Speculation: Sign-and-trade for Hughes in the works?

[Rashi]

Yeah, I think that's a good idea actually. Good veteran for the vet min pay. He would easily be done by 2012 when everyone else is off too. I think it's a perfect fit. Plus, you get to keep Sheed to either step in after the break or to trade later during the draft.

for the Vet minimum YES, hes getting old too at 35, but I believe hes still an option, i prefer a younger player though...probably not happening

if he can come with the vet min, i love it...if that don't work out, we will see what happens by trade deadline

I agree with you guys that for the vet min Stack wouldn't be too bad, but secretly the one guy I would really like to get for the vet min would be Rodney Carney. He as well is still available.

[manl_lui]

Problem with Stack is that we're rapidly running out of roster spots.  Sign Stack, and either you're letting 'Sheed retire without getting any compensation back, or you're cutting Semih, or you're not tendering a contract offer to Gody.  Assuming those two kids are GOING to be on the roster, 'Sheed is #15. 

Now, it may not be a big deal to cut Semih, but they did sign him for a reason and they seem to think he's a worthwhile project.

Stack would have been interesting had we not signed Wafer; Von's got his roster spot.  Besides, Stack can't defend, certainly he can't defend at the 3.

lets just pretend we didn't sign Von, and you have an option to choose between Von and Stack, who would you choose?

[Bankshot]

Problem with Stack is that we're rapidly running out of roster spots.  Sign Stack, and either you're letting 'Sheed retire without getting any compensation back, or you're cutting Semih, or you're not tendering a contract offer to Gody.  Assuming those two kids are GOING to be on the roster, 'Sheed is #15. 

Now, it may not be a big deal to cut Semih, but they did sign him for a reason and they seem to think he's a worthwhile project.

Stack would have been interesting had we not signed Wafer; Von's got his roster spot.  Besides, Stack can't defend, certainly he can't defend at the 3.

lets just pretend we didn't sign Von, and you have an option to choose between Von and Stack, who would you choose?

I might pick Von, just because of age. We have enough old guys. Von will probably give as much as Stack at this stage.

[Who]

I don't see any point in signing Stackhouse. He is redundant with Marquis Daniels and Von Wafer already in place.

I want the final wing player to provide a different skill set to what Boston already has.

[Fafnir]

Diaw could makes sense. His price tag is rather hefty though. Boston should ask for something else in return - a pick.

I'd also keep holding out hope for Battier or Jeffries from Houston.

And then if nothing else works, Kapono and Posey will still be available, or a trade exception trade before training camp.

we all know what Posey is capable of on defense, and can shoot the ball

Kapono on the other hand, I'm not too sure about on defense
ok 3 pt shooter, I know he won 2 in a row and all, but how many 3s can he supply in a game...

I'm more comfortable with Diaw, if not try to go back to Posey...

maybe a trade near the deadline can upgrade the team even more...

Posey isn't a good player anymore. He's declined rapidly in New Orleans.

[FrDrake]

Diaw could makes sense. His price tag is rather hefty though. Boston should ask for something else in return - a pick.

I'd also keep holding out hope for Battier or Jeffries from Houston.

And then if nothing else works, Kapono and Posey will still be available, or a trade exception trade before training camp.

I like the idea of trading Sheed for Jeffries.  Battier IMO is not going anywhere.  I had the misfortune of watching a lot of Knicks games the last few years (lived in NYC) and Jeffries is an excellent team and man-to-man defender.  D'Antoni even had him guarding PGs at times. 

The downside is he may be the worst offensive player in the entire league, but hey, you can't expect miracles when talking about the 11th or 12th guy on your roster.

Oh, and I agree with others.  Larry Hughes is terrible.

[greg_kite]

Diaw could makes sense. His price tag is rather hefty though. Boston should ask for something else in return - a pick.

I'd also keep holding out hope for Battier or Jeffries from Houston.

