Here's To Pierce!!! He is Unprecedented for This One!!!

[Drucci]

Kudos for Paul. He took less money to stay here and he did help the owners by taking a paycut this season. It was smart from him to secure a 4th year though. Fair deal overall for both parties.

[winsomme]

Kudos for Paul. He took less money to stay here and he did help the owners by taking a paycut this season. It was smart from him to secure a 4th year though. Fair deal overall for both parties.

extremely fair. well said, Drucci

[clover]

You really think he took a 20-30 million dollar discount to stay here?  You think other teams would pay him over 20 million per year for 4 years when he is past his prime when a new CBA is coming?  I know there are some dumb GMs out there, but I disagree that he could have gotten 20-30 million more.  I think he maybe could have gotten 70 million and that would have been a bad signing for another team.  

I like the thought that his discount was loyalty to Boston, but its also possible he took it to remain on a contender also.  If I've made over $100 million over my career, and I had the choice of making 60 million on a contender or 70 million on a rebuilding team, I'd take the lesser money for the contender even if I had no loyalty to the team/city.

and the criticism for Pierce just keeps on coming. Of course he wouldn't get 80 million for 4 years, but he would easily get 70-72 million. Look at what Dirk is getting to stay in Dallas. It may not be 20 million, but 10-12 million is still a lot of money to give up, especially when it's the last NBA contract you will sign.  Also, what's with the shot at his celtics pride, saying he may have done it just to be on a contender? He is the one guy since the Bird era that has always displayed celtics pride throughout his career, and repeatedly mentions how important it is for him to cement his celtics legacy. He could have also had a chance to go to a team with one of the other big FA's and still be on a contender. If this was Kobe, we would here about it all over the place about how he took less money to help the lakers, but Pierce gets criticised by his own fans, just great.

I think you're right, he did leave money on the table--because the C's rightly wouldn't have signed him for what he could have  got on the open market.  People love Pierce and I don't hear anyone really criticizing him.  The angst is worry over whether the C's gave him a contract that we'll be regretting in a year or two.

Would those same people regret having to pay Paul 22 million for this season if he hadn't opted out and it meant not being able to add any talent to the roster or even re-sign Ray?

criticizing a below market value contract for a star player that also helps add talent to a team just doesn't make any sense to me...

They'd still have the MLE and Sheed's contract to trade.  Wyc has said he's willing to spend money if and when they are truly competitive.  So if Pierce saved the owners a few mil, that shouldn't necessarily impact the team they would have fielded.

[Jon]

At this point it's just speculation.  Maybe someone would've gotten desperate, but it's also possible that he could've had to crawl back to the C's for less if he tested the open market.  

I'm happy he's back, but I'm not sure that anyone making tens of millions of dollars a year to play basketball needs to be praised for his generosity (unless he does something Mutombo-like and builds hospitals).  

[clover]

I'm happy he's back, but I'm not sure that anyone making tens of millions of dollars a year to play basketball needs to be praised for his generosity (unless he does some Mutombo-like and builds hospitals). 

Quote of the week!

[winsomme]

You really think he took a 20-30 million dollar discount to stay here?  You think other teams would pay him over 20 million per year for 4 years when he is past his prime when a new CBA is coming?  I know there are some dumb GMs out there, but I disagree that he could have gotten 20-30 million more.  I think he maybe could have gotten 70 million and that would have been a bad signing for another team.  

I like the thought that his discount was loyalty to Boston, but its also possible he took it to remain on a contender also.  If I've made over $100 million over my career, and I had the choice of making 60 million on a contender or 70 million on a rebuilding team, I'd take the lesser money for the contender even if I had no loyalty to the team/city.

and the criticism for Pierce just keeps on coming. Of course he wouldn't get 80 million for 4 years, but he would easily get 70-72 million. Look at what Dirk is getting to stay in Dallas. It may not be 20 million, but 10-12 million is still a lot of money to give up, especially when it's the last NBA contract you will sign.  Also, what's with the shot at his celtics pride, saying he may have done it just to be on a contender? He is the one guy since the Bird era that has always displayed celtics pride throughout his career, and repeatedly mentions how important it is for him to cement his celtics legacy. He could have also had a chance to go to a team with one of the other big FA's and still be on a contender. If this was Kobe, we would here about it all over the place about how he took less money to help the lakers, but Pierce gets criticised by his own fans, just great.

I think you're right, he did leave money on the table--because the C's rightly wouldn't have signed him for what he could have  got on the open market.  People love Pierce and I don't hear anyone really criticizing him.  The angst is worry over whether the C's gave him a contract that we'll be regretting in a year or two.

