Looking back at the Garnett and Gasol trades

[Redz]

Marc's outplaying Pao so far this year.

Adam Morrison's outplaying Pau Gasol this year...

True, but he's still uglier.

[ToppersBsktball10]

Marc's outplaying Pao so far this year.

Adam Morrison's outplaying Pau Gasol this year...

True, but he's still uglier.

Well played. haha TP

[greenwise]

Marc Gasol is a worse defender than Al Jeferson though. Which is pretty scary since Big Al wouldn't be as bad as he currently is if he weren't playing out of position.

You have to be kidding...Gasol worse defender than Jefferson? Why, because he is european?? Or because you've only watched Pau and you think they are the same player?

I've watched Pau and Marc.

I cannot stress how much better a defensive player Pau is over his brother, its seriously not even close. Marc is similar to David Lee on defense, though he's not a bad shot blocker. But the rest of his defensive game is "blech!"

Why white players are always compared with other white players? I don't get it. Lee and Marc's games have nothing to do at all, and their Ds are not an exception. The Spaniard is a little slow, but is a great shot blocker whereas Lee is clearly undersized but an awesome rebounder...

To me, Marc is not a bad defender and neither is Big Al.

[freshinthehouse]

Add in the substantial advantage Gasol has defensively, especially at the center position, and the fact that he has a few more years of his contract at $3 million while Jefferson is up around $12 million/year and I'd wager that most GMs in the league would rather have Marc Gasol on their team. 

Hate(love) to nitpick, but Gasol has only one year left after this year.  He is a UFA after next season.  And contract-wise, Al's is pretty team friendly for a young big that looks to be a lock for 20/10 numbers for the next decade.

And whoever said that the Wolves pick that we gave back was going to be good was wrong.  That pick was heavily protected.  And besides that, the Wolves had to give the Clips a 1st rounder (Cassell trade) before they were to give us one.  That pick would probably ended up being a 2nd rounder.

That being said, the Gasol trade isnt nearly the travesty that some made it out to be.  I still think the Wolves got the better deal, though.

[slamtheking]

Maybe j_fran, we could recall the time before the trade was sealed. Yes, the positives for both Minny and Memphis are the aftermath of the deal. The risks taken by both paid dividends. Still prior to the deal, the players offered were very disproportionate in talent and numbers.

Okay, then we have to also look at the different objectives each team had.  Minni was willing to take on Jefferson's contract while Memphis was adamant about shedding Gasol salary, which they did.  I think under the circumstances both teams' management were under, that they both did fairly well for themselves.  Of course the positives are in the aftermath of the deal, but that's the only way to accurately evaluate a trade.  And in looking at the deal at the time, no one would place Gasol near Garnett in value, so I would expect the needed perceived value at the time to be greater to get Garnett.  Everyone is also assuming that Memphis had no idea how good Marc Gasol could be which I think is wrong.  As I said earlier, he was a solid player in the Spanish league and on his way to being the league MVP.  The only reason he was a second round pick instead of a first was because of the same reason Luis Scola and so many other Euros have been. 

hate to rain on your parade for your viewpoint on this trade, which I wholeheartedly disagree with, but Al did not have a big contract when he was traded.  He had a small contract.  Minnie signed him to the big contract.  If Al was getting paid that money prior to the deal, they wouldn't have needed to include Ratliff for financial reasons.  So, the points previously made about Gasol being a better deal because of his lower salary isn't truly valid since Al was on a similar contract at the time of the deal. 

[wil]

What it comes down to is what was available at the time the trades were made.  Yes, looking back on it, Memphis got a decent deal for Pau, but that's only b/c the 48th pick in a weak draft happened to pan out.  Look at all the other players drafted around Marc and none of them are in the league anymore.  You want to say that Memphis knew he was good...probably, but i'm sure no one in the organization thought he'd be doing this good this early (it's a testament to him losing the weight). 