And then if nothing else works, Kapono and Posey will still be available, or a trade exception trade before training camp.

we all know what Posey is capable of on defense, and can shoot the ball

Kapono on the other hand, I'm not too sure about on defense
ok 3 pt shooter, I know he won 2 in a row and all, but how many 3s can he supply in a game...

I'm more comfortable with Diaw, if not try to go back to Posey...

maybe a trade near the deadline can upgrade the team even more...

Posey isn't a good player anymore. He's declined rapidly in New Orleans.

I think Sheed's contract could get us a better player than Posey.  If Paul or Marquis goes down he would be a decent replacement, but I can't see paying him that much when there is a player of the same caliber already in place (Marquis).  Unless they go big and play Marquis at the 2 and Posey at the 3 and have Wafer as the 5th wing.
I'd hold out hope for a younger guy that could contribute more.  You never know when a guy like Stephen Jackson will be asking to be traded to a contender.

[democritic]

I think Danny is done for the offseason. The reason the Stephen Jackson trade won't happen now is because he helped Charlotte make the playoffs. If Charlotte isn't going to make the playoffs come trade deadline, such a trade becomes less of a pipedream.

Sheed's contract will have the most value later in the season. That is why Danny will move his contract then and not now. The Celtics need a big 3 for the playoffs, but the playoffs are 82 games away.

[MBunge]

I think Danny is done for the offseason. The reason the Stephen Jackson trade won't happen now is because he helped Charlotte make the playoffs. If Charlotte isn't going to make the playoffs come trade deadline, such a trade becomes less of a pipedream.

Sheed's contract will have the most value later in the season. That is why Danny will move his contract then and not now. The Celtics need a big 3 for the playoffs, but the playoffs are 82 games away.

Boston is not going to pay 6 or 7 million dollars in combined salary and luxury tax so Sheed can sit at home, just to maintain the possiblity of a trade that might never happen.  Ainge is either dealing Sheed for a player or for a trade exception, but he's doing a Sheed deal this offseason or not at all.

Mike

[LilRip]

just read now all the speculation about Captain Jack and oh man would that be awesome. he isn't the most efficient scorer but he can defend and he can still light it up. highly doubt he's available and i also doubt that he'd ever want to come off the bench between now and next year.



- LilRip

[Snakehead]

just read now all the speculation about Captain Jack and oh man would that be awesome. he isn't the most efficient scorer but he can defend and he can still light it up. highly doubt he's available and i also doubt that he'd ever want to come off the bench between now and next year.



- LilRip

No way that happens.  Bobcats would look like a joke, not even competitive.  You can't trade away one of your two best players like that.  Gerald Wallace and Jackson are untouchable, which is too bad I'd like either one and especially Wallace, who was a monster last year.

[Chris]

I think Danny is done for the offseason. The reason the Stephen Jackson trade won't happen now is because he helped Charlotte make the playoffs. If Charlotte isn't going to make the playoffs come trade deadline, such a trade becomes less of a pipedream.

Sheed's contract will have the most value later in the season. That is why Danny will move his contract then and not now. The Celtics need a big 3 for the playoffs, but the playoffs are 82 games away.

Boston is not going to pay 6 or 7 million dollars in combined salary and luxury tax so Sheed can sit at home, just to maintain the possiblity of a trade that might never happen.  Ainge is either dealing Sheed for a player or for a trade exception, but he's doing a Sheed deal this offseason or not at all.

Mike

Technically they wouldn't be paying any luxury tax on Sheed.  The luxury tax is calculated by the team salary on the last day of the regular season.  Meaning contracts that were traded away mid-season would not count against it.

Of course, they would have to pay the luxury tax on the player they trade for, so, it evens out, but they would have had to pay that whether they trade Sheed now, or in February.

