Ben Rothlisberger (Allegations, Suspension, etc.)

[blackbird]

Wish for justice then instead of wishing ill.

The problem with that is that he would have to terrorize another innocent women and we would have to hope his money couldn't bail him out of that one.

I always wish for justice, but in this women...young girl really, case it's passed since they don't have any corroborating evidence that the sex was non-consensual.

Guy is just such a scum bag...even if he's not a rapist, since apparently she was too drunk to know what was going on, he's still a sexual predator. I'll hope for justice, but the way athletes get away with things, my hopes are low

another nice way to get justice would be if the girl would actually cooperate with prosecuters.

She did, there wasn't enough evidence. After the assault occurred she did everything right, he still got away with it.

Ben is very lucky the club, "accidentally" erased the video tape of this. If they had tape showing the bodyguards preventing the girls friends from getting to her he'd be going to jail for imprisonment or something along those lines at the least.

God Bless lucky "accidents" for those with money.

I think I heard that some members Ben Rapist-burger's entourage were actually off-duty policemen. If that's true I suspect that's what's behind the "accidental" tape erasure.

[Eja117]

While I agree he's probably a scumbag I have to sya I hesitate to label him that just because I thought the Duke guys were scumbags, but then it turned out that mostly the accuser was.

Since she's not prosecuting it makes me think she's after his money, which makes me think she may actually be the scumbag

except that rape is a horribly handled and prosecuted crime in this country. As a victim, especially to a rich, famous perpetrator, your choices are basically: 1. let it go and try to heal on your own, or 2. have your entire sex life and reputation put on trial and have random anonymous message boarders blaming you for getting yourself raped by hanging out in a club. most rape doesn't go to trial, and a lot of rape that does ends up with low conviction rates and high levels of scrutiny, criticism, and embarrassment for the victim.

I don't know if I believe in this unwinnable scenario. I don't think that happened to the Mike Tyson victim that ended in a conviction. Granted back then they didn't have as much internet yadda yadda

[Fafnir]

While I agree he's probably a scumbag I have to sya I hesitate to label him that just because I thought the Duke guys were scumbags, but then it turned out that mostly the accuser was.

Since she's not prosecuting it makes me think she's after his money, which makes me think she may actually be the scumbag

She didn't make the decision, the prosecutor did. The Lawyer's letter saying "don't continue" was pure PR spin. There wasn't enough evidence to convict, no way the DA was going to press charges.

He made the decision after realizing she was drunk during the incident (strike 1), there was inconclusive DNA evidence (strike 2), and she said she didn't want to help cooperate with prosecuters (biiiiggggg strike 3).

That would have made it purely he said/they said

Exactly, its a he said she said and she was drunk, so they didn't prosecute. Even DNA wouldn't change that, the sexual contact was between her and Ben. This isn't disputed.

He still took a girl too drunk to consent to a bathroom, locked the door, and had bodyguards prevent her friends from helping her.

She says she was raped and immediately went to the cops and hospital, what more do you want to her to do? Getting really drunk at a bar doesn't mean you're "asking" to be raped.

[Fafnir]

Wish for justice then instead of wishing ill.

The problem with that is that he would have to terrorize another innocent women and we would have to hope his money couldn't bail him out of that one.

I always wish for justice, but in this women...young girl really, case it's passed since they don't have any corroborating evidence that the sex was non-consensual.

Guy is just such a scum bag...even if he's not a rapist, since apparently she was too drunk to know what was going on, he's still a sexual predator. I'll hope for justice, but the way athletes get away with things, my hopes are low

another nice way to get justice would be if the girl would actually cooperate with prosecuters.

She did, there wasn't enough evidence. After the assault occurred she did everything right, he still got away with it.

Ben is very lucky the club, "accidentally" erased the video tape of this. If they had tape showing the bodyguards preventing the girls friends from getting to her he'd be going to jail for imprisonment or something along those lines at the least.

God Bless lucky "accidents" for those with money.

I think I heard that some members Ben Rapist-burger's entourage were actually off-duty policemen. If that's true I suspect that's what's behind the "accidental" tape erasure.

He's since resigned even.

This entire case stinks.

[Fan from VT]

While I agree he's probably a scumbag I have to sya I hesitate to label him that just because I thought the Duke guys were scumbags, but then it turned out that mostly the accuser was.

Since she's not prosecuting it makes me think she's after his money, which makes me think she may actually be the scumbag

except that rape is a horribly handled and prosecuted crime in this country. As a victim, especially to a rich, famous perpetrator, your choices are basically: 1. let it go and try to heal on your own, or 2. have your entire sex life and reputation put on trial and have random anonymous message boarders blaming you for getting yourself raped by hanging out in a club. most rape doesn't go to trial, and a lot of rape that does ends up with low conviction rates and high levels of scrutiny, criticism, and embarrassment for the victim.

