Suggestions to changing next year's CB NBA Draft to make it better.

[nickagneta]

Right, but since it is open to the public anybody could vote, not just GM's.  I dont see the big deal

Again, remove voting of your own team out of the process and that gets rid of the perceived bias of two GMs guaranteeing two first place votes even if everyone in the league can look at the teams and know that they don't have the best teams.

This year Portland and Orlando had two of the better teams in the league so there's no big deal that each team had a GM and AGM voting them #1. But, for the sake of argument let's chose two teams from this year that barely got a vote higher than 10, Miami and Charlotte. It's pretty obvious to all that those were not teams that would win their conferences. But if they each had two GMs and they both decided, even though they knew their team couldn't win the conference and they voted themselves #1 in the conference, that's 4 votes that are really moving placings around and could effect a vote that has only a total of 25-30 votes.

In this year's draft, it didn't matter because of the quality of the teams managed by two GMs but in the future it could be a scenario of contention.

[Roy Hobbs]

Right, but since it is open to the public anybody could vote, not just GM's.  I dont see the big deal

Again, remove voting of your own team out of the process and that gets rid of the perceived bias of two GMs guaranteeing two first place votes even if everyone in the league can look at the teams and know that they don't have the best teams.

This year Portland and Orlando had two of the better teams in the league so there's no big deal that each team had a GM and AGM voting them #1. But, for the sake of argument let's chose two teams from this year that barely got a vote higher than 10, Miami and Charlotte. It's pretty obvious to all that those were not teams that would win their conferences. But if they each had two GMs and they both decided, even though they knew their team couldn't win the conference and they voted themselves #1 in the conference, that's 4 votes that are really moving placings around and could effect a vote that has only a total of 25-30 votes.

In this year's draft, it didn't matter because of the quality of the teams managed by two GMs but in the future it could be a scenario of contention.

It's an interesting point, nick.  The only thing I can forsee happening as a result is that there would be even more "voting blocks" than there were this year.  (And there absolutely were, and are, voting blocks.)  Since people couldn't vote for themselves, they'd go to others and work of a quid pro quo arrangment, where they vote one GM first in return for their first place vote.

[Fafnir]

Right, but since it is open to the public anybody could vote, not just GM's.  I dont see the big deal

Again, remove voting of your own team out of the process and that gets rid of the perceived bias of two GMs guaranteeing two first place votes even if everyone in the league can look at the teams and know that they don't have the best teams.

This year Portland and Orlando had two of the better teams in the league so there's no big deal that each team had a GM and AGM voting them #1. But, for the sake of argument let's chose two teams from this year that barely got a vote higher than 10, Miami and Charlotte. It's pretty obvious to all that those were not teams that would win their conferences. But if they each had two GMs and they both decided, even though they knew their team couldn't win the conference and they voted themselves #1 in the conference, that's 4 votes that are really moving placings around and could effect a vote that has only a total of 25-30 votes.

In this year's draft, it didn't matter because of the quality of the teams managed by two GMs but in the future it could be a scenario of contention.

It's an interesting point, nick.  The only thing I can forsee happening as a result is that there would be even more "voting blocks" than there were this year.  (And there absolutely were, and are, voting blocks.)  Since people couldn't vote for themselves, they'd go to others and work of a quid pro quo arrangment, where they vote one GM first in return for their first place vote.

Why wouldn't they do that right now though? Even voting for yourself highly you could still work out a valuable arrangement.

I think removing votes for yourself is a good idea just to remove a normal bias for your team.

If the only reason to not restrict that is a perception that groups of GMs would act in bad faith. In other words vote based on "deals" rather than their opinions. Well letting people vote for themselves won't help stop such shenanigans.

[Gainesville Celtic]

Can I ask the reasoning behind the two votes thing?

Since some teams have asst./co GMs which is like 2 votes.

I guess but if you look, for example, at me and Lucky's votes they were different... we both voted Orlando #1, which i guess proves your point, but so did a lot of folks. I actually think we didn't have the same vote the rest of the way.

