Will Doc Ever Coach a Team Out of the First Round?

[EJPLAYA]

This series is on Doc.  Doc has no excuse if the Celtics were to lose this.  One game lose in Atlanta, fine.  Two!!!  This team has no excuse. 



Make an adjustment already.  The Hawks made an adjustment.  It is working.  The Celtics respond by playing different lineups, but change nothing they do.






Listening to him right now is making me more and more upset. 


The Celtics offense was fine in the 4th.  The shots were good, they just didn't fall. 

The Defense was fine in the 4th.



This team is defense.  And they didn't play defense going into the 4th.  House should not have been in there.  Atlanta not longer had issues getting in to their offense. 


I would rather see Tony Allen in there at that point.  Keep the defensive pressure up.


This is where coaches are important.  And the Celtics just blew a 10 point lead to the Atlanta Hawks. 


Doc, step up.  You have to win one game in Atlanta if this team is ever to have a chance of winning a title.  Play like this after this round, Celtics go home early.

The big three played almost the entire game other than PP who missed a big stretch in the first half due to stupid fouls. Rondo played 35. Perk played 25, which is his season average. Powe came in and did nothing. Sam came in and as usual did nothing. House came in and was cold (which is exactly why I didn't want Sam taking his minutes.) He did nothing.

What ADJUSTMENTS do you guys think Doc should be making?! He is letting his stars play the game. Should he come out in Boston with a starting lineup of Perk, BBD, Posey, TA, and Sam?! He is playing his best guys the majority of the minutes and they are getting caught up in the emotion. They are the ones playing like the rookies, not Atlanta. He has changed matchups defensively. The players just aren't getting it done. Stop blaming Doc just because you don't like the guy. He isn't the one missing the shots.

Think about this. If you had said we would have outrebounded them  this game, including 15-8 on the offensive boards, turned it over 10 times vs. their 17, and they went 4-18 from the floor, wouldn't you think we'd blow them out?! Had KG, PP, Rondo hit their shots we would have. Put the blame where it rightly lies. Doc put the stars in a position to win and Ray Allen was the only one that stepped up to the plate.

You think the only way a coach can make adjustments is with his rotation? You have a lot to learn. You are right, shots were not falling for the Pierce and KG as much as usual, but thats also because the game was getting out of hand and they felt that needed to force things. A good coach would bark out a series of plays for the team to settle into and not allow them to continue to play one on one. Its not like he cant tell his players what to do. Maybe the reason the Celts are so good at converting on plays coming out of timeouts is because thats all Doc ever talks about in timeouts, maybe he should spend more time describing whats going wrong and how they can adjust fix the problem.

Thanks keepthefaith. I am HONORED that you would impart of your wisdom to a guy like me who has so much to learn. If it weren't for your post pointing out how ignorant I was in the world of basketball I might be still sitting here thinking I have watched/played a game or two in my life.

[BudweiserCeltic]

Tony Allen would have worked but Ray Allen was hitting shots so do you take Rondo out and put Allen on Bibby? Worth a try - why House? Also give Garnett some rest. He stopped defending when he got in foul trouble and was gassed toward the end. Perkins played great and Powe was good on D.

Powe was awful on D, are you kidding me?

[biggs1221]

You can sit and try and place individual blame all you want, but Doc didn't cost us this game. The only potentially valid point you have is Perk not being on the floor enough. I definitely agree that we are playing too small with these guys and they are killing us on the boards in crucial times. We out rebounded them this game and had 15 offensive to their 8, but their 8 came in big stretches. 2 right there at the end that killed us.

I don't pretend to have more basketball knowledge than Doc, but I think a few things are clear:

a) the man is terrible when it comes to setting a rotation and making substitutions.  I don't even know how this is arguable.

b) for all the complaints about Jim O'Brien's offense, Doc doesn't know how to get us points when we need them

c) he is not very good at figuring out how to stop other teams runs


I'd also add that this game showed something I thought might be problematic in the playoffs.  Our offense is sooo team oriented to a fault.  Guys just pass the ball around endlessly.  Although many would argue this is how BBall is supposed to be played, in the playoffs you need to let your star players run the show to win.  The 2 years we won playoff series is because we put the game in PP's hands and let him go to work.  Atlanta won this game cause they gave it to their best player and let him go.

I hate how any time our offense stalls, Doc immediately resorts to the concept of moving the ball around more.  Give it to one of the big 3 and let them go.

[wdleehi]

Keep it civil.  I am already in a bad mood.  I will have no patience for those who want to get personal (or break any other site rule.

[bigtyc55]

I say we put doc on the bench (over in that area where pollard sits, maybe even where greg dickerson sits) and make SCAL the player (albeit inactive)-coach!

[EJPLAYA]

You can sit and try and place individual blame all you want, but Doc didn't cost us this game. The only potentially valid point you have is Perk not being on the floor enough. I definitely agree that we are playing too small with these guys and they are killing us on the boards in crucial times. We out rebounded them this game and had 15 offensive to their 8, but their 8 came in big stretches. 2 right there at the end that killed us.