I don't know if I believe in this unwinnable scenario. I don't think that happened to the Mike Tyson victim that ended in a conviction. Granted back then they didn't have as much internet yadda yadda

yeah, you can pick one high profile case where someone actually did time. And the victim actually got hatemail and death threats for having the audacity to help the prosecution, and the public just completely welcomed him back as a hilarious oddity. So you're telling me it didn't royally suck for the girl kobe raped, trying to prosecute that? kobe fans mailing you, telling you you were asking for it, that you're a Edited.  Profanity and masked profanity are against forum rules and may result in discipline. or a Edited.  Profanity and masked profanity are against forum rules and may result in discipline., having a defense attorney in the middle of court calling into question your entire life and character? to then have him walk away and be the beloved face of the NBA again? Sounds awesome. it's a wonder every rape victim isn't clamoring to bring everything out in the open

[Eja117]

While I agree he's probably a scumbag I have to sya I hesitate to label him that just because I thought the Duke guys were scumbags, but then it turned out that mostly the accuser was.

Since she's not prosecuting it makes me think she's after his money, which makes me think she may actually be the scumbag

She didn't make the decision, the prosecutor did. The Lawyer's letter saying "don't continue" was pure PR spin. There wasn't enough evidence to convict, no way the DA was going to press charges.

He made the decision after realizing she was drunk during the incident (strike 1), there was inconclusive DNA evidence (strike 2), and she said she didn't want to help cooperate with prosecuters (biiiiggggg strike 3).

That would have made it purely he said/they said

Exactly, its a he said she said and she was drunk, so they didn't prosecute. Even DNA wouldn't change that, the sexual contact was between her and Ben. This isn't disputed.

He still took a girl too drunk to consent to a bathroom, locked the door, and had bodyguards prevent her friends from helping her.

She says she was raped and immediately went to the cops and hospital, what more do you want to her to do? Getting really drunk at a bar doesn't mean you're "asking" to be raped.

Is there such a thing as "too drunk to consent"? I mean she's 21 right?

I see what you are saying fafnir and agree, but maybe what I expect from the chick is to stay clear of the dude and use her head and not perpetuate this whole "I have no responsibility for my actions because I'm a young impressionable girl who drank alcohol" bit.

I mean yeah he locked the door. I usually do that when I get it on too. And if I were famous and doing that I'd probably have my body guards outside the door too. Did you expect him to go to the middle of the dance floor?

I'm just saying when a girl puts herself into a clear he said/she said scenario she can't be mad at the world when it becomes exactly that and neither can Ben.  I'm just not totally buying this whole Ben as clubbing caveman scenario. I just reserve the right to suspect her of being a scumbag too. I think it's entirely possible she figured out way ahead of time "Hey cool. I get to bang a Super Bowl winning Qb and then falsely accuse him! And everyone will believe me cause he's an idiot who's had problems before."

If she were such a wonderful person there's about a million ways she could have avoided this.

Obviously many many potential errors in judgement going around here.

[Fafnir]

She's underage eja117, and you most certainly can be too drunk to consent to sex.

If she were such a wonderful person there's about a million ways she could have avoided this.

This is the line I really have a problem with in your whole post eja117. This is blaming the victim pure and simple.

She's not saying she's not responsible. She's saying she was drunk in a bar, and a man raped her. That's not her fault.

[Eja117]

She's underage eja117, and you most certainly can be too drunk to consent to sex.

If she were such a wonderful person there's about a million ways she could have avoided this.

This is the line I really have a problem with in your whole post eja117. This is blaming the victim pure and simple.

She's not saying she's not responsible. She's saying she was drunk in a bar, and a man raped her. That's not her fault.

No. What I'm saying is I'm not 100% certain she's a victim and not a scumbag.

And I'm not blaming, but I wouldn't mind a little personal responsibility from time to time. It's perfectly fine to say to ourselves "and what did we learn from this?"

Same thing with Ben.

What will people be saying if she has the same problem in 3 weeks with some other celebrity? They'll be saying a lot worse things that I am. And why is that? Because most of us show a modicum of common sense and personal responsibility from time to time and I don't see why it's unfair to ask that of victims and potential victims.

[Fan from VT]

She's underage eja117, and you most certainly can be too drunk to consent to sex.

If she were such a wonderful person there's about a million ways she could have avoided this.

This is the line I really have a problem with in your whole post eja117. This is blaming the victim pure and simple.

She's not saying she's not responsible. She's saying she was drunk in a bar, and a man raped her. That's not her fault.

No. What I'm saying is I'm not 100% certain she's a victim and not a scumbag.

And I'm not blaming, but I wouldn't mind a little personal responsibility from time to time. It's perfectly fine to say to ourselves "and what did we learn from this?"

Same thing with Ben.

What will people be saying if she has the same problem in 3 weeks with some other celebrity? They'll be saying a lot worse things that I am. And why is that? Because most of us show a modicum of common sense and personal responsibility from time to time and I don't see why it's unfair to ask that of victims and potential victims.

yeah, it's totally unreasonable to expect to be able to hang out in a public place and not get raped.