Would those same people regret having to pay Paul 22 million for this season if he hadn't opted out and it meant not being able to add any talent to the roster or even re-sign Ray?

criticizing a below market value contract for a star player that also helps add talent to a team just doesn't make any sense to me...

They'd still have the MLE and Sheed's contract to trade.  Wyc has said he's willing to spend money if and when they are truly competitive.  So if Pierce saved the owners a few mil, that shouldn't necessarily impact the team they would have fielded.

the money freed up by Pierce is so we can use the MLE and Sheed's contract to take back salary.

I mean, with Pierce and Ray alone we are going to be right at the lux tax level already with what seven roster spots still to fill.

[winsomme]

At this point it's just speculation.  Maybe someone would've gotten desperate, but it's also possible that he could've had to crawl back to the C's for less if he tested the open market.  

I'm happy he's back, but I'm not sure that anyone making tens of millions of dollars a year to play basketball needs to be praised for his generosity (unless he does something Mutombo-like and builds hospitals).  

I don't think anybody is confusing the different types of praise there are in the world.

But, yes, in sports terms...as a sports fan writing on and following a sports bolg, yes I think Paul should be highly commended for taking a big discount to stay with the Cs and help free up money to add to the team....

[clover]

You really think he took a 20-30 million dollar discount to stay here?  You think other teams would pay him over 20 million per year for 4 years when he is past his prime when a new CBA is coming?  I know there are some dumb GMs out there, but I disagree that he could have gotten 20-30 million more.  I think he maybe could have gotten 70 million and that would have been a bad signing for another team.  

I like the thought that his discount was loyalty to Boston, but its also possible he took it to remain on a contender also.  If I've made over $100 million over my career, and I had the choice of making 60 million on a contender or 70 million on a rebuilding team, I'd take the lesser money for the contender even if I had no loyalty to the team/city.

and the criticism for Pierce just keeps on coming. Of course he wouldn't get 80 million for 4 years, but he would easily get 70-72 million. Look at what Dirk is getting to stay in Dallas. It may not be 20 million, but 10-12 million is still a lot of money to give up, especially when it's the last NBA contract you will sign.  Also, what's with the shot at his celtics pride, saying he may have done it just to be on a contender? He is the one guy since the Bird era that has always displayed celtics pride throughout his career, and repeatedly mentions how important it is for him to cement his celtics legacy. He could have also had a chance to go to a team with one of the other big FA's and still be on a contender. If this was Kobe, we would here about it all over the place about how he took less money to help the lakers, but Pierce gets criticised by his own fans, just great.

I think you're right, he did leave money on the table--because the C's rightly wouldn't have signed him for what he could have  got on the open market.  People love Pierce and I don't hear anyone really criticizing him.  The angst is worry over whether the C's gave him a contract that we'll be regretting in a year or two.

Would those same people regret having to pay Paul 22 million for this season if he hadn't opted out and it meant not being able to add any talent to the roster or even re-sign Ray?

criticizing a below market value contract for a star player that also helps add talent to a team just doesn't make any sense to me...

They'd still have the MLE and Sheed's contract to trade.  Wyc has said he's willing to spend money if and when they are truly competitive.  So if Pierce saved the owners a few mil, that shouldn't necessarily impact the team they would have fielded.

the money freed up by Pierce is so we can use the MLE and Sheed's contract to take back salary.

I mean, with Pierce and Ray alone we are going to be right at the lux tax level already with what seven roster spots still to fill.

They're over the cap already, the reported first-year savings on Pierce doesn't affect the salary coming back from a S&T (or what's paid for the MLE) at all.

[hpantazo]

At this point it's just speculation.  Maybe someone would've gotten desperate, but it's also possible that he could've had to crawl back to the C's for less if he tested the open market.  

I'm happy he's back, but I'm not sure that anyone making tens of millions of dollars a year to play basketball needs to be praised for his generosity (unless he does something Mutombo-like and builds hospitals).  

I don't think anybody is confusing the different types of praise there are in the world.