The point is the Memphis could have gotten an even BETTER deal had they played the whole thing out like a good franchise would do.  They could have gotten cap relief AND a highly touted young player if they had really shopped around for it.  The fact of the matter is they didn't, they shipped out an allstar to a team with close ties to West (yes, i know he wasn't technically with the franchise anymore, but i'm sure he was still friendly with them) for a bunch of nothing at the time. 

In the words of Chevy Chase in Dirty Work 'hindsight is 20/20 my friend'

[wdleehi]

Look at what LA gave up at the time, not the luck of development of a decent C on a bad team.


Minn cleared cap room, got one young player that projected as a franchise player, a solid young role player and two long shot potential players that came out of HS. 



Could Min gotten a better package at the time?  Maybe if they got Bynum from LA.


Could Mem gotten a better deal?  Most definitly. 

Finally, Jefferson (if he ever shakes the health issue and gets to move to his natural position of PF) is still a potential franchise player. 

Gasol will never be a franchise player.  Even on a terrible team, he is the 4th or 5th most important player.

[laker-bob]

What it comes down to is what was available at the time the trades were made.  Yes, looking back on it, Memphis got a decent deal for Pau, but that's only b/c the 48th pick in a weak draft happened to pan out.  Look at all the other players drafted around Marc and none of them are in the league anymore.  You want to say that Memphis knew he was good...probably, but i'm sure no one in the organization thought he'd be doing this good this early (it's a testament to him losing the weight). 

The point is the Memphis could have gotten an even BETTER deal had they played the whole thing out like a good franchise would do.  They could have gotten cap relief AND a highly touted young player if they had really shopped around for it.  The fact of the matter is they didn't, they shipped out an allstar to a team with close ties to West (yes, i know he wasn't technically with the franchise anymore, but i'm sure he was still friendly with them) for a bunch of nothing at the time. 

In the words of Chevy Chase in Dirty Work 'hindsight is 20/20 my friend'

Pau Gasol was on the market for over a year, almost two years.  Nobody wanted him.  Over that period, Memphis tried to get as much as could in return, but there were no takers.  How many of you were advocating a Jefferson + other assets for Gasol trade while he was on the market?  Who knows how many teams probably said "no" to Memphis. 

Don't cry after the fact because he went to the Lakers.  The execs that didn't want Gasol, or the fans that didn't think much of Gasol at the time, are a bunch of revisionists and hypocrites. 

Gasol is a great player, but he's also isn't the sole reason why the team's prospects are so good for the foreseeable future.  How about the wisdom in drafting Bynum?  It's these two guys together that are creating nightmarish problems for virtually everyone in the league.  Nobody "gifted" Bynum to the Lakers, who wouldn't be nearly as potent without him.

The KG & Pau trades are more equal than you think.  Marc Gasol plays on a team that doesn't run its offense through him.  And if Jefferson is so good, why haven't his teams been more successful?  They go to him, yet the results are still bad.  Says quite a bit about him, if you were to ask me.

What you are really upset about is the fact the Lakers actually have a brighter future, due to Andrew Bynum.  You guys are running out of time, while the Lakers have a blossoming big man who is only 22 years old.  Granted, he needs to stay healthy, but that's true for all players.

[laker-bob]

The point is that Memphis and Minnesota had nothing to lose.  MN was going nowhere with Garnett, and Memphis was going nowhere with Pau Gasol.  Just look at their  records before the trade. Who cares that the trades also helped LA and Boston? The issue for the rebuilding teams is what's best for their franchises.

But that's the point I think the entire league is certain that Memphis could have gotten a better "basketball" package for Pau Gasol.

Instead they picked the package that saved the franchise the most money.

Assets are unloaded to save money all the time.  It's just that most of them don't involve a player as talented as Pau Gasol, and people are perturbed that it was the Lakers that got the grand prize. 

Nets didn't want Kenyon Martin's contract, so they dumped him for draft picks.  He's not as good as Gasol, but it didn't cost the Nuggets much to add him to their mix.

[BballTim]

The KG & Pau trades are more equal than you think.  Marc Gasol plays on a team that doesn't run its offense through him.  And if Jefferson is so good, why haven't his teams been more successful?  They go to him, yet the results are still bad.  Says quite a bit about him, if you were to ask me.