[Eja117]

She's underage eja117, and you most certainly can be too drunk to consent to sex.

If she were such a wonderful person there's about a million ways she could have avoided this.

This is the line I really have a problem with in your whole post eja117. This is blaming the victim pure and simple.

She's not saying she's not responsible. She's saying she was drunk in a bar, and a man raped her. That's not her fault.

No. What I'm saying is I'm not 100% certain she's a victim and not a scumbag.

And I'm not blaming, but I wouldn't mind a little personal responsibility from time to time. It's perfectly fine to say to ourselves "and what did we learn from this?"

Same thing with Ben.

What will people be saying if she has the same problem in 3 weeks with some other celebrity? They'll be saying a lot worse things that I am. And why is that? Because most of us show a modicum of common sense and personal responsibility from time to time and I don't see why it's unfair to ask that of victims and potential victims.

yeah, it's totally unreasonable to expect to be able to hang out in a public place and not get raped.

Noooooo, but it is probably unreasonable to get completely drunk with a guy known to have problems before, have something bad happen to you and not have people question your decision making, possibly what actually happened, and your motives, especially when you don't prosecute.

Maybe I just given women more credit for their intelligence than some people.

[Eja117]

Some day this will actually happen the other way around.

Some star will say that a healthy/strong chick got him drunk or high to the point that he couldn't do much, lured him into some place like a bathroom to "take care of him" and then totally took advantage of him and maybe photos or something and he's going to point at the chick.

Ben could say that right now if he wanted. Then what would people say?

It goes both ways

[Fan from VT]

She's underage eja117, and you most certainly can be too drunk to consent to sex.

If she were such a wonderful person there's about a million ways she could have avoided this.

This is the line I really have a problem with in your whole post eja117. This is blaming the victim pure and simple.

She's not saying she's not responsible. She's saying she was drunk in a bar, and a man raped her. That's not her fault.

No. What I'm saying is I'm not 100% certain she's a victim and not a scumbag.

And I'm not blaming, but I wouldn't mind a little personal responsibility from time to time. It's perfectly fine to say to ourselves "and what did we learn from this?"

Same thing with Ben.

What will people be saying if she has the same problem in 3 weeks with some other celebrity? They'll be saying a lot worse things that I am. And why is that? Because most of us show a modicum of common sense and personal responsibility from time to time and I don't see why it's unfair to ask that of victims and potential victims.

yeah, it's totally unreasonable to expect to be able to hang out in a public place and not get raped.

Noooooo, but it is probably unreasonable to get completely drunk with a guy known to have problems before, have something bad happen to you and not have people question your decision making, possibly what actually happened, and your motives, especially when you don't prosecute.

Maybe I just given women more credit for their intelligence than some people.

yeah, your attitude is because you think so highly of women. Clearly.

[wdleehi]

Keep it civil.  You can feel this having the chance to go south fast.  -  wdleehi

[Eja117]

She's underage eja117, and you most certainly can be too drunk to consent to sex.

If she were such a wonderful person there's about a million ways she could have avoided this.

This is the line I really have a problem with in your whole post eja117. This is blaming the victim pure and simple.

She's not saying she's not responsible. She's saying she was drunk in a bar, and a man raped her. That's not her fault.

No. What I'm saying is I'm not 100% certain she's a victim and not a scumbag.

And I'm not blaming, but I wouldn't mind a little personal responsibility from time to time. It's perfectly fine to say to ourselves "and what did we learn from this?"

Same thing with Ben.

What will people be saying if she has the same problem in 3 weeks with some other celebrity? They'll be saying a lot worse things that I am. And why is that? Because most of us show a modicum of common sense and personal responsibility from time to time and I don't see why it's unfair to ask that of victims and potential victims.

yeah, it's totally unreasonable to expect to be able to hang out in a public place and not get raped.

Noooooo, but it is probably unreasonable to get completely drunk with a guy known to have problems before, have something bad happen to you and not have people question your decision making, possibly what actually happened, and your motives, especially when you don't prosecute.

Maybe I just given women more credit for their intelligence than some people.

yeah, your attitude is because you think so highly of women. Clearly.

Well I don't think of them as perpetual victims or inevitable victims or helpless or unable to see the possible consequences of their actions so I would say I think highly of them.

I admit I don't think as highly of people that put themselves in a bad situation, then decide not to prosecute, then go after a guy's money.  I don't think as highly of them or people like Ben that also put themselves in absurd situations and then play victim themselves.

I don't like to run to either person's side here or jump to conclusions, other than the original assertion that Ben is probably a scumbag.

I'm just saying I think she might be too. I'm happy there are people that disagree with me on it

[wdleehi]

The only way I see Ben fixing this (if he is innocent) is to sue these women, get on the stand and defend himself. 


But I doubt we would see that.