Shams: Kristaps Porzingis Traded In 3-Team Deal (BOS-ATL-BKN)

[Goldstar88]

This trade signals to me they are tanking next year, which I think means they are trading Brown.

I don't see that.  I don't feel that these trades make it any more or less likely that they trade Brown than before the trades.

The core is Tatum - Brown - White.  How many teams have a better big 3 than that?  Not OKC I don't think.  Not IND for sure.  There may not ever be a team as good as the 2023-24 Celtics again, as long as these salary and tax rules remain.

OKC clearly and by a wide margin has not only a better top 3, but also a younger one and a much deeper supporting cast.  It isn't close.  The Lakers have a better top 3 right now. The Warriors do as well.  The Nuggets probably do as well (though that is as much because of just how better Jokic is than Tatum).  Houston does, at least for next year (and a much deeper and younger team with many more high end assets to trade).

Tatum, Brown, White simply isn't a championship core.  It really wasn't one when they won, they were just 6 deep in a strange year, but now they have 3 maybe 4 depending on how good Simons is. They aren't going to have the best player on the floor in the truly meaningful series, they have to beat those teams with depth and they just don't have it.  The team needs a real and true reset and a full-blown 1-year tank.

Saying that Tatum, Brown, White isn't a championship core?   The just won one last year.   Please go to the end of the line with the rest of the losers who complain that we didn't beat anyone good, or what ever other garbage excuse.  My god.

This team without tatum is a play in team.  With tatum they are the new Milwaukee.  Good team but not going to win a championship.  They also dont have assets to pick up a piece to out them over the top.  With that being said it may be wise to trade JB to get young pieces who can develop into a star.  Sad day as a cs fan today.  Thank you NBA for ruining the sport with this apron BS.

To me it's silly to say definitely that Tatum/Brown/White isn't a core that could win a title. In the three seasons before this one that core won a title, made game 7 of the ECF and made the finals. So clearly, they CAN win with the right team around them.

The C's will have Simons who is a good 26 year old 20ppg scorer on an expiring, Hauser's bargain 4/45 contract, Pritchard's bargain 3/23 contract, an 8.2 million dollar expiring in Niang, a 22 million dollar TPE from the KP trade, #30 last year in Schierman, #28 and #32 this year, and be able to trade some combination of first rounders in 26, 27, 31 and 33 first rounders going forward.  Thats not an elite asset pool, but its certainly enough to get a couple good role players to fill out around Tatum/Brown/White.

And who knows, maybe they even get lucky and a draft pick hits. Maybe one of Sheierman/#28/#32 becomes their Nembhard, McDaniels, Aldama, Herb Jones, or another Payton Pritchard. All starter level or high backups who were drafted in that 25-35 range.

So ya, I don't see any reason they can't take it easy next year, reset some financial stuff, and then rebuild next offseason with an eye towadrs competeing in 26-27. They don't have the MOST assets out there, but they have enough to fill in the role players.

Except that didn?t happen. The core was White, Holiday, Brown, Tatum and KP. Two of those guys are gone now. That?s a lot of talent out the door and I don?t see the C?s replacing them with comparable players.

[Who]

I am disgusted.

The organization is treating next year as a write off. This was a solid mid playoff team without Tatum and would become a title contender once again if Tatum returns late in the regular season which he is expected to do.

This is organizational malpractice. You do not just walk away from a title opportunity. It can be very hard to get back to this level. Do not take this for granted. Yet, they have.

[86MaxwellSmart]

Jrue was too expensive and KP gave us nothing in the playoffs this year....Had to be done.

Brad got some flexibility with these 2 deals....stay tuned.

[Who]

So the new look Celtics are something like this

G: D White, Pritchard
G: A Simons, Scheierman
F: Jaylen, Hauser
F: Horford, G Niang
C: Kornet, Queta

With Tatum to return late in the season. So either Niang or Queta will be pushed out of the rotation at that point. Horford resuming 6th man activities.

[jambr380]

This trade signals to me they are tanking next year, which I think means they are trading Brown.