What you are really upset about is the fact the Lakers actually have a brighter future, due to Andrew Bynum.  You guys are running out of time, while the Lakers have a blossoming big man who is only 22 years old.  Granted, he needs to stay healthy, but that's true for all players.

  Kobe would never see the playoffs with the cast Al's had to play with. And so far Bynum's not a franchise center.

[footey]

This question is going to freak some of you out:

Would you trade Garnett for Pau Gasol today, straight up (put aside salary cap issues)?

I think I would.  No disrespect to KG, I just feel there is alot more left in Gasol's tank, and he has surpassed him offensviely.

[CelticG1]

The KG & Pau trades are more equal than you think.  Marc Gasol plays on a team that doesn't run its offense through him.  And if Jefferson is so good, why haven't his teams been more successful?  They go to him, yet the results are still bad.  Says quite a bit about him, if you were to ask me.

What you are really upset about is the fact the Lakers actually have a brighter future, due to Andrew Bynum.  You guys are running out of time, while the Lakers have a blossoming big man who is only 22 years old.  Granted, he needs to stay healthy, but that's true for all players.

  Kobe would never see the playoffs with the cast Al's had to play with. And so far Bynum's not a franchise center.

He plays like a franchise center 10 games a year. Clocks ticking on the next time somebody steps on his foot and he is out for 30 games.

[Who]

This question is going to freak some of you out:

Would you trade Garnett for Pau Gasol today, straight up (put aside salary cap issues)?

I think I would.  No disrespect to KG, I just feel there is alot more left in Gasol's tank, and he has surpassed him offensively.

Yes, that's a trade I'd happily make.

That's a disappointing thought considering how different that answer would have been just two short years ago.

[laker-bob]

The KG & Pau trades are more equal than you think.  Marc Gasol plays on a team that doesn't run its offense through him.  And if Jefferson is so good, why haven't his teams been more successful?  They go to him, yet the results are still bad.  Says quite a bit about him, if you were to ask me.

What you are really upset about is the fact the Lakers actually have a brighter future, due to Andrew Bynum.  You guys are running out of time, while the Lakers have a blossoming big man who is only 22 years old.  Granted, he needs to stay healthy, but that's true for all players.

  Kobe would never see the playoffs with the cast Al's had to play with. And so far Bynum's not a franchise center.

He plays like a franchise center 10 games a year. Clocks ticking on the next time somebody steps on his foot and he is out for 30 games.

You mean if Bynum lands awkwardly on someone else's foot.  Don't see how someone stepping on his foot would be harmful.

This is merely questioning the luck factor, not his abilities.    Majority of the league wishes they had him.  How many centers are better than he is?  Just Dwight.  You'd likely swap Perkins for Bynum in a heartbeat.

[PosImpos]

The KG & Pau trades are more equal than you think.  Marc Gasol plays on a team that doesn't run its offense through him.  And if Jefferson is so good, why haven't his teams been more successful?  They go to him, yet the results are still bad.  Says quite a bit about him, if you were to ask me.

What you are really upset about is the fact the Lakers actually have a brighter future, due to Andrew Bynum.  You guys are running out of time, while the Lakers have a blossoming big man who is only 22 years old.  Granted, he needs to stay healthy, but that's true for all players.

  Kobe would never see the playoffs with the cast Al's had to play with. And so far Bynum's not a franchise center.

He plays like a franchise center 10 games a year. Clocks ticking on the next time somebody steps on his foot and he is out for 30 games.

You mean if Bynum lands awkwardly on someone else's foot.  Don't see how someone stepping on his foot would be harmful.

This is merely questioning the luck factor, not his abilities.    Majority of the league wishes they had him.  How many centers are better than he is?  Just Dwight.  You'd likely swap Perkins for Bynum in a heartbeat.

I'd rather have a C I can depend on for the whole year than Bynum.  Bynum's got worlds of potential but when he can play a whole year healthy we'll talk.

Also, there aren't any centers besides Dwight Howard that I'd rather have on the defensive end.