Furthermore, I think there is a great chance that Sheed will want a buyout if he is traded, and the C's would have to provide that money as part of the trade.  However, I think there is a likelyhood that they may decide (unofficially) to count the money Sheed is making as he is sitting at home towards that buyout.  Meaning instead of sending $3 million with Sheed to buy him out if they trade him right now, they can just pay him those 3 million over the first half of the year, and he will agree to retire without a buyout, since he already got his money.

Now, this is all pure speculation, but the C's are clever people, as is Sheed, and I think they can come to an agreement similar to this, if they want to preserve the asset a little longer, until the market opens up more.

[manl_lui]

I think Danny is done for the offseason. The reason the Stephen Jackson trade won't happen now is because he helped Charlotte make the playoffs. If Charlotte isn't going to make the playoffs come trade deadline, such a trade becomes less of a pipedream.

Sheed's contract will have the most value later in the season. That is why Danny will move his contract then and not now. The Celtics need a big 3 for the playoffs, but the playoffs are 82 games away.

Boston is not going to pay 6 or 7 million dollars in combined salary and luxury tax so Sheed can sit at home, just to maintain the possiblity of a trade that might never happen.  Ainge is either dealing Sheed for a player or for a trade exception, but he's doing a Sheed deal this offseason or not at all.

Mike

Technically they wouldn't be paying any luxury tax on Sheed.  The luxury tax is calculated by the team salary on the last day of the regular season.  Meaning contracts that were traded away mid-season would not count against it.

Of course, they would have to pay the luxury tax on the player they trade for, so, it evens out, but they would have had to pay that whether they trade Sheed now, or in February.

Furthermore, I think there is a great chance that Sheed will want a buyout if he is traded, and the C's would have to provide that money as part of the trade.  However, I think there is a likelyhood that they may decide (unofficially) to count the money Sheed is making as he is sitting at home towards that buyout.  Meaning instead of sending $3 million with Sheed to buy him out if they trade him right now, they can just pay him those 3 million over the first half of the year, and he will agree to retire without a buyout, since he already got his money.

Now, this is all pure speculation, but the C's are clever people, as is Sheed, and I think they can come to an agreement similar to this, if they want to preserve the asset a little longer, until the market opens up more.

i think Sheed's contract will be traded to another team for a wing player...

if we do very well by all star break, i see Sheed coming back for lesser money similar to PJ Brown coming in after the All Star Break

[nickagneta]

I think Danny is done for the offseason. The reason the Stephen Jackson trade won't happen now is because he helped Charlotte make the playoffs. If Charlotte isn't going to make the playoffs come trade deadline, such a trade becomes less of a pipedream.

Sheed's contract will have the most value later in the season. That is why Danny will move his contract then and not now. The Celtics need a big 3 for the playoffs, but the playoffs are 82 games away.

Boston is not going to pay 6 or 7 million dollars in combined salary and luxury tax so Sheed can sit at home, just to maintain the possiblity of a trade that might never happen.  Ainge is either dealing Sheed for a player or for a trade exception, but he's doing a Sheed deal this offseason or not at all.

Mike

Technically they wouldn't be paying any luxury tax on Sheed.  The luxury tax is calculated by the team salary on the last day of the regular season.  Meaning contracts that were traded away mid-season would not count against it.

Of course, they would have to pay the luxury tax on the player they trade for, so, it evens out, but they would have had to pay that whether they trade Sheed now, or in February.

Furthermore, I think there is a great chance that Sheed will want a buyout if he is traded, and the C's would have to provide that money as part of the trade.  However, I think there is a likelyhood that they may decide (unofficially) to count the money Sheed is making as he is sitting at home towards that buyout.  Meaning instead of sending $3 million with Sheed to buy him out if they trade him right now, they can just pay him those 3 million over the first half of the year, and he will agree to retire without a buyout, since he already got his money.

Now, this is all pure speculation, but the C's are clever people, as is Sheed, and I think they can come to an agreement similar to this, if they want to preserve the asset a little longer, until the market opens up more.

TP. Very intelligent and well thought out post Chris.

