2009 Celticsblog Draft: Voting Analysis : Team of the Future

[nickagneta]

So here was the 911 on the trade:

First I'm surprised no one mentioned that after our very brief spat the other day that j.r. and I could hug and makeup and come up with the blockbuster deal of the late round deals. Just goes to show that we have to realize that although we are playing in a competitive game, we are still all a part of the same Green-loving brotherhood and should always remember that. In that regard, love and TP's go out to Gomesfan as well as j.r.

Second, as I mentioned yesterday, I think there will definitely be a LeBron vote bias when it comes to the open vote. being in the same division I had two options, Future Team or build to beat Lebron. I tried the Future Team route and because of a couple of really bad trades starting off the trade season, I was left with three great pieces, one good piece and very little else. I wasn't winning Future Team.

So, I switched gears and decided to keep the best defensive player and best all around and experienced player of my "Big Three" and trade the rest for a defensive minded team that could still score and would be built around smothering team defense and wings that could shut leBron down so I could win the division.

So here's the team

Starting Team:

Center: Joel Przybilla - he leaves something to be desired offensively but defensively he is a very good, very big inside presence and a good shot blocker. My last line of defense.

Power Forward: Luis Scola - an international star and a defensive, hustling, intelligent player that fills what was easily my previous squad's biggest weakness. In a small ball running lineup, he is an awesome 5 as evidenced by last year's playoff run covering for an injured Yao.

Small Forward: Gerald Wallace - a tremendous defensive SF that has a solid offensive game and is great in transition

Shooting Guard: Stephen Jackson - a third straight athletic, defensive minded SG that can easily flow into a SF game due to his size(6-8) and length. The leader of this club and it's captain, he is one of the extremely very few players in the league to have 20+ PPG, 5+ RPG and 6+ APG.

Point Guard: Raymond Felton - fast, tough, good defender on PGs his size who can run an offense and run the break. He is a lot better and puts up better numbers than most people realize. Good all-around PG that has to work on his shooting.

Sixth Man: Travis Outlaw - who will be used much the same way James Posey was for the 2008 Champion Celtics he is very good defensively, a good rebounder for his position and can score. He has the ability to guard agile PFs and all SFs. He and Jackson and Wallace will drive LeBron nuts as he will never see a moment where he has someone who isn't a plus defender at that position on him.

Back Up Big: Darko Milicic - Darko will be used as the first big off the bench and is versatile enough to guard both centers and power forwards. I'm expecting rebounding and shot blocking from Darko. Any offense will be a plus.

Backup Backcourt: George Hill and Wally Szczerbiak - Hill is a great prospect that showed unbelievable maturity last year in Tony Parker's absence and could be a starter in a year or two. He's that good a prospect. Wally is the savvy vet that gives this team the 3 point threat it needs off the bench.

Others:

Aaron Gray - huge, young center with a knack for establishing good position and being able to convert his down low moves. He is a slow, poor defender.

James Singleton - Long power forward who is young and developing and will give this team solid production when used.

Tyronne Lue - bench warming vet minimum PG that gives the team options

Anthony Carter 3rd PG that gives a good strong veteran presence and is a good passer.

I think in both trades I made I gave up the best talented player but I think the depth and quality of the parts I brought in and kept makes the overall team stronger and gives me one of the better defensive teams not only in the East but maybe the league.

Who is the "go to guy" in the half court?

Enough with go to guys!!!

Why?  He doesn't have anyone at the level of KG in the half court.  And playoff basketball has a lot to do with the half court.

At least this way, he has time to think of an answer or make another move.


(by the way, when are you going to get a SG?)

First Stephen Jackson is a SG and played the SG for years alongside Artest.

Second Scola scores 14 PPG, Jackson 20 PPG, Felton 14 PPG, Wallace 11 PPG, and Outlaw 13 PPG. Five scorers between 13 and 20 PPG. I don't necessarily need a go to scorer if I have balance which I do. Depending on matchups my team can run plays for any one of 4 different players that can score. I don't necessarily need one go-to guy.

[Rondo2287]

Im very content with Afflalo at my 2 guard spot, I know that may not be a popular decision and it may hurt me in the voting, but im willing to role the dice if i have to and see again in February.  I really think having him as a defensive specialist is perfect for my team. 