I don't see that.  I don't feel that these trades make it any more or less likely that they trade Brown than before the trades.

The core is Tatum - Brown - White.  How many teams have a better big 3 than that?  Not OKC I don't think.  Not IND for sure.  There may not ever be a team as good as the 2023-24 Celtics again, as long as these salary and tax rules remain.

OKC clearly and by a wide margin has not only a better top 3, but also a younger one and a much deeper supporting cast.  It isn't close.  The Lakers have a better top 3 right now. The Warriors do as well.  The Nuggets probably do as well (though that is as much because of just how better Jokic is than Tatum).  Houston does, at least for next year (and a much deeper and younger team with many more high end assets to trade).

Tatum, Brown, White simply isn't a championship core.  It really wasn't one when they won, they were just 6 deep in a strange year, but now they have 3 maybe 4 depending on how good Simons is. They aren't going to have the best player on the floor in the truly meaningful series, they have to beat those teams with depth and they just don't have it.  The team needs a real and true reset and a full-blown 1-year tank.

Saying that Tatum, Brown, White isn't a championship core?   The just won one last year.   Please go to the end of the line with the rest of the losers who complain that we didn't beat anyone good, or what ever other garbage excuse.  My god.

This team without tatum is a play in team.  With tatum they are the new Milwaukee.  Good team but not going to win a championship.  They also dont have assets to pick up a piece to out them over the top.  With that being said it may be wise to trade JB to get young pieces who can develop into a star.  Sad day as a cs fan today.  Thank you NBA for ruining the sport with this apron BS.

To me it's silly to say definitely that Tatum/Brown/White isn't a core that could win a title. In the three seasons before this one that core won a title, made game 7 of the ECF and made the finals. So clearly, they CAN win with the right team around them.

The C's will have Simons who is a good 26 year old 20ppg scorer on an expiring, Hauser's bargain 4/45 contract, Pritchard's bargain 3/23 contract, an 8.2 million dollar expiring in Niang, a 22 million dollar TPE from the KP trade, #30 last year in Schierman, #28 and #32 this year, and be able to trade some combination of first rounders in 26, 27, 31 and 33 first rounders going forward.  Thats not an elite asset pool, but its certainly enough to get a couple good role players to fill out around Tatum/Brown/White.

And who knows, maybe they even get lucky and a draft pick hits. Maybe one of Sheierman/#28/#32 becomes their Nembhard, McDaniels, Aldama, Herb Jones, or another Payton Pritchard. All starter level or high backups who were drafted in that 25-35 range.

So ya, I don't see any reason they can't take it easy next year, reset some financial stuff, and then rebuild next offseason with an eye towadrs competeing in 26-27. They don't have the MOST assets out there, but they have enough to fill in the role players.

Except that didn?t happen. The core was White, Holiday, Brown, Tatum and KP. Two of those guys are gone now. That?s a lot of talent out the door and I don?t see the C?s replacing them with comparable players.

Smart was the 3rd best player for the 2022 Finals team and 2023 ECF team. And with how injuries played out in 2020, he was right there with Kemba as the 3rd/4th best player on that ECF team, too...at least in the Bubble.

We were spoiled getting KP and Jrue, but let's be honest, we were winning the 2024 Title without KP. And we all love Jrue, but he isn't going to be 2024 Jrue in 2027 and beyond. I'm not sure how Simons will work out, but at least he's young and productive.

The KP deal looks awful in terms of what we got back, but it probably allows us to keep our depth pieces, or at least trade for/sign other depth pieces. It's not all dire, but we do need Tatum and Brown to be their very best moving forward.

[Goldstar88]

I am disgusted.

The organization is treating next year as a write off. This was a solid mid playoff team without Tatum and would become a title contender once again if Tatum returns late in the regular season which he is expected to do.

This is organizational malpractice. You do not just walk away from a title opportunity. It can be very hard to get back to this level. Do not take this for granted. Yet, they have.

Correct

[Celtics2021]

This trade signals to me they are tanking next year, which I think means they are trading Brown.

