Is Rudy Fernandez worth a #1?

[StartOrien]

We also desperately need someone who can relieve Paul Pierce of minutes, and until Marquis Daniels can put together a full season, it's not him.

[toinewalka]

ABSOLUTELY.  Think about some of the first round picks...  If you're not taking in the lottery, your pick is based on potential and the hope that he will round out the bottom of the bench.  I'm sure people are going to throw some BBD's out there where teams struck gold, but for every 1 BBD, there are 45 nobody's and 8 Gerald Green's/Kwame Browns.  I always think about it this way:  Rudy would be hands down our backup 2/3 we desperately, and we would be happy/excited to bring him in the lineup without losing much on either end.  I don't see us finding that in the draft next year.  Also, we need that THIS YEAR.  I think he's worth it.

[jdpapa3]

Top 20 protected.

[RJ87]

Exactly, StartOrien. He can be a solid roleplayer for us. Right now, our main backups at the 2 are Quis, who has a tendency to miss long stretches of games due to injury, and Bradley, who I really think fans are expected wayy too much from too soon.

And as far as all these knocks on his defense - RayRay wasn't exactly a defensive stopper when we traded for him. But he brought into the team concept and has become a solid team defender.

[paulball2007]

I love rudy and watched a lot of Portland games(Roy on my fantasy bball squad).  Rudy can defend when he wants to.  This was the knock on Ray when he came to Boston and he's turned into a good help defender.  He's already a very good shooter.  Rudy was a lost man on that portland team.  When Oden was healthy with Aldridge, Roy, Miller he was a forgotten man.  Rudy would be a great replacement for Ray in two years.  He's young and has only been in the league a few years.  For a 1st round pick in the late teens and early 20's at best he's worth it.  He can score off the bench and is a very good athlete.  Two years of studying under Ray can help with someone with Rudy's talent.  I'm all for it. 

[Snakehead]

ABSOLUTELY.  Think about some of the first round picks...  If you're not taking in the lottery, your pick is based on potential and the hope that he will round out the bottom of the bench.  I'm sure people are going to throw some BBD's out there where teams struck gold, but for every 1 BBD, there are 45 nobody's and 8 Gerald Green's/Kwame Browns.  I always think about it this way:  Rudy would be hands down our backup 2/3 we desperately, and we would be happy/excited to bring him in the lineup without losing much on either end.  I don't see us finding that in the draft next year.  Also, we need that THIS YEAR.  I think he's worth it.

Exactly right.  Look at all the whiffs on guys in the first round, Rudy is a guarenteed good bench guy and I, like you, think he has plenty of untapped potential to be a big contributor.

You absolutely make this move for a first rounder.  He's that level of talent and you don't need to wait for him to develop.

[ssspence]

I'd argue that the Blazers might not be tempted to trade him for a 1st unless it's likely to be in the teens, which it certainly could be from the Cs as it was this year. Would you really trade Fernandez for the 25th pick when it's typically for sale for $3mil anyway? The Blazers paid $2mil to move up 10 slots in the 2nd round this year -- me thinks they can afford a late 1st.

They'll probably want a player for Rudy. If a 1st would get it done, someone likely would have pulled the trigger already.

[kozlodoev]

Exactly right.  Look at all the whiffs on guys in the first round, Rudy is a guarenteed good bench guy and I, like you, think he has plenty of untapped potential to be a big contributor.

You absolutely make this move for a first rounder.  He's that level of talent and you don't need to wait for him to develop.

How is he a "guaranteed good bench guy"? How is he any better than bringing in Michael Finley at the veteran minimum again?

[ssspence]

Career #'s from two seasons so far: (2pt/3pt/FT) 40.6%/38.7%/85.1%. 2.5 Boards, 2 assists & a steal a game. Not shabby.

You're right. It's not shabby. It's downright horrible.

Considering his minutes per game, every number here is solid with the exception of his 2pt fg % which would obviously improve in a system where he'd not have to stand around watching Roy pound the ball into the floor and actually get some open looks.

The guys makes $1mil a year. Whose stats should his look like -- Dirk's? Are you seriously comparing him to Michael Finley? He's 25 -- his best years are ahead of him -- not 6 years behind him.

[toinewalka]

Calling Rudy Michael Finley is an insult.  If you've watched either of the two guys play I think you realize in the first 30 seconds that their games at this point are polar opposites.  Finley lacks the youth and agility to play defense and run the floor.  He's a good shooter who can dribble once to create space and spot up.  Period.  Rudy is an athletic swingman who models his cam off Manu (not there talent-wise or mentally yet), and takes it to the basket, defends, and shoot in the Euro-style manner.  He is quick and crafty, and has a good grasp on when to score and when to distribute.  Finley was purely a guy to stretch the floor for 4 minutes a game.  Rudy is a full bore backup 2/3 looking to get good minutes.  If you don't like him, fine; but Michael Finley, come on.

