Rondo's Jumpshot

[Hoops]

I know the comparison has been made before, but I compare Rondo's development to Tony Parker. Both with dynamite quickness, poor jump shooters early in their careers. Both were PGs for a championship team early in their careers. Parker's jumpshooting was poor enough early on that people regularly talked about exploiting him for that weakness. Parker worked really hard. He's still not the world's greatest deep shooting threat, but he'll knock down a solid percentage of open jumpers. With hard work, I have no reason to think Rondo won't be able to do the same thing in a few years.

[LarBrd33]

Rondo will never be a good shooter.  His shot is awkward... it always looks mechanical.  It's going to be an issue throughout his entire career.

[crownsy]

Rondo will never be a good shooter.  His shot is awkward... it always looks mechanical.  It's going to be an issue throughout his entire career.

as opposed to parker, who also has a jerky looking jumpshot, but is now a decent shooter?

I don't think anyones saying rondo is suddenly going to be ray allen, but if he can hit his jumper like he has been during this 2 week stretch, thats good enough considering it shouldn't be his go to move anyway.

Developing an average jumpshot for him is a priority, not a great one, which he will, as you say, most likely never acheive.

But he doesn't need to. it would be super if he did, but just enough of one to be a threat is fine.

[LarBrd33]

Rondo will never be a good shooter.  His shot is awkward... it always looks mechanical.  It's going to be an issue throughout his entire career.

as opposed to parker, who also has a jerky looking jumpshot, but is now a decent shooter?

I don't think anyones saying rondo is suddenly going to be ray allen, but if he can hit his jumper like he has been during this 2 week stretch, thats good enough considering it shouldn't be his go to move anyway.

Developing an average jumpshot for him is a priority, not a great one, which he will, as you say, most likely never acheive.

But he doesn't need to. it would be super if he did, but just enough of one to be a threat is fine.

I think he'll just suck at shooting his entire career.  If I had a nickel for every player who "just needed to develop a jumpshot"...   

Shaq will start hitting free throws consistently before Rondo starts hitting wide open shots consistently.

[crownsy]

Rondo will never be a good shooter.  His shot is awkward... it always looks mechanical.  It's going to be an issue throughout his entire career.

as opposed to parker, who also has a jerky looking jumpshot, but is now a decent shooter?

I don't think anyones saying rondo is suddenly going to be ray allen, but if he can hit his jumper like he has been during this 2 week stretch, thats good enough considering it shouldn't be his go to move anyway.

Developing an average jumpshot for him is a priority, not a great one, which he will, as you say, most likely never acheive.

But he doesn't need to. it would be super if he did, but just enough of one to be a threat is fine.

I think he'll just suck at shooting his entire career.  If I had a nickel for every player who "just needed to develop a jumpshot"...   

Shaq will start hitting free throws consistently before Rondo starts hitting wide open shots consistently.

And i can show you just as many guys who had horrid shooting out of college and developed into average shooters, which is all we need, so whats your point?

and most of them had half the work ethic rondo has (reportedly, i know how up in arms we get around here when we rely on reporters to tell us things about the team. see POB who ive been told is a hard worker in practice despite all evidance to the contrary.)

also, whats your defintion of consistency for him, because if its like he's been shooting it lately, im fine with it. He's not hitting 60% of his jumpers, but its not like he's shooting 20% either.

[BrickJames]

I think I have come to a conclusion. When Rondo takes his time to shoot his jumper he is absolutely awful and doesn't even come close. When Rondo is kind of "rushing" the shot at the end of the shot clock, or because there is a defender closing in, he is actually quite a bit better with it. He doesn't think about the shot and so muscle memory kicks in over his mind. They say he actually knocks a lot of them down in shoot arounds and practice, so it must be a big part mental.

I think the thing that Doc needs to stress to Rondo and train him to do is to shoot the ball immediately when he is open rather than trying to square up and take his time. That should be something that he could work on, especially in the offseason. If he can make even half of those open ones that he gets with guys going under the pick he will truly be amazing.

I agree that when he doesn't out-think his shot, it's more likely to go in, but name me one player for which that's not true?

Your solution of "rushed" shots is a bad idea IMO.  Open jumpshooting is the easiest thing to teach in the game of basketball - and it comes with hard work.

Ray Allen for one. He has a pure shot that you really just can't teach and doesn't think at all when he shoots it. He just lets it fly. The great shooters do this. Reggie was the same way.

