are the pats on the verge of imploding?

[nickagneta]

I agree the the smartest move is to just send him home, like they did with Terry Glenn, I was just wondering if cutting him outright would accelerate the cap hit to this year or if it stays in next year.

Also, if they cut him, the way he is playing, I don't see how he could help any other team. He has been awful, though, if that is from effort due to disenchantment with playing under Belichick then maybe he could. Playing at his current level, he isn't a very good NFL linebacker right now.

[Chris]

Also, if they cut him, the way he is playing, I don't see how he could help any other team. He has been awful, though, if that is from effort due to disenchantment with playing under Belichick then maybe he could. Playing at his current level, he isn't a very good NFL linebacker right now.

2 issues.  1. he would be incredibly motivated to stick it to Belichick, and if they met in the playoffs, I would not be surprised if he had 3 sacks against the Pats.  2. He is simply a bad fit in the Pats scheme.  Send him to Pittsburg or something, and let him pin his ears back and rush the passer every play, and he could be more effective.

[yall hate]

I did some checking and apparently, that is not true.

http://www.bostonherald.com/blogs/sports/rap_sheet/index.php/2009/12/10/what-if-the-patriots-cut-adalius-thomas-after-2009/

And I’m new to this world, so I did some searching. I checked out some figures from Thomas’ five-year, $35-million contract, then investigated his cap figure from Miguel. Still had questions… So I emailed a dude who dedicates more time to all this than most people.

Meet Brian McIntyre. He runs www.macsfootballblog.com, and he figures cutting Thomas will mean an $8.8 million cap hit for 2010… if there is a cap, that is.

[Updated: Columnist Ron Borges makes an important point. The apparent “cap hit” is lessened by the fact that cutting Thomas would mean the team will not pay the salary it had already put on the books for 2010. It comes off the cap, because it’s not paid. So, the actual cap hit is ($8.8M -$4.9M unpaid salary), which equals $3.9 million. They no longer have to pay the $4.9 salary previously allocated for him. Got all that?]


Mac offered his calculations to us:

2007 Signing bonus: $12M (divided by 5, or $2.4M annually)
2008 Option bonus: $8M (divided by 4, or $2M annually)

Broken down yearly if he’s on the team:

2007: $900K base salary + $2.4M from signing bonus + $107K workout bonus = $3.4M cap number
2008: $900K base salary + $2.4M from signing bonus + $2M from option bonus + $107K workout bonus = $5.4M cap number
2009: $1.9M base salary + $2.4M from signing bonus + $2M from option bonus + $107K workout bonus = $6.4M cap number
2010: $4.9M base salary + $2.4M from signing bonus + $2M from option bonus + $107K workout bonus = $9.4M cap number
2011: $5.9M base salary + $2.4M from signing bonus + $2M from option bonus + $107K workout bonus = $10.4M cap number

If Thomas is cut after this season, the Patriots are on the hook for the italicized portions of the figures. That’s $8.8M.

In a potential uncapped year, that’s not so devastating. With no cap, there will be no such thing as a cap hit… if the Patriots wanted to do it.

I have no idea about any of this, as the NFL salary cap is 1000 times more complicated than the NBA's (which is saying something).  However, isn't that article referring to what happens if Thomas is cut after the season is over?  Are there different rules if he's cut during the season (which is what YH was responding to)?

I believe this is correct (and what I was commenting on).  I have no doubt they will cut him AFTER the season (I am sure they would love to trade him someplace, just so they could control where you would be going, but it is unlikely...).  But they cannot (with current financials) cut him THIS season.

[Eja117]

This may just be me but I think they imploded today.

I haven't seen a beat down like that since....the New Orleans game.

They need in no particular order

2 impact D Linemen

2 impact LBs

Improvement in the secondary and I'm not sure I see that happening if Bodden and Springs both leave

3 impact OLs (Vollmer may be one)

1 impact RB that stays healthy the whole year

2 impact receivers (Tate may be one if he stays healthy, which he hasn't done in two years. I'm going to be generous and pencil in Edelman to replace Welker, which is absurd of course)

1 impact TE.