I don't see that.  I don't feel that these trades make it any more or less likely that they trade Brown than before the trades.

The core is Tatum - Brown - White.  How many teams have a better big 3 than that?  Not OKC I don't think.  Not IND for sure.  There may not ever be a team as good as the 2023-24 Celtics again, as long as these salary and tax rules remain.

OKC clearly and by a wide margin has not only a better top 3, but also a younger one and a much deeper supporting cast.  It isn't close.  The Lakers have a better top 3 right now. The Warriors do as well.  The Nuggets probably do as well (though that is as much because of just how better Jokic is than Tatum).  Houston does, at least for next year (and a much deeper and younger team with many more high end assets to trade).

Tatum, Brown, White simply isn't a championship core.  It really wasn't one when they won, they were just 6 deep in a strange year, but now they have 3 maybe 4 depending on how good Simons is. They aren't going to have the best player on the floor in the truly meaningful series, they have to beat those teams with depth and they just don't have it.  The team needs a real and true reset and a full-blown 1-year tank.

Saying that Tatum, Brown, White isn't a championship core?   The just won one last year.   Please go to the end of the line with the rest of the losers who complain that we didn't beat anyone good, or what ever other garbage excuse.  My god.

This team without tatum is a play in team.  With tatum they are the new Milwaukee.  Good team but not going to win a championship.  They also dont have assets to pick up a piece to out them over the top.  With that being said it may be wise to trade JB to get young pieces who can develop into a star.  Sad day as a cs fan today.  Thank you NBA for ruining the sport with this apron BS.

To me it's silly to say definitely that Tatum/Brown/White isn't a core that could win a title. In the three seasons before this one that core won a title, made game 7 of the ECF and made the finals. So clearly, they CAN win with the right team around them.

The C's will have Simons who is a good 26 year old 20ppg scorer on an expiring, Hauser's bargain 4/45 contract, Pritchard's bargain 3/23 contract, an 8.2 million dollar expiring in Niang, a 22 million dollar TPE from the KP trade, #30 last year in Schierman, #28 and #32 this year, and be able to trade some combination of first rounders in 26, 27, 31 and 33 first rounders going forward.  Thats not an elite asset pool, but its certainly enough to get a couple good role players to fill out around Tatum/Brown/White.

And who knows, maybe they even get lucky and a draft pick hits. Maybe one of Sheierman/#28/#32 becomes their Nembhard, McDaniels, Aldama, Herb Jones, or another Payton Pritchard. All starter level or high backups who were drafted in that 25-35 range.

So ya, I don't see any reason they can't take it easy next year, reset some financial stuff, and then rebuild next offseason with an eye towadrs competeing in 26-27. They don't have the MOST assets out there, but they have enough to fill in the role players.

Except that didn?t happen. The core was White, Holiday, Brown, Tatum and KP. Two of those guys are gone now. That?s a lot of talent out the door and I don?t see the C?s replacing them with comparable players.

I love KP, but if you insist on naming a 5-person core for the team, you need to include Al instead of KP.  Porzingis played under 20% of available playoff minutes when we won the title.  We would have won the ring with or without him, given how everyone else played. They aren?t going to replace KP with another comparable talent, but they don?t need to, assuming Tatum can come back after a year.  And if Tatum cannot, Porzingis wasn?t going to matter anyway.

[tazzmaniac]

My prediction is that the next cost cutting move will be trading Simons at the trade deadline.  I think Hauser is safe now.  He is a good value at $10M'ish and under control for 4 more seasons.

BOS has 11 signed right now.  We have a first (28) and a second (32) round pick in this draft.  That would get us to the league minimum of 13 on the roster.  We will have 3 2-way contract slots to fill.  That could be our team for the start of 2025-26.

We would be under the second apron at that point, which would open up a few options for trades but why not dump Simons if he is not part of the future?  Let him play as a starter, build some value, and then trade him for a couple of lower cost contracts that will be useful for the 2026-27 season and beyond (or even 1).

