Author Topic: "Sometimes the best team doesn't win"  (Read 20437 times)

0 Members and 0 Guests are viewing this topic.

Re: "Sometimes the best team doesn't win"
« Reply #60 on: June 15, 2010, 04:07:09 PM »

Offline BballTim

  • Dave Cowens
  • ***********************
  • Posts: 23724
  • Tommy Points: 1123
The funniest thing is that Tony Parkers career is very similar to Rondo’s. And claiming that he’s overrated because he’s playing with a good team...

Tony look around, everything your saying has been said about you.

Actually, I agree with this, though I don't know if you are looking at it the way I am.  Both point guards wouldn't be able to make a team a championship level squad as "the man" like a Deron Williams or Steve Nash would, but both players are stars that happen to have great players around them, which imo makes them.  Now Rondo is by far a better passer and rebounder than Parker, but Parker is a better shooter and is/was a better scorer.  I also will give him that Williams and Paul are more of a challenge to guard.  LA isn't putting Kobe on him to shut Rajon down but to put Kobe on the weakest outside offensive player so he doesn't expand as much energy on that side of the court.  

However I could care what Parker has to say.  I feel the Celtics are the better team and have proven it thus far with who they've beat in the playoffs.  

  Parker isn't much more of a shooter than Rondo and he's not as good a defender. Also, when have Williams or Nash been "the man" on a championship level team? Neither of them have ever led their teams farther than Rondo led the Celts this year.

Re: "Sometimes the best team doesn't win"
« Reply #61 on: June 15, 2010, 04:08:13 PM »

Offline BballTim

  • Dave Cowens
  • ***********************
  • Posts: 23724
  • Tommy Points: 1123
How can the best team not win?

  Injuries, or especially poor refereeing.

Re: "Sometimes the best team doesn't win"
« Reply #62 on: June 15, 2010, 04:09:00 PM »

Offline misterx2day

  • Lonnie Walker IV
  • Posts: 58
  • Tommy Points: 25
I will use the wise words of Kanye West to respond to this Rondo-Parker situation:
"And if they hate then let them hate and watch the money pile up"

Rondo>>>> Parker
"I don’t know what’s wrong with that girl." - Reggie Evans on Pau Gasol.

Re: "Sometimes the best team doesn't win"
« Reply #63 on: June 15, 2010, 04:09:29 PM »

Offline Drucci

  • Global Moderator
  • Tiny Archibald
  • *******
  • Posts: 7223
  • Tommy Points: 439
Another dumb statement by Tony Parker, I am shocked. ::)

Re: "Sometimes the best team doesn't win"
« Reply #64 on: June 15, 2010, 04:10:40 PM »

Offline Chelm

  • Jrue Holiday
  • Posts: 394
  • Tommy Points: 28
The funniest thing is that Tony Parkers career is very similar to Rondo’s. And claiming that he’s overrated because he’s playing with a good team...

Tony look around, everything your saying has been said about you.

Actually, I agree with this, though I don't know if you are looking at it the way I am.  Both point guards wouldn't be able to make a team a championship level squad as "the man" like a Deron Williams or Steve Nash would, but both players are stars that happen to have great players around them, which imo makes them.  Now Rondo is by far a better passer and rebounder than Parker, but Parker is a better shooter and is/was a better scorer.  I also will give him that Williams and Paul are more of a challenge to guard.  LA isn't putting Kobe on him to shut Rajon down but to put Kobe on the weakest outside offensive player so he doesn't expand as much energy on that side of the court.  

However I could care what Parker has to say.  I feel the Celtics are the better team and have proven it thus far with who they've beat in the playoffs.  

Steve Nash and Deron Williams have never made anyone a championship team as "the man" either.
Maybe I'm off, but I see Steve Nash (today) to be pretty spectacular.  I recognize he has mileage, but if we had Nash over Rondo I think we'd be unstoppable offensively.

And we're going to start rebuilding pretty soon anyhow.

Any team can lose on a given night.  In many regards it's a game of statistics.  Roll poorly too many times and you're out, regardless of how good you are.  (0-13??)

I think it's fair to argue that Rondo is better than Tony Parker.  I do not think so about Deron Williams or Steve Nash (barring future projection).

Anyway, off work, good luck tonight!

Re: "Sometimes the best team doesn't win"
« Reply #65 on: June 15, 2010, 04:12:41 PM »

Offline KCattheStripe

  • Danny Ainge
  • **********
  • Posts: 10726
  • Tommy Points: 830

Maybe I'm off, but I see Steve Nash (today) to be pretty spectacular.  I recognize he has mileage, but if we had Nash over Rondo I think we'd be unstoppable offensively.