Why not add another SG that will help you now in voting while keeping the guy you think will help you later?

Because to get that guy, I would have to give up other guys that are helping me right now

[indeedproceed]

The Fake Phoenix Suns (Complete Barring Trades)

Starting Lineup:
Point Guard: Rajon Rondo
Shooting Guard: Roger Mason Jr
Small Forward: Josh Howard
Power Forward: Al Jefferson
Center: Andris Biedrins

Main Subs:
Bruce Bowen(SF)
Kyle Korver(SG,SF)
Jason Smith (PF/C)
Nate Robinson(PG)
Josh McRoberts (PF/C)

Rarely Used But Still Active:
Kosta Koufos (C)
CJ Watson

Inactive/D-League:
Ersan Ilyasova
Serge Ibaka
Nathan Jawai

Rotation 10 deep? Keeps them fresh.

[wdleehi]

So here was the 911 on the trade:

First I'm surprised no one mentioned that after our very brief spat the other day that j.r. and I could hug and makeup and come up with the blockbuster deal of the late round deals. Just goes to show that we have to realize that although we are playing in a competitive game, we are still all a part of the same Green-loving brotherhood and should always remember that. In that regard, love and TP's go out to Gomesfan as well as j.r.

Second, as I mentioned yesterday, I think there will definitely be a LeBron vote bias when it comes to the open vote. being in the same division I had two options, Future Team or build to beat Lebron. I tried the Future Team route and because of a couple of really bad trades starting off the trade season, I was left with three great pieces, one good piece and very little else. I wasn't winning Future Team.

So, I switched gears and decided to keep the best defensive player and best all around and experienced player of my "Big Three" and trade the rest for a defensive minded team that could still score and would be built around smothering team defense and wings that could shut leBron down so I could win the division.

So here's the team

Starting Team:

Center: Joel Przybilla - he leaves something to be desired offensively but defensively he is a very good, very big inside presence and a good shot blocker. My last line of defense.

Power Forward: Luis Scola - an international star and a defensive, hustling, intelligent player that fills what was easily my previous squad's biggest weakness. In a small ball running lineup, he is an awesome 5 as evidenced by last year's playoff run covering for an injured Yao.

Small Forward: Gerald Wallace - a tremendous defensive SF that has a solid offensive game and is great in transition

Shooting Guard: Stephen Jackson - a third straight athletic, defensive minded SG that can easily flow into a SF game due to his size(6-8) and length. The leader of this club and it's captain, he is one of the extremely very few players in the league to have 20+ PPG, 5+ RPG and 6+ APG.

Point Guard: Raymond Felton - fast, tough, good defender on PGs his size who can run an offense and run the break. He is a lot better and puts up better numbers than most people realize. Good all-around PG that has to work on his shooting.

Sixth Man: Travis Outlaw - who will be used much the same way James Posey was for the 2008 Champion Celtics he is very good defensively, a good rebounder for his position and can score. He has the ability to guard agile PFs and all SFs. He and Jackson and Wallace will drive LeBron nuts as he will never see a moment where he has someone who isn't a plus defender at that position on him.

Back Up Big: Darko Milicic - Darko will be used as the first big off the bench and is versatile enough to guard both centers and power forwards. I'm expecting rebounding and shot blocking from Darko. Any offense will be a plus.

Backup Backcourt: George Hill and Wally Szczerbiak - Hill is a great prospect that showed unbelievable maturity last year in Tony Parker's absence and could be a starter in a year or two. He's that good a prospect. Wally is the savvy vet that gives this team the 3 point threat it needs off the bench.

Others:

Aaron Gray - huge, young center with a knack for establishing good position and being able to convert his down low moves. He is a slow, poor defender.

James Singleton - Long power forward who is young and developing and will give this team solid production when used.

Tyronne Lue - bench warming vet minimum PG that gives the team options

Anthony Carter 3rd PG that gives a good strong veteran presence and is a good passer.

I think in both trades I made I gave up the best talented player but I think the depth and quality of the parts I brought in and kept makes the overall team stronger and gives me one of the better defensive teams not only in the East but maybe the league.

Who is the "go to guy" in the half court?

Enough with go to guys!!!

