Author Topic: Rumor from Sixers board in Realgm: C's interested in Willie Green  (Read 16013 times)

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Re: Rumor from Sixers board in Realgm: C's interested in Willie Green
« Reply #30 on: June 09, 2009, 09:29:30 PM »

Offline the TRUTH

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At first glance, I was all about this deal from our perspective. Now, not so much. JR was a first round pick, so obviously Danny saw something in him. Unless he is a complete locker room cancer, I don't see how he could have done anything this year to destroy all the faith Danny had in him. Definitely want to hang onto him UNLESS he's necessary in a deal that brings back a much better player than Willie Green.

As for TA...I thought he was really starting to click right before he got hurt this year. IF, and this is a huge IF, he could get back even close to the TA of January of '07, no team in the NBA would touch us. He's clearly expendable IF it's part of a deal that brings us a much better player, but he still has too much potential to just give away for a player that's only marginally better, at the most.

Re: Rumor from Sixers board in Realgm: C's interested in Willie Green
« Reply #31 on: June 09, 2009, 09:33:24 PM »

Offline Roy Hobbs

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At first glance, I was all about this deal from our perspective. Now, not so much. JR was a first round pick, so obviously Danny saw something in him. Unless he is a complete locker room cancer, I don't see how he could have done anything this year to destroy all the faith Danny had in him. Definitely want to hang onto him UNLESS he's necessary in a deal that brings back a much better player than Willie Green.

Well, hypothetically, it would be Danny giving up on him.  It's not like Danny ever really loved Giddens; the selection looks like it was a bit of a panic move because the Spurs took George Hill and Danny was left flat-footed.  There have been numerous reports of Danny trying to dump Giddens ever since the draft.

From what he's said, the team took Giddens because he thought J.R. could step in as a rookie.  We all see how that one worked out.

Quote
As for TA...I thought he was really starting to click right before he got hurt this year. IF, and this is a huge IF, he could get back even close to the TA of January of '07, no team in the NBA would touch us. He's clearly expendable IF it's part of a deal that brings us a much better player, but he still has too much potential to just give away for a player that's only marginally better, at the most.

Tony Allen doesn't have any potential, in my opinion.  He is what he is, which is an injury-prone, horribly inconsistent, low-IQ player.

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Re: Rumor from Sixers board in Realgm: C's interested in Willie Green
« Reply #32 on: June 09, 2009, 09:35:14 PM »

Offline RebusRankin

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Green isn't a huge upgrade from TA.

Re: Rumor from Sixers board in Realgm: C's interested in Willie Green
« Reply #33 on: June 09, 2009, 10:04:54 PM »

Offline the TRUTH

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At first glance, I was all about this deal from our perspective. Now, not so much. JR was a first round pick, so obviously Danny saw something in him. Unless he is a complete locker room cancer, I don't see how he could have done anything this year to destroy all the faith Danny had in him. Definitely want to hang onto him UNLESS he's necessary in a deal that brings back a much better player than Willie Green.

Well, hypothetically, it would be Danny giving up on him.  It's not like Danny ever really loved Giddens; the selection looks like it was a bit of a panic move because the Spurs took George Hill and Danny was left flat-footed.  There have been numerous reports of Danny trying to dump Giddens ever since the draft.

From what he's said, the team took Giddens because he thought J.R. could step in as a rookie.  We all see how that one worked out.

Quote
As for TA...I thought he was really starting to click right before he got hurt this year. IF, and this is a huge IF, he could get back even close to the TA of January of '07, no team in the NBA would touch us. He's clearly expendable IF it's part of a deal that brings us a much better player, but he still has too much potential to just give away for a player that's only marginally better, at the most.

Tony Allen doesn't have any potential, in my opinion.  He is what he is, which is an injury-prone, horribly inconsistent, low-IQ player.

While Danny may have preferred George Hill, he must have seen something in Giddens to draft him. If not, he would have traded back a few places into the second round to get better value and avoid a guaranteed deal. Unless JR has a horrible attitude, I doubt DA would give up on him so soon if he thought enough of him last June to draft him. Like you said, if we make this trade, DA would be giving up on JR and admitting he made a mistake drafting him.

As for TA, trust me, there are times where I'm convinced that he's the worst player I've ever seen. He makes some of the stupidest plays of anyone in the NBA, and can really drag the team down at points. IMO though, he plays much smarter basketball when he's healthy and has been playing in a consistent role for awhile.

I wouldn't necessarily say he's injury-prone or doesn't have potential, either. His most recent injury was to his thumb - not exactly a nagging knee injury or a chronic shoulder problem like Perkins has. Lots of NBA players would have been able to step in after that thumb injury and regain their old form. Not TA - don't think he has the basketball smarts for that.

That being said, if he could play 75-80 games a year, truly establish a rhythm and have a legit role, I think you'd see him play much more consistently. And during that stretch in January of 2007, he was playing at a very high level that lots of NBA players would only dream about. He clearly has the talent to do that. If we (the coaching staff and/or veteran players) can get him to play anywhere near that level on a consistent basis, that'd be huge.