2 impact coaches

I don't see them getting all that in one draft. I see them maybe adding an impact lineman on both sides of the ball, and maybe an impact LB, and a contributor at RB and that's it.

This is what I mean by coaches.

They lost Crennel, Weis, Mangini, and Daniels all in a short period of time. And in theory each time it happened those guys raided the team for coaches for their staff. And Pioli left.  We also lost players that helped like Vrabel and Harrison. Those guys are like coaches on the field. BB can't do it all himself at all times. You can't develop guys without coaches.

This season was a giant step backwards.  Now we need to take a giant step forwards just to get where we were and that's with key guys getting another year older.

The only part of the team that figures to be better next year is the secondary. You could make a case for some of the young O Linemen to maybe make that place better and maybe some of the young LBs to be better next year too, but I wouldn't count on it

[celticsclay]

This may just be me but I think they imploded today.

I haven't seen a beat down like that since....the New Orleans game.

They need in no particular order

2 impact D Linemen

2 impact LBs

Improvement in the secondary and I'm not sure I see that happening if Bodden and Springs both leave

3 impact OLs (Vollmer may be one)

1 impact RB that stays healthy the whole year

2 impact receivers (Tate may be one if he stays healthy, which he hasn't done in two years. I'm going to be generous and pencil in Edelman to replace Welker, which is absurd of course)

1 impact TE.

2 impact coaches

I don't see them getting all that in one draft. I see them maybe adding an impact lineman on both sides of the ball, and maybe an impact LB, and a contributor at RB and that's it.

This is what I mean by coaches.

They lost Crennel, Weis, Mangini, and Daniels all in a short period of time. And in theory each time it happened those guys raided the team for coaches for their staff. And Pioli left.  We also lost players that helped like Vrabel and Harrison. Those guys are like coaches on the field. BB can't do it all himself at all times. You can't develop guys without coaches.

This season was a giant step backwards.  Now we need to take a giant step forwards just to get where we were and that's with key guys getting another year older.

The only part of the team that figures to be better next year is the secondary. You could make a case for some of the young O Linemen to maybe make that place better and maybe some of the young LBs to be better next year too, but I wouldn't count on it

Did you just write off Wes Welker's career? I realize he will miss part of next season, but knowing that guy's work ethic you would have to think he could recover from that injury on the faster end of the spectrum.

[Eja117]

From what I heard on the radio he's likely out next year. Even if he comes back to expect him to be what he was is asking a lot.

[Roy Hobbs]

From what I heard on the radio he's likely out next year. Even if he comes back to expect him to be what he was is asking a lot.

The full year?  I'd be surprised by that.

[Eja117]

From what I heard on the radio he's likely out next year. Even if he comes back to expect him to be what he was is asking a lot.

The full year?  I'd be surprised by that.

Yeah. I think the theory is that the injury happened so late in this season he may not be back in time to help next year. He almost certainly won't be ready for the start of camp.  I think people hear "ACL" and they think "off season".  Especially for a Superman like Welker. But this is an ACL and an MCL and he uses he knee more than practically any pro athlete.

It's a distinct possibility he misses next season, although I agree that if anyone on Earth could come back and be effective in time to help it would be him

[nickagneta]

From what I heard on the radio he's likely out next year. Even if he comes back to expect him to be what he was is asking a lot.

The full year?  I'd be surprised by that.

Isn't that injury about a 8-10 month recovery time to get back to the playing field at a percentage that could be sustainable for play. I don't see him being out all year, he'll probably be back by week 7 but I also don't see him being 100% until the year after.

[celticsclay]

From what I heard on the radio he's likely out next year. Even if he comes back to expect him to be what he was is asking a lot.

I feel like counting out Welker is like telling Rudy he will never play football at notre dame.

The full year?  I'd be surprised by that.