I don't pretend to have more basketball knowledge than Doc, but I think a few things are clear:

a) the man is terrible when it comes to setting a rotation and making substitutions.  I don't even know how this is arguable.

b) for all the complaints about Jim O'Brien's offense, Doc doesn't know how to get us points when we need them

c) he is not very good at figuring out how to stop other teams runs


I'd also add that this game showed something I thought might be problematic in the playoffs.  Our offense is sooo team oriented to a fault.  Guys just pass the ball around endlessly.  Although many would argue this is how BBall is supposed to be played, in the playoffs you need to let your star players run the show to win.  The 2 years we won playoff series is because we put the game in PP's hands and let him go to work.  Atlanta won this game cause they gave it to their best player and let him go.

I hate how any time our offense stalls, Doc immediately resorts to the concept of moving the ball around more.  Give it to one of the big 3 and let them go.

The big three took 50 out of our 85 shots. What are you talking about?! KG missed shot after shot after shot. I can't count how many wide open jumpers he missed tonight. That's his bread and butter. PP did the same thing. He missed a freaking layup at the end that would have cut it to two. We gave it to the best players to win and other than Ray they didn't step up and hit the shots. That's not Doc's fault. He gets some of the blame, but most of it goes to KG and PP and Rondo.

[BudweiserCeltic]

You can sit and try and place individual blame all you want, but Doc didn't cost us this game. The only potentially valid point you have is Perk not being on the floor enough. I definitely agree that we are playing too small with these guys and they are killing us on the boards in crucial times. We out rebounded them this game and had 15 offensive to their 8, but their 8 came in big stretches. 2 right there at the end that killed us.

I don't pretend to have more basketball knowledge than Doc, but I think a few things are clear:

a) the man is terrible when it comes to setting a rotation and making substitutions.  I don't even know how this is arguable.

b) for all the complaints about Jim O'Brien's offense, Doc doesn't know how to get us points when we need them

c) he is not very good at figuring out how to stop other teams runs


I'd also add that this game showed something I thought might be problematic in the playoffs.  Our offense is sooo team oriented to a fault.  Guys just pass the ball around endlessly.  Although many would argue this is how BBall is supposed to be played, in the playoffs you need to let your star players run the show to win.  The 2 years we won playoff series is because we put the game in PP's hands and let him go to work.  Atlanta won this game cause they gave it to their best player and let him go.

I hate how any time our offense stalls, Doc immediately resorts to the concept of moving the ball around more.  Give it to one of the big 3 and let them go.

The big three took 50 out of our 85 shots. What are you talking about?! KG missed shot after shot after shot. I can't count how many wide open jumpers he missed tonight. That's his bread and butter. PP did the same thing. He missed a freaking layup at the end that would have cut it to two. We gave it to the best players to win and other than Ray they didn't step up and hit the shots. That's not Doc's fault. He gets some of the blame, but most of it goes to KG and PP and Rondo.

I'm 100% with you here, and I'd add Powe too... but I think Doc left him in too long in there.  He did nothing out there, and he was missing defensive assignments one after the other, so I put some on Doc here.  But if Doc had left him in the bench like game 3, then we would see people complaining here how he didn't play much.

[Celtic]

Let's not be ridiculous, Doc looked bad tonight, but not bad enough that this team shouldn't be able to overcome. This team will definitely still win the series.

[vinnie]

I honestly am still sitting here in a state of semi-shock.  The Celtics beat these guys in Atlanta in the next-to-last game of the season with the bench playing most of the second half.  Now they have lost two straight games to the Hawks.  It really is unimaginable to me.  Maybe those 66 wins during the regular season really do mean nothing.  All of the other top caliber teams are taking care of business in the playoffs.  This does not bode well for a championship.  I simply hope right now that the C's can make it to the next round.

[keepthefaith]

This series is on Doc.  Doc has no excuse if the Celtics were to lose this.  One game lose in Atlanta, fine.  Two!!!  This team has no excuse. 



Make an adjustment already.  The Hawks made an adjustment.  It is working.  The Celtics respond by playing different lineups, but change nothing they do.






Listening to him right now is making me more and more upset. 


The Celtics offense was fine in the 4th.  The shots were good, they just didn't fall. 

The Defense was fine in the 4th.



This team is defense.  And they didn't play defense going into the 4th.  House should not have been in there.  Atlanta not longer had issues getting in to their offense. 


I would rather see Tony Allen in there at that point.  Keep the defensive pressure up.


This is where coaches are important.  And the Celtics just blew a 10 point lead to the Atlanta Hawks. 


Doc, step up.  You have to win one game in Atlanta if this team is ever to have a chance of winning a title.  Play like this after this round, Celtics go home early.

The big three played almost the entire game other than PP who missed a big stretch in the first half due to stupid fouls. Rondo played 35. Perk played 25, which is his season average. Powe came in and did nothing. Sam came in and as usual did nothing. House came in and was cold (which is exactly why I didn't want Sam taking his minutes.) He did nothing.

