LeBron

[markketch]

To clarify, you are not allow to hit a man during his shooting motion, including follow through with any part of your body whether you get a piece of the shot or not.  Refs don't always call this correctly, but that is the rule.

If you block the ball cleanly and follow through, incidental contact is not a foul. The block occured after the ball was released - it does not impede the shot.

Please post the rule.

[RAcker]

You need to read the entire string.  You are actually agreeing with me.  It's ketchup that says that incidental contact during the follow through is allowed.

It IS allowed. If the shot is effectively blocked, incidental contact does NOT impede the shot and is NOT a foul.

What is so hard to understand about this? It's a very simple concept that has existed for decades in the NBA.

As someone who has shot a basketball, I would submit that hitting my arm during my follow through DOES impede my shot...especially my next shot if you continue to hit me during follow through.

Sorry, I'll let this alone.  Obviously we do not agree on a basic rule.

[RAcker]

To clarify, you are not allow to hit a man during his shooting motion, including follow through with any part of your body whether you get a piece of the shot or not.  Refs don't always call this correctly, but that is the rule.

If you block the ball cleanly and follow through, incidental contact is not a foul. The block occured after the ball was released - it does not impede the shot.

Please post the rule.

Are you allowed to land on me after a block? 

And I KNOW the rule.  YOU post the rule and prove I'm wrong.

[markketch]

As someone who has shot a basketball, I would submit that hitting my arm during my follow through DOES impede my shot...especially my next shot if you continue to hit me during follow through.

Sorry, I'll let this alone.  Obviously we do not agree on a basic rule.

How does contact after the ball is released impede your shot? The ball is arleady gone, out of your hand.  You following through and pulling your arm down isn't going to "will" the ball in, is it?

Again - INCIDENTAL contact is not a foul if it occures after a clean block.  

Your point about your "next shot" is laughable.  Is this Minority Report?

[markketch]

Are you allowed to land on me after a block? 

And I KNOW the rule.  YOU post the rule and prove I'm wrong.

Physically landing on someone is entirely different from making contact with a wrist.  I don't even need to address this - it's a silly comparisson.

You clearly do not know the rule, and have done a fantastic job of proving so.

[markketch]

(5) Incidental contact with the hand against an offensive player shall be ignored if it does not affect the player's speed, quickness, balance and/or rhythm. - this is addressing hand to waist, etc - but is applicable to our discussion.

e. Contact which occurs on the hand of the offensive player, while that hand is in contact with the ball, is legal.

[RAcker]

(5) Incidental contact with the hand against an offensive player shall be ignored if it does not affect the player's speed, quickness, balance and/or rhythm. - this is addressing hand to waist, etc - but is applicable to our discussion.

e. Contact which occurs on the hand of the offensive player, while that hand is in contact with the ball, is legal.

Um...no source?

[markketch]

1. Incidental Contact
The mere fact that contact occurs does not necessarily constitute a foul. Contact which is incidental to an effort by a player to play an opponent, reach a loose ball, or perform normal defensive or offensive movements, should not be consid-ered illegal. If, however, a player attempts to play an opponent from a position where he has no reasonable chance to perform without making contact with his opponent, the responsibility is on the player in this position.
The hand is considered "part of the ball" when it is in contact with the ball. Therefore, contact on that hand by a defender while it is in contact with the ball is not illegal.

http://www.nba.com/analysis/rules_a.html

http://www.nba.com/analysis/rules_12.html?nav=ArticleList

[RAcker]

(5) Incidental contact with the hand against an offensive player shall be ignored if it does not affect the player's speed, quickness, balance and/or rhythm. - this is addressing hand to waist, etc - but is applicable to our discussion.

e. Contact which occurs on the hand of the offensive player, while that hand is in contact with the ball, is legal.

I agree with a hand touch.  I thought we were talking about a hit across the arm?

[RAcker]

1. Incidental Contact
The mere fact that contact occurs does not necessarily constitute a foul. Contact which is incidental to an effort by a player to play an opponent, reach a loose ball, or perform normal defensive or offensive movements, should not be consid-ered illegal. If, however, a player attempts to play an opponent from a position where he has no reasonable chance to perform without making contact with his opponent, the responsibility is on the player in this position.
The hand is considered "part of the ball" when it is in contact with the ball. Therefore, contact on that hand by a defender while it is in contact with the ball is not illegal.

http://www.nba.com/analysis/rules_a.html

http://www.nba.com/analysis/rules_12.html?nav=ArticleList

I agree with this.  But this says nothing of shooting motion.  Let me find it.

[markketch]

Are you serious?

[crownsy]

(5) Incidental contact with the hand against an offensive player shall be ignored if it does not affect the player's speed, quickness, balance and/or rhythm. - this is addressing hand to waist, etc - but is applicable to our discussion.

e. Contact which occurs on the hand of the offensive player, while that hand is in contact with the ball, is legal.

I agree with a hand touch.  I thought we were talking about a hit across the arm?

come on now, don't try to change what you were saying now to try to explain it away. You disagreed with him that ANY contact post shot is a foul.

I'm sorry racker, he's right. If it doesn't affect the shooters follow through and the shot has been blocked, its not a foul.

thats why your examples of intentianl hard whacks to the arm, nut shots, whacks across the face, and other crazy stuff made no sense in context, those are all clearly detrmental to the shooter and intentional.

your wrong on this issue racker, if your not post the rule you think you know inside and out.

[markketch]

Incidental Contact: The mere fact that contact occurs does not mean a foul has been committed. Players are allowed to contact other players when reaching for a loose ball, or when performing normal offensive and defensive movements. The hand is considered “ part of the ball” when it is in contact with the ball and contact with a players hand when it is in contact with the ball is not a foul.

A defensive movement would be attempting a block and following through, correct?

http://www.nba.com/features/misunderstoodrules_051128.html

[markketch]

come on now, don't try to change what you were saying now to try to explain it away. You disagreed with him that ANY contact post shot is a foul.

I'm sorry racker, he's right. If it doesn't affect the shooters follow through and the shot has been blocked, its not a foul.

thats why your examples of intentianl hard whacks to the arm, nut shots, whacks across the face, and other crazy stuff made no sense in context, those are all clearly detrmental to the shooter and intentional.

your wrong on this issue racker, if your not post the rule you think you know inside and out.

TP for being sensical and putting our differences aside.  Thank you for engaging in a fun conversation.

[crownsy]

Incidental Contact: The mere fact that contact occurs does not mean a foul has been committed. Players are allowed to contact other players when reaching for a loose ball, or when performing normal offensive and defensive movements. The hand is considered “ part of the ball” when it is in contact with the ball and contact with a players hand when it is in contact with the ball is not a foul.

A defensive movement would be attempting a block and following through, correct?

http://www.nba.com/features/misunderstoodrules_051128.html

UGh im going to have to TP a cavs fan....I feel dirty  

man, were going to have two rational cavs fans who are good for a basketball discussion now between you and MACOH 

and racker, its no big deal your wrong on this one issue man, im wrong all the time