Celts have 12 players on the roster now.  Tatum takes up a roster spot regardless of whether he plays at all.  Teams are required to fill 14 roster spots not 13. 
May not be any more action before these trades become official but Stevens is not done making moves.  Didn't like Stevens as a coach but he's been an excellent GM.  Two good and necessary trades given the circumstances. 

[Who]

I don't know about the fit of Porzingis on the Hawks. I feel Trae Young is similar to Luka Doncic in the way he plays as a ball dominant driving guard ... that Trae works best with a rim roller who facilitates that man movement on offense. Then you put the skilled players at SG, SF, PF around Trae & a rim rolling center. Like Luka wants to do in LAL and did in DAL.

Luka and Porzingis had a mixed relationship / on court chemsitry wise in Dallas. I wouldn't be surprised to see the same thing in Atlanta with Trae Young.

[keevsnick]

This trade signals to me they are tanking next year, which I think means they are trading Brown.

I don't see that.  I don't feel that these trades make it any more or less likely that they trade Brown than before the trades.

The core is Tatum - Brown - White.  How many teams have a better big 3 than that?  Not OKC I don't think.  Not IND for sure.  There may not ever be a team as good as the 2023-24 Celtics again, as long as these salary and tax rules remain.

OKC clearly and by a wide margin has not only a better top 3, but also a younger one and a much deeper supporting cast.  It isn't close.  The Lakers have a better top 3 right now. The Warriors do as well.  The Nuggets probably do as well (though that is as much because of just how better Jokic is than Tatum).  Houston does, at least for next year (and a much deeper and younger team with many more high end assets to trade).

Tatum, Brown, White simply isn't a championship core.  It really wasn't one when they won, they were just 6 deep in a strange year, but now they have 3 maybe 4 depending on how good Simons is. They aren't going to have the best player on the floor in the truly meaningful series, they have to beat those teams with depth and they just don't have it.  The team needs a real and true reset and a full-blown 1-year tank.

Saying that Tatum, Brown, White isn't a championship core?   The just won one last year.   Please go to the end of the line with the rest of the losers who complain that we didn't beat anyone good, or what ever other garbage excuse.  My god.

This team without tatum is a play in team.  With tatum they are the new Milwaukee.  Good team but not going to win a championship.  They also dont have assets to pick up a piece to out them over the top.  With that being said it may be wise to trade JB to get young pieces who can develop into a star.  Sad day as a cs fan today.  Thank you NBA for ruining the sport with this apron BS.

To me it's silly to say definitely that Tatum/Brown/White isn't a core that could win a title. In the three seasons before this one that core won a title, made game 7 of the ECF and made the finals. So clearly, they CAN win with the right team around them.

The C's will have Simons who is a good 26 year old 20ppg scorer on an expiring, Hauser's bargain 4/45 contract, Pritchard's bargain 3/23 contract, an 8.2 million dollar expiring in Niang, a 22 million dollar TPE from the KP trade, #30 last year in Schierman, #28 and #32 this year, and be able to trade some combination of first rounders in 26, 27, 31 and 33 first rounders going forward.  Thats not an elite asset pool, but its certainly enough to get a couple good role players to fill out around Tatum/Brown/White.

And who knows, maybe they even get lucky and a draft pick hits. Maybe one of Sheierman/#28/#32 becomes their Nembhard, McDaniels, Aldama, Herb Jones, or another Payton Pritchard. All starter level or high backups who were drafted in that 25-35 range.

So ya, I don't see any reason they can't take it easy next year, reset some financial stuff, and then rebuild next offseason with an eye towadrs competeing in 26-27. They don't have the MOST assets out there, but they have enough to fill in the role players.

Except that didn?t happen. The core was White, Holiday, Brown, Tatum and KP. Two of those guys are gone now. That't a lot of talent out the door and I don?t see the C?s replacing them with comparable players.

KP played like 7 of the 19 playoff games that year, he was not a part of the core. Al has a better argument.