And remarkably easy to score on.

Re: "Sometimes the best team doesn't win"
« Reply #66 on: June 15, 2010, 04:13:10 PM »

Offline KCattheStripe

  • Danny Ainge
  • **********
  • Posts: 10726
  • Tommy Points: 830
I will use the wise words of Kanye West to respond to this Rondo-Parker situation:
"And if they hate then let them hate and watch the money pile up"

Rondo>>>> Parker

50 said it first. ;)

Re: "Sometimes the best team doesn't win"
« Reply #67 on: June 15, 2010, 04:13:37 PM »

Offline Bankshot

  • Tiny Archibald
  • *******
  • Posts: 7540
  • Tommy Points: 632
LOL at Tony Parker.  He's obviously jealous of Rondo and the Celtics.
"If somebody would have told you when he was playing with the Knicks that Nate Robinson was going to change a big time game and he was going to do it mostly because of his defense, somebody would have got slapped."  Mark Jackson

Re: "Sometimes the best team doesn't win"
« Reply #68 on: June 15, 2010, 04:16:12 PM »

Offline Fafnir

  • Bill Russell
  • ******************************
  • Posts: 30863
  • Tommy Points: 1330
The funniest thing is that Tony Parkers career is very similar to Rondo’s. And claiming that he’s overrated because he’s playing with a good team...

Tony look around, everything your saying has been said about you.

Actually, I agree with this, though I don't know if you are looking at it the way I am.  Both point guards wouldn't be able to make a team a championship level squad as "the man" like a Deron Williams or Steve Nash would, but both players are stars that happen to have great players around them, which imo makes them.  Now Rondo is by far a better passer and rebounder than Parker, but Parker is a better shooter and is/was a better scorer.  I also will give him that Williams and Paul are more of a challenge to guard.  LA isn't putting Kobe on him to shut Rajon down but to put Kobe on the weakest outside offensive player so he doesn't expand as much energy on that side of the court.  

However I could care what Parker has to say.  I feel the Celtics are the better team and have proven it thus far with who they've beat in the playoffs.  

Steve Nash and Deron Williams have never made anyone a championship team as "the man" either.
Maybe I'm off, but I see Steve Nash (today) to be pretty spectacular.  I recognize he has mileage, but if we had Nash over Rondo I think we'd be unstoppable offensively.

And we're going to start rebuilding pretty soon anyhow.

Any team can lose on a given night.  In many regards it's a game of statistics.  Roll poorly too many times and you're out, regardless of how good you are.  (0-13??)

I think it's fair to argue that Rondo is better than Tony Parker.  I do not think so about Deron Williams or Steve Nash (barring future projection).

Anyway, off work, good luck tonight!
Nash would make us a top 6 offensive team at least, maybe top 3.

But we wouldn't be the same defensive team. Right now we have one weak defender in our starting five, adding another one at the point would really hurt our defense. Also Rondo helps compensate for our weak rebounding at the other positions.

I don't think Nash would make the team better overall.

Re: "Sometimes the best team doesn't win"
« Reply #69 on: June 15, 2010, 04:16:23 PM »

Offline jdpapa3

  • Ray Allen
  • ***
  • Posts: 3884
  • Tommy Points: 85
LOL at Tony Parker.  He's obviously jealous of Rondo and the Celtics.

Parker does have more jewelry than Rondo. Maybe Rondo trash talked him during a game or something and he took it personally.

Re: "Sometimes the best team doesn't win"
« Reply #70 on: June 15, 2010, 04:20:32 PM »

Offline BballTim

  • Dave Cowens
  • ***********************
  • Posts: 23724
  • Tommy Points: 1123
The funniest thing is that Tony Parkers career is very similar to Rondo’s. And claiming that he’s overrated because he’s playing with a good team...

Tony look around, everything your saying has been said about you.

Actually, I agree with this, though I don't know if you are looking at it the way I am.  Both point guards wouldn't be able to make a team a championship level squad as "the man" like a Deron Williams or Steve Nash would, but both players are stars that happen to have great players around them, which imo makes them.  Now Rondo is by far a better passer and rebounder than Parker, but Parker is a better shooter and is/was a better scorer.  I also will give him that Williams and Paul are more of a challenge to guard.  LA isn't putting Kobe on him to shut Rajon down but to put Kobe on the weakest outside offensive player so he doesn't expand as much energy on that side of the court.  