You're splitting hairs here, because you know what I mean. I am not saying the guy should shoot Eddie House style and just release the shot as quickly as he can. He just shouldn't sit there and pause for 2-3 seconds and try and guide the ball in which is what he tends to do when he is that wide open. He just needs to catch that open one and pull up immediately into the shot.

I think you misunderstood my first point, because you agreed with me.  Everyone's better when they don't over-think their shot.

In any case, I was doing more than splitting hairs (at least I think so).  What I was suggesting is that instead of practicing to release without hesitation, he should practice taking his time and actually hitting a [dang]ed jumper.

It's called focus, and unlike non-hesitated/pressured shots (which he seems to have down pat), practice makes perfect.

[BballTim]

I think I have come to a conclusion. When Rondo takes his time to shoot his jumper he is absolutely awful and doesn't even come close. When Rondo is kind of "rushing" the shot at the end of the shot clock, or because there is a defender closing in, he is actually quite a bit better with it. He doesn't think about the shot and so muscle memory kicks in over his mind. They say he actually knocks a lot of them down in shoot arounds and practice, so it must be a big part mental.

I think the thing that Doc needs to stress to Rondo and train him to do is to shoot the ball immediately when he is open rather than trying to square up and take his time. That should be something that he could work on, especially in the offseason. If he can make even half of those open ones that he gets with guys going under the pick he will truly be amazing.

I agree that when he doesn't out-think his shot, it's more likely to go in, but name me one player for which that's not true?

Your solution of "rushed" shots is a bad idea IMO.  Open jumpshooting is the easiest thing to teach in the game of basketball - and it comes with hard work.

Ray Allen for one. He has a pure shot that you really just can't teach and doesn't think at all when he shoots it. He just lets it fly. The great shooters do this. Reggie was the same way.

You're splitting hairs here, because you know what I mean. I am not saying the guy should shoot Eddie House style and just release the shot as quickly as he can. He just shouldn't sit there and pause for 2-3 seconds and try and guide the ball in which is what he tends to do when he is that wide open. He just needs to catch that open one and pull up immediately into the shot.

  But when Ray hesitates on his shot IMO it's less likely to go in.

[crownsy]

I think I have come to a conclusion. When Rondo takes his time to shoot his jumper he is absolutely awful and doesn't even come close. When Rondo is kind of "rushing" the shot at the end of the shot clock, or because there is a defender closing in, he is actually quite a bit better with it. He doesn't think about the shot and so muscle memory kicks in over his mind. They say he actually knocks a lot of them down in shoot arounds and practice, so it must be a big part mental.

I think the thing that Doc needs to stress to Rondo and train him to do is to shoot the ball immediately when he is open rather than trying to square up and take his time. That should be something that he could work on, especially in the offseason. If he can make even half of those open ones that he gets with guys going under the pick he will truly be amazing.

I agree that when he doesn't out-think his shot, it's more likely to go in, but name me one player for which that's not true?

Your solution of "rushed" shots is a bad idea IMO.  Open jumpshooting is the easiest thing to teach in the game of basketball - and it comes with hard work.

Ray Allen for one. He has a pure shot that you really just can't teach and doesn't think at all when he shoots it. He just lets it fly. The great shooters do this. Reggie was the same way.

You're splitting hairs here, because you know what I mean. I am not saying the guy should shoot Eddie House style and just release the shot as quickly as he can. He just shouldn't sit there and pause for 2-3 seconds and try and guide the ball in which is what he tends to do when he is that wide open. He just needs to catch that open one and pull up immediately into the shot.

  But when Ray hesitates on his shot IMO it's less likely to go in.

right, thats why EJ had him as a rythm shooter.

But i would argue that outside of ray and eddie, both of whom have honed thier jumper to super catch and shoot levels, other guys who "think" on thier shots do better.

Paul, Kg, scal, and to an extent baby are far better with a second to set thier feet and form rather than catch and shoot.

rondo clearly is not, which is how this came up. I think that rajon is a much better catch and shoot guy, and he should do more of it. The minute he puts the ball on the floor in the half court set, his jumper is out the window.

[spazmonkey]

Only time will tell if Rondo ever develops a reliable jumper.  That said, I think it's not so much about overthinking, but rather, about consistent mechanics.  There's a reason great athletes are often known to have obsessive-compulsive workout (and personal) habits.  Repetition breeds consistency.  Consistent mechanics yield consistent results.  If Rondo knocks 'em down in practice, he needs to find a way to get his mind and body into that space during the game.