To clarify, I'm not strongly against trading him away if the right deal presents itself. However, I don't think he's complete trash, as many C's fans do. I wouldn't just give him away for a bag of Doritos, because he's shown enough talent to make me think there's a CHANCE - however slight - that he could still develop into a great energy guy off the bench.

Re: Rumor from Sixers board in Realgm: C's interested in Willie Green
« Reply #34 on: June 09, 2009, 10:07:39 PM »

Offline Roy Hobbs

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While Danny may have preferred George Hill, he must have seen something in Giddens to draft him. If not, he would have traded back a few places into the second round to get better value and avoid a guaranteed deal.

I *guarantee* that Danny would have moved into the second round to avoid paying a guaranteed contract if he could have.  Just because he ended up drafting Giddens doesn't mean he was in love with him.  According to Ainge, he drafted him because he could fill a role immediately.  As I said, that didn't happen, meaning it looks like it was essentially a wasted draft pick.

I wouldn't be surprised at all if the Celtics decline to pick up Giddens' contract for next season.  Actually, I'd say it's very, very likely that they do decline it.

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Re: Rumor from Sixers board in Realgm: C's interested in Willie Green
« Reply #35 on: June 09, 2009, 10:57:09 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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So we trade Tony Allen for a really bad version of Eddie House???

Since I hate Tony Allen's game I say...yeah....okay....sure...why not!!

But this trade doesn't make us any better or worse, because we'd be trading a brain dead 13th player on the roster and a rookie 15th player on the roster for what will be an overconfident, poor shooting, 13th player on the roster.

Re: Rumor from Sixers board in Realgm: C's interested in Willie Green
« Reply #36 on: June 09, 2009, 11:52:55 PM »

Offline Lucky17

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The last post in that RealGM thread containing the Green trade chatter:

Quote
I am not so sure Green goes...I think Eddie Jordan wants him to be the backup SG. He wants to find his starting SG via free agency/draft/trade.

They really want to move Sammy....and to my surprise..Korver is still an option along with Parker for mid level. They want to keep a shooter on the floor at all times..so maybe they split the time between Korver and Kapono. Eddie Jordan is the guy that started Jared Jeffries at the two..so you could see a Korver acquired and start and be backed up by Kapono

Miller wants a 3 year deal at a minimum and we dont want to go above 2...so I think he wont be here in some form or fashion. Also...I dont think we use midlevel if we sign and trade Miller...if we let him walk..we will use the midlevel.

I still think we draft a PG to back up Lou

Lou/DRAFTED PG/Ivey
Midlevel or guy we get for Miller/Green
Iguodala/Kapono
Thad/Speights
Brand/Smith

I didnt include Dalembert cuz I dont think he will be here.....will also sign a vet big as insurance....thats what my impression is of what will happen. Today surprised me...I didnt hear anything and didnt expect a move so soon.

Lots of interest there, least of which is a bit of backtrack on the Green trade talk: Miller asking for too much to stay, Sixers giving Dalembert away (possible buyout?), Korver (or possibly Carney) returning.
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Re: Rumor from Sixers board in Realgm: C's interested in Willie Green
« Reply #37 on: June 10, 2009, 12:02:55 AM »

Offline hpantazo

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The last post in that RealGM thread containing the Green trade chatter:

Quote
I am not so sure Green goes...I think Eddie Jordan wants him to be the backup SG. He wants to find his starting SG via free agency/draft/trade.

They really want to move Sammy....and to my surprise..Korver is still an option along with Parker for mid level. They want to keep a shooter on the floor at all times..so maybe they split the time between Korver and Kapono. Eddie Jordan is the guy that started Jared Jeffries at the two..so you could see a Korver acquired and start and be backed up by Kapono

Miller wants a 3 year deal at a minimum and we dont want to go above 2...so I think he wont be here in some form or fashion. Also...I dont think we use midlevel if we sign and trade Miller...if we let him walk..we will use the midlevel.

I still think we draft a PG to back up Lou

Lou/DRAFTED PG/Ivey
Midlevel or guy we get for Miller/Green
Iguodala/Kapono
Thad/Speights
Brand/Smith

I didnt include Dalembert cuz I dont think he will be here.....will also sign a vet big as insurance....thats what my impression is of what will happen. Today surprised me...I didnt hear anything and didnt expect a move so soon.

Lots of interest there, least of which is a bit of backtrack on the Green trade talk: Miller asking for too much to stay, Sixers giving Dalembert away (possible buyout?), Korver (or possibly Carney) returning.

any chance we can get Dalembert? He would be a nice big off the bench

Re: Rumor from Sixers board in Realgm: C's interested in Willie Green
« Reply #38 on: June 10, 2009, 12:17:40 AM »

Offline Lucky17

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any chance we can get Dalembert? He would be a nice big off the bench

He makes a ton of money: $11.2 mil this season, $12.125 next, and $13 in the 3rd and last year remaining on his contract.