However I could care what Parker has to say.  I feel the Celtics are the better team and have proven it thus far with who they've beat in the playoffs.  

Steve Nash and Deron Williams have never made anyone a championship team as "the man" either.
Maybe I'm off, but I see Steve Nash (today) to be pretty spectacular.  I recognize he has mileage, but if we had Nash over Rondo I think we'd be unstoppable offensively.

And we're going to start rebuilding pretty soon anyhow.

Any team can lose on a given night.  In many regards it's a game of statistics.  Roll poorly too many times and you're out, regardless of how good you are.  (0-13??)

I think it's fair to argue that Rondo is better than Tony Parker.  I do not think so about Deron Williams or Steve Nash (barring future projection).

Anyway, off work, good luck tonight!

  If the Suns made it to the finals most people would have seen pg as a big matchup in out favor.

Re: "Sometimes the best team doesn't win"
« Reply #71 on: June 15, 2010, 04:24:05 PM »

Offline Birdbrain

  • Jim Loscutoff
  • **
  • Posts: 2939
  • Tommy Points: 235
  • 36 charges and counting..
Tony Parker hasn't part of any 'best PG in NBA' discussion for 3 years.  Dude is washed up already.  

But he is right sometimes the better team doesn't win.  It has nothing to do with this series though.  I mean his old crusty team was embarrassingly beat in the 1st round and I believe they were in fact beat by a better team.

I think most of this is fact that most people look at the C's as a MUCH better version of the good not great Spurs teams. Like they took what the Spurs did and made it better.
Little Fockers 1.5/10
Gulliver's Travels 1/10
Grown Ups -20/10
Tron Legacy 6.5/10

Re: "Sometimes the best team doesn't win"
« Reply #72 on: June 15, 2010, 04:26:42 PM »

Offline Andy Jick

  • Ray Allen
  • ***
  • Posts: 3795
  • Tommy Points: 89
  • You know my methods, Watson.
Well, Tony...  Sometimes a woman doesn't marry the best man for her either.  It's just one of those crazy unnatural laws.
"It was easier to know it than to explain why I know it."

Re: "Sometimes the best team doesn't win"
« Reply #73 on: June 15, 2010, 04:41:06 PM »

Offline Chris

  • Global Moderator
  • Dennis Johnson
  • ******************
  • Posts: 18008
  • Tommy Points: 642
The funniest thing is that Tony Parkers career is very similar to Rondo’s. And claiming that he’s overrated because he’s playing with a good team...

Tony look around, everything your saying has been said about you.

Actually, I agree with this, though I don't know if you are looking at it the way I am.  Both point guards wouldn't be able to make a team a championship level squad as "the man" like a Deron Williams or Steve Nash would, but both players are stars that happen to have great players around them, which imo makes them.  Now Rondo is by far a better passer and rebounder than Parker, but Parker is a better shooter and is/was a better scorer.  I also will give him that Williams and Paul are more of a challenge to guard.  LA isn't putting Kobe on him to shut Rajon down but to put Kobe on the weakest outside offensive player so he doesn't expand as much energy on that side of the court.  

However I could care what Parker has to say.  I feel the Celtics are the better team and have proven it thus far with who they've beat in the playoffs.  

Steve Nash and Deron Williams have never made anyone a championship team as "the man" either.
Maybe I'm off, but I see Steve Nash (today) to be pretty spectacular.  I recognize he has mileage, but if we had Nash over Rondo I think we'd be unstoppable offensively.

And we're going to start rebuilding pretty soon anyhow.

Any team can lose on a given night.  In many regards it's a game of statistics.  Roll poorly too many times and you're out, regardless of how good you are.  (0-13??)

I think it's fair to argue that Rondo is better than Tony Parker.  I do not think so about Deron Williams or Steve Nash (barring future projection).

Anyway, off work, good luck tonight!

  If the Suns made it to the finals most people would have seen pg as a big matchup in out favor.

Ultimately, I think this is a tough argument, since both of these players are perfect fits for their teams.  I think Rondo is nearly perfect for what the C's need.  He brings them the defense, rebounding, and passing that they really need from that position, and because they have so many other shooters, his lack of shooting is not that important.  

And Nash is the same way.  They win by outscoring their opponent, and Nash is absolutely perfect at running the show on that team.  His combination of ballhandling, shooting, and passing drives that team to be much better than they would be without him.

I think if you put Nash on the Celtics, they would be worse, and if you put Rondo on the Suns, they would be worse (he cannot single-handedly make them a defensive team, and his offense is not good enough without a better outside shot to outscore anyone).