Why?  He doesn't have anyone at the level of KG in the half court.  And playoff basketball has a lot to do with the half court.

At least this way, he has time to think of an answer or make another move.


(by the way, when are you going to get a SG?)

First Stephen Jackson is a SG and played the SG for years alongside Artest.

Second Scola scores 14 PPG, Jackson 20 PPG, Felton 14 PPG, Wallace 11 PPG, and Outlaw 13 PPG. Five scorers between 13 and 20 PPG. I don't necessarily need a go to scorer if I have balance which I do. Depending on matchups my team can run plays for any one of 4 different players that can score. I don't necessarily need one go-to guy.

The SG question wasn't for you.

Those are nice numbers, but the majority of it comes off of the full court offense or being set up by better offensive players.  You will have no issues during the regular season.

But come playoff time, are you really comfortable with the half court offense lead by Jackson?  

[wdleehi]

The Fake Phoenix Suns (Complete Barring Trades)

Starting Lineup:
Point Guard: Rajon Rondo
Shooting Guard: Roger Mason Jr
Small Forward: Josh Howard
Power Forward: Al Jefferson
Center: Andris Biedrins

Main Subs:
Bruce Bowen(SF)
Kyle Korver(SG,SF)
Jason Smith (PF/C)
Nate Robinson(PG)
Josh McRoberts (PF/C)

Rarely Used But Still Active:
Kosta Koufos (C)
CJ Watson

Inactive/D-League:
Ersan Ilyasova
Serge Ibaka
Nathan Jawai

Rotation 10 deep? Keeps them fresh.

Really like your starters. 

Only hole I see is a back up big man that is a sure thing.

[indeedproceed]

The SG question wasn't for you.

Those are nice numbers, but the majority of it comes off of the full court offense or being set up by better offensive players.  You will have no issues during the regular season.

But come playoff time, are you really comfortable with the half court offense lead by Jackson?  

I always wondered...why is playoff basketball halfcourt basketball? does it only take a little bit more effort to stop the transition game?

[nickagneta]

So here was the 911 on the trade:

First I'm surprised no one mentioned that after our very brief spat the other day that j.r. and I could hug and makeup and come up with the blockbuster deal of the late round deals. Just goes to show that we have to realize that although we are playing in a competitive game, we are still all a part of the same Green-loving brotherhood and should always remember that. In that regard, love and TP's go out to Gomesfan as well as j.r.

Second, as I mentioned yesterday, I think there will definitely be a LeBron vote bias when it comes to the open vote. being in the same division I had two options, Future Team or build to beat Lebron. I tried the Future Team route and because of a couple of really bad trades starting off the trade season, I was left with three great pieces, one good piece and very little else. I wasn't winning Future Team.

So, I switched gears and decided to keep the best defensive player and best all around and experienced player of my "Big Three" and trade the rest for a defensive minded team that could still score and would be built around smothering team defense and wings that could shut leBron down so I could win the division.

So here's the team

Starting Team:

Center: Joel Przybilla - he leaves something to be desired offensively but defensively he is a very good, very big inside presence and a good shot blocker. My last line of defense.

Power Forward: Luis Scola - an international star and a defensive, hustling, intelligent player that fills what was easily my previous squad's biggest weakness. In a small ball running lineup, he is an awesome 5 as evidenced by last year's playoff run covering for an injured Yao.

Small Forward: Gerald Wallace - a tremendous defensive SF that has a solid offensive game and is great in transition

Shooting Guard: Stephen Jackson - a third straight athletic, defensive minded SG that can easily flow into a SF game due to his size(6-8) and length. The leader of this club and it's captain, he is one of the extremely very few players in the league to have 20+ PPG, 5+ RPG and 6+ APG.

Point Guard: Raymond Felton - fast, tough, good defender on PGs his size who can run an offense and run the break. He is a lot better and puts up better numbers than most people realize. Good all-around PG that has to work on his shooting.

Sixth Man: Travis Outlaw - who will be used much the same way James Posey was for the 2008 Champion Celtics he is very good defensively, a good rebounder for his position and can score. He has the ability to guard agile PFs and all SFs. He and Jackson and Wallace will drive LeBron nuts as he will never see a moment where he has someone who isn't a plus defender at that position on him.

