Who is the Backup 3? does anyone else NOT see a glaring weakness??

[tapper]

TA is a different type of defender than posey is. TA playing against King James will try to deny him the ball with quickness and once he has the ball will try to get up underneath him to deny the drive. If he gets past Tony , then help defense kicks in. The team will be different this year, sit back, enjoy the ride and see how it all plaays out.

[gar]

Yes he can defend the drive; but Kobe or Lebron can simply shoot over him.

[zerophase]

i dissagree. tony allen on defense vs. kobe has looked great in the past. he's unable to guard lebron though. i think allen could turn into a bowen type player but instead of shooting 3's on offense, be more of a slasher.

[Chris]

Yes he can defend the drive; but Kobe or Lebron can simply shoot over him.

But he would likely only be covering either of those guys for 5-10 minutes per game.  Ray and Pierce will still see the majority of the minutes.

Not to mention, Lebron could also shoot over Posey.  What Posey did to Lebron, and what Ray Allen and Pierce did to Kobe was get in his face and get him off his rhythm.  That way even if he can get his shot off, he will be taking it out of rhythm, or off balance.  Don't you remember all of those "The C's just got lucky, because Lebron was getting open shots and missing them" comments after game 1?  That was no coincidence.

Tony Allen can certainly do that.  The only question with him is whether he can keep his head in the game 80% of the time or better, rather than the 35-40% that we have seen the last few years.

[Jon]

I just worry about Tony Allen and Rondo on the court at the same time.  Sure, both are excellent penetrators, but as teams figured out with Rondo, if you just back off him a few steps, you take his penetration away and make him shoot a low percentage jumper.  I don't think it'll be too long before teams starting giving Tony this treatment too.  Put the two of them on the court together and you make it really easy for the other team to pack the lane and prevent the other Celtics on the court from making anything happen in the middle as well. 

[Chris]

I just worry about Tony Allen and Rondo on the court at the same time.  Sure, both are excellent penetrators, but as teams figured out with Rondo, if you just back off him a few steps, you take his penetration away and make him shoot a low percentage jumper.  I don't think it'll be too long before teams starting giving Tony this treatment too.  Put the two of them on the court together and you make it really easy for the other team to pack the lane and prevent the other Celtics on the court from making anything happen in the middle as well. 

Good point...although I don't expect it to happen too often.  And when it does, they will likely turn up the pressure and try to control the tempo of the game by being pests, and creating an up tempo game, so the defense doesn't have time to set up.

[cordobes]

Yes he can defend the drive; but Kobe or Lebron can simply shoot over him.

But he would likely only be covering either of those guys for 5-10 minutes per game.  Ray and Pierce will still see the majority of the minutes.

Not to mention, Lebron could also shoot over Posey.  What Posey did to Lebron, and what Ray Allen and Pierce did to Kobe was get in his face and get him off his rhythm.  That way even if he can get his shot off, he will be taking it out of rhythm, or off balance.  Don't you remember all of those "The C's just got lucky, because Lebron was getting open shots and missing them" comments after game 1?  That was no coincidence.

Tony Allen can certainly do that.  The only question with him is whether he can keep his head in the game 80% of the time or better, rather than the 35-40% that we have seen the last few years.

Yeps, but LeBron is not a very consistent outside shooter (yet) and Kobe his not much taller than him. Tony's toughest defensive assignemts are guys like Hedo or Peja, that can keep shooting all day like he isn't even there. He can't be used to guard those guys.

Still, what worries me more about Tony are the turnovers. Turnovers are very, very costly and his TO rate is very high.

[BudweiserCeltic]

I just worry about Tony Allen and Rondo on the court at the same time.  Sure, both are excellent penetrators, but as teams figured out with Rondo, if you just back off him a few steps, you take his penetration away and make him shoot a low percentage jumper.  I don't think it'll be too long before teams starting giving Tony this treatment too.  Put the two of them on the court together and you make it really easy for the other team to pack the lane and prevent the other Celtics on the court from making anything happen in the middle as well. 

Yet the problem with Rondo wasn't that they made him a jump shooter, it was that he wasn't ready to put the shot up, constantly hesitated to take the shot. This was more of a problem with poor decision making by Rondo and more of a confidence problem, than a lack of skill one. Those open shots he had during the playoffs he was draining with great consistency through all the season... Rondo simply showed his youth and inexperience in the playoffs; that's all it was. Also, Tony, more than Rondo, more often than not attacks the basket even when left open.

[StartOrien]

Can we PLEASE get a little clarification

are we talking about the big three of KG, Pierce and Allen or Nick Young, Andray Blatche and some other guy (Maguire, maybe?)?