But, yes, in sports terms...as a sports fan writing on and following a sports bolg, yes I think Paul should be highly commended for taking a big discount to stay with the Cs and help free up money to add to the team....

well said. No one is comparing any pro athlete to a saint or a real hero here, but in terms of sports, Pierce deserves praise for what he did, as he would have deserved criticism had he bolted for more money.He also does do a fair amount of local charity work. Yea he doesn't build hospitals, but he does have the Truth Foundation, which helps local kids, and has his campaign to make kids fit.  I always get the feeling that, although Pierce has his fan base, there are always some fans that just don't like to give him credit and are always waiting to take cheap shots at him, which is sad considering everything he's done for the celtics and all the bad years he fought through without bad mouthing the organization or the fans, as many pro athletes tend to do nowadays. I can't put my finger on it, but something about Pierce rubs some fans the wrong way, which is too bad. I love the guy, he's the best celtic in the last 20 years and brought a banner to us.

[clover]

At this point it's just speculation.  Maybe someone would've gotten desperate, but it's also possible that he could've had to crawl back to the C's for less if he tested the open market.  

I'm happy he's back, but I'm not sure that anyone making tens of millions of dollars a year to play basketball needs to be praised for his generosity (unless he does something Mutombo-like and builds hospitals).  

I don't think anybody is confusing the different types of praise there are in the world.

But, yes, in sports terms...as a sports fan writing on and following a sports bolg, yes I think Paul should be highly commended for taking a big discount to stay with the Cs and help free up money to add to the team....

well said. No one is comparing any pro athlete to a saint or a real hero here, but in terms of sports, Pierce deserves praise for what he did, as he would have deserved criticism had he bolted for more money. I always get the feeling that, although Pierce has his fan base, there are always some fans that just don't like to give him credit and are always waiting to take cheap shots at him, which is sad considering everything he's done for the celtics and all the bad years he fought through without bad mouthing the organization or the fans, as many pro athletes tend to do nowadays. I can't put my finger on it, but something about Pierce rubs some fans the wrong way, which is too bad. I love the guy, he's the best celtic in the last 20 years and brought a banner to us.

I wouldn't have criticized him if he'd taken the money, just as it's okay with me if Ray takes the money.  It's nice that he wants to stay and finish out his career here, and I don't blame him for getting all he could from the C's.  But I don't think he left any money (or years) on the table in negotiating with the Celtics and it's to be seen whether his resigning turns out well for the team or not.  Just because fans ponder the wisdom of his contract for the sake of the team doesn't mean they are disrespecting him or unappreciative of his play in Boston.

[winsomme]

You really think he took a 20-30 million dollar discount to stay here?  You think other teams would pay him over 20 million per year for 4 years when he is past his prime when a new CBA is coming?  I know there are some dumb GMs out there, but I disagree that he could have gotten 20-30 million more.  I think he maybe could have gotten 70 million and that would have been a bad signing for another team.  

I like the thought that his discount was loyalty to Boston, but its also possible he took it to remain on a contender also.  If I've made over $100 million over my career, and I had the choice of making 60 million on a contender or 70 million on a rebuilding team, I'd take the lesser money for the contender even if I had no loyalty to the team/city.

and the criticism for Pierce just keeps on coming. Of course he wouldn't get 80 million for 4 years, but he would easily get 70-72 million. Look at what Dirk is getting to stay in Dallas. It may not be 20 million, but 10-12 million is still a lot of money to give up, especially when it's the last NBA contract you will sign.  Also, what's with the shot at his celtics pride, saying he may have done it just to be on a contender? He is the one guy since the Bird era that has always displayed celtics pride throughout his career, and repeatedly mentions how important it is for him to cement his celtics legacy. He could have also had a chance to go to a team with one of the other big FA's and still be on a contender. If this was Kobe, we would here about it all over the place about how he took less money to help the lakers, but Pierce gets criticised by his own fans, just great.

I think you're right, he did leave money on the table--because the C's rightly wouldn't have signed him for what he could have  got on the open market.  People love Pierce and I don't hear anyone really criticizing him.  The angst is worry over whether the C's gave him a contract that we'll be regretting in a year or two.

Would those same people regret having to pay Paul 22 million for this season if he hadn't opted out and it meant not being able to add any talent to the roster or even re-sign Ray?

criticizing a below market value contract for a star player that also helps add talent to a team just doesn't make any sense to me...

They'd still have the MLE and Sheed's contract to trade.  Wyc has said he's willing to spend money if and when they are truly competitive.  So if Pierce saved the owners a few mil, that shouldn't necessarily impact the team they would have fielded.

the money freed up by Pierce is so we can use the MLE and Sheed's contract to take back salary.

I mean, with Pierce and Ray alone we are going to be right at the lux tax level already with what seven roster spots still to fill.