Back Up Big: Darko Milicic - Darko will be used as the first big off the bench and is versatile enough to guard both centers and power forwards. I'm expecting rebounding and shot blocking from Darko. Any offense will be a plus.

Backup Backcourt: George Hill and Wally Szczerbiak - Hill is a great prospect that showed unbelievable maturity last year in Tony Parker's absence and could be a starter in a year or two. He's that good a prospect. Wally is the savvy vet that gives this team the 3 point threat it needs off the bench.

Others:

Aaron Gray - huge, young center with a knack for establishing good position and being able to convert his down low moves. He is a slow, poor defender.

James Singleton - Long power forward who is young and developing and will give this team solid production when used.

Tyronne Lue - bench warming vet minimum PG that gives the team options

Anthony Carter 3rd PG that gives a good strong veteran presence and is a good passer.

I think in both trades I made I gave up the best talented player but I think the depth and quality of the parts I brought in and kept makes the overall team stronger and gives me one of the better defensive teams not only in the East but maybe the league.

Who is the "go to guy" in the half court?

Enough with go to guys!!!

Why?  He doesn't have anyone at the level of KG in the half court.  And playoff basketball has a lot to do with the half court.

At least this way, he has time to think of an answer or make another move.


(by the way, when are you going to get a SG?)

First Stephen Jackson is a SG and played the SG for years alongside Artest.

Second Scola scores 14 PPG, Jackson 20 PPG, Felton 14 PPG, Wallace 11 PPG, and Outlaw 13 PPG. Five scorers between 13 and 20 PPG. I don't necessarily need a go to scorer if I have balance which I do. Depending on matchups my team can run plays for any one of 4 different players that can score. I don't necessarily need one go-to guy.

The SG question wasn't for you.

Those are nice numbers, but the majority of it comes off of the full court offense or being set up by better offensive players.  You will have no issues during the regular season.

But come playoff time, are you really comfortable with the half court offense lead by Jackson?  

Thanks wd, you have mme making the playoffs. Cool, I must have done something right!! TP4U!!Wahooo. I'm going to the playoffs!!!!

[indeedproceed]

The Fake Phoenix Suns (Complete Barring Trades)

Starting Lineup:
Point Guard: Rajon Rondo
Shooting Guard: Roger Mason Jr
Small Forward: Josh Howard
Power Forward: Al Jefferson
Center: Andris Biedrins

Main Subs:
Bruce Bowen(SF)
Kyle Korver(SG,SF)
Jason Smith (PF/C)
Nate Robinson(PG)
Josh McRoberts (PF/C)

Rarely Used But Still Active:
Kosta Koufos (C)
CJ Watson

Inactive/D-League:
Ersan Ilyasova
Serge Ibaka
Nathan Jawai

Rotation 10 deep? Keeps them fresh.

Really like your starters. 

Only hole I see is a back up big man that is a sure thing.

I hear ya. I could throw numbers of per minute scoring and rebounding stats at you to try to probe my point, but truth be told it won't mean a thing, really. Not if they've only played in like 6 games (Jawai), or if they don't get the right amount of PT (Koufos) to actually claim they've played professional basketball.

They ran out fast and furious, so basically what I did was scour press reports and roster comments to try to find which guys I could get at the discount that might make a difference next year.

Jason Smith is a guy who played 76 games at 14 mins a match 2 years ago, but then he broke his leg. Supposedly he's good now. He's still 7 ft, I think he's a rotation big.

Josh McRoberts Indiana seems super excited about. He can kinda hit a long ball, kinda block shots, kinda play defense, kinda rebound, but he doesn't do any of those things at a level of excellence. He's put on 20lbs of muscle (I put the press release somewhre, its actually true) since last season, and Indy just gave him a fatboy contract, so I think that he's in their long term plans.

Koufos as a starter at 24 mins per game over 7 games last season had averages of 10.3 pts, 6.1 rbs, and 1.86 blocks. That's great production from a rookie, but that's also over 7 games which means ultimately it amounts to diddly.

Nathan Jawai is as of now the only backup to Eric Dampier. At 6'10 280lbs, he's got the size to be a player, and Diop got a lot of PT behind Damp 2 years ago. Jawai might stick as a defender/rebounder

Serge Ibaka I know is athletically talents, I know he's got basketball skills that can be used now, but I also know he's 19 and has a rep for being inconsistent. I don't have time to give that guy significant time.

