Shams: C's Sign Boucher/Niang & two future 2nd rounders to Utah for RJ Luis Jr.

[DefenseWinsChamps]

So how long do the Cs have to stay under the 2nd apron to avoid repeater penalties? Until what date?

[Roy H.]

Just so people don?t think I?m talking out of my ass, Jake Fischer reported that #9 and Barrett was offered for Jrue. No doubt they were also interested in White, but I was not confused when I wrote that. And, yes, I think it was a major mistake if we didn?t accept that deal if it was really offered.

https://www.si.com/nba/raptors/report-celtics-turned-down-toronto-raptors-rj-barrett-offer-for-jrue-holiday

If this was true, I would like to think that Brad did his due diligence and gauged Barrett?s trade value around the league. Perhaps no team wanted 2 years of Barrett and so BS opted for Simons and his expiring contract. Simons would be easier to flip by trade deadline. If RJ was an expiring contract then maybe Brad would have said yes.

I'm sure Brad knew what he was doing, but if in fact it was Barrett and #9 for Jrue, that seems like a very difficult deal to refuse.  Surprising to the point that I doubt that was offered.  I don't doubt the report happened, I just doubt the veracity of it.

I remember seeing that report with Jrue, and I couldn't believe it. Then a few others said it was an offer for White, which seems closer in value. Again, who knows where the truth lies.

If the point is to shed salary, why would Brad want to trade for RJ? He?s making nearly $30M this year and next.

You'd then use the #9 to send him to BRK or another team, picking up a large TPE and additional draft assets.  Net-net, we'd have been better off than just Simons.

[Roy H.]

So what trade exceptions do we have altogether now that this trade is completed?

Springer - $4.01 million - expires 2/26/2026
KP - $22.5 million -- expires 7/7/2026
Jrue - $4.7 million -- expires 7/7/2026
Niang - $8.2 million - expires 8/6/2026

[paintitgreen]

So how long do the Cs have to stay under the 2nd apron to avoid repeater penalties? Until what date?

There are different repeater penalties. The basic repeater penalty is the extra dollar per dollar over the tax level in pure tax payments. A non-repeater team pays $1.50 for every dollar over the tax level up to $5 million; a repeater pays $2.50 in that first bracket. At all levels it is an extra $1 for a repeater. The second apron has nothing to do with that type of repeater penalty - it applies to any team that has been over the tax in three of the last four years. As of now, the Celtics are on their fourth straight year over the tax. They cannot avoid the repeater category this year, but obviously if they get below the tax line, then there is no penalty because it only adds to a tax bill, and if you have no tax bill, there is no repeater penalty.

If they drop below the tax this year, but then go above the tax level next year, they will still pay a repeater penalty for 26-27. To avoid future repeater penalties, they need to stay below the tax for a second year. If it is this season and next, then they would be clear of the repeater penalty for the following two years. (Or if they drop below in 25-26, go above in 26-27, and drop below in 27-28, then they would pay a repeater penalty in 26-27, but be clear of the repeater penalty in 28-29.)

There is also a penalty for multiple second apron appearances. From what I understand, if a team is above the second apron in 3 of 5 years, then its next draft pick falls to the end of the first round regardless of record. I believe the second apron only came into existence last summer, so the Celtics have one second apron appearance against them (24-25). But if they go above the second apron in 2 of the next 4 years (including this one), they will get that first round pick penalty.

[paintitgreen]

So what trade exceptions do we have altogether now that this trade is completed?

Springer - $4.01 million - expires 2/26/2026
KP - $22.5 million -- expires 7/7/2026
Jrue - $4.7 million -- expires 7/7/2026
Niang - $8.2 million - expires 8/6/2026