The numbers could work on a swap of Ray for Dalembert and Andre Miller in a sign and trade, but then we need to get a starting SG somehow.
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Re: Rumor from Sixers board in Realgm: C's interested in Willie Green
« Reply #39 on: June 10, 2009, 12:37:19 AM »

Offline johnnyrondo

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While Danny may have preferred George Hill, he must have seen something in Giddens to draft him. If not, he would have traded back a few places into the second round to get better value and avoid a guaranteed deal.

I *guarantee* that Danny would have moved into the second round to avoid paying a guaranteed contract if he could have.  Just because he ended up drafting Giddens doesn't mean he was in love with him.  According to Ainge, he drafted him because he could fill a role immediately.  As I said, that didn't happen, meaning it looks like it was essentially a wasted draft pick.

I wouldn't be surprised at all if the Celtics decline to pick up Giddens' contract for next season.  Actually, I'd say it's very, very likely that they do decline it.

I think it was also mentioned that the C's tried to sell the pick, but no one wanted it. Still should have taken Chalmers. Giddens was a REACH.

Re: Rumor from Sixers board in Realgm: C's interested in Willie Green
« Reply #40 on: June 10, 2009, 12:42:22 AM »

Offline Atzar

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I don't think I'd trade TA for Willie Green straight up.  Willie Green can occasionally explode on offense.  Tony Allen can occasionally explode on offense and is also capable of utterly shutting his man down on defense.  Now, add in the fact that TA has an expiring contract.  And we're throwing them Giddens?  I fully condone getting rid of TA, but I think he could be used to get somebody more useful than Willie Green.  

Perhaps this is a move to free up a spot on the roster, or perhaps this is the front office wanting no part of TA's offcourt issues.  If either is the case, then I could live with this.  But if this trade is actually about the players, then it doesn't make much sense to me.

Re: Rumor from Sixers board in Realgm: C's interested in Willie Green
« Reply #41 on: June 10, 2009, 05:57:15 AM »

Offline wdleehi

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any chance we can get Dalembert? He would be a nice big off the bench

He makes a ton of money: $11.2 mil this season, $12.125 next, and $13 in the 3rd and last year remaining on his contract.

The numbers could work on a swap of Ray for Dalembert and Andre Miller in a sign and trade, but then we need to get a starting SG somehow.


There is a reason the 76ers want to dump him.



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Re: Rumor from Sixers board in Realgm: C's interested in Willie Green
« Reply #42 on: June 10, 2009, 07:22:16 AM »

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So we trade Tony Allen for a really bad version of Eddie House???

Since I hate Tony Allen's game I say...yeah....okay....sure...why not!!

But this trade doesn't make us any better or worse, because we'd be trading a brain dead 13th player on the roster and a rookie 15th player on the roster for what will be an overconfident, poor shooting, 13th player on the roster.

i like it!  ;D

poor tony and JR. herds of physical talent it seems, but not the bb brains to match?

has anyone actually watched giddens' games? what is the problem/shortcoming?

is it a case that he is a ball hog? not a team player? has a bb IQ of -14? cant shoot beyond 6 feet?

no one seems to like poor little JR, i am just wondering why not?
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Re: Rumor from Sixers board in Realgm: C's interested in Willie Green
« Reply #43 on: June 10, 2009, 07:44:36 AM »

Offline CoachBo

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I don't think I'd trade TA for Willie Green straight up.  Willie Green can occasionally explode on offense.  Tony Allen can occasionally explode on offense and is also capable of utterly shutting his man down on defense.  Now, add in the fact that TA has an expiring contract.  And we're throwing them Giddens?  I fully condone getting rid of TA, but I think he could be used to get somebody more useful than Willie Green.  

Perhaps this is a move to free up a spot on the roster, or perhaps this is the front office wanting no part of TA's offcourt issues.  If either is the case, then I could live with this.  But if this trade is actually about the players, then it doesn't make much sense to me.


This news draws a big meh from me. I'm not enamored of Willie Green.

But I'd trade Tony Allen for Willie Aames right now, let alone Willie Green.
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Re: Rumor from Sixers board in Realgm: C's interested in Willie Green
« Reply #44 on: June 10, 2009, 08:24:57 AM »

Offline BballTim

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I don't think I'd trade TA for Willie Green straight up.  Willie Green can occasionally explode on offense.  Tony Allen can occasionally explode on offense and is also capable of utterly shutting his man down on defense.  Now, add in the fact that TA has an expiring contract.  And we're throwing them Giddens?  I fully condone getting rid of TA, but I think he could be used to get somebody more useful than Willie Green.  

Perhaps this is a move to free up a spot on the roster, or perhaps this is the front office wanting no part of TA's offcourt issues.  If either is the case, then I could live with this.  But if this trade is actually about the players, then it doesn't make much sense to me.


This news draws a big meh from me. I'm not enamored of Willie Green.

But I'd trade Tony Allen for Willie Aames right now, let alone Willie Green.

  I'd save his contract to throw in on a deal for something we need rather than just do the first deal that comes along that gets him off the roster. We only have one MLE to use and I'm not up for any of the "improve our bench by trading Ray" plans.