But the bigger point is if you need to replace 33 year old Jrue and 37 year old Horford in your "core" to get back to a title, I think that's doable. Not that it will be super easy, but they have enough pieces to work with to bring back a #4 and #5 bets player(s). Simons, who is already on the roster, may even be one of those replacements. The C's have work to do, but its not insurmountable work.

[Goldstar88]

So the new look Celtics are something like this

G: D White, Pritchard
G: A Simons, Scheierman
F: Jaylen, Hauser
F: Horford, G Niang
C: Kornet, Queta

With Tatum to return late in the season. So either Niang or Queta will be pushed out of the rotation at that point. Horford resuming 6th man activities.

Might be good enough for the play-in tournament.

[Who]

I like the Hawks nucleus. I thought they had a chance to become / move into the bottom part of the 2nd tier playoff teams in the East. 1st tier being the title contenders and usually top 3-4 seeds. Mid tier being 4-6th seeds. Low tier playoff teams being the guys in the play-in spots.

I thought ill-health last season made them look worse than they actually were and next season could see a good improvement.

So with Porzingis joining I think 2nd tier playoff team should be the floor in terms of expectations. That Atlanta should be a 4th-6th seed in the East. They have a shot at being a top 3 seed if everything works out wonderfully well. And it would be a disappointing season for them if they were in the play-in next year.

Roster

G: Trae Young,
G: Dyson Daniels
F: Z Risacher, C LeVert
F: Jalen Johnson
C: Porzingis, Okongwu

Others: Garrison Matthews, Krejci, L Nance Jr, Bufkin, D Barlow, Mo Gueye.

That is a quality 7 man rotation. Some of these guys can fill end of rotation jobs. One more good bench player in the backcourt would be nice. That would give them an 8 man rotation with those end of rotation players filling in jobs where needed depending on opponent.

[tazzmaniac]

I am disgusted.

The organization is treating next year as a write off. This was a solid mid playoff team without Tatum and would become a title contender once again if Tatum returns late in the regular season which he is expected to do.

This is organizational malpractice. You do not just walk away from a title opportunity. It can be very hard to get back to this level. Do not take this for granted. Yet, they have.

You're normally well-grounded but sounds like you are in fantasy land on this.  The organization is making moves to deal with the financial reality on the new cba.  This will provide a lot more optionality and flexibility for the future.   Tatum will not be back at the end of the season.  Tanking for next season is the right move just like it was for the Robinson-less Spurs.  Not ending up with a good lottery pick would be a failure.   

[Moranis]

This trade signals to me they are tanking next year, which I think means they are trading Brown.

I don't see that.  I don't feel that these trades make it any more or less likely that they trade Brown than before the trades.

The core is Tatum - Brown - White.  How many teams have a better big 3 than that?  Not OKC I don't think.  Not IND for sure.  There may not ever be a team as good as the 2023-24 Celtics again, as long as these salary and tax rules remain.

OKC clearly and by a wide margin has not only a better top 3, but also a younger one and a much deeper supporting cast.  It isn't close.  The Lakers have a better top 3 right now. The Warriors do as well.  The Nuggets probably do as well (though that is as much because of just how better Jokic is than Tatum).  Houston does, at least for next year (and a much deeper and younger team with many more high end assets to trade).

Tatum, Brown, White simply isn't a championship core.  It really wasn't one when they won, they were just 6 deep in a strange year, but now they have 3 maybe 4 depending on how good Simons is. They aren't going to have the best player on the floor in the truly meaningful series, they have to beat those teams with depth and they just don't have it.  The team needs a real and true reset and a full-blown 1-year tank.

I am not worried about the Lakers or GSW.  We are talking about 2026-27.  Durant probably is not a factor by then either.  Denver and OKC are at least worth debating.  Jokic and Murray are only in the discussion if Murray is healthy.  I expect DEN to be in the mix for sure, but I feel Tatum-Brown-White are right there with them at worst (assuming Tatum returns to form).

I don't buy that OKC with SGA-Williams-Holmgren are any better than Tatum-Brown-White.  OKC is going to be facing the same issues of resigning their players and dealing with the 2nd apron.  Right now, all the supporting cast are on rookie contracts, but that doesn't last forever.