They're over the cap already, the reported first-year savings on Pierce doesn't affect the salary coming back from a S&T (or what's paid for the MLE) at all.

they're over the regular cap, not the lux cap (which they also certainly go over again)...

but what it does affect is how much over the lux cap they go which in the end is a double savings and more room for Danny to spend (operationally speaking)...

[Who]

I don't think the Celtics would have paid Paul Pierce any more money than they did if Pierce demanded it.

I thought Pierce got the best deal possible out of the team he wanted to play for.

[winsomme]

At this point it's just speculation.  Maybe someone would've gotten desperate, but it's also possible that he could've had to crawl back to the C's for less if he tested the open market.  

I'm happy he's back, but I'm not sure that anyone making tens of millions of dollars a year to play basketball needs to be praised for his generosity (unless he does something Mutombo-like and builds hospitals).  

I don't think anybody is confusing the different types of praise there are in the world.

But, yes, in sports terms...as a sports fan writing on and following a sports bolg, yes I think Paul should be highly commended for taking a big discount to stay with the Cs and help free up money to add to the team....

well said. No one is comparing any pro athlete to a saint or a real hero here, but in terms of sports, Pierce deserves praise for what he did, as he would have deserved criticism had he bolted for more money. I always get the feeling that, although Pierce has his fan base, there are always some fans that just don't like to give him credit and are always waiting to take cheap shots at him, which is sad considering everything he's done for the celtics and all the bad years he fought through without bad mouthing the organization or the fans, as many pro athletes tend to do nowadays. I can't put my finger on it, but something about Pierce rubs some fans the wrong way, which is too bad. I love the guy, he's the best celtic in the last 20 years and brought a banner to us.

I wouldn't have criticized him if he'd taken the money, just as it's okay with me if Ray takes the money.  It's nice that he wants to stay and finish out his career here, and I don't blame him for getting all he could from the C's.  But I don't think he left any money (or years) on the table in negotiating with the Celtics and it's to be seen whether his resigning turns out well for the team or not.  Just because fans ponder the wisdom of his contract for the sake of the team doesn't mean they are disrespecting him or unappreciative of his play in Boston.

but clover, you are coming from a stance which is very difficult to debate. Your point seems to be that we don't know what he would have gotten on the open market, so you're not going to acknowledge any savings.....ok sure, we don't know, but as has been said, we can see what other players are getting and Dirk drafted the same year as Paul got 20 mil more....

I mean, it doesn't seem like there will be any ground given by you no matter what happens moving forward (unless we win a Title I suppose). for instance, if Ray signs, it could be the case that Paul taking less money freed up money operationally to sign him....but your counter point could be "well they would have signed him anyway...."

okay, maybe...but that's why the starting place has to be at the very least what Paul is going to receive for THIS season. and on that point, there really is no debating that he is getting less money....money that can potentially be used elsewhere.

[winsomme]

I don't think the Celtics would have paid Paul Pierce any more money than they did if Pierce demanded it.

I thought Pierce got the best deal possible out of the team he wanted to play for.

I'll agree with that. They weren't going to break the bank to keep him, but another team certainly could have been willing to pay him more...and that is money left on the table.

and like I mentioned to clover, the Cs are going to be paying Paul less money for the upcoming season....something many hoped would happen at that start of the season when looking to this off season.

[Who]

You really think he took a 20-30 million dollar discount to stay here?  You think other teams would pay him over 20 million per year for 4 years when he is past his prime when a new CBA is coming?  I know there are some dumb GMs out there, but I disagree that he could have gotten 20-30 million more.  I think he maybe could have gotten 70 million and that would have been a bad signing for another team. 

I like the thought that his discount was loyalty to Boston, but its also possible he took it to remain on a contender also.  If I've made over $100 million over my career, and I had the choice of making 60 million on a contender or 70 million on a rebuilding team, I'd take the lesser money for the contender even if I had no loyalty to the team/city.

It is unclear (but possible) whether or not any team would have been willing to pay Pierce $80+ million or $90+ million + it doesn't appear that Pierce engaged with any other teams so he didn't have a firm grasp of what they may offer him either.

It's too hard to say how much money Pierce sacrificed to stay here in Boston. I don't think he even knows (which is idiotic and the wrong way to run a negotiation).

It isn't idiotic to prefer personal satisfaction/happiness to mere dollars.  In fact, as you--if you are lucky--win learn in about 75 more incarnations, it is idiotic not to.

Pierce would have had a strong chance to play for another contender.

Giving up $10-15 million or more ... when all you have to do is work in another city for 4 years ...

I think not pursuing and properly evaluating those options before reaching your decision is foolish.