Yeah. I think the theory is that the injury happened so late in this season he may not be back in time to help next year. He almost certainly won't be ready for the start of camp.  I think people hear "ACL" and they think "off season".  Especially for a Superman like Welker. But this is an ACL and an MCL and he uses he knee more than practically any pro athlete.

It's a distinct possibility he misses next season, although I agree that if anyone on Earth could come back and be effective in time to help it would be him

[Eja117]

From what I heard on the radio he's likely out next year. Even if he comes back to expect him to be what he was is asking a lot.

The full year?  I'd be surprised by that.

Isn't that injury about a 8-10 month recovery time to get back to the playing field at a percentage that could be sustainable for play. I don't see him being out all year, he'll probably be back by week 7 but I also don't see him being 100% until the year after.

This is the thing that makes me nervous about it.  Even if he comes back and even if he's good, how good are we talking? Good enough to draw double teams? Good enough to be the best receiver in the NFL? Cause that's what he was this year. If he's only good enough to be single covered by a good fast smart hard hitting DB we could have some serious problems because there are only two other offensive players that demand coverage of any kind and one of them is the third down back, and both of those players are over 30.  That's bad

[celticsclay]

From what I heard on the radio he's likely out next year. Even if he comes back to expect him to be what he was is asking a lot.

The full year?  I'd be surprised by that.

Isn't that injury about a 8-10 month recovery time to get back to the playing field at a percentage that could be sustainable for play. I don't see him being out all year, he'll probably be back by week 7 but I also don't see him being 100% until the year after.

This is the thing that makes me nervous about it.  Even if he comes back and even if he's good, how good are we talking? Good enough to draw double teams? Good enough to be the best receiver in the NFL? Cause that's what he was this year. If he's only good enough to be single covered by a good fast smart hard hitting DB we could have some serious problems because there are only two other offensive players that demand coverage of any kind and one of them is the third down back, and both of those players are over 30.  That's bad

We need some youth at the skill positions for sure. Unfortunately guys we thought we had in Watson and Maroney just have not panned out. Not to mention Mr. Chad Jackson. The team really needs to draft an RB in the first few rounds and hope either Edelman, Aiken or Tate makes a huge leap.

[Rondo_is_better]

...nah. We'll pull it back together.

[USG]

First thing's first: Blow up the O-Line. Save Vollmer and Mankins, and dump Kaczur in international waters just to make sure he doesn't find his way back.

Running and passing start with the O-Line. No matter how good Brady is, he's going to be neutralized when there's 3 guys in the backfield every play. Maroney--as much as I don't think he's the answer--can't be entirely blamed for his struggles when there are no gaps.

2nd, I'd say we avoid overinvesting picks in wide receivers. I think that's probably one of the most overdrafted positions. RBs, too, are fairly injury prone. We need to get a good pass rusher (how good is Julius Peppers looking 4 months later? Oi.) and buff up the secondary, presumably with a CB to match Butler (who I think is gonna be good).

Here's how I'd probably draft, position wise, assuming there's a worthwhile talent at the level available:

1: OT
2: DT
3: CB

[Eja117]

First thing's first: Blow up the O-Line. Save Vollmer and Mankins, and dump Kaczur in international waters just to make sure he doesn't find his way back.

Running and passing start with the O-Line. No matter how good Brady is, he's going to be neutralized when there's 3 guys in the backfield every play. Maroney--as much as I don't think he's the answer--can't be entirely blamed for his struggles when there are no gaps.

2nd, I'd say we avoid overinvesting picks in wide receivers. I think that's probably one of the most overdrafted positions. RBs, too, are fairly injury prone. We need to get a good pass rusher (how good is Julius Peppers looking 4 months later? Oi.) and buff up the secondary, presumably with a CB to match Butler (who I think is gonna be good).

Here's how I'd probably draft, position wise, assuming there's a worthwhile talent at the level available:

1: OT
2: DT
3: CB

TP. i agreed with everything you said and the way you said it till you got till the last sentence and a half, and even then I didn't dramatically disagree