I could see doing something like a GM can't vote for their own team or something (like coaches & the all star team can't vote for their own players), but 2 votes means that, for example, your individual vote for the rest of the Eastern Conf. would carry more weight than
either Lucky or mine.

just a diff. way of looking at it.

[JSD]

Another advantage of having two votes:

vote 1
...
7.T
8.X
9.Y

vote 2
...
7.T
8.Y
9.X

[Rondo2287]

Another advantage of having two votes:

vote 1
...
7.T
8.X
9.Y

vote 2
...
7.T
8.Y
9.X

To ensure that we have another tie at the final playoffs spot??

[nickagneta]

Right, but since it is open to the public anybody could vote, not just GM's.  I dont see the big deal

Again, remove voting of your own team out of the process and that gets rid of the perceived bias of two GMs guaranteeing two first place votes even if everyone in the league can look at the teams and know that they don't have the best teams.

This year Portland and Orlando had two of the better teams in the league so there's no big deal that each team had a GM and AGM voting them #1. But, for the sake of argument let's chose two teams from this year that barely got a vote higher than 10, Miami and Charlotte. It's pretty obvious to all that those were not teams that would win their conferences. But if they each had two GMs and they both decided, even though they knew their team couldn't win the conference and they voted themselves #1 in the conference, that's 4 votes that are really moving placings around and could effect a vote that has only a total of 25-30 votes.

In this year's draft, it didn't matter because of the quality of the teams managed by two GMs but in the future it could be a scenario of contention.

It's an interesting point, nick.  The only thing I can foresee happening as a result is that there would be even more "voting blocks" than there were this year.  (And there absolutely were, and are, voting blocks.)  Since people couldn't vote for themselves, they'd go to others and work of a quid pro quo arrangment, where they vote one GM first in return for their first place vote.

Well if there were voting blocks, or if people were out recruiting cyber friends to vote for them that weren't GMs, I would hope that we could find a way to stop that. There did appear to be one persistent outside voter that I am assuming was just extremely interested bystander and not a recruited voter used to manipulate the voting in the East(ahem, jdpapa). I found it strange that this person made it a point to vote in both the East seedings and the East runoff but never made an attempt to vote in the West seedings or yesterday's playoff vote that was simultaneous to the East run off. Probably misplaced suspicion but you never know.

[Donoghus]

Nick,

Is your PM box full?  I sent you a PM.

Thanks.

[Fafnir]

Another advantage of having two votes:

vote 1
...
7.T
8.X
9.Y

vote 2
...
7.T
8.Y
9.X

Whats to stop two GMs from doing that now?

I think you have to assume good faith participation or this whole game falls apart. Similar to FFLs that involve money, you have to watch for player swapping or tanking to boost a friend's record.

[Kwhit10]

Can I ask the reasoning behind the two votes thing?

Since some teams have asst./co GMs which is like 2 votes.

I guess but if you look, for example, at me and Lucky's votes they were different... we both voted Orlando #1, which i guess proves your point, but so did a lot of folks. I actually think we didn't have the same vote the rest of the way.

I could see doing something like a GM can't vote for their own team or something (like coaches & the all star team can't vote for their own players), but 2 votes means that, for example, your individual vote for the rest of the Eastern Conf. would carry more weight than
either Lucky or mine.

just a diff. way of looking at it.

It doesn't matter to me if your votes differ beyond both your #1 votes. Be honest the only position that really matters to you, is the one you finish in, correct?  This is a competition.  I'm trying to get my team in the best position as possible, yes I am voting for the other teams, but it isn't my greatest interest in how the rest of the field finishes.

[Redz]

Can I ask the reasoning behind the two votes thing?

Since some teams have asst./co GMs which is like 2 votes.

I guess but if you look, for example, at me and Lucky's votes they were different... we both voted Orlando #1, which i guess proves your point, but so did a lot of folks. I actually think we didn't have the same vote the rest of the way.

I could see doing something like a GM can't vote for their own team or something (like coaches & the all star team can't vote for their own players), but 2 votes means that, for example, your individual vote for the rest of the Eastern Conf. would carry more weight than
either Lucky or mine.

just a diff. way of looking at it.