On a related note, Tommy mentioned something I found interesting the other night.  I can't remember which game, but it was a home game within the last few weeks.  He disagreed that Rondo's lack of a jumpshot was major issue.  His argument was that although Rondo passes up open jumpers, he's instead breaking down the defense and creating  high-percentage shots for his teammates or for himself (i.e., layup/floater).  Granted, Tommy's hardly an objective observer of the Celtics...and I don't think I entirely agree...but it got me thinking...

[crownsy]

Only time will tell if Rondo ever develops a reliable jumper.  That said, I think it's not so much about overthinking, but rather, about consistent mechanics.  There's a reason great athletes are often known to have obsessive-compulsive workout (and personal) habits.  Repetition breeds consistency.  Consistent mechanics yield consistent results.  If Rondo knocks 'em down in practice, he needs to find a way to get his mind and body into that space during the game.

On a related note, Tommy mentioned something I found interesting the other night.  I can't remember which game, but it was a home game within the last few weeks.  He disagreed that Rondo's lack of a jumpshot was major issue.  His argument was that although Rondo passes up open jumpers, he's instead breaking down the defense and creating  high-percentage shots for his teammates or for himself (i.e., layup/floater).  Granted, Tommy's hardly an objective observer of the Celtics...and I don't think I entirely agree...but it got me thinking...

thats true against subpar to average defensive teams. The problem is good defensive squads can make a ton of use out of not having to space to guard him.

he just needs to take the shots he sees in rythm when were swinging the ball, which to his credit he has done lately.

[fairweatherfan]

Rondo will never be a good shooter.  His shot is awkward... it always looks mechanical.  It's going to be an issue throughout his entire career.

I disagree - his shot is still mechanical and inaccurate, but it is significantly less mechanical and inaccurate this year than last.  He's even showed a hint of a three point stroke - he's just 9-27 on the season, but several of those 18 misses are end-of-quarter heaves.

I wish Rondo was shooting better right now, but I can't say I'm unhappy with his progress this year, and I think he'll continue to get better as his career progresses.  He'll never be a great shooter, but I think he'll eventually be an above-average one.

[cordobes]

Rondo will never be a good shooter.  His shot is awkward... it always looks mechanical.  It's going to be an issue throughout his entire career.

as opposed to parker, who also has a jerky looking jumpshot, but is now a decent shooter?

I don't think anyones saying rondo is suddenly going to be ray allen, but if he can hit his jumper like he has been during this 2 week stretch, thats good enough considering it shouldn't be his go to move anyway.

Developing an average jumpshot for him is a priority, not a great one, which he will, as you say, most likely never acheive.

But he doesn't need to. it would be super if he did, but just enough of one to be a threat is fine.

I think he'll just suck at shooting his entire career.  If I had a nickel for every player who "just needed to develop a jumpshot"...   

Shaq will start hitting free throws consistently before Rondo starts hitting wide open shots consistently.

And i can show you just as many guys who had horrid shooting out of college and developed into average shooters, which is all we need, so whats your point?

Guards that after two years in the league were as bad as Rondo and later developed into average shooters? Who?

[crownsy]

Rondo will never be a good shooter.  His shot is awkward... it always looks mechanical.  It's going to be an issue throughout his entire career.

as opposed to parker, who also has a jerky looking jumpshot, but is now a decent shooter?

I don't think anyones saying rondo is suddenly going to be ray allen, but if he can hit his jumper like he has been during this 2 week stretch, thats good enough considering it shouldn't be his go to move anyway.

Developing an average jumpshot for him is a priority, not a great one, which he will, as you say, most likely never acheive.

But he doesn't need to. it would be super if he did, but just enough of one to be a threat is fine.

I think he'll just suck at shooting his entire career.  If I had a nickel for every player who "just needed to develop a jumpshot"...   

Shaq will start hitting free throws consistently before Rondo starts hitting wide open shots consistently.

And i can show you just as many guys who had horrid shooting out of college and developed into average shooters, which is all we need, so whats your point?

Guards that after two years in the league were as bad as Rondo and later developed into average shooters? Who?

parker is the easiest example.

billups to an extent (36% first two years, though he wasen't as bad, though he also took a ton more shots, but he initaly couldn't hit the broadside of a barn. Its why we ran him out of town)

hate to be praising knicks, but duhon. 


jason kid was a horrid shooter early in his career (33%), and while he's never been great, he's improved to average (40-42%).

If were going to expand to bench guys, im sure i can find more, those four were just off the top of my head at work.

Were not talking about him improving to "WOW!" levels, what he's done the last 2 weeks would be fine.

[BrickJames]

Don't confuse FG% with shooting.

[wdleehi]

Rondo can develop a respectable jumpshot.  


Then he becomes even more of nightmare.