What ADJUSTMENTS do you guys think Doc should be making?! He is letting his stars play the game. Should he come out in Boston with a starting lineup of Perk, BBD, Posey, TA, and Sam?! He is playing his best guys the majority of the minutes and they are getting caught up in the emotion. They are the ones playing like the rookies, not Atlanta. He has changed matchups defensively. The players just aren't getting it done. Stop blaming Doc just because you don't like the guy. He isn't the one missing the shots.

Think about this. If you had said we would have outrebounded them  this game, including 15-8 on the offensive boards, turned it over 10 times vs. their 17, and they went 4-18 from the floor, wouldn't you think we'd blow them out?! Had KG, PP, Rondo hit their shots we would have. Put the blame where it rightly lies. Doc put the stars in a position to win and Ray Allen was the only one that stepped up to the plate.

You think the only way a coach can make adjustments is with his rotation? You have a lot to learn. You are right, shots were not falling for the Pierce and KG as much as usual, but thats also because the game was getting out of hand and they felt that needed to force things. A good coach would bark out a series of plays for the team to settle into and not allow them to continue to play one on one. Its not like he cant tell his players what to do. Maybe the reason the Celts are so good at converting on plays coming out of timeouts is because thats all Doc ever talks about in timeouts, maybe he should spend more time describing whats going wrong and how they can adjust fix the problem.

Thanks keepthefaith. I am HONORED that you would impart of your wisdom to a guy like me who has so much to learn. If it weren't for your post pointing out how ignorant I was in the world of basketball I might be still sitting here thinking I have watched/played a game or two in my life.

that Doc made very few adjustments in terms of offensive and defensive strategy to stop the bleeding tonight. If the Celtics had a better coach they would have won tonight. Period.


edit - I left one warning already.  - wdleehi

[ktw7]

Why are people even mentioning Paul's missed layup and KG's missed shots in the 4th, the fact is we should have never even been behind in the first place! We had a 10 point lead going into the 4th, and Doc refused to make a change on Joe Johnson until after the hawks built a 6 point lead. Not only that he refused to run plays for Ray allen or Pierce in positions where we could get points.

We should have never lost that 10 point lead, everything after that is irrelevent.

[NoraG1]

I honestly am still sitting here in a state of semi-shock.  The Celtics beat these guys in Atlanta in the next-to-last game of the season with the bench playing most of the second half.  Now they have lost two straight games to the Hawks.  It really is unimaginable to me.  Maybe those 66 wins during the regular season really do mean nothing.  All of the other top caliber teams are taking care of business in the playoffs.  This does not bode well for a championship.  I simply hope right now that the C's can make it to the next round.

Detroit isn't. And most of the other teams have lost one game. It is a concern but this is the type of team that gives the C's trouble all year. Hawks, Wiz, and Bobcats are all similar and have given the C's fits. C's will not likely face many of these after the 1st round. C's have work to do though.

[jay_jay54]

why the hell does perk sit on the bench for every third quarter...?
24 min, 6 pts, 9 rebs, 1 ast, 1blk, 3-4fg, heres the big one...4 offensive boards!!!
i'm so sick of midget ball with posey playing PF for us, the game is meant to have C and a PF not KG and 3 guys 6'6''-6'8'' and rondo.
its just absurd!

TP for your statements,exactly the way i feel also.I watched Perkins all season long,and never see him after 3 quarters much,why?He is never in foul trouble at this time,but Doc  always seem to take him out,leave KG to man the boards with Powe or whoever he decides to play.Also,early on in the fourth,he saw Ray wasn't handling Joe Johnson.Instead of sticking Posey on him,he stays with Ray.What was Doc expecting to happen,a miracle.Very lousy coaching this series,and tonight was his worst.

[BudweiserCeltic]

I honestly am still sitting here in a state of semi-shock.  The Celtics beat these guys in Atlanta in the next-to-last game of the season with the bench playing most of the second half.  Now they have lost two straight games to the Hawks.  It really is unimaginable to me.  Maybe those 66 wins during the regular season really do mean nothing.  All of the other top caliber teams are taking care of business in the playoffs.  This does not bode well for a championship.  I simply hope right now that the C's can make it to the next round.

What's funny is that in those games the Hawks made it a game when our starters were playing... This Hawks team is very dangerous, but I think their energy and athletism is feeding off too much from their home court.  I doubt they'll play the same over at Boston.  Anyways, this was a reality check for the Celtics.  Weren't you people hoping for a tough match-up to prepare us for the rest of the playoffs? I think we got one here.

[vinnie]

Why am I reading posts talking about how the Hawks are the kind of team that gives the Celtics trouble?  If I am correct, The Celtics had won six straight against the Hawks this year, including the first two playoff games, by an average of at least 15 points per game.  How is that a team that gives the Celtics trouble?  I just don't get it.