It doesn't matter to me if your votes differ beyond both your #1 votes. Be honest the only position that really matters to you, is the one you finish in, correct?  This is a competition.  I'm trying to get my team in the best position as possible, yes I am voting for the other teams, but it isn't my greatest interest in how the rest of the field finishes.

It's like a Miss America contest with the girls as the judges.

Therein lies the problem.  Ideally you'd need an objective panel of judges, but who on earth is going to be willing to do that?  And based on the amount of finger pointing etc...that goes on, even if you could find some people willing to do it, you'd never satisfy the masses that they are both objective and competent.

[JSD]

Can I ask the reasoning behind the two votes thing?

Since some teams have asst./co GMs which is like 2 votes.

I guess but if you look, for example, at me and Lucky's votes they were different... we both voted Orlando #1, which i guess proves your point, but so did a lot of folks. I actually think we didn't have the same vote the rest of the way.

I could see doing something like a GM can't vote for their own team or something (like coaches & the all star team can't vote for their own players), but 2 votes means that, for example, your individual vote for the rest of the Eastern Conf. would carry more weight than
either Lucky or mine.

just a diff. way of looking at it.

It doesn't matter to me if your votes differ beyond both your #1 votes. Be honest the only position that really matters to you, is the one you finish in, correct?  This is a competition.  I'm trying to get my team in the best position as possible, yes I am voting for the other teams, but it isn't my greatest interest in how the rest of the field finishes.

It's like a Miss America contest with the girls as the judges.

Therein lies the problem.  Ideally you'd need an objective panel of judges, but who on earth is going to be willing to do that?  And based on the amount of finger pointing etc...that goes on, even if you could find some people willing to do it, you'd never satisfy the masses that they are both objective and competent.

TP and a great point. Imagine if American Idol contestants had to decide themselves? We're begging for drama.

Hobbs resigning = a need for reform.


What about this as a format? We'll set it up like the Lebanese government. 

Commish (MOD)
Assistant Commish(MOD)
Judge 1 (CB Member)
Judge 2 (CB Member)
Judge 3 (CB Member)
30 teams (MODS/CB Members)

[JSD]

Obviously you can't be a GM if your a judge or commissioner. The judges vote in the same fashion as the GM's voted this year.

[Fafnir]

Can I ask the reasoning behind the two votes thing?

Since some teams have asst./co GMs which is like 2 votes.

I guess but if you look, for example, at me and Lucky's votes they were different... we both voted Orlando #1, which i guess proves your point, but so did a lot of folks. I actually think we didn't have the same vote the rest of the way.

I could see doing something like a GM can't vote for their own team or something (like coaches & the all star team can't vote for their own players), but 2 votes means that, for example, your individual vote for the rest of the Eastern Conf. would carry more weight than
either Lucky or mine.

just a diff. way of looking at it.

It doesn't matter to me if your votes differ beyond both your #1 votes. Be honest the only position that really matters to you, is the one you finish in, correct?  This is a competition.  I'm trying to get my team in the best position as possible, yes I am voting for the other teams, but it isn't my greatest interest in how the rest of the field finishes.

It's like a Miss America contest with the girls as the judges.

Therein lies the problem.  Ideally you'd need an objective panel of judges, but who on earth is going to be willing to do that?  And based on the amount of finger pointing etc...that goes on, even if you could find some people willing to do it, you'd never satisfy the masses that they are both objective and competent.

TP and a great point. Imagine if American Idol contestants had to decide themselves? We're begging for drama.

Hobbs resigning = a need for reform.


What about this as a format? We'll set it up like the Lebanese government. 

Commish (MOD)
Assistant Commish(MOD)
Judge 1 (CB Member)
Judge 2 (CB Member)
Judge 3 (CB Member)
30 teams (MODS/CB Members)

You might want to get a few more judges than that. I'd call it a selection committee though. 

[Edgar]

I like my format better


Edgar Suprajury.


and all do what he wants.