand that KG was injured the year that the Cs lost to
Orlando and his presence was clearly missed.

This really shows that those trades have had an immense impact on both teams.

I really hope this trend continues that way we will see who wins
the 'best of 3' before the lockout.

[hpantazo]

[dang], just when I was starting forget about the Gasol trade. Memphis gave up a young dominant big man for basically $$ relief just so they could then go and overpay Zach Randolph.

[Sizzlack]

[dang], just when I was starting forget about the Gasol trade. Memphis gave up a young dominant big man for basically $$ relief just so they could then go and overpay Zach Randolph.

Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaalllllllllllllllaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaace!

Ugh, thank god for Danny.

[Chris]

[dang], just when I was starting forget about the Gasol trade. Memphis gave up a young dominant big man for basically $$ relief just so they could then go and overpay Zach Randolph.

Well, they also got their starting center, their PF of the future (Arthur), an interesting rookie who is already seeing minutes as a rookie (Vazquez), and their own first round pick either this year or next year (lottery protected) or 2013 (top 12 protected).

Ultimately, they came out in better shape than the Wolves did anyways.

[Fafnir]

[dang], just when I was starting forget about the Gasol trade. Memphis gave up a young dominant big man for basically $$ relief just so they could then go and overpay Zach Randolph.

Well, they also got their starting center, their PF of the future (Arthur), an interesting rookie who is already seeing minutes as a rookie (Vazquez), and their own first round pick either this year or next year (lottery protected) or 2013 (top 12 protected).

Ultimately, they came out in better shape than the Wolves did anyways.

Assuming they don't have to overpay Marc Gasol to keep him I suppose.

I think Minnesota got much better value (talents + picks) but subsequently botched it from there.

[Sizzlack]

[dang], just when I was starting forget about the Gasol trade. Memphis gave up a young dominant big man for basically $$ relief just so they could then go and overpay Zach Randolph.

Well, they also got their starting center, their PF of the future (Arthur), an interesting rookie who is already seeing minutes as a rookie (Vazquez), and their own first round pick either this year or next year (lottery protected) or 2013 (top 12 protected).

Ultimately, they came out in better shape than the Wolves did anyways.

Assuming they don't have to overpay Marc Gasol to keep him I suppose.

I think Minnesota got much better value (talents + picks) but subsequently botched it from there.

Kaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahn!

[BballTim]

[dang], just when I was starting forget about the Gasol trade. Memphis gave up a young dominant big man for basically $$ relief just so they could then go and overpay Zach Randolph.

Well, they also got their starting center, their PF of the future (Arthur), an interesting rookie who is already seeing minutes as a rookie (Vazquez), and their own first round pick either this year or next year (lottery protected) or 2013 (top 12 protected).

Ultimately, they came out in better shape than the Wolves did anyways.

  If Al stays healthy and Marc has the injury it clearly tilts the other way, probably still does if Al just stays healthy.

[Chris]

[dang], just when I was starting forget about the Gasol trade. Memphis gave up a young dominant big man for basically $$ relief just so they could then go and overpay Zach Randolph.

Well, they also got their starting center, their PF of the future (Arthur), an interesting rookie who is already seeing minutes as a rookie (Vazquez), and their own first round pick either this year or next year (lottery protected) or 2013 (top 12 protected).

Ultimately, they came out in better shape than the Wolves did anyways.

  If Al stays healthy and Marc has the injury it clearly tilts the other way, probably still does if Al just stays healthy.

Al isn't on the Wolves anymore.  They gave up on him already.  So, their only hope are those draft picks from Utah, or Kosta Kuofos.

This isn't about which player is better, it is about which team got a better return for their trade.  So far, it is Memphis by a long shot.

[Chris]

[dang], just when I was starting forget about the Gasol trade. Memphis gave up a young dominant big man for basically $$ relief just so they could then go and overpay Zach Randolph.

Well, they also got their starting center, their PF of the future (Arthur), an interesting rookie who is already seeing minutes as a rookie (Vazquez), and their own first round pick either this year or next year (lottery protected) or 2013 (top 12 protected).