To me, Rondo and Nash are both on the same level of flawed star.  Meaning they are just below that top tier, because they have a flaw that can be exploited, particularly if they do not have players around them to hide that weakness.

The biggest difference between Rondo and Nash's careers is that the Celtics have been able to hide Rondo's weakness by surrounding him with shooters and skilled offensive players, so even if he is not able to attack the rim and break down the defense, they can still survive offensively, and allow him to be effective on defense and fast breaks.  The Suns on the other hand have not hid Nash's weakness.  Instead, they built a team weakness around it, and it has been their achilles heal.  If they surrounded Nash with guys who can play defense the way the C's play offense around Rondo, they would be great as well.  But since they haven't, he is stuck in (relative) mediocrity.

And lets be clear, this is not to bash Rondo.  There are maybe 3-4 players in the league who are good enough, and have a complete enough game to not fall in this category (or lower), but I think this shows how well this team was put together.

Re: "Sometimes the best team doesn't win"
« Reply #74 on: June 15, 2010, 05:03:31 PM »

Offline BballTim

  • Dave Cowens
  • ***********************
  • Posts: 23724
  • Tommy Points: 1123
The funniest thing is that Tony Parkers career is very similar to Rondo’s. And claiming that he’s overrated because he’s playing with a good team...

Tony look around, everything your saying has been said about you.

Actually, I agree with this, though I don't know if you are looking at it the way I am.  Both point guards wouldn't be able to make a team a championship level squad as "the man" like a Deron Williams or Steve Nash would, but both players are stars that happen to have great players around them, which imo makes them.  Now Rondo is by far a better passer and rebounder than Parker, but Parker is a better shooter and is/was a better scorer.  I also will give him that Williams and Paul are more of a challenge to guard.  LA isn't putting Kobe on him to shut Rajon down but to put Kobe on the weakest outside offensive player so he doesn't expand as much energy on that side of the court.  

However I could care what Parker has to say.  I feel the Celtics are the better team and have proven it thus far with who they've beat in the playoffs.  

Steve Nash and Deron Williams have never made anyone a championship team as "the man" either.
Maybe I'm off, but I see Steve Nash (today) to be pretty spectacular.  I recognize he has mileage, but if we had Nash over Rondo I think we'd be unstoppable offensively.

And we're going to start rebuilding pretty soon anyhow.

Any team can lose on a given night.  In many regards it's a game of statistics.  Roll poorly too many times and you're out, regardless of how good you are.  (0-13??)

I think it's fair to argue that Rondo is better than Tony Parker.  I do not think so about Deron Williams or Steve Nash (barring future projection).

Anyway, off work, good luck tonight!

  If the Suns made it to the finals most people would have seen pg as a big matchup in out favor.

Ultimately, I think this is a tough argument, since both of these players are perfect fits for their teams.  I think Rondo is nearly perfect for what the C's need.  He brings them the defense, rebounding, and passing that they really need from that position, and because they have so many other shooters, his lack of shooting is not that important.  

And Nash is the same way.  They win by outscoring their opponent, and Nash is absolutely perfect at running the show on that team.  His combination of ballhandling, shooting, and passing drives that team to be much better than they would be without him.

I think if you put Nash on the Celtics, they would be worse, and if you put Rondo on the Suns, they would be worse (he cannot single-handedly make them a defensive team, and his offense is not good enough without a better outside shot to outscore anyone).

To me, Rondo and Nash are both on the same level of flawed star.  Meaning they are just below that top tier, because they have a flaw that can be exploited, particularly if they do not have players around them to hide that weakness.

The biggest difference between Rondo and Nash's careers is that the Celtics have been able to hide Rondo's weakness by surrounding him with shooters and skilled offensive players, so even if he is not able to attack the rim and break down the defense, they can still survive offensively, and allow him to be effective on defense and fast breaks.  The Suns on the other hand have not hid Nash's weakness.  Instead, they built a team weakness around it, and it has been their achilles heal.  If they surrounded Nash with guys who can play defense the way the C's play offense around Rondo, they would be great as well.  But since they haven't, he is stuck in (relative) mediocrity.

And lets be clear, this is not to bash Rondo.  There are maybe 3-4 players in the league who are good enough, and have a complete enough game to not fall in this category (or lower), but I think this shows how well this team was put together.

  Put Rondo on a team as athletic as the Suns and they'll have no trouble scoring. His transition play is great. Put him in a half court setting with Amar'e and 3 three point shooters and he'll have a field day. I think that Rondo's shooting woes overshadow everything else he does in your eyes.