I think between the 5 of them, 2 will make me look really smart. But who knows. If we were actually playing this out and I could tell a coach what to do, I'd tell him to give 2 or 3 different guys 15 mins each night, don't play them all 2 mins a night. They all have potential, its worth a loss or two early to weed out the ones that are really worth it. 

[wdleehi]

The SG question wasn't for you.

Those are nice numbers, but the majority of it comes off of the full court offense or being set up by better offensive players.  You will have no issues during the regular season.

But come playoff time, are you really comfortable with the half court offense lead by Jackson?  

I always wondered...why is playoff basketball halfcourt basketball? does it only take a little bit more effort to stop the transition game?

More time to create the defensive game plans to cut off the transition game. 

[crownsy]

I think KG is definitely a go to guy late. He his 20 footers like it's no ones business in the 4th quarter and is an 80% FT shooter. So he doesn't sit in the low block begging for the ball for a low post move but he's seriously clutch and effective in his style game and there is no better clutch 4th quarter defender in the league.

I find the notion a bit crazy that Garnett isn't a go to guy.

Tinted green glasses aside, do you view him as a legitimate #1 scorer? I suppose he is on a 33 win team (2007 in Minn.).

You asked us to look at his Minnesota days for proof.  I don't get it.  In what year didn't KG lead the Twolves in scoring?  That team made it to the Western Conference Finals, and KG was league MVP.

I'm just very surprised, that a member of CB is saying this.  It doesn't seem only motivated by posturing, either.

Ok, and what happened the moment he became the #2 guy?

Also, what happened the majority of times he was the #1 guy? (knocked out of the playoffs in the 1st round 8 times)

So don't be so surprised.

what happened the majority of the times paul was our number one scorer with a bad team around him?

one ECF run and a bunch of did not make the playoffs + early exits.

All the above proves is basketball is a  team sport.

[The Walker Wiggle]

Ok, Celticsblog general malcontent and Houston's GM raising the curtain on the '09-'10 Rockets. Darkhorse contender in an underrated conference? I like to think so.

PF Anthony Randolph/ DeJuan Blair/ Earl Clark
SF Grant Hill/ Andres Nocioni/ DaJuan Summers
C Chris Bosh/ David Andersen/ Jonas Jerebeko
SG Joe Johnson/ Bobby Jackson/ Marcus Thornton
PG Monta Ellis/ D.J. Augustin/ Mike Taylor

IR Leon Powe

Because I know Rockets' intention to start Bosh at center is unpopular with some of the board's purists, also please indulge this pitch: Chris filled fully half of the Raptors center minutes last season, out-scored and out-rebounded opposing centers, drew twice the number of fouls, and posted a +6.5 PER differential. He’s 6th in the NBA in rebounding, despite concerns about his build, and in Beijing led the US Men’s team in boards.

Also worth mentioning that 20 year old Anthony Randolph is 6’11” (...and a ½) and added another 10 pounds of muscle this offseason. So Rockets don't lack for height or length just girth. (And, yes, little conventional back to the basket scoring, but that’s a lost art anyway, right?)

[bucknersrevenge]

KG doesn't have the mentality of being a #1 "go to" guy for a team. I think that's why he's such a perfect fit. Leading a team in scoring thru the natural function and flow of the offense is one thing. But I don't think KG at this point is a guy who'd want to be that guy for 82 games and then in the playoffs. He'd rather defer to more pure scorers. And the problem with Toronto as Jsaad appeared to be saying is that I don't think any of those guys are pure enough ecorers to do that. That's a team full of #2 and #3 scorers. I don't see a real hierarchy for that team that would allow KG to get his points in the natural flow of the offense. If KG is the best scorer on your team I think that's a problem. And I love KG too btw.

[Rondo2287]

KG was the MVP as the number one guy

[BigAlTheFuture]

KG was the MVP as the number one guy

But its obvious that he isn't the MVP player he once was anymore.

[Rondo2287]

agreed, but as WDleei said, why are we saying the guy cant be a number 1 anymore since he sacrificed a stat boost to win a championship