[wahz]

IMHO, Tony will play a little more at the three than the two during the reg season.. And he is strong enough and long enough to do it and has done it well in the past. But because this lineup will happen at times as a result: Perk/OBryant, KG/Baby, TA, RA, and RR, it is clear we will need to pick up another shooter from the three or four to deepen our playoff bench. I'll be pretty shocked if we do something different than that. That above lineup is one mean lineup though, as is this one: Perk, KG, PP, TA, RR. a very quick and physical group of guys

[cordobes]

I just worry about Tony Allen and Rondo on the court at the same time.  Sure, both are excellent penetrators, but as teams figured out with Rondo, if you just back off him a few steps, you take his penetration away and make him shoot a low percentage jumper.  I don't think it'll be too long before teams starting giving Tony this treatment too.  Put the two of them on the court together and you make it really easy for the other team to pack the lane and prevent the other Celtics on the court from making anything happen in the middle as well. 

Yet the problem with Rondo wasn't that they made him a jump shooter, it was that he wasn't ready to put the shot up, constantly hesitated to take the shot. This was more of a problem with poor decision making by Rondo and more of a confidence problem, than a lack of skill one. Those open shots he had during the playoffs he was draining with great consistency through all the season... Rondo simply showed his youth and inexperience in the playoffs; that's all it was. Also, Tony, more than Rondo, more often than not attacks the basket even when left open.

Well, confidence played a big role, but there's a reason why Rondo didn't rely on his jump-shot: he's not that good making them. Especially from beyond the line, which is very important to provide spacing. Rondo hit 87 shots when more than 12ft away from the basket, with relatively low percentages, and barely shot from the 3 - which is a problem, because he has to stand behind the line to provide spacing.

[rondofan1255]

I think Danny will choose between the 3 and the 5, as to which roster spot to add depth too.

I would prefer the 3, but if POB does not mesh as the backup C, then I would say the 5 would need more help. At the same time, the 3 is questionable, with Bill Walker and Scal there. TA may play there some ( a different kind of small ball)..

Definitely, we will not be adding another PG or SG, or PF for that matter. I cannot think of any 3's that may be of good use for this team that we might pick up during midseason. At the 5, I hope PJ comes back.

[Chris]

Yes he can defend the drive; but Kobe or Lebron can simply shoot over him.

But he would likely only be covering either of those guys for 5-10 minutes per game.  Ray and Pierce will still see the majority of the minutes.

Not to mention, Lebron could also shoot over Posey.  What Posey did to Lebron, and what Ray Allen and Pierce did to Kobe was get in his face and get him off his rhythm.  That way even if he can get his shot off, he will be taking it out of rhythm, or off balance.  Don't you remember all of those "The C's just got lucky, because Lebron was getting open shots and missing them" comments after game 1?  That was no coincidence.

Tony Allen can certainly do that.  The only question with him is whether he can keep his head in the game 80% of the time or better, rather than the 35-40% that we have seen the last few years.

Yeps, but LeBron is not a very consistent outside shooter (yet) and Kobe his not much taller than him. Tony's toughest defensive assignemts are guys like Hedo or Peja, that can keep shooting all day like he isn't even there. He can't be used to guard those guys.

Still, what worries me more about Tony are the turnovers. Turnovers are very, very costly and his TO rate is very high.

Peja is not a problem, because he can be bother by someone getting up on him, and denying him the ball.  Hedo can be a problem though...but again, Pierce will be covering him 90% of the time. 

And remember, we still have Giddens and Walker (or even Scal) in case of emergency.

[Chris]

I think Danny will choose between the 3 and the 5, as to which roster spot to add depth too.

I would prefer the 3, but if POB does not mesh as the backup C, then I would say the 5 would need more help. At the same time, the 3 is questionable, with Bill Walker and Scal there. TA may play there some ( a different kind of small ball)..

Definitely, we will not be adding another PG or SG, or PF for that matter. I cannot think of any 3's that may be of good use for this team that we might pick up during midseason. At the 5, I hope PJ comes back.

I think this is probably right.  Danny is going to throw things up against the wall at the beginning of the season, and hope something sticks.  I think he feels that there is a good chance that Giddens, Walker, or POB will be able to be at least a solid 9th or 10th man/matchup specialist by midseason.  If none of them pan out, he might be in a bind, but if just one of them do (and there are no other major injuries), he will just have to bring someone in for whoever did not step up.

[Jon]

I just worry about Tony Allen and Rondo on the court at the same time.  Sure, both are excellent penetrators, but as teams figured out with Rondo, if you just back off him a few steps, you take his penetration away and make him shoot a low percentage jumper.  I don't think it'll be too long before teams starting giving Tony this treatment too.  Put the two of them on the court together and you make it really easy for the other team to pack the lane and prevent the other Celtics on the court from making anything happen in the middle as well. 

Good point...although I don't expect it to happen too often.  And when it does, they will likely turn up the pressure and try to control the tempo of the game by being pests, and creating an up tempo game, so the defense doesn't have time to set up.

But it should happen, and often.  The reason we didn't see Tony Allen and Rondo on the court that much last year was because Allen didn't get many minutes.  But that should change this year.  Rondo will at least be playing 35 mpg this year and with Allen backing up both the 2/3, should at least see 25 mpg.  Their paths will cross frequently.

And while I agree defensively Rondo and Allen can be pests and consequently push the pace off turnovers, that also leads to another problem of Tony Allen's: turnovers. 

I'm not saying he can't put it together; players have certainly made bigger strides than what I'm calling for.  However, I am concerned.