They are all potential 30%, not 35% players at the top (aside from SGA).  That matter a lot.  They also have a lot more young players and future draft picks.  They are much better positioned to keep their core in tact that Boston is right now.  They are much more similar to Boston from 2021, except that SGA is significantly better than Tatum was in 2021 (well pretty much everyone is better) and they have much better draft capital.  Boston had a very nice run beginning that very next year making the Finals in 22, losing a heartbreaking game 7 in the ECF in 23, and then winning in 24.  The team choked away this year.  Pretty unacceptable, but it showed pretty clearly the cracks in the armor.  The team is done as currently constituted.  Team needs a full reset this year and the best way to do that is trade Brown and restock the assets.  There are plenty of potential trades that can do that out there.

You have been wanting to trade Brown for many years.  You said over and over that JT and JB can't win a title together, they are a bad fit, they can't do anything together...Well they win the title, JB is the East Finals MVP, and the Finals MVP and here you are still with the same dog and pony show.  I mean everyone is welcome to their opinion.  But it doesn't seem logical to me.  It seems EXTREMELY unlikely that the C's are going to trade Brown at this point.  They already traded Jrue and KP.  That got them where they needed to go salary wise.

Those awards are nonsense.  Everyone agrees Tatum is a better player than Brown and in both those series, Tatum scored more points, grabbed more rebounds, and dished out more assists.  The writers got cute and got it wrong.  Perhaps the worst voting for finals mvp ever and that is saying something considering Iguodala won it over both Curry and Lebron. 

Brown played much more complimentary during that whole run to the championship.  He didn't do that very much before that run and he didn't do that last year, which is why the team flamed out in the 2nd round. 

And yes I would have traded Brown for Kawhi in the summer of 2018 and the Celtics would almost certainly have won the 2019 title had they done that and had at least as many as they have now (and who knows what Kawhi and Kyrie would have done after winning the 2019 title).  We might very well be sitting on a dynasty right now.  The great what if.

The numbers support that Boston wins at about the same rate whether Brown plays in the game or is out.  It has been that way since his 2nd year when he became a starter.  He just doesn't impact the game like he should.  If they keep him this year, I fully believe it will become very apparent that I have been correct in this.  He simply isn't good enough to be a #1 and his skill set doesn't compliment Tatum all that well so he isn't the correct #2 on this team (he'd be pretty good next to someone like Jokic or Giannis though).  White is a much better complimentary piece, he just isn't good enough as a player to be a #2.

More of the same I hate Brown propaganda.   We heard if for years, all of us have eyes and know what happened for us to win the title.  It must have been really painful for you to have to watch JB have so much success and play so well.   I will just say that I disagree with almost everything you wrote.   I will stop engaging you about it.

I don't hate Brown as a player at all. I just don't think he is a great compliment next to Tatum and don't think he is a #1 type player.  I don't see that as a controversial take at all.  He played great last year in the playoffs I said that, but it still doesn't change the fact that Tatum out scored, out rebounded, and out assisted him in both the ECF and Finals.  That is simply a fact.  It is certainly my opinion that the voters got it wrong, but given the better player had better stats and didn't win the awards, I feel pretty confident in that opinion.  Put it this way, do you know how many times a player has led his team in the Finals in points, rebounds, and assists, while being on the winning team and not won Finals MVP?  Give you a hint, there is 1 player on that list. 

[Who]

Here is the Ringer's player ranking that was updated June 4 https://nbarankings.theringer.com/

Tatum is 10, Brown is 21, White is 38, Simons is 87, Pritchard is 89

10 seems fair for expectations of Tatum coming off an achilles injury. The say he was top 5 before the injury. Agree with that. I am hoping for around 10th best when he returns.

I thought we still had the makings of a title team with Tatum as the 10th best player in the league if we kept the gang together. If we kept Jrue and Zinger. That is why I wanted the ownership to pay the luxury tax and keep it together.