[kozlodoev]

Considering his minutes per game, every number here is solid with the exception of his 2pt fg % which would obviously improve in a system where he'd not have to stand around watching Roy pound the ball into the floor and actually get some open looks.

No matter how you slice it, a career .400 from the field is a horrible shooting percentage. And that includes a jaw-dropping .370 during the last season, so the guy has regressed in this parameter.

That this will "obviously improve" is your wild guess. Rudy Fernandez is, at best, a complementary bench player on any team, so if he doesn't know how to be effective in this role in Portland, there is no reason to believe he will be any better in Boston.

The guys makes $1mil a year. Whose stats should his look like -- Dirk's? Are you seriously comparing him to Michael Finley? He's 25 -- his best years are ahead of him -- not 6 years behind him.

What fans (and even some GMs in the NBA) fail to understand is that being young is not much in itself. What differentiates good teams from bad teams is that good teams are able to acquire what they need when they need it. At this point, the Celtics need a bench player who can hit open shots for 2 years, and as much flexibility thereafter. It doesn't really matter whether the said player is 25 or 33 today, as long as he can play the role he's needed in.

So the fact that Rudy Fernandez is not old is really not relevant. Or the fact that he "may be good in the future" -- he's not going to be a player to build around. If he were, we won't even be having a discussion of trading him for a protected first-rounder. Someone like him can be found as need arises, and when more critical signings have been made.

[StartOrien]

Exactly right.  Look at all the whiffs on guys in the first round, Rudy is a guarenteed good bench guy and I, like you, think he has plenty of untapped potential to be a big contributor.

You absolutely make this move for a first rounder.  He's that level of talent and you don't need to wait for him to develop.

How is he a "guaranteed good bench guy"? How is he any better than bringing in Michael Finley at the veteran minimum again?

Let's forget about talent for a second, though I strongly disagree with, but per 36 minute averages in this are incredibly flawed because only one of these players is capable of playing anywhere close to 36 minutes per night. Rudy Fernandez is a young player who has averaged slightly under 25 minutes per game in his first two season. Michael Finley got injured last season when he went to pick up his luggage.

Again, it can't be stated enough: This team desperately needs a body to aleviate minutes from Paul Pierce and, to a lesser extent Ray Allen (Nate Robinson/Avery Bradley could potentially be enough).

[kozlodoev]

Calling Rudy Michael Finley is an insult.  If you've watched either of the two guys play I think you realize in the first 30 seconds that their games at this point are polar opposites.  Finley lacks the youth and agility to play defense and run the floor.  He's a good shooter who can dribble once to create space and spot up.  Period.

It might be an insult to Michael Finley, since despite the fact that both of them are fringe rotation players at this stage of their careers, Finley is the more efficient contributor, and has had the better career.

Rudy is an athletic swingman who models his cam off Manu (not there talent-wise or mentally yet), and takes it to the basket, defends, and shoot in the Euro-style manner.  He is quick and crafty, and has a good grasp on when to score and when to distribute.  Finley was purely a guy to stretch the floor for 4 minutes a game.  Rudy is a full bore backup 2/3 looking to get good minutes.  If you don't like him, fine; but Michael Finley, come on.

If he is such a great shooter and has a good grasp of when to score, why is he shooting .400 from the field for his career? Why did he shoot .370 last season? How is he able to play SF at 6'5, 185 lbs?

[kozlodoev]

Again, it can't be stated enough: This team desperately needs a body to aleviate minutes from Paul Pierce and, to a lesser extent Ray Allen (Nate Robinson/Avery Bradley could potentially be enough).

That they do, but this guy is not Rudy Fernandez.

[BballTim]

Calling Rudy Michael Finley is an insult.  If you've watched either of the two guys play I think you realize in the first 30 seconds that their games at this point are polar opposites.  Finley lacks the youth and agility to play defense and run the floor.  He's a good shooter who can dribble once to create space and spot up.  Period.  Rudy is an athletic swingman who models his cam off Manu (not there talent-wise or mentally yet), and takes it to the basket, defends, and shoot in the Euro-style manner.  He is quick and crafty, and has a good grasp on when to score and when to distribute.  Finley was purely a guy to stretch the floor for 4 minutes a game.  Rudy is a full bore backup 2/3 looking to get good minutes.  If you don't like him, fine; but Michael Finley, come on.

  He didn't say they were the same kind of player, he asked whether one was significantly better than the other for the Celts.