But note that if those trade exceptions are used, the Celtics will be hard capped at the second apron. They should still be useful, though, as I am sure the Celtics want to avoid the second apron next year as well and the trade exception can be rolled over. For example, say the Celtics find a $22 million player to trade Simons for at the deadline. They trade Simons and bring back the $22 million player under the KP exception. Now they have a $27.6 million exception and they are hard capped but well below that second apron hard cap since they are already below and would be cutting salary. And the exception would be good until around the 26-27 trade deadline instead of expiring in the 26 offseason. Similarly, if they decided to trade Hauser for a $3 million and $4 million player, they could bring in the players under the Springer and Jrue exceptions and get a new $10 mil exception for Hauser. Again, they could not acquire a $27 million player with an exception if it puts them over the second apron but theoretically they can continue growing the exceptions until they can use it while staying below the second apron. Like maybe if next summer they found a package for Jaylen Brown that they liked and it included a $27 million player, a $10 million player and an $8 million player plus picks, then they could acquire the three players under their exceptions and have a new $57 million trade exception available until the summer of 27 to search for a max star to bring in, so long as they remained below the second apron. Couldn?t get you Giannis but if Memphis decided to blow it up and get rid of Jaren Jackson or Miami with Bam or Cleveland with Mitchell or Mobley or Garland, the Celtics in that scenario would be in position to bring in the star without sending any salary back. Again as long as the team stays below the second apron because they would be hard capped there if they use an exception.

[paintitgreen]

It seems Brad had some players he liked. Guys he would have loved to bring in and see what they have. Then with JT going down and getting under the second apron, he is like well I always liked Minot, I thought RJ Louis Jr was a really intriguing kid. I like the signings, they are kinda sneaky good! I liked Boucher, I always thought he needed to add weight, he never really did, but I like his game.
I think this year is shaping up to be really fun!! I love the chance of a kid coming in and surprising everyone. Seems to me Brad does too, he is filling out the roster with possibilities. That will be a lot of fun to watch, can't wait!!

I can definitely see this with Garza and Minott, I think Brad likes them to bring them in. With Luis, though, he was not drafted a month ago when the Celtics had multiple second round picks and could have reached out after the draft. The Jazz had to trade something, and he is a player with no salary counting against the salary cap. I doubt his inclusion in the trade has any deeper meaning. He could absolutely stick around and eventually make the Celtics but I doubt there was a real ?want? there. He is the something that Utah had to give to make it a trade.

[Celtics4ever]

The tape I saw of Luis at St Johns  looked better than Gonzales in Europe.    I know that means nothing.  But Hugo needs to get stronger with the ball and work on his body, I get he is young.

We did not work him out in the predraft.   LA, GS, SAC did.  His team mates, Kadary Richmond, and Aaron Scott worked out for more teams that RJ.

I could not find any summer league stats of Luis Jr. but I found this :

Luis was ruled out of his second straight Summer League game on Monday with left knee soreness.

https://sports.yahoo.com/article/rj-luis-jr-other-st-213200063.html

I doubt he is next John Starks, Bruce Bowen, Ben Wallace or David Wesley aka an undrafted guy carving out playing time in the NBA.  But I would love to be wrong.  The sore knee stuff is always a concern.   

[lbgreen33]

It seems Brad had some players he liked. Guys he would have loved to bring in and see what they have. Then with JT going down and getting under the second apron, he is like well I always liked Minot, I thought RJ Louis Jr was a really intriguing kid. I like the signings, they are kinda sneaky good! I liked Boucher, I always thought he needed to add weight, he never really did, but I like his game.
I think this year is shaping up to be really fun!! I love the chance of a kid coming in and surprising everyone. Seems to me Brad does too, he is filling out the roster with possibilities. That will be a lot of fun to watch, can't wait!!

I can definitely see this with Garza and Minott, I think Brad likes them to bring them in. With Luis, though, he was not drafted a month ago when the Celtics had multiple second round picks and could have reached out after the draft. The Jazz had to trade something, and he is a player with no salary counting against the salary cap. I doubt his inclusion in the trade has any deeper meaning. He could absolutely stick around and eventually make the Celtics but I doubt there was a real ?want? there. He is the something that Utah had to give to make it a trade.

I totally agree with you! I think I am excited because I liked RJ in college and St Johns had a great year, the first in a while. His coach last year was Rick Pitino who is a great College coach! The kid really has something, but again I like St Johns so there is that too, hard to be biased because I watched him a lot and really like his game.