Ultimately, they came out in better shape than the Wolves did anyways.

Assuming they don't have to overpay Marc Gasol to keep him I suppose.

I think Minnesota got much better value (talents + picks) but subsequently botched it from there.

Did they though?  They got one talented player...and they couldn't develop him.  And they also really only got 1 pick out of it.  They recieved the Celtics pick in 2009 (I believe), as well as their own pick, which they had traded to the Celtics in the Wally trade. 

However, the C's never would have gotten that first round pick, because the Clippers owed a pick to the Clippers first, and because of its protection, they have not yet sent it to LA.  And, even if they finish outside of the bottom 10 this year, and send their 2011 pick to LA, since they cannot send their pick in consecutive years, and since a pick cannot be conveyed more than 7 years after a trade (the deadline was 2012), it was going to turn into a 2012 second round pick.

Of course, hindsight is 20/20...but the Wolves really got killed in that deal compared to Memphis.

[Fafnir]

[dang], just when I was starting forget about the Gasol trade. Memphis gave up a young dominant big man for basically $$ relief just so they could then go and overpay Zach Randolph.

Well, they also got their starting center, their PF of the future (Arthur), an interesting rookie who is already seeing minutes as a rookie (Vazquez), and their own first round pick either this year or next year (lottery protected) or 2013 (top 12 protected).

Ultimately, they came out in better shape than the Wolves did anyways.

Assuming they don't have to overpay Marc Gasol to keep him I suppose.

I think Minnesota got much better value (talents + picks) but subsequently botched it from there.

Did they though?  They got one talented player...and they couldn't develop him.  And they also really only got 1 pick out of it.  They recieved the Celtics pick in 2009 (I believe), as well as their own pick, which they had traded to the Celtics in the Wally trade. 

However, the C's never would have gotten that first round pick, because the Clippers owed a pick to the Clippers first, and because of its protection, they have not yet sent it to LA.  And, even if they finish outside of the bottom 10 this year, and send their 2011 pick to LA, since they cannot send their pick in consecutive years, and since a pick cannot be conveyed more than 7 years after a trade (the deadline was 2012), it was going to turn into a 2012 second round pick.

Of course, hindsight is 20/20...but the Wolves really got killed in that deal compared to Memphis.

Because one of the low level prospects was a "hit" doesn't mean they got better value. I still consider Al Jefferson a much better player than Marc Gasol, just because minnesota subsquently drafted yet another PF and had to ditch Jefferson doesn't change that fact.

Just because Ron Artest hits that ill advised three point shot doesn't mean it was the right shot.

Memphis did a better job with everything after they traded Gasol, conflating future actions with how good the trades where is a mistake in my view.

[indeedproceed]

Memphis did a better job with everything after they traded Gasol, conflating future actions with how good the trades where is a mistake in my view.

Conflating, huh? Bet you think you're Mister Big Pants McGee trotting out such a verbose vocabulary.

Its been a long day...

[Fafnir]

[dang], just when I was starting forget about the Gasol trade. Memphis gave up a young dominant big man for basically $$ relief just so they could then go and overpay Zach Randolph.

Well, they also got their starting center, their PF of the future (Arthur), an interesting rookie who is already seeing minutes as a rookie (Vazquez), and their own first round pick either this year or next year (lottery protected) or 2013 (top 12 protected).

Ultimately, they came out in better shape than the Wolves did anyways.

  If Al stays healthy and Marc has the injury it clearly tilts the other way, probably still does if Al just stays healthy.

Al isn't on the Wolves anymore.  They gave up on him already.  So, their only hope are those draft picks from Utah, or Kosta Kuofos.

This isn't about which player is better, it is about which team got a better return for their trade.  So far, it is Memphis by a long shot.

Your argument seems to me to equate their trades with how well their overall rebuilding process was managed. Memphis has certainly done a better job of that. McHale and Kahn did/are doing a great job to mucking things up.