Here's the problem with this scenario and why I think if Sheed isn't traded before the start of the season, the C's will just let him retire and take the savings, The amount of money Sheed is paid to hang around has to be counted against the team's cap that he gets traded to.

The trade deadline is mid February. I think NBA players get paid twice monthly starting with one paycheck at the end of October and running through April. That's 13 pay periods, 8 of which are before the trade deadline. That means if Sheed is traded at the deadline he would already have to have been paid $3.87 million already.

With his 15% trade kicker that means that Sheed's contract would have to count as $7.2 million for the team that trades for him and that in the end, if he retires immediately, the team that trades for him is only getting about $3.4 million in salary relief on top of the extra salary they could trade to Boston because of the 125% + $100000 rule. It's some but not nearly as much as they would be able to get from Cleveland, Chicago, Toronto, Atlanta or Phoenix as a trade exception.

Also, not trading him before the season starts for salary relief negates the use of trading the non-guaranteed contracts of Gaffney and LaFayette that could bring the total savings to a team trading the max amount they could for those three contracts to around $10-11 million or so.

Sheed has to go before the season starts.

[Roy Hobbs]

I think Danny is done for the offseason. The reason the Stephen Jackson trade won't happen now is because he helped Charlotte make the playoffs. If Charlotte isn't going to make the playoffs come trade deadline, such a trade becomes less of a pipedream.

Sheed's contract will have the most value later in the season. That is why Danny will move his contract then and not now. The Celtics need a big 3 for the playoffs, but the playoffs are 82 games away.

Boston is not going to pay 6 or 7 million dollars in combined salary and luxury tax so Sheed can sit at home, just to maintain the possiblity of a trade that might never happen.  Ainge is either dealing Sheed for a player or for a trade exception, but he's doing a Sheed deal this offseason or not at all.

Mike

Technically they wouldn't be paying any luxury tax on Sheed.  The luxury tax is calculated by the team salary on the last day of the regular season.  Meaning contracts that were traded away mid-season would not count against it.

Of course, they would have to pay the luxury tax on the player they trade for, so, it evens out, but they would have had to pay that whether they trade Sheed now, or in February.

Furthermore, I think there is a great chance that Sheed will want a buyout if he is traded, and the C's would have to provide that money as part of the trade.  However, I think there is a likelyhood that they may decide (unofficially) to count the money Sheed is making as he is sitting at home towards that buyout.  Meaning instead of sending $3 million with Sheed to buy him out if they trade him right now, they can just pay him those 3 million over the first half of the year, and he will agree to retire without a buyout, since he already got his money.

Now, this is all pure speculation, but the C's are clever people, as is Sheed, and I think they can come to an agreement similar to this, if they want to preserve the asset a little longer, until the market opens up more.

TP. Very intelligent and well thought out post Chris.

Here's the problem with this scenario and why I think if Sheed isn't traded before the start of the season, the C's will just let him retire and take the savings, The amount of money Sheed is paid to hang around has to be counted against the team's cap that he gets traded to.

The trade deadline is mid February. I think NBA players get paid twice monthly starting with one paycheck at the end of October and running through April. That's 13 pay periods, 8 of which are before the trade deadline. That means if Sheed is traded at the deadline he would already have to have been paid $3.87 million already.

With his 15% trade kicker that means that Sheed's contract would have to count as $7.2 million for the team that trades for him and that in the end, if he retires immediately, the team that trades for him is only getting about $3.4 million in salary relief on top of the extra salary they could trade to Boston because of the 125% + $100000 rule. It's some but not nearly as much as they would be able to get from Cleveland, Chicago, Toronto, Atlanta or Phoenix as a trade exception.

Also, not trading him before the season starts for salary relief negates the use of trading the non-guaranteed contracts of Gaffney and LaFayette that could bring the total savings to a team trading the max amount they could for those three contracts to around $10-11 million or so.

Sheed has to go before the season starts.

Well stated, nick.