[Fafnir]

Memphis did a better job with everything after they traded Gasol, conflating future actions with how good the trades where is a mistake in my view.

Conflating, huh? Bet you think you're Mister Big Pants McGee trotting out such a verbose vocabulary.

Its been a long day...

For me too, its sad that after this post I looked it up to make sure I actually used it correctly..... 

[Chris]

[dang], just when I was starting forget about the Gasol trade. Memphis gave up a young dominant big man for basically $$ relief just so they could then go and overpay Zach Randolph.

Well, they also got their starting center, their PF of the future (Arthur), an interesting rookie who is already seeing minutes as a rookie (Vazquez), and their own first round pick either this year or next year (lottery protected) or 2013 (top 12 protected).

Ultimately, they came out in better shape than the Wolves did anyways.

Assuming they don't have to overpay Marc Gasol to keep him I suppose.

I think Minnesota got much better value (talents + picks) but subsequently botched it from there.

Did they though?  They got one talented player...and they couldn't develop him.  And they also really only got 1 pick out of it.  They recieved the Celtics pick in 2009 (I believe), as well as their own pick, which they had traded to the Celtics in the Wally trade. 

However, the C's never would have gotten that first round pick, because the Clippers owed a pick to the Clippers first, and because of its protection, they have not yet sent it to LA.  And, even if they finish outside of the bottom 10 this year, and send their 2011 pick to LA, since they cannot send their pick in consecutive years, and since a pick cannot be conveyed more than 7 years after a trade (the deadline was 2012), it was going to turn into a 2012 second round pick.

Of course, hindsight is 20/20...but the Wolves really got killed in that deal compared to Memphis.

Because one of the low level prospects was a "hit" doesn't mean they got better value. I still consider Al Jefferson a much better player than Marc Gasol, just because minnesota subsquently drafted yet another PF and had to ditch Jefferson doesn't change that fact.

Just because Ron Artest hits that ill advised three point shot doesn't mean it was the right shot.

Memphis did a better job with everything after they traded Gasol, conflating future actions with how good the trades where is a mistake in my view.

We're talking abotu different things here.  I am not saying that the trade was better at the time.  I am just saying that it turned out better.  

Although I do think that the comments that Pau was given up for nothing other than cash was wrong at the time, and is even more wrong now.  I think it was a much better trade than many others we have seen, which don't get nearly the bad press.

How about Chauncey Billups for a washed up AI and little else?  How about Ray Allen for Green?  Yeah, Green is a decent player, but is that anywhere near equal value for Allen?  

I think Wallace gets a bad wrap here, when he really did a very good job of getting value for Gasol...even if people don't want to admit it.

[Chris]

[dang], just when I was starting forget about the Gasol trade. Memphis gave up a young dominant big man for basically $$ relief just so they could then go and overpay Zach Randolph.

Well, they also got their starting center, their PF of the future (Arthur), an interesting rookie who is already seeing minutes as a rookie (Vazquez), and their own first round pick either this year or next year (lottery protected) or 2013 (top 12 protected).

Ultimately, they came out in better shape than the Wolves did anyways.

  If Al stays healthy and Marc has the injury it clearly tilts the other way, probably still does if Al just stays healthy.

Al isn't on the Wolves anymore.  They gave up on him already.  So, their only hope are those draft picks from Utah, or Kosta Kuofos.

This isn't about which player is better, it is about which team got a better return for their trade.  So far, it is Memphis by a long shot.

Your argument seems to me to equate their trades with how well their overall rebuilding process was managed. Memphis has certainly done a better job of that. McHale and Kahn did/are doing a great job to mucking things up.

But maybe that is because McHale didn't do a good job of setting himself up for the rebuilding process with the trade.  Maybe he should have asked for more first round picks rather than flawed young players like Green and Gomes. 

I agree that Memphis has done a better job of rebuilding, but I think at least part of that has to do with their philosophy of rebuilding that was represented in that trade.  They wanted cap space and draft picks.  Minnesota wanted players.